Defoliation Side By Side - Bushy Plants

2,795
263
Naw bro - most expensive in the world (for now - we are moving and will have 25kw of solar). Here in Philly is .14/KWh
.14kwh the most expensive in the world? lol... Hawaii is like .35kwh... Conneticut is around .20kwh .14kwh is cheap electricity compared to a ton of other states.
 
16
13
I would argue the that plants have the ability to translocate sugars that are made from photosynthesis with chlorophyll to parts of the plant where they need that food the most.

Flowers are not the main source of these sugars made with photosynthesis. Fan leaves are the main source.




Nice bush - why do you defoil?

Where did you get the idea from to take off all the fan leaves?
i’ve read a lot about defoliation for general gardening, and it makes sense for pot - i typically leave fan leaves on the outside and around the top the longest, then yank them before last few weeks of flowering - appears to not have any negative consequences in my climate. the shock seems to strengthen the grow imho, along with high stress training (literally snapped every branch on that plant up top ages ago)

the plant gets amazing airflow and full sun coverage in the flowering stage along with nutrients and water, also still has a lot of leaves if you get up close - i just cut all the spiny branches with baby buds before flowering to clean out the middle

also makes harvesting a bit easier
 
181
63
25kw solar man that's huge we can't get that big here yet I've got 6.5kw solar I can upgrade to 10kw for an extra $10,000 which would probably bring my power bill down to $50 a month. Don't have a lazy 10 G lying round though but if I did would more likely go into an indoor grow set up. 😁
25kW is the max then we have to start down another path with generation and get a generating license with insurance and all that bs. Forgetabout it.

Here's the weird thing. The electric company installed an outdoor light on a pole on our property and installed a 150W hps lamp on it ffs. I have to pay $30/month for the pole and the electricity then I have to pay $15/ month for the "delivery" fee. So my bill is like $45 and thats the best it will get. Then I get credits for my over generation. In Jan-March I'll likely use some extra that my credit will pay for. We have geothermal heat and cooling too. The pump for that uses a lot of power as do the professional air handling units.
At the end of the day, compared to our previous home we gonna be WAY ahead with the cost of heating cooling and lighting specially with an indoor grow with lights on during the day. My current space I'm using about 2000watts for VEG and Flower. We generate 10x that during a mostly sunny day. 10-3 I'm +20K watts. Found out that the folks that build the system paid $87K for the solar with salt water batteries. The panels are in a field outta sight.

I think the people that lived there were growing. They had to have been. It's overkill for normal living. Complete indoor environmental control too with dehumidifier, and humidifiers in the air units built in.

I would not have bought the place if not for the solar and geo.


solar battery.jpg



Solar array but thats only part of it there are 2 banks of panels like that in the pic. The other bank is behind it.

solar arrays.jpg
 
181
63
i’ve read a lot about defoliation for general gardening, and it makes sense for pot - i typically leave fan leaves on the outside and around the top the longest, then yank them before last few weeks of flowering -
Well the plant gets its energy to build flowers from the old fan leaves that turn into energy supplies for the flowers.

Why do those fan leaves turn yellow, IF you leave them on the plant?

The reason is this, chlorophyll (the green stuff) in the leaves is stored energy in the form of several different sugars that the leaves create during photosynthesis. The plants will later on as the leaf matures, use up that stored energy to create FLOWERS and seeds.

So by taking off all the fan leaves where does the plant now get the energy to produce flowers?

The plant "might" look to the roots but that isn't how the plant gets energy to produce flowers. It does that with photosynthesis. here's the cool part, due to the location of the fan leaves - take a look should be located right where the leaf stem meets the plant stem there's a stem shooting out right there and that new stem is where the flowers are.

So the energy goes into the fan leaf down the leaf stem then up the stem into the flower. That process is called translocation.

Roots do not create sugars the plant needs to grow flowers. This is ONLY done is the leaves.

Moving on to the fan leaf that turns yellow. This process is how the leaf gives back its stored energy to the flowers. The process is called abscission and resorption.

I'm not making this shit up. Wiki has it spelled out right here:

Be sure to read the "process"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abscission#Resorption

That bag of fan leaves you throw (hopefully in the compost bin) is a bag of nutrients, sugars, proteins and plant hormones the plant needs to finish its life cycle. This is science not some anecdotal bs.
 
280
63
Well the plant gets its energy to build flowers from the old fan leaves that turn into energy supplies for the flowers.

Why do those fan leaves turn yellow, IF you leave them on the plant?

The reason is this, chlorophyll (the green stuff) in the leaves is stored energy in the form of several different sugars that the leaves create during photosynthesis. The plants will later on as the leaf matures, use up that stored energy to create FLOWERS and seeds.

So by taking off all the fan leaves where does the plant now get the energy to produce flowers?

The plant "might" look to the roots but that isn't how the plant gets energy to produce flowers. It does that with photosynthesis. here's the cool part, due to the location of the fan leaves - take a look should be located right where the leaf stem meets the plant stem there's a stem shooting out right there and that new stem is where the flowers are.

So the energy goes into the fan leaf down the leaf stem then up the stem into the flower. That process is called translocation.

Roots do not create sugars the plant needs to grow flowers. This is ONLY done is the leaves.

Moving on to the fan leaf that turns yellow. This process is how the leaf gives back its stored energy to the flowers. The process is called abscission and resorption.

I'm not making this shit up. Wiki has it spelled out right here:

Be sure to read the "process"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abscission#Resorption

That bag of fan leaves you throw (hopefully in the compost bin) is a bag of nutrients, sugars, proteins and plant hormones the plant needs to finish its life cycle. This is science not some anecdotal bs.
This is partial truth. Don’t believe all wiki says. You could definitely be giving false info depending on a persons environment. You want to know what all those terms really mean and do pick up a intro to horticulture book.
 
1,935
263
.14kwh the most expensive in the world? lol... Hawaii is like .35kwh... Conneticut is around .20kwh .14kwh is cheap electricity compared to a ton of other states.
On the other side of Pa, we are paying 7 cents/KWH. I was going to get into solar energy a while back, but the 20+ year payback period was just too high in this area, not to mention the weather.
 
181
63
This is partial truth. Don’t believe all wiki says. You could definitely be giving false info depending on a persons environment. You want to know what all those terms really mean and do pick up a intro to horticulture book.
Its not just wiki - I quoted that because its an easier read than a science article written by.... wait for it..... scientists.
Not to mention all the science articles that were used for reference in the wiki article. Yeah there might be a few books to take a look at there. Check em out.


Yes an intro to horticulture book

This one but you need to know how to read at a college level, its not written for 6th graders.


Botany by James D. Mauseth

This book goes into GREAT detail about the functions of leaves and after reading this you will likely not be doing defoil and many other weird things only cannabis growers do.






 
181
63
On the other side of Pa, we are paying 7 cents/KWH. I was going to get into solar energy a while back, but the 20+ year payback period was just too high in this area, not to mention the weather.
We pay .14/Kwh because we still need to pay for the nuclear power plant at Limeric that they sold us telling us it will reduce our engergy costs. What a freaking joke that turned into.

We are i the process of moving to upstate New York - finger lakes region. We get less sunlight up there that western PA.
It rains/snows every morning then the sun comes out most days. We generate a good deal of energy even with overcast conditions. It's actually amazing. The only time we dont generate during daylight hours is when the panels are covered with snow.
 
280
63
Its not just wiki - I quoted that because its an easier read than a science article written by.... wait for it..... scientists.
Not to mention all the science articles that were used for reference in the wiki article. Yeah there might be a few books to take a look at there. Check em out.


Yes an intro to horticulture book

This one but you need to know how to read at a college level, its not written for 6th graders.


Botany by James D. Mauseth

This book goes into GREAT detail about the functions of leaves and after reading this you will likely not be doing defoil and many other weird


I have used many of Mr. Mauseth’s books,studies and lab results in more papers than I can account. I’m sure I’ve just slapped his name on as a source on more than one occasion because he has so much material out.

You do know science is ever changing,and basing everything on “science “ may not always give you the best outcome.
Experienced growers do what they do because they have learned to through trial and error and know what works. All plants are not the same or even cannabis strains. Many love to be pruned. And if grown in a certain way may need to. Other strains may hate it. It’s all depending on your situation. I mean I don’t prune my aloe or my jade plants ever. But I will my Japanese maple and dwarf weeping balsam.
 
181
63
I prune my aloe lol

Pruning and defoliation are different.

Sure I prune cannabis in veg and occasionally in early flower.
Defoil not so much.

So your leaves function differently on your japanese maple tree than you cannabis tree?
 
280
63
I prune my aloe lol

Pruning and defoliation are different.

Sure I prune cannabis in veg and occasionally in early flower.
Defoil not so much.

So your leaves function differently on your japanese maple tree than you cannabis tree?
You may harvest a aloe leave yes. And absolutely the leaves are different. Cannabis would be considered a herbaceous plant. While the my maple is a woody specimen. While the the function is almost the same,they grow much different. You see herbaceous plants are designed to be harvested and keep growing as long as prevented from producing seed. The maple will shed its leaves annually no matter what. And can regrow anywhere along a branch(stem) herbaceous plants have a designed grow pattern.(I.e. you know where your leaves will produce on a cannabis plant) My maple will store its energy for the winter,the cannabis plant using it for flower. And again I do not defoliate I prune also.
 
Top