Feds Raid Oaksterdam University

[Junkbarman]

Obama and his cronies going back on their word yet one more time..


http://motherjones.com/mojo/2012/04/federal-raid-oaksterdam-oakland-marijuana

Mon Apr. 2, 2012

This morning, agents from the Drug Enforcement Agency, US Marshals Service, and Internal Revenue Service served a warrant on Oaksterdam University, a trade school in Oakland, California, for medical marijuana growers. Local pot activist Richard Lee, the founder of "America's first cannabis college," was reportedly detained briefly at his homeas the feds began to confiscate documents and pot from the school and a dispensary affiliated with him.

The raid is the latest setback for local "hempreneurs" who'd planned to make Oakland into a mecca for above-ground pot cultivation and commerce. Last year, after the city council voted to approve four industrial-scale grow operations projected to net up to $7.7 million in yearly tax revenue, the Justice Department warned the city attorney that they would be considered "illegal, large-scale pot growing operations, with Oakland planning to get a cut of the illicit profits." The city council gave in, voting 7-1 to put the plans on hold. (For more on the city's pot-induced dreams, check out Josh Harkinson's profile of the guys behind the would-be grower superstore Weedmart.)

The Oaksterdam raid isn't a surprise considering the Obama administration's about-face on medical marijuana. The president campaigned on the promise that he'd stop federal raids on medical marijuana operations that were in compliance with state laws, a vow that Attorney General Eric Holder repeated after the election. But then the Obama administration raided more than 100 dispensaries in its first three years and is now poised to outpace the Bush administration's crackdown record.

The precise cause of the Oaksterdam raid is not immediately clear. Also unclear is whether any charges against Lee would extend beyond medical marijuana production to drug selling or tax issues. (Back taxes are dogging Oakland's Harborside Health Center, the West Coast's largest dispensary.) Yet targeting someone as high profile as Lee sends a strong signal that the feds don't think California's medical marijuana laws shield the state's growers.

"Medicine is not a crime! DEA, go away!" protesters chanted outside Oaksterdam as they passed around a "protest doobie" earlier today. Later, city Councilwoman Rebecca Kaplan told reporters that law enforcement should focus its resources on violent crime. "We have not had crime or violence associated with our dispensaries, and that's because they've been tightly regulated," she said. At least one protester was reportedly arrested after a clash with police, and riot police are now on the scene.

 

[Capulator]

most likely tax evasion. greed is what does these large scale ops in.

 

[squiggly]

I'd like to again point out the Obama doesn't run the DEA or tell it what to do. Much the opposite, his appointee asserted her power to unilaterally make decisions without his thumbs up or down very quickly upon being confirmed in her job.

Obama's administration was at odds with her early on and basically conceded defeat. People are quick to blame things on a President (be it Obama or Bush)--but they critically forget that the job of the President is very simple and is about 3 things long:

1. Promote democracy/use diplomacy

2. Make decisions about going to war/strategy in war (with counsel).

3. Sign/veto bills forwarded to him and confirmed by both houses of congress and the CBO (a strictly non-partisan entity).

That's it. He's the commander-in-chief of the armed forces, not the world. If we want this to change we have to change federal law, it is easy to see that the DEA is a huge lobby against legalization and that they have a huge interest in propagating this war and demonizing legalization. They also have unilateral power in doing this so long as it respects federal law unless a county sheriff, or congress, orders them out.

If legalization happens they ALL lose their jobs. Just think about that for a second. Consider that 80% of LEO's are on the drug war bill. They are your problem by-and-large. Not the president.

He's sadly impotent to stop this. At least he hasn't praised it as Bush did.

 

[Junkbarman]

When you get up and say things like this, you put yourself out there for the blame..


"I'm not going to be using Justice Department resources to try to circumvent state laws on this issue," he vowed, promising an end to the Bush administration's high-profile raids on providers of medical pot, which is legal in 16 states and the District of Columbia.


AND THEN, he renominates her for the position...but he doesn't have the power, does he?

 

[Darth Fader]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Removal_of_cannabis_from_Schedule_I_of_the_Controlled_Substances_Act

see "Process" section.

 

[baba G]

Not much has changed, government spends its energy on keeping it's power and looking for ways to expand it.

 

[fishwhistle]

Squiggly,I dont agree bro,he can ABSOFUCKINLUTELY stop it with 1 phone call,no question about it and if they dont follow his orders immediately he can boot their ass right out,do not fool yourself!There is plenty for them to do elsewhere,meth is rampant and cartels are running wild in mexico and the US,Going after Pot is taking the easy way out for them,why work hard when we can just kick back and fuck with stoners until we can retire after 20 years with 100%+ of our pay?can you retire after 20 at 100%?I cant.They have all forgotten who the fuck they work for.

 

[squiggly]

Fishwhistle,

The attorney general, Holder, under Mr. Obama released a statement regarding drug policy and stating that medical marijuana grows should not be targeted (nor dispensaries) and that only operations masquerading as such to get around the rules would be targets.

The director of the DEA shortly thereafter essentially came out and said her marching orders didn't come from Obama or Holder, but instead that her position as director and confirmation by congress allowed her the power to continue raids as she saw fit under federal law.

Admittedly Obama didn't press the issue perhaps as hard as he should have--but he's a far cry from Bush or Clinton. Going any further than he did would've been political suicide--and I don't blame the guy.

His policy and belief about the correct way to move forward (allow the states to handle it) is markedly different from his predecessors (and likely those to follow him). While this isn't going to change everything overnight--it is progress.

Part of what you're seeing is that as the industry ramps up, more people are using it in an improper way--this is to be expected. The DEA has backed off in some areas where the Justice dpt has put its foot down--but in most areas the policy has been ignored. Obama did not expect this and that is a failing, but it doesn't represent his beliefs or his preferences--these are not his cronies, they are people who are in direct opposition to him, and vocally at that. This is not a secret or a conspiracy theory.

Here is the NORML article on the whole thing:

http://blog.norml.org/2010/11/18/ob...ore-administrations-medical-marijuana-policy/

You can read her remarks therein. This was a bait-and-switch, there are no two ways about it. That was obvious enough to anyone who was paying attention to these stories as they happened.

 

[ttystikk]

most likely tax evasion. greed is what does these large scale ops in.

Yeah sure- and if you were a corporation who suddenly couldn't take ANY tax deductions for legitimate business expenses from gasoline and building lease to power bills and employee paychecks, you'd be in deep for 'tax evasion' too. The problem is a runaway Federal Govt. which seems to be able to make up the laws it wants to enforce as it goes along, always to its own benefit and almost never to the benefit of the society it's supposed to protect and SERVE.

The only way to scare it into line is to threaten a constitutional convention. One was almost voted by the states way back in the 1970s, over equal rights for women(!). The Feds got the fear of God put in them, and suddenly became champions of womens' and now gays' rights.

Between the war on the people who use drugs (let's be honest, they don't care about the drugs themselves), the 'Patriot Act' (a truly Orwellian crime against the Bill of Rights that every American should be screaming to have overturned) and the RICO Act (again, a law that turns due process and citizens' protections from undue search and seizure on its head), we now have a Federal Government that could on any given day start acting like Syria's Assad regime against selected elements of our citizenry- and quote the above as legal cover for doing it.

As if that weren't enough, Atty. General Eric Holder has recently declared the Posse Commitatus Act null and void unilaterally, which means the military can now be used as civilian police.

FASCISM. Any questions? I really think the political Right has gone entirely far enough...

 

[nangonug]

Not much has changed, government spends its energy on keeping it's power and looking for ways to expand it.

What can you say! His material is just as relivent today as it was a decade ago. If your not familure with Bill Hicks then go do your homework. It's a shame he died so young I would have loved to see him proform live.

 

[Junkbarman]

I'd like to again point out the Obama doesn't run the DEA or tell it what to do. Much the opposite, his appointee asserted her power to unilaterally make decisions without his thumbs up or down very quickly upon being confirmed in her job.

Obama's administration was at odds with her early on and basically conceded defeat. People are quick to blame things on a President (be it Obama or Bush)--but they critically forget that the job of the President is very simple and is about 3 things long:

1. Promote democracy/use diplomacy

2. Make decisions about going to war/strategy in war (with counsel).

3. Sign/veto bills forwarded to him and confirmed by both houses of congress and the CBO (a strictly non-partisan entity).

That's it. He's the commander-in-chief of the armed forces, not the world. If we want this to change we have to change federal law, it is easy to see that the DEA is a huge lobby against legalization and that they have a huge interest in propagating this war and demonizing legalization. They also have unilateral power in doing this so long as it respects federal law unless a county sheriff, or congress, orders them out.

If legalization happens they ALL lose their jobs. Just think about that for a second. Consider that 80% of LEO's are on the drug war bill. They are your problem by-and-large. Not the president.

He's sadly impotent to stop this. At least he hasn't praised it as Bush did.

It's amazing to me that the president of the United States does only 3 things in all the time he spends in power. Good information to know.


I thought the president also appoints all these people who head these departments, like the DEA, Attorney General, etc., does he not?

So, if I want to change the head of the DEA(the person pushing this issue), the only thing I can do is change the president, correct?

I mean if you want to dumb it down to the most basic level, then that seems to be the most basic level there could be.

 

[Junkbarman]

Fishwhistle,

The attorney general, Holder, under Mr. Obama released a statement regarding drug policy and stating that medical marijuana grows should not be targeted (nor dispensaries) and that only operations masquerading as such to get around the rules would be targets.

The director of the DEA shortly thereafter essentially came out and said her marching orders didn't come from Obama or Holder, but instead that her position as director and confirmation by congress allowed her the power to continue raids as she saw fit under federal law.

Admittedly Obama didn't press the issue perhaps as hard as he should have--but he's a far cry from Bush or Clinton. Going any further than he did would've been political suicide--and I don't blame the guy.

His policy and belief about the correct way to move forward (allow the states to handle it) is markedly different from his predecessors (and likely those to follow him). While this isn't going to change everything overnight--it is progress.

Part of what you're seeing is that as the industry ramps up, more people are using it in an improper way--this is to be expected. The DEA has backed off in some areas where the Justice dpt has put its foot down--but in most areas the policy has been ignored. Obama did not expect this and that is a failing, but it doesn't represent his beliefs or his preferences--these are not his cronies, they are people who are in direct opposition to him, and vocally at that. This is not a secret or a conspiracy theory.

Here is the NORML article on the whole thing:

http://blog.norml.org/2010/11/18/ob...ore-administrations-medical-marijuana-policy/

You can read her remarks therein. This was a bait-and-switch, there are no two ways about it. That was obvious enough to anyone who was paying attention to these stories as they happened.

So give the president a free pass on mistakes he makes, when these issues are really important to me?

Sure, its not the start of a war or send the economy into the toilet, but this could decide someone's entire future who thought they were abiding by the law, to later find the DEA on their ass.

So you're telling me, someone who's had a very direct stance on an issue, that held this position for 3 years, then gets renominated by the a president is just suddenly going to change that stance?

HIGHLY unlikely.

So, yes, that does come back to the president. Makes no sense to put people in power that don't march to the same drum on issues.

 

[Capulator]

Right we can all talk shit but the thing is that MJ is a schedule 1 and is FEDERALLY illegal. Richard Lee is a big time activist. He is/was behind prop 18, oaksterdam, and harborside. Also the marijuana factories. Giving licenses to grow in 100,000 square feet of warehouse space to 4 people. Give me a fuckin' break.Like that shit isn't politics at its best. Do you think that if people were operating as the law intended that there would be these huge ass busts... probably not. Then it would be a waste. BUT, when you are making lots of money, and start getting lots of assets from it, then, well, you become a target. Even with our own gov. as fucked as it is, I still love my country and would rather be here than many other places in the world.

When you look at the busts that have happened recently, they have been MAJOR ones (4000 plants +), they have been cartels (which they cant even keep up with), they have been incited by local law (local law calling the feds in), or in some cases a concerned crictized calling out the DEA to raid a neighbor.

This is like me telling my kid that I will turn a blind eye to him getting a cookie out of the cookie jar, and I turn around and the kid takes all the cookies, and replaces them by taking a shit in the jar.

 

[squiggly]

I thought the president also appoints all these people who head these departments, like the DEA, Attorney General, etc., does he not?

So, if I want to change the head of the DEA(the person pushing this issue), the only thing I can do is change the president, correct?

I mean if you want to dumb it down to the most basic level, then that seems to be the most basic level there could be.

The President doesn't do only 3 things, he hears all issues of national security and makes decisions on those. He is supposed to help congress come together (but I will laugh at you loudly if you think it's his fault congress has done nothing in the past 4 years).

What I was referring to are the constitutional powers afforded him.

Yes, Obama did nominate the administrator (and Holder, too). However, the point I've been making, which you've skipped over, is that once the nomination goes through Obama is powerless to control those people. He has no standing over them.

It is clear by the way this all developed that Obama thought his DEA administrator nominee was going to go along with him--she made it clear once she had the nomination that this was not the case, and Obama was vocally not happy about it (and let us know through the Justice Dpt--Holder, who actually is one of his "cronies" ).

You can choose to believe that Obama is behind this if you like--but unfortunately you'll be wrong. That is your right, but it just doesn't make sense--the information is right there in front of you. It's public, it's googleable.

I get it that lots of people hate Obama. I'm cool with that, but you make Americans seem sort of daft. Note: I'm not saying anyone IS daft--or trying to insult anyone. I'm saying from an outside viewpoint we look like idiots when we make wild assumptions about information which is readily available to the public. I want you to understand that when you use reasoning like this, you make it a fact that a BBC reporter understands your country's system of government better than you do--and that is a shame. When you use almost no critical thinking or research skills and just immediately blame everything on the black guy you don't like--it makes us look super backwoods. I'm not defending Obama (though I am a supporter of his, in fairness), so much as I am defending logic and reason.

Do a little reading, figure out how the government systems your decrying actually operate. Find out who is actually making these decisions. It's not a secret.

If this were all up for speculation I'd just let it ride--but it's not. It's very clearly spelled out for each and every one of us in our nations laws.

I'm just guessing, but most people who jump on the hate Obama bandwagon probably used the buzz phrase, "read the law" when the health bill was going through.

Well I'm here now to say:

No you.

 

[fishwhistle]

I think caps right,schedule 1 status for pot has got to go for starters and i agree they seem to be after the bigger guys,my problem with them closing dispensaries is some sick people rely on them for meds as they cant grow their own or dont have the resources to.In cali we voted to legalize medical marijuana but they dont want you to be able to buy it anywhere or grow it outdoors(most places anyways)so your basically left with only indoor grow ops which cost alot of money and are not really environmentally sound as we all know too well,what was your electric bill last month?and that does not even count the setup and equipment required,some folks cannot afford this.I am no fan of most dispensaries either,60$ eighths slung by fuckin weirdos that i would not let in my house and dont know shit about cannabis,close em all down,but leave the ones that are doin it right alone.It just pisses me off when the people vote to create a new law and then our own government does everything they can to circumvent the peoples will,do they work for us or are we just the peasants they tax to death and force their will on?

 

[squiggly]

This is like me telling my kid that I will turn a blind eye to him getting a cookie out of the cookie jar, and I turn around and the kid takes all the cookies, and replaces them by taking a shit in the jar.

That's exactly right. When one of us guys here is getting raided--that's when alarm bells should go off. Most of the shit that's been getting shut down has been doing it outside the confines of the law.

Unfortunately with how the laws are written in most states that is still EASY to do--even if you're trying hard to abide by it. End of the day, the state laws need to be strengthened and federal law needs to be changed.

As for the DEA Administrator: I watched this nomination and confirmation process unfold day by day (I watch pot politics very closely--first news I read every morning).

From my perspective here's how it looked.

Obama met with Leonhart and was satisfied that she would fall in line with his policies--I'm assuming his conversation went something like this:

"So we just don't want to attack people who are following their state's laws--we don't feel it should be the policy of the DEA to circumvent state law"

Leonhart: "Sounds good to me."

End scene.

Now I believe Obama's failure here was taking her word for it. But I can nearly guarantee you that the conversation did NOT go like this:

"So what we want to do is raid all the dispensaries and grows. We'd like to circumvent state law as much as possible. We're going to come out and make a statement to the contrary, though, and when you come out you'll completely ignore my administrations policy and leave me with shit all over my face."

Leonhart: "Sounds good." (I imagine she would've said this to the above, as well--except this time she'd have meant it).

The top situation: wherein Obama made a mistake of character judgment--is much much more realistic.

There is no logic you can use wherein it makes sense for a president who plans to run for a second term would have nominated a person who he KNEW planned to make him look stupid.

I'm not saying the guy is blameless in this, or that he doesn't have shit all over his face--he totally does. It's just that Leonhart threw it at him--and he was unsuspecting.

If he knew what the DEA was going to continue to do, why would he release a policy which was incongruous with that? Because he felt like dropping a few percentage points in the polls?

No.

It was a bait-and-switch and he fell for it. Blame him for that all day--that was his mistake. He is not some anti-pot president, though. He, like most of us, thinks the whole thing is stupid.

Need I remind you what party, and what ideology gave us the controlled substances act to begin with? I'm just saying it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out what type of person made the poster I've attached (propaganda against weed during Anslinger's time)--or to realize that it wasn't a rocket scientist.

 

[squiggly]

I think caps right,schedule 1 status for pot has got to go for starters

I want to be quick in addressing this schedule 1 business.

This is VERY LIKELY another bait and switch. While schedule 1 status does not make sense for marijuana under the law--in the past 25 years the court system has seen fit to treat marijuana differently through various statutes and changes to local laws/ordinance.

As a for instance, in my second-home neighborhood near Chicago's south side it is now akin to jaywalking if you have a half ounce or less in one bag on your person. It's a 50 dollar ticket.

If you change the schedule--this stuff instantly becomes a narcotic. Until laws are updated, people getting caught with a dimebag will be treated as though they had oxycontin without a perscription.

For anyone using this stuff medically only--this would be a great development. For the rest of us, this would be the pot-head holocaust. As for de facto legalization policy in general--I think it'd be a nail in the coffin.

 

[dirk d]

honestly i dont know how californians even grow indoors. im starting to understand why they grow so much outdoors. growers need to get more $$$ for quality indoor crops. i see the dispensaries charging $60 for an eigth but the growers get what $25 an eighth roughly 3k a lb??

i dont want anyone going to jail for mj but reality is that prices are too low and these huge dispensaries are making a killing at the expense of the grower. how many growers you know that make 1 million+ a year???

and doing tv shows and shit like that is asking for trouble.

 

[MakinGoo]

honestly i dont know how californians even grow indoors. im starting to understand why they grow so much outdoors. growers need to get more $$$ for quality indoor crops. i see the dispensaries charging $60 for an eigth but the growers get what $25 an eighth roughly 3k a lb??

i dont want anyone going to jail for mj but reality is that prices are too low and these huge dispensaries are making a killing at the expense of the grower. how many growers you know that make 1 million+ a year???

and doing tv shows and shit like that is asking for trouble.

Great post..

 

[Junkbarman]

Squiggly, you are out of line.

No one here is a racist, but you throw that term around very loosely.

Look I'm new to this forum, and I thought you were a respected member, but as of this point, not anymore in my eyes.