electrical set up

  • Thread starter motownklown
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motownklown

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hello everyone and thank you all for such amazing information.. all the sites that i have previously been to do not compare, that is why i am seeking your advise. i am a legal patient/ caregiver for 5 other patients in michigan. i am setting a small flowering room up in a basement for another patient. the problem is he has no electric outlets in the area we want to use. he currently has 2 open slots at the bottom of his breaker box with no breakers. (we want to run 2 1000 watt air cooled lights with a 6" in line fan/ filter system.)if i wire 4 outlets into the area, would i have to use 20 amp breakers or would 15 amp work, and is 14/2 sufficient wire? only because he has a roll already.(budget is tight)any pics or other threads that might explain would be appreciated.:RastaBong:
 
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motownklown

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wow thanks for your quickness, another scenerio, we have enough aluminum core 8/4 and a brand new 100 amp panel to run from existing panel to grow area, if i run that then 12/2 to 2- 4 way outlets would that work? or am i making too much work?, thanks again
 
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motownklown

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broke down and bought a roll of 12/2 and 2- 20 amp breakers gonna do it with the 2 open slots @ bottom of breaker panel to 2- 4way gang boxes, thanks again
 
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weedfarm

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the sub panel would come in handy if you plan on expanding. Otherwise 2 20A breakers with 12/2 wire will work fine. Remember the 80% rule. You can only use 80% of the circuits capacity when running for 3+ hours, which you are. So one ballast on each circuit
 
dentonland

dentonland

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:rock1 20 amp breaker can run your lighting with 12-2. Use the other one for your fans, etc. 120v x 15 amp breaker is 1800 watts. max load should be 1500 watts. 120v x 20 amp breaker is 2400 watts, using 2000 max.
 
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motownklown

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awesome, dentonland, great info, read it before just didnt remember what or where, lol burnt brain cells right bank....
 
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weedfarm

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:rock1 20 amp breaker can run your lighting with 12-2. Use the other one for your fans, etc. 120v x 15 amp breaker is 1800 watts. max load should be 1500 watts. 120v x 20 amp breaker is 2400 watts, using 2000 max.

I highly suggest you do not run both ballasts on one circuit.

Math says at 120 volts a 1000 watt ballast will pull 8.3 amps, but in reality its closer to 9 amps. That puts your total amperage at 18 amps, above the 16 amps continuous load rating.

Doubt me, get a meter and check it out

As a side note, at 240 it should be 4.16 amps. This morning I metered one of my ballasts and it was almost 4.6



Another issue, what do you plan on doing for a timer? A digital timer is not going to handle 2 ballasts



I have wired a lot of lights and 2 1000 ballasts on a 20A circuit is pushing it.
 
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motownklown

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Thanks weed, I ran two separate 20 amp breakers on 12/2 to w 4 gang boxes and a 15 amp to another 4 gang... digital timers? I put my coo-koo clock in front of the light switch, when the bird pops out at noon, on goes the lights, LOL.. timers on each light for now.. thanks again for all the info
 
dentonland

dentonland

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:danceyoooo... 2000watts divided by 230 is 8.9 amps.for both your lights... your great on a 20 amp... and IMO your extra breaker space will be great for a dedicated line for the extras. not sharing with the existing outlets...... if you tried to run em on 240v your not gonna have a seperate line for your 120v...and throw em on industrial time clock T101 intermatic... heavy duty with half hr increments..
good luck amigo:dance
 
Papa

Papa

Supporter
2,474
163
you guys are forgetting that "1,000 watts" is the lamp rating.

a core and coil ballast will pull closer to 1,100 watts.










Papa
 
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weedfarm

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:rock1 20 amp breaker can run your lighting with 12-2. Use the other one for your fans, etc. 120v x 15 amp breaker is 1800 watts. max load should be 1500 watts. 120v x 20 amp breaker is 2400 watts, using 2000 max.

:danceyoooo... 2000watts divided by 230 is 8.9 amps.for both your lights... your great on a 20 amp... and IMO your extra breaker space will be great for a dedicated line for the extras. not sharing with the existing outlets...... if you tried to run em on 240v your not gonna have a seperate line for your 120v...and throw em on industrial time clock T101 intermatic... heavy duty with half hr increments..
good luck amigo:dance


Are you paying attention to the thread or what you are even posting for that matter????

Like I said in another post, you need to stop giving electrical advice. Peoples homes, lives and freedom depend on the advice given
 
U

Underground

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Are you paying attention to the thread or what you are even posting for that matter????

Like I said in another post, you need to stop giving electrical advice. Peoples homes, lives and freedom depend on the advice given
I know the one you're talking about, but he's right on these posts.


You shouldn't use alu inside a dwelling. It's only legal for the service in the states. But a separate sub panel would be the way to go here. Especially if you only have two circuits left.
 
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Underground

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PS You should always install in-line fuses on HID fixtures with magnetic ballasts. When a ballast or a cap decides to take a shit, it will melt down and short out tripping the circuit. If you have other lights on the circuit they all just went down.
 
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swizzlegrower

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sub panel real cheap and just as ez to install as 2 20 amp......running 240 will also help....too many people scared of 240.....twin 60 or 70 with number 6 copper 5500 watts maybe 150 bucks.... go for it motownklown....marty chillcut's vet group got your state mmr.....look him up...
 
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weedfarm

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I know the one you're talking about, but he's right on these posts.


.

right about running 2 1000 ballasts on a 120v 20 a circuit? I disagree

Actually in the post I quoted he calculates the amps at 230V. he then suggests to use the extra breaker for extra, this means the lights would be on 120V not 230/240. he then says if they tried to run them on 230, they wouldnt have the extra breaker.

He calculated the load at 230, then suggests running everything at 120. it is not consistent
 
U

Underground

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right about running 2 1000 ballasts on a 120v 20 a circuit? I disagree

Actually in the post I quoted he calculates the amps at 230V. he then suggests to use the extra breaker for extra, this means the lights would be on 120V not 230/240. he then says if they tried to run them on 230, they wouldnt have the extra breaker.

He calculated the load at 230, then suggests running everything at 120. it is not consistent
I got ya now, I thought he was just saying (or rather meaning to say) that the lighting should be run on 120 through a timeclock and that other needs could be put on the remaining circuit. But there's nothing to stop them from running a 30amp 120 circuit. I also see no problem with loading the circuit more than 80%, especially under these circumstances. Unless the end user is a complete jackass. We only make shit idiot proof for the general mass of idiots. The code recognizes and is less restrictive for supervised installations. I have never actually had a grow room, but from what I am reading most experienced growers and respected community members recommend things like replacing the lamp before it's useful life is over, regular cleaning, etc. The user has his/her hands on these on regular basis maintaining or moving them. Any problems will be caught long before Johnny Homeowner would notice a problem with the HID lighting up his driveway. It can be assumed that the lighting is going to be on a routine cleaning/maintenance schedule in these cases. I still wouldn't 100% load the circuits, but I'm not scared to go over 80%. Many times I've seen breakers pefectly happy running beyond their rated capacities.
 
dentonland

dentonland

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sub panel is definitely the way to go.
all ballasts arent created equal
word to the people
 
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weedfarm

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I got ya now, I thought he was just saying (or rather meaning to say) that the lighting should be run on 120 through a timeclock and that other needs could be put on the remaining circuit. But there's nothing to stop them from running a 30amp 120 circuit. I also see no problem with loading the circuit more than 80%, especially under these circumstances. Unless the end user is a complete jackass. We only make shit idiot proof for the general mass of idiots. The code recognizes and is less restrictive for supervised installations. I have never actually had a grow room, but from what I am reading most experienced growers and respected community members recommend things like replacing the lamp before it's useful life is over, regular cleaning, etc. The user has his/her hands on these on regular basis maintaining or moving them. Any problems will be caught long before Johnny Homeowner would notice a problem with the HID lighting up his driveway. It can be assumed that the lighting is going to be on a routine cleaning/maintenance schedule in these cases. I still wouldn't 100% load the circuits, but I'm not scared to go over 80%. Many times I've seen breakers pefectly happy running beyond their rated capacities.


To be honest I have run circuits past 80% as well. But I know the risk. And yes I have seen breakers go past their capacity as well. At work we had a 20A breaker trip 5-6 times a day. When I looked at what was on the circuit I just could not figure out why it stayed on at all. I did fix it.

But if the breaker is running past its rated capacity, what about the wire? The breaker is there to protect the wire, and if the breaker is not tripping, the wire is carrying more current than its rated for.

But A LOT of growers dont know jack about electric and are with all due respect, the mass of idiots. When they ask questions like , hey can i swap my 20A breaker for a 30A breaker, you have to treat them carefully and explain stuff to them. Lets face it, this board is for people who smoke pot and when they read these posts, they may be high.

You admit to never having a grow room. Well you dont interact with your lights as much as you think. My lights are always on ropes with cleats on the wall so I can adjust the height. I dont touch the hood or ballast often at all. As far as cleaning, at max, that will happen every 2 months because most growers are not going to open the hoods and try cleaning them over flowering plants.


When we tell people they can put 2 1000watters on a 20A circuit, lets just make sure we give them all the info, just not tell them its OK.


If they leave for the weekend, and the breaker trips, their plants get no light for 2-3 days and stresses the plants. A couple times of this and you have hermied plants
 
Seamaiden

Seamaiden

Living dead girl
23,596
638
I've left rep for one of the people in here, but feel it's important to note publicly that if someone is going to give advice, especially about something like working with electricity, with a potential to be absolutely deadly, then that person had better be able to A) give spot on absolutely correct advice and, B) be able to take the heat when they're called out for giving wrong advice.

I've noted in another thread the problems my husband and I are having with our home because of shoddy electrical work and GFCI's failing. We have had SO many problems and on at least three different occasions can count ourselves fortunate that our home didn't burn down with us inside it.

Please, don't take this issue lightly.
 
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