Germinating In Buildasoil's Mix

[Bulldog11]

@Bulldog11 -- we've discussed what we're getting for our product. I'm paying $33/yd for a soil that doesn't cause me problems and seems to grow great veggies and weed. I won't ever make the claim that it's the best, because I don't *know* that it's the best, but it's the best I can do for the amount of money I have to spend. While I admit I'm terrible at the maths, I believe I'm getting a much better return on my investment than you are for the soil I buy premixed (from a local outfit, and yes, it comes with some basic testing and organic certification, it's been a while since I've laid eyes on the little brochure they hand out with it so I'd have to look around).

Math is something I excel at, and took very high levels of math while still in school. 33/ a yard over a five year period means you paid an average of 6.6$ a yard. Now to quantify how much that translates to yield. I don't know your yields, so I will now do my soil.

330$ a yard over a five year period means I paid an average of 66$ a yard, per year. In my garden, I shoot for 1-8 pounds per yard of soil, per year. So lets take the average and say 4 pounds per yard of soil, per year. That means I pay on average over a 5 year period $16.50 a pound of cannabis, a year. That is not even taking into consideration how important proper nutrients balance is to your final product, and the difference in quality that superior soil provides.

The difference in cost is so minimal when you look at things in the long run. However the quality of soil makes the largest difference of anything you can do as an outdoor cannabis gardener. It's hard to fork out thousands of dollars for soil, but the numbers don't lie. You gotta pay to play, just like anything in life, IMO.

BTW, I am not knocking your style of growing one bit. In fact, I know the quality you produce and it's in a top tier. I am just trying to show how a 330$ soil can be feasible in the long run. :)

 

[Calixylon]

Germinating into a soilmix that hot probably will kill your seed

 

[Minitiger]

Math is something I excel at, and took very high levels of math while still in school. 33/ a yard over a five year period means you paid an average of 6.6$ a yard. Now to quantify how much that translates to yield. I don't know your yields, so I will now do my soil.

330$ a yard over a five year period means I paid an average of 66$ a yard, per year. In my garden, I shoot for 1-8 pounds per yard of soil, per year. So lets take the average and say 4 pounds per yard of soil, per year. That means I pay on average over a 5 year period $16.50 a pound of cannabis, a year. That is not even taking into consideration how important proper nutrients balance is to your final product, and the difference in quality that superior soil provides.

The difference in cost is so minimal when you look at things in the long run. However the quality of soil makes the largest difference of anything you can do as an outdoor cannabis gardener. It's hard to fork out thousands of dollars for soil, but the numbers don't lie. You gotta pay to play, just like anything in life, IMO.

BTW, I am not knocking your style of growing one bit. In fact, I know the quality you produce and it's in a top tier. I am just trying to show how a 330$ soil can be feasible in the long run. :)

Call me dumb (people do almost every day haha), but I'm assuming you're getting those averages because you're "recycling" or re-using that yard of soil over a five year period. Right?

 

[Bulldog11]

Yes. I should have stated that.

If your just throwing out your soil every year, your missing the big picture anyway.

 

[Minitiger]

Germinating into a soilmix that hot probably will kill your seed

It didn't with the Rev's mix. And that mix was a lot "hotter" than Coots'. Think bat guano, bird guano, dolomite lime etc etc....

 

[Minitiger]

Yes. I should have stated that.

If your just throwing out your soil every year, your missing the big picture anyway.

I agree. Just wanted to be sure. Cuz at first I was like,"Wouldn't $330 a year mean he averages, uh, $330 a year...?" hahaha!!!

 

[Minitiger]

@Bulldog11 , I forgot to ask, when you germinate your seeds, do you plant straight into the 60/40 peat/EWC mix? Or do you do the soak/paper towel thing first?

 

[Bulldog11]

Strait in. No need for the paper towel.

 

[Minitiger]

Strait in. No need for the paper towel.

Since you've used both the Revs mix and Cootz, I was just wondering your opinion regarding the veg process between the two. Only asking because that Prayer Tower seedling I've been monitoring has been vegging suuuuper slow compared to the seeds I sprouted in the Revs mix. I realize that the Revs contains tons of N, so it makes sense to me that that the "tester seeds" I planted in the Revs mix would blow up as soon as they broke ground, but I have to say that this Prayer Tower tester that I planted in Cootz mix is growing unusually slow. At least in my opinion, compared to the way the strains I sprouted in the Revs mix grew. It's been like almost two weeks since my "Cootz mix tester plant" broke ground and it's just barely starting its fourth set of leaves. And I mean, just BARELY. And this is outside, in ten hours of full SoCal sun. Definitely not over- or under-watering. Barley mulch, one OG Biowar inoculant, plus a tiny bit of aloe once and potassium silicate twice. In fact, it's been growing so slow that I gave it a miniscule top-dress of EWC and neem meal a couple waterings ago, just to see if it it would thrive a little more.

any thoughts re: water retention of coco vs peat. Cuz that's the only thing I can think of why it's vegging so slow. I mean, besides the fact that its been how as shit outside in SoCal. And I've been being extremely careful about when and how much I water it. Positive I'm giving it how much water it needs, when it needs it.

Basically, I'm asking about any observations you've noticed between vegging in the Revs mix vs Cootz. I'm still gonna use Cootz, no matter what you say haha! Just wondering if you could tell me why the fuck this Prayer Tower seedling is growing so much slower than the crappy genetics I used to test the Revs mix a few months ago.

 

[Bulldog11]

Have you tried a compost tea? Or instead of a top dress with EWC, maybe make up an EWC slurry.

The reason I say this is because organics takes a while to establish the proper microbes to intake their nutrients. The coots mix is low in P and light on N for a reason. When you mix up a coots mix, you don't get that hot build up of microbes processing the material. This means that you must inoculate your soil with microbes.

The Rev mix is loaded up so much with everything, the soil mix cooks quite a bit. This means that your microlife will be a little more active right out the gate. The Rev mix like you stated also has a good amount of N to begin with.

Here is the main difference in the long run. I find the Rev mix is great, we are splitting hairs here. However, the Rev mix will give you everything you need in ample amount. When you give ample amounts on N and P, you can cause problems with the way the plant breaks down these elements. P will block microlife if in excess and too much N makes it hard for the plant to convert Nitrate nitrogen to Ammonia nitrogen. If your plant has too much Nitrate Nitrogen then your results will be increased susceptibility for disease. Too much P starts to effect your macro elements, especially Iron.

Coots mix takes this into account. He keeps his inputs low in these areas. You may have to top dress a tad, or foliar certain elements, but nothing is in excess. The antagonistic interactions in coots mix is perfect. Between Coots and Michael Astrea they really dove into the science, and made the best mix possible. The down side? This creates plants that concentrates on top quality buds, and fully developed THC. However, your plants wont break world records when it comes to yield. The Rev mix will produce good plants no doubt, however your quality wont be as good IMO. Your yields should be.

So my point, if you load up on everything your vegging plants will look great. If you keep to coots, your vegging plants will be good, but the flowering plants will be second to none.

 

[Bulldog11]

Get an AACT, or EWC slurry on that coots mix to liven it up a bit. What size container are we talking? The bigger the better with those two soil mixes and the organic process they have in mind.

 

[Minitiger]

Have you tried a compost tea? Or instead of a top dress with EWC, maybe make up an EWC slurry.

The reason I say this is because organics takes a while to establish the proper microbes to intake their nutrients. The coots mix is low in P and light on N for a reason. When you mix up a coots mix, you don't get that hot build up of microbes processing the material. This means that you must inoculate your soil with microbes.

The Rev mix is loaded up so much with everything, the soil mix cooks quite a bit. This means that your microlife will be a little more active right out the gate. The Rev mix like you stated also has a good amount of N to begin with.

Here is the main difference in the long run. I find the Rev mix is great, we are splitting hairs here. However, the Rev mix will give you everything you need in ample amount. When you give ample amounts on N and P, you can cause problems with the way the plant breaks down these elements. P will block microlife if in excess and too much N makes it hard for the plant to convert Nitrate nitrogen to Ammonia nitrogen. If your plant has too much Nitrate Nitrogen then your results will be increased susceptibility for disease. Too much P starts to effect your macro elements, especially Iron.

Coots mix takes this into account. He keeps his inputs low in these areas. You may have to top dress a tad, or foliar certain elements, but nothing is in excess. The antagonistic interactions in coots mix is perfect. Between Coots and Michael Astrea they really dove into the science, and made the best mix possible. The down side? This creates plants that concentrates on top quality buds, and fully developed THC. However, your plants wont break world records when it comes to yield. The Rev mix will produce good plants no doubt, however your quality wont be as good IMO. Your yields should be.

So my point, if you load up on everything your vegging plants will look great. If you keep to coots, your vegging plants will be good, but the flowering plants will be second to none.

Man.... Yer smart... Hahaha!!

Seriously, though, thanks for the detailed response. Between you and seamaiden, I feel like I'm bugging the shit out of y'all, so thank you for the reply.

I haven't used an AACT yet because it's only one plant and it's in one of those three inch, like, seedling starter pots. Once it gets big enough, I'm gonna put it in a fifteen gallon and see what happens. But because it's in such a small container, I didn't want to waste my AACT ingredients just to pour like half a cup in there. I was planning on brewing one today to use tomorrow on my batch of Coots mix that's sitting in my garage. Of course I'd use some on this Prayer Tower seedling, too. And I did already pour one onto my "cooking" batch of Coots a few weeks ago. The AACT recipe I used was one of Coots'. I don't have the recipe committed to memory, but it's like a mix of different seed meals, some EWC, I think a tiny bit of molasses, possibly some kelp or maybe fish and kelp hydrosylate, something like that.

Having said that, I did use a little OG Biowar (all three of them) when it first broke ground, I figured that'd be enough for the time being. But I guess not. What about a little EM-1? Would that help? Or should I just use an AACT? Like I said, this plant is kinda just for fucking around with, I have no intention of flowering it. It's more for me to get an idea of what to expect once I start my indoor (which has been a whole 'nother thing...).

Sorry for all the Super Noob questions. Like I said, yer smart. I'm dumb haha!

 

[Bulldog11]

You have done what I would recommend. Start applying AACT to your "cooking" mix. Once you put your seedling/clone into it's final or larger pot with the new soil innoculated with AACT's, they should really respond. If it's just an experiment, try transplanting into a 1-3 gallon pot with the innoculated soil and watch them take off.

When growing in a 3" seed starter pot there is no point to using coots mix or Rev's mix. For a plant that size, 60% peat, 40% castings. Add some perlite maybe. Done deal. Once the roots have filled the 3" starter pots, that is when you transplant into your finial soil mix. Some plants really don't like that much nutes when first started. The 60-40 approach is much better IMO.

I haven't used the og bio war, but from what I do know, that seems like a great approach as well. However, I am not 100% sure about all the ins and outs of the OG Biowar.

 

[Bulldog11]

BTW - Tag me or Pm me and if I am around I will help whenever possible. Good luck.

 

[Minitiger]

You have done what I would recommend. Start applying AACT to your "cooking" mix. Once you put your seedling/clone into it's final or larger pot with the new soil innoculated with AACT's, they should really respond. If it's just an experiment, try transplanting into a 1-3 gallon pot with the innoculated soil and watch them take off.

When growing in a 3" seed starter pot there is no point to using coots mix or Rev's mix. For a plant that size, 60% peat, 40% castings. Add some perlite maybe. Done deal. Once the roots have filled the 3" starter pots, that is when you transplant into your finial soil mix. Some plants really don't like that much nutes when first started. The 60-40 approach is much better IMO.

I haven't used the og bio war, but from what I do know, that seems like a great approach as well. However, I am not 100% sure about all the ins and outs of the OG Biowar.

Word. I have to say, I noticed a little "nute burn" or whatever the fuck you wanna call it on two of the leaf tips. Wasn't sure if it was from the soil mix or from the top dress I did last week. The top-dress was extremely light, though. Like maybe an eighth of a teaspoon (if that) of neem and maybe a tablespoon of EWC. Maybe Prayer Tower is just one of those strains that's sensitive. It also has a little crinkling going on, maybe it's just a genetic's thing, maybe it's from the soil, maybe it's the top dress. I dunno. Obviously.

Re: starting my seeds in the 60/40 mix: that was my plan for when I sprout indoors, I just kind of wanted to see how things would happen if I sprouted in the full-on mix. But yeah, once the "official" grow commences, I'll be starting in the 60/40 mix, with some perlite (I have a huge bag of it, per the Rev's instructions, might as well use some of it).

The only reason I'm gonna plant the tester into a fifteen gallon is to see how cover crops work. Or how they affect growth patterns. I realize that if its not in a huge no-till pot or straight in the ground, cover crops might be pointless, but I'm still curious. And, uh.... Shit, just forgot what my point was. Anyway, yeah, uh... Man, totally forgot what I was getting at, sorry haha.

Thanks for the help, though. The Farm is the shit. Love all of yall, even if I've never acknowledged it, I'm always inspired by y'all.

 

[Minitiger]

Man, you were soooo right, @Bulldog11 (not that I ever doubted you haha). Poured a little bit of that AACT onto the tester and it took OFF. Looks amazing now, gonna transplant it into a two gallon tomorrow or the next day (skipping the cover crop experiment for now) and see how it does. Just a time-killer thing while I straighten up my indoor issues, but that doesn't make it any less fun. That plant is SINGING now.

Soooo..... Thank you thank you.

 

[Bulldog11]

Anytime brother! Glad to hear it's working out for you. With quality soil like that, you will be a happy man come harvest. Good luck.