freeze drying will over dry flower. You can’t cure flower after you freeze dried it. It doesn’t have enough water content to cure anymore.Freeze drying and curing is starting to become main....
For instance LIVE ROSIN...your freshly chopped flower is dunked in liquid nitrogen to freeze dry... no curing needed... there is validity behind this methodology
Thanks for the the answer. I received my controller a couple of days ago and tested it yesterday. I went with the Digiten 1011, $40 on Amazon. No issues at all with it, in fact it worked very well. I was able to do a temperature between 45-50 F and also between 55-60. Could probably go a bit higher or lower but those are the ranges I tested yesterday. Humidity stayed within 10% 50-60 RH, without using the water/fan. Ended up having the start and stop temperature only vary by 1 degree at the end to keep the humidity as stable as possible. It still had at least 10 minutes in between on/off, which should be good for the compressor. It is holding the temperature pretty well inside the cooler, with a room temperature around 70-72 F.Glad you got things working for you. You got it right, match the colors of the wires together. To bypass the sensor you just get rid of it. No circuit boards needed. The inkbird controller will be the brains. We just want it to either be on or off.
the compressor is a lot to work against. You really need to dial in all these environmental controllers so you limit the humidity fluctuations. Those humidity spikes make me uncomfortable for mold.
Google around for “lotus cure.” People dry in regular fridges by using brown paper bags as kind of a moisture barrier. You might get some more ideas from it.
Sorry for the newb question @PahPahCee , I just wrapped my first grow and as a tech/analytical person I wanted to build a cannatrol as well.So 1 hole drilled total. You feed the probe through it inside the fridge and the Dehum power cable feeds outside of the fridge to plug into the controller.
Disassemble the probe to make it smaller. Two ways about it:
View attachment 2011936
Or just unscrew the back of the controller housing and you can disconnect the probe from that side.
No drain pipe needed. All thermoelectric fridges have a little drain port in the bottom back of the unit. You just sit the Dehum ontop and it’ll drain out no problem. If you look at the back of these fridges you can see indentations and groves where water will funnel down to the drain.
You can just collect the water in the Dehum. It probably would only need to be emptied once or twice before you were done drying. The problem is space. If the Dehum is too tall then the shelves won’t fit.
The fridge peltier fan never stops spinning. This is your work horse. It does 90% of the moisture removal. The Dehum is really more about adding heat and steering the RH into the right direction.
So the procedure is:
1) Load the fridge with fresh nug
2) wait 24 hours for the RH to stabilize in the fridge. Record the RH.
3) turn on your inkbird controller so the Dehum drops the RH by 0.5 or so.
3) have the Dehum turn off before it raises the temperature to an undesirable temp.
4) temperature is back within your range and start steering your RH back down.
5) stop dropping RH once you hit 62%
6) grove bag it or leave it in the fridge until your ready.
All the people I talk to doing this have great results. Now, we all are dropping RH and adjusting temperatures a bit differently because we’re making it up as we go. The above directions work great for me. I tend to drop 0.5% RH a day, maintaining 58degrees F. Then after two weeks it’s usually ready to go into bags.
the goal is to get the bud to a moisture content of 12%. We achieve this by bringing the environment to 62% rh with the lowest temperature achievable.Sorry for the newb question @PahPahCee , I just wrapped my first grow and as a tech/analytical person I wanted to build a cannatrol as well.
My question isn't about the set up, but the process you listed above, and my confusion could be entirely based on my newbness.
If I understand correctly, you're goal is to hit/ maintain 62% rh within 2 weeks, and then your flower is considered dried and ready to cure, correct?
I thought the goal was to dry your bud to remove chlorophyll and get rid of the hay taste/harshness, then rehydrate during curing to give aerobic bacteria time to work and increase flavor profiles.
To that point, I thought the goal was a low humidity during drying, with a goal of buds hitting ~12% moisture content before rehydrating to 58%-62% during curing. The 12% indicates the point you flip from drying to curing.
Is my understanding incorrect? I have some bud in a wine cooler now, and I have been checking it with a moisture meter daily. I am looking for my hygrometer to check fridge humidity based on what I have been reading here, as I was under the understanding lower humidity = better during the dry and assumed the natural low humidity of a compressor based fridge would be fine.
My buds are currently on day 7 in the fridge, and have an average moisture content of ~18% via a moisture meter and still feel pretty spongy/fresh.
Thanks!
Gotcha. I have my fridge at 41° and I am swinging from 61% to 41% Humidity as the compressor kicks on and off. Temp swings from 42.2° to 46.7°. I placed a small dehumidifier inside as it was getting up to 65°, but I'm not sure it is doing much with the compressor cycle frequency.the goal is to get the bud to a moisture content of 12%. We achieve this by bringing the environment to 62% rh with the lowest temperature achievable.
By dropping the rh by 0.5% a day you can lower the RH without raising the internal temperature by more than a few F. Usually it takes around 2 weeks if you go slowly like this. You can go faster but I would avoid going past 62F.
You do not want to over dry your bud with the intention of reintroducing moisture. I do not recall the exact science behind it by the idea is; once you get the bud below 58% RH it stops curing. You can’t restart a cure by adding more moisture. So I like to stop drying at 62% because it gives me the most barrier to preserve the flower.
A normal compressor fridge has wide humidity swings. It will over dry your material and you will lose a majority of your terpenes. The flavor of your cannabis comes from the terpenes.
You want to keep the active moisture content below 62% or 12% (with a moisture meter) to prevent microbial/fungal growth.
if the humidity doesn’t dip to low and stays close to average around 60%RH I would imagine the it will take a while to dry at 40F.Gotcha. I have my fridge at 41° and I am swinging from 61% to 41% Humidity as the compressor kicks on and off. Temp swings from 42.2° to 46.7°. I placed a small dehumidifier inside as it was getting up to 65°, but I'm not sure it is doing much with the compressor cycle frequency.
I tried a higher temp setting to see if I could reduce the compressor cycling, but the humidity got as high as 80%, so I lowered it again.
It seems with the sine wave at 41° temp setting I am averaging about 61% Humidity. I have attached a photo showing my data for the time period I have been monitoring.
I think even with the swings I should be OK at 41° setting as I have brown bags buffering the bud from the fluctuations. I measured multiple bud moistures from different bags in different spots and the average is still around 16-17%, so it doesn't seem to be drying too quickly.
I guess I should figure out how I want to cure now. My buddy does it via jars, but he doesn't burp them despite my advice (he's also new, on his 3rd grow). I'm trying to take a more scientific approach and show him how good it could be, lol.
I may do a small control in jars, figure out fridge curing conditions for a portion, maybe make a small controlled open jar environment with a tote for a portion and then try freezer cured via sublimation for a final portion... 3 weeks later invite some friends over for a blind taste test.
Thanks for the response!
No judgement but based on your data you have quite a large swing in temps from low to high. I would recommend getting a temperature/humidity controller like an Inkbird. I am using a Digiten that I got on Amazon for $40. I have a 5.2 cubic foot Vissani wine fridge and found the thermostat to be wildly inaccurate. Using a controller I have been able to dial my temperature to within 1.5 degrees difference between high and low. You can adjust down to tenths of a degree and also set it to have a compressor cool down time of how ever many minutes you choose. So if it was set to come on but has not reached the time you set for compressor cool down it will not turn back on until it reaches that time (I have not had a need for this yet but it is a nice feature). Every fridge is going to be different but I have maintained an average of 43 F degrees while drying the past month.Gotcha. I have my fridge at 41° and I am swinging from 61% to 41% Humidity as the compressor kicks on and off. Temp swings from 42.2° to 46.7°. I placed a small dehumidifier inside as it was getting up to 65°, but I'm not sure it is doing much with the compressor cycle frequency.
I tried a higher temp setting to see if I could reduce the compressor cycling, but the humidity got as high as 80%, so I lowered it again.
It seems with the sine wave at 41° temp setting I am averaging about 61% Humidity. I have attached a photo showing my data for the time period I have been monitoring.
I think even with the swings I should be OK at 41° setting as I have brown bags buffering the bud from the fluctuations. I measured multiple bud moistures from different bags in different spots and the average is still around 16-17%, so it doesn't seem to be drying too quickly.
I guess I should figure out how I want to cure now. My buddy does it via jars, but he doesn't burp them despite my advice (he's also new, on his 3rd grow). I'm trying to take a more scientific approach and show him how good it could be, lol.
I may do a small control in jars, figure out fridge curing conditions for a portion, maybe make a small controlled open jar environment with a tote for a portion and then try freezer cured via sublimation for a final portion... 3 weeks later invite some friends over for a blind taste test.
Thanks for the response!
Thanks for the feedback, no hard feelings at all. The big temp swing in my data is from when I adjusted my temp to 50 to see if I could stabilize the humidity swings from the compressor. Right now I am having 5 degree swings from 41.9° to 46.6°. Humidity from 39% to 60.4%, so average is a little low at 54.5%.No judgement but based on your data you have quite a large swing in temps from low to high. I would recommend getting a temperature/humidity controller like an Inkbird. I am using a Digiten that I got on Amazon for $40. I have a 5.2 cubic foot Vissani wine fridge and found the thermostat to be wildly inaccurate. Using a controller I have been able to dial my temperature to within 1.5 degrees difference between high and low. You can adjust down to tenths of a degree and also set it to have a compressor cool down time of how ever many minutes you choose. So if it was set to come on but has not reached the time you set for compressor cool down it will not turn back on until it reaches that time (I have not had a need for this yet but it is a nice feature). Every fridge is going to be different but I have maintained an average of 43 F degrees while drying the past month.
Also finding the small dehumidifier I have is really doing nothing. I am more concerned with too low of humidity and drying too fast. Using a small plastic bowl of water with a sponge and a 3 inch usb fan blowing over it connected to the humidity outlet on the controller helps keep the humidity from dropping below say 40% RH (my current setting) and having shut off when it gets to 45% RH. I have not filled my fridge, I'm doing 1 or 2 smaller autos at a time. My humidity never got above 70% RH. If your humidity is really high use the dehumidifier, on the other hand once it levels out if it goes to low use the water/bowl/sponge humidifier.
I ran the wires for the controller probe and usb fan through the door seal and put some one side sticky weather stripping around the area to help seal any air loss. The wires are small and I have no issues with air entering or escaping.
Hope your lotus dry goes as well as mine is at this point.
Makes sense to what I am seeing. I am compressor based, by the time the dehu would kick on the compressor would also thus eliminating the need for it. The initial humidity spike seems to decrease and level out for almost everyone. For me it was only a matter of hours.I don’t see a need for a dehum in a compressor fridge set up. In the peltier wine fridge it is needed because the humidity continue to increase without the fridge ramping up the onboard peltier.
We use the dehumidifier to lower RH but more importantly it increases the temperature. This in return tells the fridge to increase its cooling efforts. This creates our sublimation.
The lotus cure is similar but it’s all about slowing down the sublimation. This is done by modifying the fridge cooling cycle and adding moisture barriers to combat the rh swings.
5 degree difference I would think would be fine. I am by no means an expert, for me it's all about what you find works best for you. I do some things that might seem excessive but give me peace of mind and I am happy with the results. We are basically experimenting here and sharing results, take them with a grain of salt and form your own conclusions.Thanks for the feedback, no hard feelings at all. The big temp swing in my data is from when I adjusted my temp to 50 to see if I could stabilize the humidity swings from the compressor. Right now I am having 5 degree swings from 41.9° to 46.6°. Humidity from 39% to 60.4%, so average is a little low at 54.5%.
I have an inkbird temp and humidity controller, but found them to be less accurate than the ac infinity controller I am using. I could power the fridge through it and turn it on/off as needed if that would be a better route than letting the fridge control it, but regardless of what is controlling the compressor, the temp swings are really happening.
I believe the culprit is the door on my wine fridge. I got a good deal on a vinotemp 141 bottle wine fridge, but the inner glass on the front door was broke. So it is missing the extra R value of the second pane of glass and whatever inert gas was in there. I think I may try cutting some foam board to fit the recessed glass spot and see if the added R value of the insulation helps stabilize the temp more.
I agree, the small dehumidifer doesn't seem to be doing much and I am thinking about scrapping it from the set up.
Sure do.I thought terps start degrading at 55 and under
Sure do.
Lower the temperature the better. Just don’t freeze your material on accident.
That's awesome that you have a space that can maintain a good drying environment. I am in an warm humid area where getting to 60/60 is almost impossible even in the colder months. I would need to add another tent and dehumidifier to even come close and I would have to run A/C way too much and would be really difficult to come close to 60 F degrees. For me the fridge was cheaper and more stable then any environment I could create. It also allows me to be flexible when it comes to harvest. I can chop different strains at different times without having to try and change the grow room environment for drying.Just wanted to add my two cents worth to this discussion. I have an insulated grow room in my garage under the house. I heat with a hot oil heater, cool with a portable LG air conditioner and have a dehumidifier. I grow two crops a year, one in Fall one in Winter which gives me over two pounds of weed.
1. Chop plants after 48 hrs of darkness, at around 55°f 50 to 60 % RH hang upside-down in darkness. Maintain 55° and 50 to 60 % RH thru process.
2 Remove fan leaves after 24 hrs continue to hang upside-down until buds get crunchy on outside, usually about 5 to 7 days.
3. Trim plants and put buds in Glad XXL food containers on a layer of wax paper with a mini hygrometer/thermometer from Amazon. About 2 oz per container.
4. Put lid on loosely, lift wax paper and buds out a couple of times a day and turn them. Do this until RH gets down to 70%. Start snapping the lid on and let RH build in container then open it up, turn buds and let moisture escape.Keep doing this until RH stabilizes under 70%.
5.Put in widemouth Mason jars with mini hygrometers. Burp jars when RH gets above 70%. Keep doing this until RH stabilizes. I like mine 65 to 70%.
6. This all happens at around 55° f, burp once a week for a couple weeks
7. Once everything is stable in Mason jars put in a refrigerator at 45° with a container of damp rid in fridge. Keep lids on tight. Leave hygrometers in jars, check once a week, if RH creeps up let jar warm up and burp.
My weed keeps fresh and Terpy for over a year doing this with no mold problems.
They make a Fresh Saver Vacuum Packaging System you can find on Amazon that vacuum seals glass jars. I use that also to keep my weed fresh. The dry, cure and storage are the most important steps in having really good cannabis. I have been growing for 10 years and when Ohio got Medical I was really surprised to find out how inferior dispensary weed was. But when you think of it, all they want to do is get their product to market asap. They can't take the time to coddle their product like the home grower can. Michigan has much better product than Ohio does. As a matter of fact Lume Cannabis has a product called Black Out which is dried and cured in the dark at low temps in glass jars much like I do.That's awesome that you have a space that can maintain a good drying environment. I am in an warm humid area where getting to 60/60 is almost impossible even in the colder months. I would need to add another tent and dehumidifier to even come close and I would have to run A/C way too much and would be really difficult to come close to 60 F degrees. For me the fridge was cheaper and more stable then any environment I could create. It also allows me to be flexible when it comes to harvest. I can chop different strains at different times without having to try and change the grow room environment for drying.
I am going to store my stash in the fridge around 60 F degrees/50-60 RH when the drying process is finished. I stored a batch in Grove bags in my food refrigerator and eventually it got pretty dry. It's still very green and the trich's look good and it smokes well but the lower humidity in the fridge dried it out beyond my preference. Might switch to jars once the curing is done to keep it air tight. Since the Grove bags supposedly breathe I think that had something to do with my stash over qdrying during storage in the fridge.
Time to roll a HUUUGE joint !Get some RMAX and frame out your garage for drying. Put a roll-in AC in, they are also dehumidifiers. Put an oscillating fan aimed at the floor. Never blow air on buds. They dry too fast and taste harsh. Keep it dark . You know what time it is
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