Fox Farm vs Pro-Mix vs Roots Organic

TapwaterKiller · Jan 2, 2011

From my first grow a little over 6 years ago Ive grown hydroponically using Grodan rockwool cubes/slabs in Dutch leach tray ebb&flow systems with almost zero problems (had a great mentor). Unfortunately Ive always grown for other people and had little to no control over the nutrients (GH) I used and strains I grew. Ive literally seen/smoked nothing but White Rhino and Northern Lights from the same 3 mothers my entire growing career. The time has come for me to move on...

I plan on switching over to organic (or at least as organic as possible) under one light (1000w HPS) and obtaining some new genetics from Sannie. I dont have any experience with soil apart from a few experimental runs using a mix of Fox Farm Ocean Forrest/Light Warrior/Perlite/EarthJuice that I grew beside my hydro systems without direct light. Initially I loved the mix and the plants obviously did to...some of the healthiest looking plants Ive ever grown...until I ran into some pest/powdery mildew problems on the 3rd round (which I had never even seen either before so I assume it came in the soil).

So Ive researched my ass off and have everything sorted out for the most part... except I havent decided which medium Im going to go with. Since there is no way in hell Im paying shipping on bags of soil I am limited to what my local hydro store carries and have it narrowed down to 3 choices. Id appreciate any info that would help me make my decision.
Heres the run down...
Nutrients/additives:
Earth Juice- Catalyst/Grow/Bloom/MicroBlast/Meta-K/Hi-Brix/pH Up&Down (Air pump/stones to "brew" it)
Advanced Nutrients- Bud Blood
Hygrozme
Cal/Mag+ (If I decide to use my RO...I might just buy a cheap chlorine filter)
Either Humbolt MycoMadness or PlantSuccess Great White Mycorhizzae (help me decide on that too...I would have to order the GW)
SuperThrive

Medium Choices:
Pro-Mix BX with mycorise pro/Perlite

Roots Organic potting soil (the one with bat guano, earth worm castings, fish bone meal, feather meal, Perlite and Pumice
green sand, mycorrhizae, glacial rock dust, soybean meal, humic acid.)(Coco Based)

Fox Farms Ocean Forrest/Light Warrior/Perlite mix (possibly even throw the Happy Frog in the mix as well)

Thanks in advance. Peace.

Buddy Hemphill · Jan 2, 2011

pro-mix is inert. no ammendments. its not really organic soil, IMHO

Fox Farm has had quality control issues. The guy that owns it depleted his supply of soil and has been outsourcing for over a year.

Roots is what I use and I love it. I use it as a base for subcools SS. No problems so far.

I use Sunshine4 which is the same as promix to dilute the super soil instead of Roots.

Buddy Flowers · Jan 2, 2011

yea Pro Mix is 60% Perlite (approx) and 40 % canadian sphagnum peat so nothing in iot whatsoever. I like it for flowering because i have control of the ppms

cymbaline · Jan 2, 2011

I've only used pro-mix. It's low-cost and I don't have to travel a long distance to buy bags of soil. While it isn't organic soil, it is a organic medium..
I use it for the base of supersoil instead of soil like Hemphill is doing. Or use it alone and have complete control of the nutes you supply.

Fred · Jan 2, 2011

Since you've already grown Hydro and have some skills I would go with the Pro-Mix. You have a nice list of expensive additives and nutes so why not be in control. If you choose the soil then go with Roots and don't add all that stuff. Most of it will be wasted and the soil will still be in control. Keep the Hygrozyme either way.

This has been talked about to death. If you check out my old "girls in their home" threads you will find examples of all three of these and my opinions of them. Picts to match.

Good luck man.

fred

TapwaterKiller · Jan 3, 2011

Thanks for the replies guys!

"pro-mix is inert. no ammendments. its not really organic soil, IMHO

Fox Farm has had quality control issues. The guy that owns it depleted his supply of soil and has been outsourcing for over a year.

Roots is what I use and I love it. I use it as a base for subcools SS. No problems so far." - Buddy HempHill

The inert factor of Pro-Mix is why its at the top of my list...besides the fact that its the least expensive route.
Ive read that A LOT about Fox Farms. I havent used it in 2 years and when I did I got critters and powdery mildew.
Have you ever had any critters when using Roots Organic?

"yea Pro Mix is 60% Perlite (approx) and 40 % canadian sphagnum peat so nothing in iot whatsoever. I like it for flowering because i have control of the ppms" -Buddy Flowers

My thoughts exactly.

"Since you've already grown Hydro and have some skills I would go with the Pro-Mix. You have a nice list of expensive additives and nutes so why not be in control. If you choose the soil then go with Roots and don't add all that stuff. Most of it will be wasted and the soil will still be in control. Keep the Hygrozyme either way." -Fred

Again, exactly what I was thinking. Its probably the safest route for me considering soil is more or less the "relm of the unkown" to me.

With the Pro-Mix...Ive heard of people ammending it with earth worm castings and extra perlite. Would this be beneficial?

Ive actuallly been considering doing the Subcool Super Soil method as well...but mixing solutions and taking pH/PPM readings is fun to me and makes me feel in control of the grow. I dont know what Id do with myself if I only had to water:bongsmi:.

ent · Jan 3, 2011

If you are leaning the promix route do you have the option of coco?

TapwaterKiller · Jan 3, 2011

ent said:
If you are leaning the promix route do you have the option of coco?

Yes...but the local store only carries Sunleaves coco.

CT Guy · Jan 3, 2011

My recommendation would be the Pro Mix with amendments.

Buddy, it's funny because I've heard horrible complaints about quality control with the Roots soil! (though people complain about Fox Farm as well).

Roccus · Jan 3, 2011

pro-mix not organic

CT Guy · Jan 3, 2011

Roccus said:
pro-mix not organic

I've heard this before. Can you refresh my memory on why it's not? Thanks!

How about just sourcing some sphagnum peat moss?

TapwaterKiller · Jan 4, 2011

Roccus said:
pro-mix not organic

Its organic enough for me...

I get annoyed by the "100% organic or die" people. Unless you eat 100% organic food (which only 1-2% of the worlds population does) you really shouldnt be worried about growing 100% organic cannabis.

So Im about 70/30 Pro-Mix/Roots Organic. Fox Farms is out. I have about a week to decide before I get this grow kicked off and knowing me Ill probably end up making my decision in the hydro store while staring at a bale of Po-mix beside a bag of Roots Organic:bongsmi:. Theres also a chance I say to hell with them both and go the Sunleaves Coco route. Thanks or all the responses and Ill keep you updated and possibly start a journal here.

subrob · Jan 4, 2011

i just ran some minor side by sides w the following:
fox farms soil-fox farms nutes(basic three)
roots organic-fox farms nutes
mendo basement mix-fox farms nutes
fox farms soil-cannabio nutes
roots organic-canna bio
m.b.m.-canna bio
...the reason i tried these combos(and admittedly, i did not put much effort into 'dialing them in'-they are pre mixes, you shouldnt have to) is i was told i couldnt get the canna bio soil in the states anymore...it was the best pre mix organic line i have ever seen...after trying a few diff things i learned this
A) if you live in a place where you can get the canna bio line, including soil, do it
B) if thats not possible, go truly organic, mix your own, its easier than you think
C) im converting back to hydro...im sure i will be back to organic at some point...but im bored
...good luck

CalcioErba2004 · Jan 4, 2011

Hey rob good to see you over here as well. :)

I have used Roots Organic, Promix BX, Fox Farm and Royal Gold. Royal Gold is pure crap. Roots is good but I don't like it as much as FF and Promix because its coco based and not peat based. My mix of choice:

1 cft bag of FF Light Warrior
2 cft bag of FF Happy Frog
1.5 cft bag of FF Ocean Forest
1cft bag of Roots Organic Wormcastings
4cft bag of large coarse perlite(got sunshine this time around)

For the perlite I get whatever is available at my local store in 4cft bags. This mix is perfect and I never really have to feed ferts in veg and very very lightly in flower. Tapwater is what i usually use(400 to 600 ppms) and I have a RO filter for flushing out. For ferts I use Roots Organic full line and hygrozyme.

Morals · Jan 4, 2011

For smaller indoor grows I like to make a soil mix with Pro Mix bx,fox farm,and root organics soils. Then I add more perlite,castings,guanos,etc. You get the best of both worlds and don't have to completely rely on nutes. You can get super vigorous growth with minimal nutes and work your way up from weak to strong nute feedings.
For larger scale grows 6k + watts I go with straight bales of promix with a bit of castings and rely more on nutes and additives.

Burned Haze · Jan 4, 2011

Pro Mix BX and Great White, had wonderful results. Get Root Pots from same people who do roots organic, no root circling and 15 gallons gave me 1/2 LB solid plants.

-BH

CT Guy · Jan 6, 2011

Burned Haze said:
Pro Mix BX and Great White, had wonderful results. Get Root Pots from same people who do roots organic, no root circling and 15 gallons gave me 1/2 LB solid plants.

-BH

Haven't tried Root Pots, but am a big fan of Smart Pots. You get great soil aeration and root pruning. I have a purple sage on my back porch right now that is the only thing still living from the summer. I partially attribute that to the Smart Pot. It was able to get rapid root and veg growth, allowing it to be better prepared for all the crappy weather we've had here in the NW.

ent · Jan 6, 2011

If you take Ocean Forest or Roots Organic mix out of the bag and measure the run off, the PPM's are so ridiculously high I'm amazed most seedlings or cuts don't die when they are young and vulnerable. The RO 707 mix is a bit lighter, but still run off is way high.

nouvellechef · Jan 6, 2011

You can basically make pro mix from the Depot or lowes. Premiere make Pro Mix. They stock there peat, grade C at the depot as well as perlite. Only think missing is myco. But for a innoculant, just buy a innoculant, mix it up and dip rooted clones. It only needs one dip for whole cycle. By the way, generally hydro stores charge crazy prices for things as they are geared toward cannabis. Most dont know it, but Ace hardware can get pro-mix on there route. Just need SKU number. You can find it at acehardwareoutlet.com

Get the black bale though. Its grade A. If your using full organic ammendments, dont throw away after harvest. Re-ammend. You can get 10 cycles from the black bales before it becomes acidic. GL

Whippleschnitz · Jan 6, 2011

The pro-mix is probably going to be the least expensive route for you. I prefer to use the Roots organic soil because it is coco based not peat based. My experience has shown that peat will continue to drop in ph over time but the coco will be more stable. IMO all of these bagged mixes will benefit from some additions. There are plenty of soil threads on here you can read through that should give you some good advice.

Fox Farm vs Pro-Mix vs Roots Organic

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