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Nectarivorous · Oct 20, 2021

Frankster said:
I think once you get things back under control well, you can ramp it up again, in some respect, and get a bit more weight gain out of it. I think the key here is getting it over the hump, and then moving forward. I would start nailing it with humics/fluvics going forward, if possible, along with your base nutrient blend, (trio) like you say, maybe some trace (1/4 tsp per gallon) of sugars to feed the biome layer some. I use mostly barley malt right now, seems to work good.

Stressing that biome with dry cycling, and keeping nailing it with fluvic really seems to do some crazy good things during this phase, and it really helps increase stress resistance, and stretch water dynamics, IMO. Lowers overall nutrient needs.

Interesting. I did notice I had missed the switch to week seven nutrients. Was a week late, but having said that one girl is two weeks behind so probably split the difference to some extent. I have now stopped the batshit (@Madmax ), and the A/B should have been back to 1/2. I've basically dropped EC over a third. I use Fulvic always so good to hear that's the right move. What they've been getting thru heavy flower:

RO, 12ml/gal silica. pH down to 6.5, then 8 ml/gal of Calmag
12 ml/gal Canna A&B
5 ml/gal Fulvic
7.5 ml/gal PK
10 ml/gal Liquid Lead (sugars/aminos)
10 ml/gal Cannazym
15 ml/gal Biodiesel guano mix

Have now dropped guano completely and Canna back to 8 per gal. I am optimistic that the reduced photon drive and lowered N ratio will allow me to still get plenty of weight and frost, reckon there's still 2-3 weeks in then before harvest, but things may change as they move out of stress. So good to get great feedback so quickly.

Frankster · Oct 20, 2021

Nectarivorous said:
Interesting. I did notice I had missed the switch to week seven nutrients. Was a week late, but having said that one girl is two weeks behind so probably split the difference to some extent. I have now stopped the batshit (@Madmax ), and the A/B should have been back to 1/2. I've basically dropped EC over a third. I use Fulvic always so good to hear that's the right move. What they've been getting thru heavy flower:

RO, 12ml/gal silica. pH down to 6.5, then 8 ml/gal of Calmag
12 ml/gal Canna A&B
5 ml/gal Fulvic
7.5 ml/gal PK
10 ml/gal Liquid Lead (sugars/aminos)
10 ml/gal Cannazym
15 ml/gal Biodiesel guano mix

Have now dropped guano completely and Canna back to 8 per gal. I am optimistic that the reduced photon drive and lowered N ratio will allow me to still get plenty of weight and frost, reckon there's still 2-3 weeks in then before harvest, but things may change as they move out of stress. So good to get great feedback so quickly.

Yea, looks like you've got your bases covered well; monitor/regulate your phosphorus intake; I would recommend easing off the petal if your turning into late flowering.

Phosphorus is much like protein. When we eat a bunch of meat, your body can only absorb so much, then the rest either passes though, or goes into energy storage. (this requires energy cycles) Same with phosphorus. The plant, especially buds, starts loading it up during early flower and it explodes though the mid phase, but drops off rapidly during late flower. Let your acids, your (base nutrients w/phos) and your sugars carry you across the finish line. I use those to fill the gap of (ppm), to replace any extra phosphorus, I had pushed prior.

The plant is building Carbon at this juncture, more so than at any other prior phase. I believe the plant metabolome and water dynamics are a huge factor here. Your enzymes, biologicals, amino's and sugars (plus your base nutrient) should be the primary focus, IMO. High P interferes with N absorption. (which you are tapering) Also P interferes with zinc, iron, cobalt or calcium, because the P can lock up these nutrients. I really, really think P gets easily overdone, (especially at end) at least for me, it was.

Keeping those microbes happy/healthy is super critical. Your metabolites, microbes, VDP, plant respiration, water dynamics, evaporation, soil drain ability, are all key aspects to knocking it out of the ballpark, during late flowering, and high P is it's mortal enemy. The plants breath above, in the leaves, during photosynthesis, but your soil is alive and needs to breath just as well as the plant does. It's inter-dependent. Both of these systems are are conjoined, IMO.

So much is happening below that we simply don't fathom. Keeping it dialed in is so very huge. Nutrients, IMO, are just one aspect of it all.
Benchmarks used to evaluate soil health include CO2 release, humus levels, and microbial metabolic activity. I was reading the other day how small amounts of sucrose doubled forest floor respiration in (2 hours), and created a 9x fold increase in respiration at peak (hour 20), then persisted for 48 hours.

Nectarivorous · Oct 20, 2021

Frankster said:
Yea, looks like you've got your bases covered well; monitor/regulate your phosphorus intake; I would recommend easing off the petal if your turning into late flowering.

Phosphorus is much like protein. When we eat a bunch of meat, your body can only absorb so much, then the rest either passes though, or goes into energy storage. (this requires energy cycles) Same with phosphorus. The plant, especially buds, starts loading it up during early flower and it explodes though the mid phase, but drops off rapidly during late flower. Let your acids, your (base nutrients w/phos) and your sugars carry you across the finish line. I use those to fill the gap of (ppm), to replace any extra phosphorus, I had pushed prior.

The plant is building Carbon at this juncture, more so than at any other prior phase. I believe the plant metabolome and water dynamics are a huge factor here. Your enzymes, biologicals, amino's and sugars (plus your base nutrient) should be the primary focus, IMO. High P interferes with N absorption. (which you are tapering) Also P interferes with zinc, iron, cobalt or calcium, because the P can lock up these nutrients. I really, really think P gets easily overdone, (especially at end) at least for me, it was.

Keeping those microbes happy/healthy is super critical. Your metabolites, microbes, VDP, plant respiration, water dynamics, evaporation, soil drain ability, are all key aspects to knocking it out of the ballpark, during late flowering, and high P is it's mortal enemy. The plants breath above, in the leaves, during photosynthesis, but your soil is alive and needs to breath just as well as the plant does. It's inter-dependent. Both of these systems are are conjoined, IMO.

So much is happening below that we simply don't fathom. Keeping it dialed in is so very huge.
View attachment 1180662

Amazing advice. Funnily enough when I checked my feed chart the PK is supposed to be dropped by week seven also exactly as you're saying. That will go when I fill my tank again tonight.

Frankster · Oct 22, 2021

I would consider cutting that cal/mag in half also, possibly. Then replacing the half removed with magnesium sulfate, if possible.

ie. The cal could use dropping, but the mag part is still relevant, and sulfur is relevant toward the end, IMO. That's probably splitting hairs, but that never stops me, lol. Make sure your still getting potassium too.

It's one of the reason's I've gone to using hydroxide forms of calcium, and potassium. I really enjoy being able to micromanage some of the nutrients, and customize them to fit whatever I'm doing at any particular juncture of development. Hydroxides provide that opportunity, but they are somewhat hazardous, and highly reactive. A salt and water are produced when acids react with metal hydroxides. Metal hydroxides are bases, because they neutralise acids.

I actively ferment lactic acid (from sugars) in my solutions, so I use hydroxides to pull things back into line. Currently working with Streptomyces, Lactic Acid Bacteria (LABS), Lactobacillus, Bifidobacterium. Labs have been used for some time now, increasing terpene content, and increasing complexity.

How to Make Lactobacillus | Probiotics | Growing Organic

Lactobacillus (LABs) is a wonderful microorganism that you should definitely be using in your garden! Learn how to make LABs with this quick tutorial!

growingorganic.com

Homo formative process;
glucose + 2 ADP + 2 Pi → 2 lactate + 2 ATP

Hetero formative process
glucose + ADP + Pi → lactate + ethanol + CO2 + ATP

Bifidum pathway;
2 glucose + 5 ADP + 5 Pi → 3 acetate + 2 lactate + 5 ATP

Nectarivorous · Oct 23, 2021

HUGE FK UP! Pls help!

Changed the lights in my grow last night, fkd up and plugged the new one into the board that is not connected to the timer just walked past and saw light coming under the door. They have been on for 20 hours straight

I have just turned them off, my solution is to leave them off for 12 hours, let the timer run for the remaining four hours of their usual lights off time, then return them to their normal cycle.

Any chance this will work or am I faaaaarrrrked?

Nectarivorous · Oct 23, 2021

Nectarivorous said:
HUGE FK UP! Pls help!

Changed the lights in my grow last night, fkd up and plugged the new one into the board that is not connected to the timer just walked past and saw light coming under the door. They have been on for 20 hours straight

I have just turned them off, my solution is to leave them off for 12 hours, let the timer run for the remaining four hours of their usual lights off time, then return them to their normal cycle.

Any chance this will work or am I faaaaarrrrked?

I'm actually thinking going into a four hour light cycle after this might just add to the stress? Maybe back on at 1 am, off at midday tomorrow, and just do 11 hours light / 12 hours dark until they are back on the schedule I want?

Nectarivorous · Oct 23, 2021

Nectarivorous said:
I'm actually thinking going into a four hour light cycle after this might just add to the stress? Maybe back on at 1 am, off at midday tomorrow, and just do 11 hours light / 12 hours dark until they are back on the schedule I want?

It's day 53 of flower btw...

Justlovetogrow · Oct 23, 2021

Y

Nectarivorous said:
It's day 53 of flower btw...

ya should be alright mate just leave it off for 12 then back on for 12 or leave it off untill your next desired time cycle at least u didn’t do what I did and give em 3hrs light in the middle of there dark period for the last 3 weeks they don’t like that much but 1 extra 8hrs of light shouldn’t hurt ya

Nectarivorous · Oct 23, 2021

Justlovetogrow said:
Y

ya should be alright mate just leave it off for 12 then back on for 12 or leave it off untill your next desired time cycle at least u didn’t do what I did and give em 3hrs light in the middle of there dark period for the last 3 weeks they don’t like that much but 1 extra 8hrs of light shouldn’t hurt ya

Fuck I hope so mate. I had read that one event like that is much less damaging than small light leaks throughout the life of the plant. I'm thinking the least stressful way is I'll turn them back on at 1 am in 12 hours, of at 11am, back on 12 hours later, and just do 10/12 until they're back on schedule. Don't want to shock them too much by doing a four hour light cycle after they've just gone thru a 20 hour light cycle. Such a drongo. Alf would say I was a flaming galah and take me to his dungeon.

Frankster · Oct 23, 2021

Nectarivorous said:
HUGE FK UP! Pls help!

Changed the lights in my grow last night, fkd up and plugged the new one into the board that is not connected to the timer just walked past and saw light coming under the door. They have been on for 20 hours straight

I have just turned them off, my solution is to leave them off for 12 hours, let the timer run for the remaining four hours of their usual lights off time, then return them to their normal cycle.

Any chance this will work or am I faaaaarrrrked?

yes, correct, give them 12 rest, and reset the timer.
See, taking the intuitive thing sometimes pays off, and you learn, and try to put in presets. Redundancy, where you can find it is good also.

Chances are, if this is a hybrid, or Indica, your probably alright. No harm, no foul. It's all about stress response.

For me, it's digital timers, I guess I'm an analog type of person. I leave nothing to chance these days. If the lights go out, it resets itself.

BN-LINK BND-60/U47 Indoor Mini 24-Hour Mechanical Outlet Timer, 3-Prong, 2-Pack - Amazon.com

www.amazon.com

Nectarivorous · Oct 23, 2021

Frankster said:
yes, correct, give them 12 rest, and reset the timer.

Sorry just to clarify, would you do the 12 dark, the remaining four that would have been on their light cycle, then lights out at normal time and back to normal? My other strategy was 12 hours now, then 10 light/12 dark until I get back to normal schedule? Do you think one is preferable to the other or no difference? Many thanks as always for your friendly help with the quickness

Justlovetogrow · Oct 23, 2021

Nectarivorous said:
Fuck I hope so mate. I had read that one event like that is much less damaging than small light leaks throughout the life of the plant. I'm thinking the least stressful way is I'll turn them back on at 1 am in 12 hours, of at 11am, back on 12 hours later, and just do 10/12 until they're back on schedule. Don't want to shock them too much by doing a four hour light cycle after they've just gone thru a 20 hour light cycle. Such a drongo. Alf would say I was a flaming galah and take me to his dungeon.

Alfs rape dungeon is not the place to be

Nectarivorous · Oct 23, 2021

Nectarivorous said:
Sorry just to clarify, would you do the 12 dark, the remaining four that would have been on their light cycle, then lights out at normal time and back to normal? My other strategy was 12 hours now, then 10 light/12 dark until I get back to normal schedule? Do you think one is preferable to the other or no difference? Many thanks as always for your friendly help with the quickness

I should say I do use a timer, I just plugged it into the powerboard that doesn't run on it. They're definitely not relying on me to turn them off

Frankster · Oct 23, 2021

Nectarivorous said:
I should say I do use a timer, I just plugged it into the powerboard that doesn't run on it. They're definitely not relying on me to turn them off

Things sometimes happen, unfortunately, so hopefully, they

Nectarivorous said:
It's day 53 of flower btw...

'll recover alright.

I think you'll be ok. 20 hours is a long time, hopefully it won't send them into shock. Only time will tell. Perhaps the end yield could be somewhat affected also, perhaps. Some strains are far more resistant than others. Heavy Indica and Rudy doing the best.

Saliva's in particular being the diva's
That's why I suggest, if you don't have a dark, shade buffer area, only growing some specific strains.

Nectarivorous · Oct 23, 2021

Frankster said:
Things sometimes happen, unfortunately, so hopefully, they

'll recover alright.

I think you'll be ok. 20 hours is a long time, hopefully it won't send them into shock. Only time will tell. Perhaps the end yield could be somewhat affected also, perhaps. Some strains are far more resistant than others. Heavy Indica and Rudy doing the best.

Saliva's in particular being the diva's
That's why I suggest, if you don't have a dark, shade buffer area, only growing some specific strains.

Yeah these are sativa dominant genetically percentage wise, but by leaf structure and node spacing they are much more indica. I'm gonna go with 12 hours dark now, then 10/12 until I get them back on normal schedule. I assume I'll need to watch for signs of herming and reveg??

Frankster · Oct 23, 2021

Nectarivorous said:
Fuck I hope so mate. I had read that one event like that is much less damaging than small light leaks throughout the life of the plant. I'm thinking the least stressful way is I'll turn them back on at 1 am in 12 hours, of at 11am, back on 12 hours later, and just do 10/12 until they're back on schedule. Don't want to shock them too much by doing a four hour light cycle after they've just gone thru a 20 hour light cycle. Such a drongo. Alf would say I was a flaming galah and take me to his dungeon.

I would reset them, if you can, just work them 12/12 from here forward. If it's feasible.
Like being up for a day, usually isn't too much traumatic. Like for me, I worked decades graveyards 12's and 16' hour days.

It's extended stress that matter. if something's reset, when it's found, I think that's generally the best strategy. But certainly, the plant doesn't need extended downtime on the flipside, that would simply complicate the matter. Best to stick to 12/12 rule. That's what I shoot for.

Nectarivorous · Oct 23, 2021

Frankster said:
I would reset them, if you can, just work them 12/12 from here forward. If it's feasible, of course.

As in just let the new on off time for today become the new time? Makes it tricky to feed them as they'd be on 1am - 1pm. But given they're probably less than three weeks away from harvest and I'm up all night with a baby anyway I'm happy to do that if it gives me the best chance of avoiding issues!

Frankster · Oct 23, 2021

That's why I like the manuals, you just click it, and done. bam, reset. No fuss, no muss.

BionicKroniK · Oct 23, 2021

@Nectarivorous...They should be good, they're SO dang forgiving!

This last grow was SO stressful, thnx to @ComfortablyNumb who decided to REarrange the GROW room in the middle of the grow AND the lights were still on the 18/6 and not 12/12 when "flipped" ), I'm surprised they never hermied!

Frankster · Oct 23, 2021

BionicKroniK said:
@Nectarivorous...They should be good, they're SO dang forgiving!

This last grow was SO stressful, thnx to @ComfortablyNumb who decided to REarrange the GROW room in the middle of the grow AND the lights were still on the 18/6 and not 12/12 when "flipped" ), I'm surprised they never hermied!

I've had little plants, like some zkittles, and it was flowered early, and left out, stressed early. It was a runt, but surprisingly great. I enjoyed that little plant.
Just keep an eye out for nanners, and pick them early. lol, hopefully that doesn't occur. They'll look like pollen sacks.

Frankster's Diagnostic Helpline; post your problem child here.

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Never trust a doctor who's plants have died.

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BN-LINK BND-60/U47 Indoor Mini 24-Hour Mechanical Outlet Timer, 3-Prong, 2-Pack - Amazon.com

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Never trust a doctor who's plants have died.

Nectarivorous

Frankster

Never trust a doctor who's plants have died.

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Never trust a doctor who's plants have died.

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Never trust a doctor who's plants have died.

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Frankster's Diagnostic Helpline; post your problem child here.

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Frankster

Never trust a doctor who's plants have died.

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Never trust a doctor who's plants have died.

How to Make Lactobacillus | Probiotics | Growing Organic

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Justlovetogrow

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Frankster

Never trust a doctor who's plants have died.

BN-LINK BND-60/U47 Indoor Mini 24-Hour Mechanical Outlet Timer, 3-Prong, 2-Pack - Amazon.com

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Never trust a doctor who's plants have died.

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Never trust a doctor who's plants have died.

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Never trust a doctor who's plants have died.

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