Cheap alternatives to overpriced hydroponic nutrients

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cottageman

cottageman

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I use power both power si products because they seem to work the best for me and what I’ve tried so far. I do .5ml/gallon for the regular one and I do .75ml/gal for the bloom. I usually cut it out around the beginning of week 7 in flower
What Silica product are you using and how much per gallon? What week do you cut out the Silica? Thanks!
 
robo

robo

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It's all NH4 not N03. Think he is in coco. Was trying to look at the ingredients but they dont list it.

yes 100% agree with everything you stated.
Haha damn looks like I’m the one now who’s not reading the thread before I post in it. LOL
Idk how I missed that it’s 100% ammonium. Fail
Glad there’s more knowledgeable people around here than me. :)
 
cemchris

cemchris

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@mikeross It seems fine but I have never ran N that high in flower. I usually max out about 110. Not to say it won't be good or work just have never gone that high. Everything else seems good.
 
cemchris

cemchris

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Haha damn looks like I’m the one now who’s not reading the thread before I post in it. LOL
Idk how I missed that it’s 100% ammonium. Fail
Glad there’s more knowledgeable people around here than me. :)

:D got u fam
 
mikeross

mikeross

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@mikeross It seems fine but I have never ran N that high in flower. I usually max out about 110. Not to say it won't be good or work just have never gone that high. Everything else seems good.

As mentioned... I'm clueless about nutrient ratios but gotta start somewhere. The guys running those ratios are all running 100% Canna Coco. I did some research and will quote the following from two different sources:

" The microflora living in coco requires nitrogen and removes it from the coir in a process called nitrogen drawdown. To balance this drawdown, a coco-specific base nutrient should have a higher nitrogen percentage than a base for soil and hydro."

" While the lignin increases microorganism growth in coir, which is beneficial, those microorganisms require nitrogen. While natural coir does have a small amount of nitrogen, it will not be enough to create an ideal environment for growth. Your nutrient base should also include more nitrogen than you would with traditional soil or hydroponics."

I also came across the ratios for Canna's base nutrients and Nitrogen is sitting @ 185 which is way way higher than any other line I've seen.
 
cemchris

cemchris

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As mentioned... I'm clueless about nutrient ratios but gotta start somewhere. The guys running those ratios are all running 100% Canna Coco. I did some research and will quote the following from two different sources:

" The microflora living in coco requires nitrogen and removes it from the coir in a process called nitrogen drawdown. To balance this drawdown, a coco-specific base nutrient should have a higher nitrogen percentage than a base for soil and hydro."

" While the lignin increases microorganism growth in coir, which is beneficial, those microorganisms require nitrogen. While natural coir does have a small amount of nitrogen, it will not be enough to create an ideal environment for growth. Your nutrient base should also include more nitrogen than you would with traditional soil or hydroponics."

I also came across the ratios for Canna's base nutrients and Nitrogen is sitting @ 185 which is way way higher than any other line I've seen.

Good info. It's a journey with lots of testing. My N ratio has crept up and up since I started down the same path. Kind of threw everything I thought I knew on my head once I started to get into the nuts and bolts of it all.
 
robo

robo

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As mentioned... I'm clueless about nutrient ratios but gotta start somewhere. The guys running those ratios are all running 100% Canna Coco. I did some research and will quote the following from two different sources:

" The microflora living in coco requires nitrogen and removes it from the coir in a process called nitrogen drawdown. To balance this drawdown, a coco-specific base nutrient should have a higher nitrogen percentage than a base for soil and hydro."

" While the lignin increases microorganism growth in coir, which is beneficial, those microorganisms require nitrogen. While natural coir does have a small amount of nitrogen, it will not be enough to create an ideal environment for growth. Your nutrient base should also include more nitrogen than you would with traditional soil or hydroponics."

I also came across the ratios for Canna's base nutrients and Nitrogen is sitting @ 185 which is way way higher than any other line I've seen.
All you need to worry about when running coco is a little bit higher Ca & Mg to account for the media holding on to it & add 50ppm of K for the amount of potassium the media breaking down provides.

so because of the ratio your N will be a little higher, but in application it’s usually taken care of by lowering your K.
That is unless you’ve got some monster feeders then your ppms will be higher and thus overall everything will be larger numbers, but I’ve never had to go over 120 N either.

I did have a chance to look at canna coco’s breakdown & I was surprised as how much nitrogen it has, I thought this would be balanced out by their pk boost but it only calls for it once in their feed chart. I’ve seen good results from other people but just a little too much nitrogen for my tastes. Less nitrogen=less trimming!
 
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Fudge

Fudge

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As mentioned... I'm clueless about nutrient ratios but gotta start somewhere. The guys running those ratios are all running 100% Canna Coco. I did some research and will quote the following from two different sources:

" The microflora living in coco requires nitrogen and removes it from the coir in a process called nitrogen drawdown. To balance this drawdown, a coco-specific base nutrient should have a higher nitrogen percentage than a base for soil and hydro."

" While the lignin increases microorganism growth in coir, which is beneficial, those microorganisms require nitrogen. While natural coir does have a small amount of nitrogen, it will not be enough to create an ideal environment for growth. Your nutrient base should also include more nitrogen than you would with traditional soil or hydroponics."

I also came across the ratios for Canna's base nutrients and Nitrogen is sitting @ 185 which is way way higher than any other line I've seen.


I Dont suppose youve got the cannacoco a/b breakdown, bill gave me a great wiki to use, has loads of nutrient breakdowns in it, but the only canna missing is the coco one, Ive already got a great start from bill , but the bignug im running for the 3rd time now in a SOG this time, I know exactly when and how much to increase using canna so id like to replicate as close to that as possible at least just for this strain as ive got her so dialled in now she eats everything i throw at her, takes stress like a champ LST Mainline, you name it ive tried it on her, but she is a critical mass x so is always a good bet. I will be trying out testing SBS runs in the near future say 2 or 3 of each both bignug same everything, but 3 on dry nutes and 3 on the equivalent cann. then check it out cost/yield/quality etc, but just for these little ladies for now id like to keep them as happy as possible.
 
BillFarthing

BillFarthing

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if your using it in a fertilizer any potassium silicate product is totally fine.

Potassium/calcium is a see-saw that has to be in balance.

The cation exchange with coco has residual K and potassium silicate can lock out calcium. Further, the same high potassium can lock out calcium with Jack's 5-12-26/cal nit. You are best to use an alternate silica source in either scenario.

https://medteknutrients.com.au/hydroponic-coir-substrate-science/

Alternate sources would be rice hulls (charred for quicker availability), stabilized silicic acid or using potassium silicate as a foliar versus drench.
 
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cemchris

cemchris

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Potassium/calcium is a see-saw that has to be in balance.

The cation exchange with coco has residual K and potassium silicate can lock out calcium. Further, the same high potassium can lock out calcium with Jack's 5-12-26/cal nit. You are best to use an alternate silica source in either scenario.

https://medteknutrients.com.au/hydroponic-coir-substrate-science/

Alternate sources would be rice hulls (charred for quicker availability), stabilized silicic acid or using potassium silicate as a foliar versus drench.

Good read

Another reason I moved away from pure coco to a mixed product with bark and other things like Tupur.
 
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cottageman

cottageman

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This calculator has helped me a ton. Type in the ratios of whatever fertilizer you want and it will tell you the exact ppl of almost every element. When I had having N problems when I was using the heavy16 line I used this calculator to realize I was way too low on my N so I switched to jacks and then Athena because of the ratios seem to work great and the calculator helped me so massively in figuring out what nutrients to switch to
 
Fudge

Fudge

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I don't have it but saw it on a youtube video discussing Jack's. Click this link and forward to the 30:05 mark and you will see Canna's breakdown.

Screenshot_2020-09-22-00-43-01.png

Managed to grab a screenshot if anyone wants itHope it's clear enough if you zoom in
 
Fudge

Fudge

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I've just noticed the canna coco hasn't got any micros in bar 1, So which additive is it that gives that in the canna range?. I use kelp cold press and fish shit as well as calmag along side, but does this mean I'm lacking in them or is it that they are assuming the coco contains enough micros itself?
Forgive me if I'm missing something, it's late here and I've just come out the tent after 2 hours of sweating, then had a creamy hot chocolate. And an equally creamy bong. So I may be a little red-eyed right now haha
 
Dr.Green55

Dr.Green55

395
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I like Jack's 3.6/Cal nit 2.4 the best.

So I never used jacks or even played with it, so I don't know much about their stuff, I take it thats their coco mix or an all purpose ? Do they consider that to be a start to finish mix , or veg and then add a flower P/K boost ?
 
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