Could I Please Get A Little Help With Deficiency

[Tbone]

In the other thread, the OP was using a burner for co2 and was not having the proper flame from the burner causing issues.

I have looked at the flame on the burners ( this problem is happening in both rooms)They appear to be burning blue.

 

[DemonTrich]

I would recheck the burners. I thought you were running tanks. His room was perfect, then something happened with the flame causing issues. I'm not familiar with burners, just tanka.

 

[Mr.GoodCat]

A few things. 800ppm is way to strong for a rdwc system. Also your humidity is a little low but I don't think it's the culprit here. Lastly is your air pump in your sealed room? If so it's pumping co2 into your system, that's no good.

If it was me here is what I would do, listed in order of importance imho. Move air pump out of the room so it's not pulling co2 enriched air into the system. Drop your ppm so you max out at about 400. Dont let your ph shoot above 6. Stay on the 5.5-6 range. And lastly raise your rh to 70-75 range if you want to run your room at 83 to get your vpd in a more optimum range. I personally like to run my room at 77 and rh at 70 until flush then I drop the temp to about 72 and the rh to about 50. Hope this helps and good luck!

 

[DemonTrich]

If I followed VDP in flower, I'd get bud rot asap. Co2 builds dense buds, thus needing 50-60%rh to avoid bud rot. 500 ppm is what I run last 2 weeks of flower. Ambient ppm in the world is about 400, unless you live in LA, or other major cities with a lot of air pollution.

X2 on the air pump sucking in co2 air into your roots. Roots need o2, not co2.

 

[Tbone]

A few things. 800ppm is way to strong for a rdwc system. Also your humidity is a little low but I don't think it's the culprit here. Lastly is your air pump in your sealed room? If so it's pumping co2 into your system, that's no good.

If it was me here is what I would do, listed in order of importance imho. Move air pump out of the room so it's not pulling co2 enriched air into the system. Drop your ppm so you max out at about 400. Dont let your ph shoot above 6. Stay on the 5.5-6 range. And lastly raise your rh to 70-75 range if you want to run your room at 83 to get your vpd in a more optimum range. I personally like to run my room at 77 and rh at 70 until flush then I drop the temp to about 72 and the rh to about 50. Hope this helps and good luck!

Air pumps have alway been outside the room. Even the epicenter is outside the room. I do try to run higher RH at the begining of flower attempting to get closer to optimum VDP but to hit the mark on VDP I think I would be risking mold.

Thanks to everyones help I may have come up with something. Ill describe in another post.

 

[Tbone]

You guys have really got this old man thinking. First off ,again, I want to say thank you for all the help. All of you.

Anyway, My original co2 controller had a dead band I set at "400 ppm" meaning when the co2 reached 1500 it would turn off and not turn back on untill the co2 dropped to 1100ppm. When I set up the enviro controllers , I left the offsets at factory specs or "150ppm offset" Im thinking maybe this tight of an offset is not allowing for o2 to accumulate in the room. So on my next grow I will set the offset so when co2 reaches 1500ppm it will turn off and not turn back on until it reaches say 700ppm. This might be a little extreme but should show some kind of difference. At least its something I can try. But it will be a while because I am a long ways away from flipping to flower.

 

[EventHorizan]

That's a interesting point about the air pump. That's the second time I've heard that. I'm glad you brought that up as I need to run a line for mine.
Do you think I need to filter the air coming in? Can I intake air from outside?

 

[DemonTrich]

That's a hell of a high dead band setting. I have mine set at 50ppm on my fuzzy logic controller. Tou want to keep that ppm at your desired set level all thru lights on with minimal swings to allow the plants to absorb the proper co2 saturation.

 

[RoeBuck]

I also run a closed environment with co2, starting at 1200 and dropping to 400 the last couple of weeks. I've never run into an issue like this. To me it looks more like a nutrient deficiency, possibly P and/or K. Are you seeing any red stems on your leaf stalks or red streaks running up the main stalk? I'm not familiar with the nutes you are running but would suggest you compare the amounts of P and K you are feeding to House & Garden and Current Solutions, which I've found to both work well in these systems. I've never run into deficiencies of either element over a variety of strains using them.

 

[Tbone]

I also run a closed environment with co2, starting at 1200 and dropping to 400 the last couple of weeks. I've never run into an issue like this. To me it looks more like a nutrient deficiency, possibly P and/or K. Are you seeing any red stems on your leaf stalks or red streaks running up the main stalk? I'm not familiar with the nutes you are running but would suggest you compare the amounts of P and K you are feeding to House & Garden and Current Solutions, which I've found to both work well in these systems. I've never run into deficiencies of either element over a variety of strains using them.

Ive put a lot of thought into this today and Im kind of also thinking back to a nutrient deficiency. I think theres plenty of P and K but I could be locking K out. I run RO water and the Cal- mag I am using has quite a bit of N in it.

Fyi. these nutes are very similar to Cultured solutions I believe this company used to make the Cultured Solutions for Current Culture but im not totally sure on that. The companies name is "CleanGrow"
I do have some red perioles on some leaves, just dont recall this deficiency prior to the environment change on this strain.

 

[Tbone]

That's a hell of a high dead band setting. I have mine set at 50ppm on my fuzzy logic controller. Tou want to keep that ppm at your desired set level all thru lights on with minimal swings to allow the plants to absorb the proper co2 saturation.

Its a new day and I have kind of re-thought the co2 thing. Im back on a nutrient def. problem. I have to agree, I should want to set everything in the enviroment without too much fluctuation.

 

[Tbone]

This last grow is almost complete and it will be a little while until I flip to flower and experience this problem again. I am going to make a couple nutrient adjustments and see if I get any improvements.
Change Cal Mag brand with lower N
Then up the cal mag
Then if the deficiency still starts showing up, just up the P and K .
Try to run a little lower ppm's in general
Once I resolve this I promise to come back with results.
Thank you everyone for all the help so far.

 

[Mr.GoodCat]

Its a new day and I have kind of re-thought the co2 thing. Im back on a nutrient def. problem. I have to agree, I should want to set everything in the enviroment without too much fluctuation.

Did you ever drop your ppm from 800? That's crazy high for under current. If you called the folks over At cc I bet they would agree. Also less is more in that system. You basically just need base nutes and calmag if running ro, and MAYBE a booster during peak months. Kiss is best with your setup

 

[Mr.GoodCat]

Did you ever drop your ppm from 800? That's crazy high for under current. If you called the folks over At cc I bet they would agree. Also less is more in that system. You basically just need base nutes and calmag if running ro, and MAYBE a booster during peak months. Kiss is best with your setup

Try running 250-300ppm in veg you don't need anymore than than that

 

[DemonTrich]

I don't use co2 in veg and I struggle to keep the growth down. Busting out the hedge clippers, or gonna top and clone them all.

 

[RoeBuck]

This last grow is almost complete and it will be a little while until I flip to flower and experience this problem again. I am going to make a couple nutrient adjustments and see if I get any improvements.
Change Cal Mag brand with lower N
Then up the cal mag
Then if the deficiency still starts showing up, just up the P and K .
Try to run a little lower ppm's in general
Once I resolve this I promise to come back with results.
Thank you everyone for all the help so far.

Coming from soil growing my instinct was to run high ppms when I first started with rdwc. I quickly learned that less is truly more in these systems as they are so efficient. I run a separate veg system and cloner. Once I move from the cloner to the veg system I start at about 200 ppm (500 scale). When I move them to bloom I generally start around 300 ppm and by week 5 or so, when they are at peak feeding, rarely go over 550. I check my pH and ppm every day and look for the pH to slowly rise while the ppm falls. Day to day it's not much, maybe a .2 or .3 pH increase and a 5-10 point drop in ppm, depending on how heavy they are feeding. If the readings are going in the other direction it's a good bet my nutes are too strong. Nutrient levels that are too high will cause nute lockout, which can look like a deficiency. It's so much easier to increase ppm as opposed to dropping ppm.

 

[Mr.GoodCat]

Coming from soil growing my instinct was to run high ppms when I first started with rdwc. I quickly learned that less is truly more in these systems as they are so efficient. I run a separate veg system and cloner. Once I move from the cloner to the veg system I start at about 200 ppm (500 scale). When I move them to bloom I generally start around 300 ppm and by week 5 or so, when they are at peak feeding, rarely go over 550. I check my pH and ppm every day and look for the pH to slowly rise while the ppm falls. Day to day it's not much, maybe a .2 or .3 pH increase and a 5-10 point drop in ppm, depending on how heavy they are feeding. If the readings are going in the other direction it's a good bet my nutes are too strong. Nutrient levels that are too high will cause nute lockout, which can look like a deficiency. It's so much easier to increase ppm as opposed to dropping ppm.

+1

 

[stickyfing3rs]

That's definitely nute burn, try running just a base nutrient at low ppm. I've been growing in rdwc for a long time and am using house and garden aqua flakes ONLY. At the 1:1 ratio they recommend

 

[JMcG]

Drop your nutes down bro!
I gotta agree with the last two posts, especially because I just went through the same scenario. I am on my fifth round of UC grows now, and it is amazing to me how low I can get the nutes. My last couple of rounds I had problems very similar to yours, and I kept chasing my tail trying to address my " deficiencies". Even though I was only using around 400-500 ppms (500 scale) it was way too much. Curling, cupping, necrosis, I had it all to some degree or another. I still had a pretty good yield but I know it could have been better.
So I spent some time researching it on CC s website and also here on the Farm. My system apparently is considered super charged and as a result needs the lowest feeding schedule of them all. I am going into week six since the flip on my new batch of ladies right now. At the flip I stayed around 180 ppm and now they still barely want anything much past 240. I keep reverting back to my previous mind set of shoving as much nutes down their throats as I thought I could and try to blast them with a bit higher concentration and POW!.... burn.
I'd be surprised if they end up much higher than 275- 350 by the end of it all...

 

[Tbone]

I wanted to take a minute to stop in, say thank you, let you guys know I read your last posts, and to let you know where I am at with my current grow. I have two seperate strains in pre veg now so it will be a little while before I get to flower. But when I do I will post my progress. #1 thing I am going to do is work with a lot lighter nutrient schedule! So you guys got that in my head. Come to think of it becasuse I am using automatic dosers I should be able to run an even lower nutrient schedule. The dosers work in a way that if the ppm's drop a few points , the dosers will give a squirt. Meaning I dont really have "down 50 ppm , replenish" thing going on. Rather the nutes stay at a consistent level all the time, less fluctuation.
In my last few grows I was at 350- 400 at the end of veg and the plants looked healthy, When I flipped to flower the problem would start. Most likely because I would up the nutes at this time.
Bottom line is I hear you loud and clear and will run a lot lower nute schedule this run!
Ill keep you posted.
Thanks everyone for helping!!