Breeding for whorls

[Sativied]

The skunk is perhaps just the most successful example and by combining the right afghan, or perhaps even any indica, with the right sativa(s), the same thing can be achieved, redo some of the skunk work.

that weird looking dr grimspoon .. skunk too lol ?

I got it at Barney's coffeeshop once, been a while but remember I wasn't impressed, expected something special also considering the price. Plants look like they suffer from severe inbreeding depression. Based on among others choco thai, panama red and Highland Oxacan Gold - a Mexican land race sativa used by DJ Short. Not really large calyxes though. Not fat stacked tails either but a string of "beads" as Barney's calls it. Could be great for testing by crossing it with skunk, afghani and others.

have you seen old timers haze at ace seeds, looks like jungle weed to me
from what i have read from all those old hippies over at mr nice they think o haze is for breeding
not growing and that tom hills haze was the one to grow to find a pheno worth keeping that is not jungle weed

I initially got a little excited when I read about OT haze and then I visited ACEs site and read the description. They changed it by now, but initially you could pick between different parent pairs (like a purple pheno) . Someone for decades keeps an O haze population - I assume he used more than 2 parents each generation, else one might as well buy o haze from any seed bank - but you could only buy lines based on two parents, a subset of the gene pool of OT Haze. They should have done open pollination instead of narrowing it down to a few lines first. The color example makes it obvious already, OT haze contained both purple and green phenos, Ace sold 3 or so variations (at the same time), one in which you could find purple, others in which you could not (or less chance, don't remember). Same thing automatically applies to more obscure traits and genes that could have recombined into something new.

Tom Hill's haze is probably the last option I'd consider. His selfing methods, what seems to be an erroneous interpretation of the single seed descent method, are also great for defeating the point of having a less narrowed down more original o haze gene pool as breeding stock. I was recently in couple of discussions with him at icmag. Throwing pearls before swines. He claims the drug variety should only be grown from clone (which come from selfed plants) as it is supposed to because that's what people did 50 years ago when everything was better. Like him nobody will ever improve a variety by breeding regardless of resources and plant count. It's not susceptible to tried and true widely documented plant breeding methods, it's not a diploid, not just a plant... and so much more easily refuted nonsense. I expected a professional but encountered a disgruntled troll trying to obfuscate others with classic fallacies and projecting the illusion of knowledge.

According to a on old post from Sam the best place to buy O haze is at Flying Dutchmen, which later was sold to sensi. They still have a shop in Amsterdam but it's basically sensi seeds now. I don't know how they maintained it for decades but that's still where I'd go first. It lists O haze flower time of 90-115 days... and that's partly why NL#5/Haze, Silver Haze, SSH, and other haze hybrids are often used instead. Sam posted once that 16 is exaggerated and it's more like 12. That did respark my interest. I think I'm going to get a pack and grow a couple of them next run.

I would love to see you grow some land race sativas indoors in nft, I wouldn't be surprise if they produce larger calyxes than the ones I typically see on pics of outdoor grown only. Would probably take some ongoing canopy control to tame it. How about some Panama Red from Ace? It's at F8-F10. Columbian + Panama. Somehow I think some of those auction sites with rare land race offers are more reliable for pure varieties than some commercial seed banks.

 

[Sativied]

IH (ICE x CH) entering it's final week. Had to push it in the corner, leaves against wall so it's a little bend out of shape, bottom leaves are starting to dry but overall I'm happy with the results. I could put 49 of these under 400w mh, or the 315w cmh.

Too leafy, tough probably partly from the MH.

(I keep a piece of ducting hose around it, not actually growing in transparent container).

Some CHxCH pics. Not entirely happy with the way things are going. Largely cause it's too crowded and I had to switch to hps to get full coverage so they stretched a lot. Main goal is getting some fresh seeds from whorlers which should work out, do have male and female whorlers.

one of the males I culled:

Not fasciated but very hollow stem. Not good for cropping. I thought it was the chunk who donated this to the P cross as it had few bad ones, but apparently it's in the CH as well.

One of the better looking males, not tri though:

Pretty sure it's male, two axillary branches where there should be one is usually male.

This one's pot leaned over, plant orientated towards the light. It's like a sunflower now:

Since it's so full they are pretty much all like that, 1 cola plants, stretched. I sure wouldn't mind a veg space that is actually larger than the flower space.

Tri females:

At first I thought there were three stipules per set of three leaves (while normally with two branches there are four), but it appears now there can be 9... the one above is missing one the right.

 

[geologic]

Wow, good stuff with the stipule observations an all.
I've had a few plants like that male you culled:
very hollow and extremely thin-walled,
and the big ol' stem eventually just flops over--
I always wondered if it could be a form of self-pruning...

 

[Sativied]

It's one of the key traits I selected against in the P-F2, didn't expect having to do that again. It's almost always the most stretchy plants, and since it's to crowded they put more energy in stretching (shade avoidance), so they are so far plants I would have removed anyway.

Not suitable for cropping cause it doesn't heal up well (right opened up for pic, left is result of pinching).

The upside is that I got plenty of plants with stems that can kill a vampire so I can select towards those.

This fat wide bladed plant has bulged like an umbrella from the start, when dry wet and in between. It's a female, not going to use it for seeds but I want to see the bud. O haze x mex sativa seems unlikely to produce this:

Obvious in the smaller leaves already, not just wide but short.

According to one source (dunno, wasn't credited) hash farmers selected towards wide leaflets and relatively small single cola plants for cheap export hash. As I clearly notice in my crosses wide leaflets block light to the lower branches, and narrow leaflets allow a plant to branch out more and/or fill up better. Wide causes more stretch. I think that's because they are hybrids and wide leaflets should be avoided whenever possible.

That branch in the center of the pic stretched 6 inches in one node, apparently it was extremely eager to be taller than the main stem.

I really don't like that trait. Failed hybrid trait. Those lower branches should either elongate by stacking nodes, or stay short.

The pale one is still pale but also still healthy. Fascinating plant. More narrow leaflets than all except one.

One of my best whorled phyllotaxy shots, regular at the bottom, then quad, settling as tri:

Another one (6 stipules... I wonder how many there are on a tri whorled from tricots).

Some whorled branches:

 

[NFT]

The skunk is perhaps just the most successful example and by combining the right afghan, or perhaps even any indica, with the right sativa(s), the same thing can be achieved, redo some of the skunk work.


I got it at Barney's coffeeshop once, been a while but remember I wasn't impressed, expected something special also considering the price. Plants look like they suffer from severe inbreeding depression. Based on among others choco thai, panama red and Highland Oxacan Gold - a Mexican land race sativa used by DJ Short. Not really large calyxes though. Not fat stacked tails either but a string of "beads" as Barney's calls it. Could be great for testing by crossing it with skunk, afghani and others.


I initially got a little excited when I read about OT haze and then I visited ACEs site and read the description. They changed it by now, but initially you could pick between different parent pairs (like a purple pheno) . Someone for decades keeps an O haze population - I assume he used more than 2 parents each generation, else one might as well buy o haze from any seed bank - but you could only buy lines based on two parents, a subset of the gene pool of OT Haze. They should have done open pollination instead of narrowing it down to a few lines first. The color example makes it obvious already, OT haze contained both purple and green phenos, Ace sold 3 or so variations (at the same time), one in which you could find purple, others in which you could not (or less chance, don't remember). Same thing automatically applies to more obscure traits and genes that could have recombined into something new.

Tom Hill's haze is probably the last option I'd consider. His selfing methods, what seems to be an erroneous interpretation of the single seed descent method, are also great for defeating the point of having a less narrowed down more original o haze gene pool as breeding stock. I was recently in couple of discussions with him at icmag. Throwing pearls before swines. He claims the drug variety should only be grown from clone (which come from selfed plants) as it is supposed to because that's what people did 50 years ago when everything was better. Like him nobody will ever improve a variety by breeding regardless of resources and plant count. It's not susceptible to tried and true widely documented plant breeding methods, it's not a diploid, not just a plant... and so much more easily refuted nonsense. I expected a professional but encountered a disgruntled troll trying to obfuscate others with classic fallacies and projecting the illusion of knowledge.

According to a on old post from Sam the best place to buy O haze is at Flying Dutchmen, which later was sold to sensi. They still have a shop in Amsterdam but it's basically sensi seeds now. I don't know how they maintained it for decades but that's still where I'd go first. It lists O haze flower time of 90-115 days... and that's partly why NL#5/Haze, Silver Haze, SSH, and other haze hybrids are often used instead. Sam posted once that 16 is exaggerated and it's more like 12. That did respark my interest. I think I'm going to get a pack and grow a couple of them next run.

I would love to see you grow some land race sativas indoors in nft, I wouldn't be surprise if they produce larger calyxes than the ones I typically see on pics of outdoor grown only. Would probably take some ongoing canopy control to tame it. How about some Panama Red from Ace? It's at F8-F10. Columbian + Panama. Somehow I think some of those auction sites with rare land race offers are more reliable for pure varieties than some commercial seed banks.

Thanks for all the info mate, with the tom hills haze from what i have read it was more
stable with phenotypes and less flower time, i do not want to grow any o haze myself
i think my experience with angel heart put me off a bit i want some afghan in the mix
just to stand a better chance of shorter flowering times

i am still a little worried how big the hy-pro amnesia is going to get especially in NFT
i have the fem version i think its just nevs haze x an india they keep themselves (empire state or something)
less worried about the jack 0 nesia

panama red looks nice, i do look at ace seeds a fair bit
i find most of the modern crosses around today uninspiring
i would like seeds from some kind of landrace that has been worked on so maybe an IBL from landraces
with no skunk NL or haze lol

i am not keen on the idea of a bunch of seeds from some random farmer
" collected in the mountains of Afghanistan" is what i got from seedsmans afghan 1 most of the plants were a joke
did not even flower correctly threw most of them away

i have always been on the lookout for lebanese too
i remember the imported hash well, it would be nice to see a quick finishing leb sativa grow
they are not known for potency but the flavour can be very good
next generation seeds have started doing a leb x skunk1 thats about the best i can find so far
i would like to see more simple crosses available
two way simple hybrids rather than the genetic cheese/spacequeen/og soup with so much that is around today
columbian x leb
laos x Pakistan or whatever

peace

 

[Sativied]

Went to a local coffeeshop last night and guess what was listed at the bottom (most expensive so at the top sort speak) of the menu... OG Kush. Same price as amnesia haze, 1 euro more than ssh.

I've never been a big kush fan but my wife used to favorite, that is, when we were half our age. That was usually listed as master kush or hindu kush. I've grown skywalker kush, and smoked various kush crossed like candy kush and a few others that all had something in common, obviously. I'm talking about the musky smell especially after crumbling. I call it moldy. My wife says she thinks she knows what I mean but it's not mold, that's kush... Anyway, the OG Kush was like opening a bag of oldskool. So was the effect. Stoned, the next morning still. Heavy eyes. Turns me introvert and lazy. The kind of stuff you can smoke for a long time and then later wonder where those years went. Opposed to a creative cerebral head high. Not my thing.

It is a little odd to see it on the menu at the same price as amnesia, while other indica classics they have on the menu cost 2/3 - 3/4 of that. It's basically priced as a haze hybrid.

 

[NFT]

Went to a local coffeeshop last night and guess what was listed at the bottom (most expensive so at the top sort speak) of the menu... OG Kush. Same price as amnesia haze, 1 euro more than ssh.

I've never been a big kush fan but my wife used to favorite, that is, when we were half our age. That was usually listed as master kush or hindu kush. I've grown skywalker kush, and smoked various kush crossed like candy kush and a few others that all had something in common, obviously. I'm talking about the musky smell especially after crumbling. I call it moldy. My wife says she thinks she knows what I mean but it's not mold, that's kush... Anyway, the OG Kush was like opening a bag of oldskool. So was the effect. Stoned, the next morning still. Heavy eyes. Turns me introvert and lazy. The kind of stuff you can smoke for a long time and then later wonder where those years went. Opposed to a creative cerebral head high. Not my thing.

It is a little odd to see it on the menu at the same price as amnesia, while other indica classics they have on the menu cost 2/3 - 3/4 of that. It's basically priced as a haze hybrid.

Kush or any "heavy" bud is not so popular here do not think it ever will be
people are too accustomed to the smoother smoking much less lung expanding skunk and haze strains
that look much bigger in their tiny little 10-20 bags lol

i liked the taste of some of the og plants i have grown
they do seem hit and miss from seed

peace

 

[Sativied]

Pretty much all the amnesias get tall and require little veg time, especially from clone. The frequent amnesia growers in the dutch forums recommend switching to 12/12 when it's "1/3 green" (canopy/coverage). Yet the same folks said I switched too late to 12/12 on my first tubes runs even when I barely vegged - not realizing the veg rates of mediumless. The liberty haze and chocolate fondue had branches up to 4-6 feet.

Compared to many other hybrids grown here the grows often look terribly stretched yet fill up very well, and the product is usually superb. I think you will have to top and crop it a bit as it doesn't branch out a lot. Though I get much wider plants too in in NFT, sometimes don't needed any cropping or even topping and still got a mini sog per plant. Very curious to see what happens in your grotank.

i am not keen on the idea of a bunch of seeds from some random farmer
" collected in the mountains of Afghanistan" is what i got from seedsmans afghan 1 most of the plants were a joke
did not even flower correctly threw most of them away

Like O Haze I think they are generally better for looking for plants/traits to crossbreed into a hybrid or backcross into a classic than for looking for keepers. Been a while since I checked but seeds of africa and one or two others used to or still do sell very cheap land race seeds. At least the price is right there and reflects what you can expect.

i find most of the modern crosses around today uninspiring [...] i would like to see more simple crosses available
two way simple hybrids rather than the genetic cheese/spacequeen/og soup with so much that is around today

Have you ever tried white widow? Smoked it for years, was nr 1 pre-amnesia/ssh times. So much I had enough of it. It's Brazil x India. Should yield great in NFT. Kind of boring high but strong.

 

[NFT]

i am going to run jack o nesia hypro amnesia dinafem amnesia and daybreaker
got a few others to get rid of but don't have the room to do it all on one run
the daybreaker (gage green) was terrible last year i started a few seeds none came up

i grew straight white widow years ago as a break from the NL crosses when ww became the new thing
i found it got very big the taste was boring and bland compared to the NL crosses i had been growing

i guess i could give it a go again have never run any crosses of it before

"afghan haze" from mr nice has no skunk it makes some interesting large calyx compared to NL5 haze
afghan haze is (afghan-T) x haze C
from what i remember haze C is the thai leading haze (haze A) is the Colombian leaning haze
https://mrnice.nl/dhtml/strains.php?id=15

always liked this pic of the jack o nesia
most of the pics around of it show it with nice size calyx and lots of resin

peace

 

[Sativied]

That jackonesia looks excellent. Definitely looks like something I'd be interested in growing if I had more space. The afghan haze looks like a low yielder, especially considering it's 10 weeks. They mention in other shorter flowing afghan crosses that it contributes to high yield, and one the better haze hybrids make up in yield for the longer flower time. I noticed the pics at mns aren't always the best examples though.

 

[NFT]

That jackonesia looks excellent. Definitely looks like something I'd be interested in growing if I had more space. The afghan haze looks like a low yielder, especially considering it's 10 weeks. They mention in other shorter flowing afghan crosses that it contributes to high yield, and one the better haze hybrids make up in yield for the longer flower time. I noticed the pics at mns aren't always the best examples though.

AH does look like it can have problems making cola, little rocket like single buds, one of the phenos of angelheart did that
so did one of the phenos of lavender
they can be very low yielding even when they get fairly big

i think the mns forum was a lively place a few years back with some more pictures and growers etc
many of the more vocal regular folk there left after some squabbling its been pretty much a graveyard since
still there are some bright sparks still there that lurk around lol

the better seed versions of amnesia if any at all since it is a clone only seem to be hypro and jack o nesa
not going to spend £100+ on soma seeds after growing lavender that was not worth the money
seemed like any other afghan/skunk at 1/3 of the price

peace

 

[Sativied]

Not the best example yet a typical amnesia grow in NL


Always surprising how it fills up after looking horribly stretched. Strong strain too, seen quite a few poor grows, starting from nearly dead clones, still produce great bud. For example checkout and then the last page.

Last one, all in one post:

49 amnesia, 11 day veg including topping.

Only so many colas you can cram in a single space, to increase yield after that, the way to go is up. Amnesia slender leaves in combination with 1k watt gavitas is a very popular combination yet still the local shop was out of amnesia and ssh today.... Settled for some mango indica that didn't taste like mango at all.

 

[NFT]

Not the best example yet a typical amnesia grow in NL


Always surprising how it fills up after looking horribly stretched. Strong strain too, seen quite a few poor grows, starting from nearly dead clones, still produce great bud. For example checkout and then the last page.

Last one, all in one post:

49 amnesia, 11 day veg including topping.

Only so many colas you can cram in a single space, to increase yield after that, the way to go is up. Amnesia slender leaves in combination with 1k watt gavitas is a very popular combination yet still the local shop was out of amnesia and ssh today.... Settled for some mango indica that didn't taste like mango at all.

I like the recovery on the second link, can still see some burnt curled up leaves and the rust spot/burning thing but great colas at the end
looks like she will do well yield wise, i am happy how big mothers milk has got with just 16 days veg cfl
so i plan to veg the amnesia for around 12 days but under the MH as i will have all the space free to start them
my thinking now is that once the stem starts to fatten all the way to the bottom they are big enough to flower
they are normally about 6 inch at this stage with a few sets of leaves and little side shoots just starting to grow
out of the main stem

still get a decent enough yield per plant at least 3 oz if the genetics permits perhaps a fair bit more when flowered at 6 inch from seed

this was mothers milk at 13 days, i will flower the amnesia at around this size and top them
i would expect them to stretch for 2-3 weeks before they reach maturity before flowering begins
they could still get 4ft but that will be ok she looks floppy enough for me to bend over if need be
i have about 5ft of height i can use but i do not like them getting over 4ft

jack o nesia

peace

 

[Sativied]

Sounds like a good plan for amnesia.

Hypro/superstrains changed their story later to include enemy of the state but it's commonly accepted here to be an SSH cut. Worse, greenhouse's SSH bag seed. Strange how bag seeds lead to elite cuts here now too.

By crossing it with Nev haze they basically reduced the amount of skunk genes and increased the haze and NL portion.
http://en.seedfinder.eu/strain-info/Amnesia/HY-PRO_Seeds/
Since amnesia is according to some a NL-dominant that seems like a good choice even though I don't like nev haze much.

Jackonesia shows it too: http://en.seedfinder.eu/strain-info/Jack_O_Nesia/Karma_Genetics/ Don't know what D-cut means. Good combination, jack herrer and amnesia/ssh, have the same parent strains. Jackonesia could produce a better calyx to leaf ratio but especially in combination with more yield, fatter buds, than the amnesia cut.

I'm not in the grow scene here sort of speak, I barely know any growers personally and they don't know I grow. I go to growshops 5-10 minutes before they close so there are no other customers. This makes it hard to get clones from reliable sources, especially since the trade in clones is illegal. Have to buy them from a "cuttin-farmer", folks who do nothing but make tens of thousands of clones. Cheap though, especially compared to elite cuts in the US. Varies but less than ten bucks per clone and when you get nore than a handful it gets a lot cheaper.

Anyway... I eventually decided to ask at the grow shop"I know you guys don't and can't sell them but can you tell me were someone can buy clones? I've been growing from seeds since the time they banned clones from grow shops".

He told me the guys (frequent customers that also frequently made the place smell like amnesia) usually exchange those with each other hinting I should ask one of them. About a week later I went early to that shop... And it was gone, just an empty building...

I should make some effort again to get the cut. Maybe Power Plant too (seems to be second most popular clone after amnesia), supposedly south african genetics, no hybrid. Frosty, good yielder, fast. Sativa dom but feels a bit like a smooth indica. High but not hazy racy slighlty-paranoid (which I prefer :)).

 

[NFT]

Sounds like a good plan for amnesia.

Hypro/superstrains changed their story later to include enemy of the state but it's commonly accepted here to be an SSH cut. Worse, greenhouse's SSH bag seed. Strange how bag seeds lead to elite cuts here now too.

By crossing it with Nev haze they basically reduced the amount of skunk genes and increased the haze and NL portion.
http://en.seedfinder.eu/strain-info/Amnesia/HY-PRO_Seeds/
Since amnesia is according to some a NL-dominant that seems like a good choice even though I don't like nev haze much.

Jackonesia shows it too: http://en.seedfinder.eu/strain-info/Jack_O_Nesia/Karma_Genetics/ Don't know what D-cut means. Good combination, jack herrer and amnesia/ssh, have the same parent strains. Jackonesia could produce a better calyx to leaf ratio but especially in combination with more yield, fatter buds, than the amnesia cut.

I'm not in the grow scene here sort of speak, I barely know any growers personally and they don't know I grow. I go to growshops 5-10 minutes before they close so there are no other customers. This makes it hard to get clones from reliable sources, especially since the trade in clones is illegal. Have to buy them from a "cuttin-farmer", folks who do nothing but make tens of thousands of clones. Cheap though, especially compared to elite cuts in the US. Varies but less than ten bucks per clone and when you get nore than a handful it gets a lot cheaper.

Anyway... I eventually decided to ask at the grow shop"I know you guys don't and can't sell them but can you tell me were someone can buy clones? I've been growing from seeds since the time they banned clones from grow shops".

He told me the guys (frequent customers that also frequently made the place smell like amnesia) usually exchange those with each other hinting I should ask one of them. About a week later I went early to that shop... And it was gone, just an empty building...

I should make some effort again to get the cut. Maybe Power Plant too (seems to be second most popular clone after amnesia), supposedly south african genetics, no hybrid. Frosty, good yielder, fast. Sativa dom but feels a bit like a smooth indica. High but not hazy racy slighlty-paranoid (which I prefer :)).

Your situation is similar to mine, i do not mix with other growers other than on the net
which might be the better place to find authentic cuttings from reliable sources
some folk collect them like trophies

i do have cuttings available from a few sources locally where i could meet people to get them
although i can't be sure of the clones authenticity, these folk do not know what they are really selling
got offered clones of strawberry amnesia recently, this seems to be a dinafem cross , might as well do that myself from dinafem seeds

when taking other peoples cuttings i have to put them in quarantine for a while in case they have bugs or diseases
unless it is the real deal its not worth it imo, and here most of the clones on offer are knockoffs
clones were on sale here at many of the hydro shops in the past if you asked discreetly
has stopped now they even have signs up saying do not ask for such things

karma on another forum said the D cut is similar to the core cut maybe even a sister
but takes a little longer 11 weeks has more foxtails and more bubblegum flavor
i also read others say karma used the hypro cut to win a cup, so it might be the same cutting (core) renamed D

peace

 

[Sativied]

Clones usually come with mites here by default, or so it seems anyway in the dutch forums. They often look very poor. Rates are even lower than I thought, 1 clone costs as much as 1gram if you buy 100gram. About half the rates of a gram in shop. About $7 for a clone, cheaper than a seed.

For some reason many dutch closet/tent growers are not fanatic cloners. I see quite a few that have trouble finding good clones, while they've grown it several times already, they still buy new clones, sometimes dozens or more. It seems they are starting to wise up but many also have something against cloning females from fem seed. Hermaphobia...

A popular yet seemingly harder to get version is the S5 haze. Supposedly amnesia too, slightly different, in particular shorter flowering of period 8-9 weeks.

 

[NFT]

Clones usually come with mites here by default, or so it seems anyway in the dutch forums. They often look very poor. Rates are even lower than I thought, 1 clone costs as much as 1gram if you buy 100gram. About half the rates of a gram in shop. About $7 for a clone, cheaper than a seed.

For some reason many dutch closet/tent growers are not fanatic cloners. I see quite a few that have trouble finding good clones, while they've grown it several times already, they still buy new clones, sometimes dozens or more. It seems they are starting to wise up but many also have something against cloning females from fem seed. Hermaphobia...

A popular yet seemingly harder to get version is the S5 haze. Supposedly amnesia too, slightly different, in particular shorter flowering of period 8-9 weeks.

we have those guys here too that do nothing but clones they never flower any plants and they will sell 10 or 100 or however many they can muster with their little setups
these clones they offer will always be average usually some cheap high yielding strain like critical or blue cheese
they might rename them to something more fashionable or exotic

the guys holding the authentic clones collect them like trophies and sell them for more than £6 each
and are unlikely to offer them by the 100 since this could run into a few thousand cost wise
most folk would buy a couple of the expensive genuine and clone these ones themselves

i have not heard of s5 haze, but i have heard of A5 and c5

there was a user on another forum yosamity sam or something like that
he was always growing C5, they are supposedly original clones from the work Nev
did with ( NL#5 x haze A ), this was the stock that both the female parent half of SSH and mango haze were selected, and then crossed with haze C male

so a5 and c5 would both be clones of NL#5 x haze A
that were perhaps good but not good enough to be the parents of SSH and mango haze
karma genetics has a new cross using the A5 clone (A5 haze bx 1)

peace

 

[Sativied]

Good info, thanks. It's often sold as amnesia clones and then folks in the forums recognize it as S5. Being that amnesia is by some considered to be an NL dominant SSH it would not have surprised me if they were related, S5 perhaps being something like C5 x SSH. However, the supposed origin at another forum (the English version of that dutch forum)

"There are only a few people who have the original clones of the S5... (with lots of happiness and love is the S5 discovered, while crossbreeding a Original Silver haze and a beautiful (and potential) Amnesia (Silver was daddy, Amnees was mother). After a few selection rounds the noticed that one clone was the strain the have been looking for.. Best potentials, best flavour, best effect, super steady...and best of all... instead of 74 days of flowering, this clone was ready in 62 days (milky trichomes). The men could not be happier, unfortunately after a while the guys got into a fight, they broke up, and the 60 clones were divided between them.. So after a while there were not much clones left..
Myself, i dont know who the 3 guys are, i only now that i am one of the few lucky bastards who has the orginal S5 haze. We keep some mothers for our rounds, because the S5 is only growed in small grows, it is still very rare...
The S5 name All three of them did their time obligatory military service... And the remembered: S1, ok. S2 less gifted....S5: complete wacko!"

Original silver haze would be... oh... yeah, that makes sense. It's afghani x haze. S5 = (Afghani x Haze) x (NL#5 x Haze x Skunk) (assuming SSH cut story). Hence the shorter flower time.

The reason I got Amnesia White is because I was thinking of crossing Amnesia with Afghani. Noticed it already existed but they crossed the result with Thai later, bought it anyway to check it out. As I mentioned in this thread I think (Amnesia x Afghani) x O Haze could work better, especially if that opposed to the thai in AW doesn't make it herm. S5 is basically already that... Ah well, can't be surprised really.

A google search shows S5 in the UK known mostly as product at some shops in Amsterdam.

 

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Some CH x CH pics. I was really worried it would all stretch too much and while it did stretch quite a bit the stems are wide, leaves larger than my hand... they are small giants. I'm sure they will stretch some more but so far I can't complain considering how full it was. Some have very stretch petioles of the fans but clearly from being to crowded.

Quad-tri whorled, just in the HPS closet for a few days now - flash making it look pale.

Regular (showing nicely that tri whorled has better coverage. * instead of + from the top.)

I ditched the pale looking plant again, was a male.

 

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The evergreen IH plant in hempy, should be done soon. Have given it only water for a few days and it's like it's from plastic.

Starting to show the tails more obviously:

Nothing special, but seeded (small buds at bottom) with AW and CH pollen. Could be interesting to grow out someday, maybe put a few outdoors.

All CHxCH, two males (right in front against the wall)

Most stretched right in the back corner, the indica dom with leaves like slaw in left front corner.

Fairly happy with the soil choice and Atami AB nutes so far.