Buffering RO water

hummusjonas · May 11, 2020

Hi there !!! Ok so im experiencing a big drop in my PH when i add my nutes. I use RO water, i buffer it with CaMag and when i add my nutes ( iguana juice bloom from advance nutrients), my PH drops to as much as 3.7... My RO water is originally at 7. I see myself using a big quantity of PH up.. and i got a good friend telling me that these Ph up and Ph down products can mess up the ph in my soil . He talked to me about some special salts used in the aquariums that are not as bad as these ph up and down.

IF this is true, that ph up and ph down can be agresive and can fuck up my soil ph, can anyone give me any advice as to what i can use, i really just added like 200ml of ph up to a 500 liter tank to get it to 6.1ph, that looks like too much.. any advice.. tahnx

growsince79 · May 11, 2020

hummusjonas said:
Hi there !!! Ok so im experiencing a big drop in my PH when i add my nutes. I use RO water, i buffer it with CaMag and when i add my nutes ( iguana juice bloom from advance nutrients), my PH drops to as much as 3.7... My RO water is originally at 7. I see myself using a big quantity of PH up.. and i got a good friend telling me that these Ph up and Ph down products can mess up the ph in my soil . He talked to me about some special salts used in the aquariums that are not as bad as these ph up and down.

IF this is true, that ph up and ph down can be agresive and can fuck up my soil ph, can anyone give me any advice as to what i can use, i really just added like 200ml of ph up to a 500 liter tank to get it to 6.1ph, that looks like too much.. any advice.. tahnx

I mix ro with 1/3 tap water then ad nutes and adjust if needed.

Aqua Man · May 11, 2020

hummusjonas said:
Hi there !!! Ok so im experiencing a big drop in my PH when i add my nutes. I use RO water, i buffer it with CaMag and when i add my nutes ( iguana juice bloom from advance nutrients), my PH drops to as much as 3.7... My RO water is originally at 7. I see myself using a big quantity of PH up.. and i got a good friend telling me that these Ph up and Ph down products can mess up the ph in my soil . He talked to me about some special salts used in the aquariums that are not as bad as these ph up and down.

IF this is true, that ph up and ph down can be agresive and can fuck up my soil ph, can anyone give me any advice as to what i can use, i really just added like 200ml of ph up to a 500 liter tank to get it to 6.1ph, that looks like too much.. any advice.. tahnx

It's your call mag. The source is cal and mag nitrate. That doesn't buffer pH.

You can find a cal mag with a source of calcium carbonate and it will fix this.

You can also buy potassium bicarbonate (dirt cheap) and use half a tsp to start in 5 gal of RO water. But you may need 1tsp.

It's the carbonate and bicarbonate that buffer water.

In tap water they use calcium carbonate so yes depending on ppm you can mix varying amount with RO for an adequate buffer

If the ppm of your tap water is under 200. Preferably 100-150 would be ideal to use that and skip the RO all together

Aqua Man · May 11, 2020

If you use the potassium bicarbonate in RO as a buffer you will still need the cal mag

Dirtbag · May 11, 2020

Start using potassium silicate in the water before adding all your nutes.

Aqua Man · May 11, 2020

Dirtbag said:
Start using potassium silicate in the water before adding all your nutes.

Another good option. Silica is great for the plants and usually lacking in nutrients

cemchris · May 11, 2020

Dirtbag said:
Start using potassium silicate in the water before adding all your nutes.

That is a win win

cemchris · May 11, 2020

hummusjonas said:
i got a good friend telling me that these Ph up and Ph down products can mess up the ph in my soil .

That's a new one to me. Down will be P. Up will be K. That in turn can mess with it if using a bunch i guess but no more if you are feeding a ton on top of it or the soil is already hot. KOH (what most PH up is - pot hydroxide) can cause issues in soil but I doubt the amount you use will have any noticeable effect so I wouldn't worry too much. The only study I ever read about this was I think raw industrial waste being dumped.

This is more of a concern for recircing hydroponics with getting a ppm level of P or K to the point of locking out things with the addition of too much down or up over the span of a week or more.

Aqua Man · May 11, 2020

cemchris said:
That's a new one to me. Down will be P. Up will be K. That in turn can mess with it if using a bunch i guess but no more if you are feeding a ton on top of it or the soil is already hot. KOH (what most PH up is - pot hydroxide) can cause issues in soil but I doubt the amount you use will have any noticeable effect so I wouldn't worry too much. The only study I ever read about this was I think raw industrial waste being dumped.

But are either necessary in a buffered soil? Personally I think having to add either is a soil problem or source water issue.

Thoughts?

redshift75 · May 11, 2020

Aqua Man said:
But are either necessary in a buffered soil? Personally I think having to add either is a soil problem or source water issue.

Thoughts?

I would agree with that sentiment. as i have to add ro now with our new well that is pumping out water that is all over the place. The soil as ive learned can only do so much buffering before the PH swings get to it. From there the constant swings from the water make a never ending battle. Have had to use both at rates ive never had to use them before. But ive always had to use it to make adjustments to get it in range. Well.... anytime ive been on well water not city tap water.

I thought about adding the buffering/remineralization post filters to the RO setup to help buffer it. But ill experiment with it as i go. its a battle even a good living soil has trouble adjusting. the well right now is sometimes putting out 1200ppm+ with 12+ph. So im trying to constantly fill up inbetween swings.

My experience was my source water issue has escalated into a soil problem. Although it held off nicely for some time. lots of the potted plants and trays seem to be hitting the point they wont work through it anymore even with the ph up and down to balance..

One drop · May 12, 2020

Aqua Man said:
Another good option. Silica is great for the plants and usually lacking in nutrients

Yes Silica is a good way to go that’s my ph up .

Kraken.headz · May 12, 2020

I have a remineralization filter, which helps tremendously. I used to use the House and Gardens stabilizer, and that was great for drain to waste situations.
Harley Smith always recommended Humic as a buffer. Not something I'd want to use for my stock reservoir, but a fine option if you're going to use it in the next 48 hours.

hummusjonas · May 13, 2020

Aqua Man said:
It's your call mag. The source is cal and mag nitrate. That doesn't buffer pH.

You can find a cal mag with a source of calcium carbonate and it will fix this.

You can also buy potassium bicarbonate (dirt cheap) and use half a tsp to start in 5 gal of RO water. But you may need 1tsp.

It's the carbonate and bicarbonate that buffer water.

In tap water they use calcium carbonate so yes depending on ppm you can mix varying amount with RO for an adequate buffer

If the ppm of your tap water is under 200. Preferably 100-150 would be ideal to use that and skip the RO all together

Hey aqua man!!! thanx for the fast reply! Ok im a bit confused and please excuse my ingnorance. So I use RO water,,, and the calcium and magnesium (mononutrients from canna) i use is to buffer the RO water, not the Ph. So RO comes out at 0.0 ppm and Ph 7. I add cal mag to give back to water what i took away from it, until i get to 200ppm or 0.4EC resulting in a ph of 5.6 give or take. Then i add regulator aptus which is silicon with boron and molybdenum. That dosent afect the EC or PPM but drops my ph to about 4.3,, and then after that i add my nutes (iguan juice ) to about 600 to 700 ppm with another ph drop to about 3.8. Then to buffer the PH i use ph up (KOH) and ph down (HCL) both from canna.

These Ph up and downs.. if slighty touch my skin,, they burn,, specially Ph down, and i heard that that can fuck up the ph in my soil and microbes too. Anyway i was concerned that i was using too much ph up and that that could play around with my soil and heard about some salts used for accauriums. My tap water is 200 ppm.. but since i use microbes,, trichoderma and mycorrhizae im concerned that the tap water might have chlorine or fluorine that my fuck around with, so i just go with RO. Its the first time this happens to me ... that i have to use such a big quantity of Ph up (200ml) for a 500 liter tank. I do remember last year getting a Ph in my RO of about 8.2ph .. now im getting 7 or even 6.8,, but still was experiencing a a heavy drop to 4.3...

Dirtbag · May 13, 2020

You're using far too much Calmag also, I'd use about half that. 100ppm/0.2 is all you should need. And seriously, look into using potassium silicate. Without it my nute concoction ends up 4.7-4.8ph. With potassium silicate I can balance it all right around 5.8-6 no problem without needing ph up or down.

Aqua Man · May 13, 2020

hummusjonas said:
Hey aqua man!!! thanx for the fast reply! Ok im a bit confused and please excuse my ingnorance. So I use RO water,,, and the calcium and magnesium (mononutrients from canna) i use is to buffer the RO water, not the Ph. So RO comes out at 0.0 ppm and Ph 7. I add cal mag to give back to water what i took away from it, until i get to 200ppm or 0.4EC resulting in a ph of 5.6 give or take. Then i add regulator aptus which is silicon with boron and molybdenum. That dosent afect the EC or PPM but drops my ph to about 4.3,, and then after that i add my nutes (iguan juice ) to about 600 to 700 ppm with another ph drop to about 3.8. Then to buffer the PH i use ph up (KOH) and ph down (HCL) both from canna.

These Ph up and downs.. if slighty touch my skin,, they burn,, specially Ph down, and i heard that that can fuck up the ph in my soil and microbes too. Anyway i was concerned that i was using too much ph up and that that could play around with my soil and heard about some salts used for accauriums. My tap water is 200 ppm.. but since i use microbes,, trichoderma and mycorrhizae im concerned that the tap water might have chlorine or fluorine that my fuck around with, so i just go with RO. Its the first time this happens to me ... that i have to use such a big quantity of Ph up (200ml) for a 500 liter tank. I do remember last year getting a Ph in my RO of about 8.2ph .. now im getting 7 or even 6.8,, but still was experiencing a a heavy drop to 4.3...

It cause the source of you cal mag is calcium nitrate and magnesium nitrate and those will actually lower pH not buffer it.

I really good option is to as @dirbag and @cemchris point out is potassium silicate. Plants love both the potassium and silica. It's a better option than potassium bicarbonate as I suggested. This will buffer the ph and you likely won't need ph up ever again. Ph up is generally potassium bicarbonate or a few other like cemchris listed.

Start with the potassium silicate then ph down to about 6.2 then add cal mag, then nutrients. It should put you dam close to target.

In terms of tap water chlorine and chloramine might make a small dent in the microbiology but they reproduce extremely fast so with the amount of either in tap water it's negligible. If making teas that's different.

The above option is the most ideal because cannabis absolutely loves silica.

The other is drop the cal mag and use tap. 200ppm is absolutely fine. You may need a tiny bit of cal mag if you show deficiencies but not likely.

hummusjonas · May 13, 2020

Aqua Man said:
It cause the source of you cal mag is calcium nitrate and magnesium nitrate and those will actually lower pH not buffer it.

I really good option is to as @dirbag and @cemchris point out is potassium silicate. Plants love both the potassium and silica. It's a better option than potassium bicarbonate as I suggested. This will buffer the ph and you likely won't need ph up ever again. Ph up is generally potassium bicarbonate or a few other like cemchris listed.

Start with the potassium silicate then ph down to about 6.2 then add cal mag, then nutrients. It should put you dam close to target.

In terms of tap water chlorine and chloramine might make a small dent in the microbiology but they reproduce extremely fast so with the amount of either in tap water it's negligible. If making teas that's different.

The above option is the most ideal because cannabis absolutely loves silica.

The other is drop the cal mag and use tap. 200ppm is absolutely fine. You may need a tiny bit of cal mag if you show deficiencies but not likely.

so i try mixing my tap water and osmosis together 50% / 50% and i get 7.4ph and 150ppm. Alone tap water is 200ppm and 7.8ph. You suggest i stop using my Osmosis machine and go straight with tap or mix them together? anyway thanks to all im such and amateur,, we are so way back here in spain.. big hugs to all of you and i will look forward into this potassium silicate!!!

Aqua Man · May 13, 2020

hummusjonas said:
so i try mixing my tap water and osmosis together 50% / 50% and i get 7.4ph and 150ppm. Alone tap water is 200ppm and 7.8ph. You suggest i stop using my Osmosis machine and go straight with tap or mix them together? anyway thanks to all im such and amateur,, we are so way back here in spain.. big hugs to all of you and i will look forward into this potassium silicate!!!

RO with potassium silicate is the best option.

Straight tap or 50/50 is an option. No cal mag.

As @Dirtbag said if you go to RO no more than 150ppm cal mag. 100ppm is good. 200 is too much.

hummusjonas · May 13, 2020

Dirtbag said:
You're using far too much Calmag also, I'd use about half that. 100ppm/0.2 is all you should need. And seriously, look into using potassium silicate. Without it my nute concoction ends up 4.7-4.8ph. With potassium silicate I can balance it all right around 5.8-6 no problem without needing ph up or down.

hey dirtbag thanks for the tip. i get a bit confused

Dirtbag said:
You're using far too much Calmag also, I'd use about half that. 100ppm/0.2 is all you should need. And seriously, look into using potassium silicate. Without it my nute concoction ends up 4.7-4.8ph. With potassium silicate I can balance it all right around 5.8-6 no problem without needing ph up or down.

hey dirtbag thanks for the tip.. im a bit confused when it comes silicate, silicon, silicic acid ... is it all the same? I mean i use silicon or silicate ( aptus regulator ) to improve the plants immune system, aparently it makes the cell´s wall thicker, makes them resistent to pests and high temperatures, and controls the internode distance so they dont strectch excesively,, is that what potassium silicate does apart from helping to buffer the Ph?

hummusjonas · May 13, 2020

Aqua Man said:
RO with potassium silicate is the best option.

Straight tap or 50/50 is an option. No cal mag.

As @Dirtbag said if you go to RO no more than 150ppm cal mag. 100ppm is good. 200 is too much.

nice one !!!!! we have been recieving for the past years a lot of american genetics,, im growing at the mometns gorila skitelz, watermelon skitelz, and banana sherbert. I heard that a lot of this new genetics need extra calmag.. i give it foliar (camag metrop) and they seem to like it? what do you think?

Aqua Man · May 13, 2020

hummusjonas said:
nice one !!!!! we have been recieving for the past years a lot of american genetics,, im growing at the mometns gorila skitelz, watermelon skitelz, and banana sherbert. I heard that a lot of this new genetics need extra calmag.. i give it foliar (camag metrop) and they seem to like it? what do you think?

Have you tried it without?

Buffering RO water

Buffering RO water

hummusjonas

growsince79

Aqua Man

Aqua Man

Dirtbag

Aqua Man

cemchris

cemchris

Aqua Man

redshift75

Guest

One drop

Bush Doctor

Kraken.headz

hummusjonas

Attachments

Dirtbag

Aqua Man

hummusjonas

Aqua Man

hummusjonas

hummusjonas

Aqua Man

Buffering RO water

Buffering RO water

hummusjonas

growsince79

Aqua Man

Aqua Man

Dirtbag

Aqua Man

cemchris

cemchris

Aqua Man

redshift75

Guest

One drop

Bush Doctor

Kraken.headz

hummusjonas

Attachments

Dirtbag

Aqua Man

hummusjonas

Aqua Man

hummusjonas

hummusjonas

Aqua Man

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency