Dirtbag
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In hydroponics, yeah i think it likely has a root protectant benefit but im not sure what else it really offers. I personally dont think its all that much. As far as I know, sulphur is the main nutrient responsible for producing aroma, which matches my experience pretty well. One of my stinkiest crops was flowered with very short 15 min sulphur burns nightly through the first 6 weeks of flower. Short enough that the plants are able to use up all of the sulphur by taking it in by absorbtion through the leaf, and consuming it as a nutrient. Made an enormous difference in flavor too. Only stopped because of the risk, too much can, (and did on other crops) burn the stigmas and stunt growth.Dude I love having you around. You come at it from the other direction, lay down some knowledge, and always make me think. Easy to get tunnel vision, you are like the Anti-Elon tunnel buster.
Here's what I think I know.
Fungi that grows on roots is effective in both hydro and soil to increase root surface. (there is a bit more to it than that obviously)
Bacteria that grows in soil is responsible for making nutrients in a form the plant can use. They do many other things as well.
Plants feed bacteria in a symbiotic relationship, evolved in dirt.
We do not need bacteria to ionize nutes in hydro if we use chelated synthetics.
Good bacteria colonies out-compete bad bacteria and fungus to hopefully prevent root rot.
Are you thinking all this beneficial bacteria stuff is only good for preventing root rot in hydro? All the other perceived benefits like stinkier weed is just placebo? If the only benefit is to prevent rot, H2O2 works identically?
In what testable way should I look? In my fog system I could easily do 4 side by sides with 2 clones each. What do I run? Looking at the previous post Max Microbe is off the list. Whatever is in there can't overpower anything.What about other bacteria like those found in living aqueous environments like Nitrosomonas, Nitrosococcus, Nitrobacter, Nitrospina, Nitrospira and Nitrococcus?
Would they offer any benefits?
I can guarantee I get them just like any aquarium, even if not purposefully put in the water. Shedding root cells causes a little ammonia. That's the equivalent of an exudate calling in a bacteria.They are also abundant in the air
I definitely need to consider this side of the argument. I should run H2O2 in one of the 4 fog systems as part of the test.In hydroponics, yeah i think it likely has a root protectant benefit but im not sure what else it really offers. I personally dont think its all that much. As far as I know, sulphur is the main nutrient responsible for producing aroma, which matches my experience pretty well. One of my stinkiest crops was flowered with very short 15 min sulphur burns nightly through the first 6 weeks of flower. Short enough that the plants are able to use up all of the sulphur by taking it in by absorbtion through the leaf, and consuming it as a nutrient. Made an enormous difference in flavor too. Only stopped because of the risk, too much can, (and did on other crops) burn the stigmas and stunt growth.
Also having tried a few different types of micros over a few grows using Great white and RAW microbes in numerous types of media, I didn't really notice a whole lot of difference. Maybe they did something behind the scenes? I'm not sure. Nothing noticeable by any means.
No clue how to test, but they offer bottles of these bacteria [ combined in a 'proprietary formula'] to 'cycle aquariums' and in the right hands they work [ fast].In what testable way should I look? In my fog system I could easily do 4 side by sides with 2 clones each. What do I run? Looking at the previous post Max Microbe is off the list. Whatever is in there can't overpower anything.
We'll declare the winner when you make the stoned post ever!How do you declare a winning method? Lab testing a given. Accurate harvest, all that. I'll document it all.
That question is for everyone.
I definitely noticed a vigor difference in oldet clone cuts… the legends ultimate indica clearly showed that to me but once it got going although not as fast the growth was better and healthier. It’s very possible its just a really picky bitch and a low tolerance outside of its preferences.Tonight's updates. I'm putting the worst first, good news further down.
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The real sour continues to add root mass, although I don't think it is doubling daily now. More like 80%. Those roots are more than enough to support the leaf mass, I just need this plant to turn on. It's just plain being a finnicky lil bitch. Take a look at this:
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I'm about ready to start researching viruses. Here's Sour Diesel:
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At least she is becoming more typical, even if the variegation adds to the oddity. This plant is respiring and becoming healthy. Incidentally it was closest to the humidifier fan (now off).
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Her root mass is still doubling daily. She has caught up to and overtaken the other.
Hey, those twist locks were nearly perfect, just made one adjustment for fog. So that tent gets put back together and turned on this weekend.
Going on the too much wind theory, I shut off the AC infinity canopy fan Yesterday. It wasn't hitting the plant much at all, if it was enough to cause a wind burn, it just needs to be better genetics. I'm not even pushing yet. Everything but AC and humidifier as of this report has also been turned off.
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All fans were on the lowest settings barely keeping the air filtered and moving. I am not exhausting. Still no CO2 nesessary in a sealed room, so virtually no photosynthesis.
I just need these girls to turn on. I know this seem impatient, but normally my growth is much faster.
I have adjusted my spectrum as far red as it will go in this tent. I've just got different temp COB LEDs with dimmer knobs. I also turned on the "bloom enhancer" leds. These lights are kinda dated now. But they sure have put out a ton of nice weed.
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400PPFD of red shifted light at 40" away. If I turn off bloom enhancer I'm at the light's minimum. I've never run my lights this low this long before, so I'm adding these colored bloom leds in, even tho it raises PPFD, I just want to see if I can trigger something good with spectrum. I'm really running out of knobs to try here.
I got seeds ready to get wet if these don't take a turn to the better. Or maybe I'll hit Mosh up for those GMO clones. Next up Microbes!
We'll declare the winner when you make the stoned post ever!
The testing is all on you!
Keep it fun!
That's what I'm thinking. I'm hoping to get them both good and healthy and tissue culture them and see if I can get any youth back.I definitely noticed a vigor difference in oldet clone cuts… the legends ultimate indica clearly showed that to me but once it got going although not as fast the growth was better and healthier. It’s very possible its just a really picky bitch and a low tolerance outside of its preferences.
I think the only way to win the quality war is to have it lab tested for cannabinoid and terpene content. Yield would be interesting but the bottom line were talking about is absolute quality in terms of aroma and effects, which can only be measured in the head or the lab.I definitely need to consider this side of the argument. I should run H2O2 in one of the 4 fog systems as part of the test.
My results that say beneficials improve weed are anecdotal.
I need to define the parameters of success tho. Let say I grow 8 identical clones from Tissue Culture in 4 individual systems in a single grow chamber with proper control and lighting. As close to a lab experiment as we are gonna get.
Maybe 1 = H2O2
2 = Orca
3 = Nothing
4 = Res water from the RDWC system
How do you declare a winning method? Lab testing a given. Accurate harvest, all that. I'll document it all.
That question is for everyone.
She was a picky bitch for me in dirt! And I think picking a winner is gonna be hard - we all would judge based on different criteria based on personal preference - I would look at it as a roi situation - it’s all new and intersteing to me , hopefully I can retain some of the info .I definitely noticed a vigor difference in oldet clone cuts… the legends ultimate indica clearly showed that to me but once it got going although not as fast the growth was better and healthier. It’s very possible its just a really picky bitch and a low tolerance outside of its preferences.
She just hasn't caught up to her roots.I definitely noticed a vigor difference in oldet clone cuts… the legends ultimate indica clearly showed that to me but once it got going although not as fast the growth was better and healthier. It’s very possible its just a really picky bitch and a low tolerance outside of its preferences.
Good idea but nope.Hey @Moe.Red on you high root growth and low shoot growth are you still using the clonex or used until very recently?
after replying to a different thread I couldn’t help but wonder this because it likely cont IBA and that will do exactly this, shift the plant to root growth and slow shoot growth.
I typically use it only until i see the clones have rooted
So no ferts at all?Good idea but nope.
nothing but RO and nutes and biologics.
Could have been some on the clones tho.
If you are no ferts at all give them about a 20 percent dose of the Jacks clone starter and I can guarantee they will take off.So no ferts at all?
I push the boundaries. Sometimes destructively, but always instructively. Follow along and laugh and learn with me if you wanna try to chase maximum plant potential!
So it's no secret I have been working with Aqua man on some new ways to do things. This is what I am working on in my part of the world.
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(( that was the second post you wrote, each time my mind was hearing Samuel Jackson's voice in my head) ) - sorry I'm new ...that was going to be my next question. back in my GC days, one of the microgrowers set up a fogponics system using acrylic for the tank and a venturi for circulating the fog. was pretty wild.
No I’m running jacks epsom mr fulvic. Around 300 ppm up from 180 ppm at first. No improvement when I upped them.If you are no ferts at all give them about a 20 percent dose of the Jacks clone starter and I can guarantee they will take off.
Wait ferts = nutes right?So no ferts at all?
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