Happy so far - but checking :)

[Nectarivorous]

Oof. Opened the tent 40 minutes after lights on to this. 3 praying plants and one on its knees. I'm taking it as that one is suffering the most with the extra water and needs a bit longer.
The consensus seems to be that praying leaves are good as long as the plant is thriving and not curling and yellowing, like a sign the light is just right. Thoughts? Is it maybe more stress here?
Close up of leaves on Girl 2 looks to me like heavy waterlogged leaf. It's bent all the way from the tip of the petiole, not curling at the edges. Cheers

 

[Nectarivorous]

Big girl done. She's in a good healthy spot and was already working hard on sixth so wanted to get the fifth off. Pretty sure I've left just enough

 

[Capital_Florica]

The consensus seems to be that praying leaves are good as long as the plant is thriving and not curling and yellowing, like a sign the light is just right. Thoughts? Is it maybe more stress here?

Yup, I'd agree with that. For your plants, praying seems to be a good sign. I'd interpret it as having that light dialed-in perfectly. Measure the distance, you'll probably have to raise it in a couple of weeks.

Maybe try spreading your watering out to give them more time to dry out in between. Still twice a day, but further apart. Might need to go to one a day for 48 hours or so to dry them out some if you think overwatering is your issue. I know you need to be careful with the coco because it can dry out to a point that's detrimental way faster than soil. So I wouldn't go to one a day unless you're able to check on them every couple of hours. But I can't stress how important the overwatering stuff is. It will ruin the development of a good root system and come to bite you in the ass later. So always safer to be on the drier side than wetter, but I know you have to be careful with coco.

Can you not water the one in the back and water the others? Like, let her dry out for a day but not the others?

Pretty sure I've left just enough

Looks perfect man. I can't wait to see how she recovers.

 

[Nectarivorous]

Yup, I'd agree with that. For your plants, praying seems to be a good sign. I'd interpret it as having that light dialed-in perfectly. Measure the distance, you'll probably have to raise it in a couple of weeks.

Maybe try spreading your watering out to give them more time to dry out in between. Still twice a day, but further apart. Might need to go to one a day for 48 hours or so to dry them out some if you think overwatering is your issue. I know you need to be careful with the coco because it can dry out to a point that's detrimental way faster than soil. So I wouldn't go to one a day unless you're able to check on them every couple of hours. But I can't stress how important the overwatering stuff is. It will ruin the development of a good root system and come to bite you in the ass later. So always safer to be on the drier side than wetter, but I know you have to be careful with coco.

Can you not water the one in the back and water the others? Like, let her dry out for a day but not the others?



Looks perfect man. I can't wait to see how she recovers.

Yeah I reckon that's what those other plants are telling me. I'll put a pic up after they've had their first lights out but even in the hours since big girl was topped the secondary shoots have gone apeshit. I gather if you catch them when they're singing and going off they just convert all those good vibes down low.

You're spot on about the watering, I actually didn't water any of them at all yesterday and they were more than fine. It's definitely the space between the drinks with Coco in these big pots, hard to put 'too much' water as it drains so well, but I've learned that 'too often' is the same thing as 'too much'. She's slowly coming good, doing the normal raising and lowering just all at a slightly lower height. The stems have already stopped drooping. Had planned to do exactly as you said, give the other girls a water today and leave her until I see signs she's not struggling. She's really ready to be topped in the next day or too but I won't be doing any such thing while she's in watering stress.

I check my girls every couple of hours as I work from home so I'm able to be quite 'Johnny on the spot' when things go south. That's why I was happy to leave them without water for a day knowing I'd spot any wilting as soon as it happened. If anything the three that aren't drooping got even more bright and cheery and took off, more confirmation that overwatering was affecting all of them to differing degrees.

Cheers for all your help man, I actually had a look at the topping this morning, the cut has sealed beautifully, and the joints of the fan leaves at node 4 are already swollen. Was not prepared for that to happen so quickly. I think it's getting ready to go mental

 

[Capital_Florica]

hard to put 'too much' water as it drains so well, but I've learned that 'too often' is the same thing as 'too much'.

Exactly! Overwatering is frequency not amount. As long as you aren't doing it too often, too much shouldn't matter.

If anything the three that aren't drooping got even more bright and cheery and took off

I've been trying to spread my waterings out a lot recently and every morning I think I'm going to open the room and see droop but I see the exact opposite. It's been pretty remarkable. Has really taught me to lay off the water and just wait till the plants tell me they need more.

the cut has sealed beautifully, and the joints of the fan leaves at node 4 are already swollen. Was not prepared for that to happen so quickly. I think it's getting ready to go mental

Dude! It's crazy how they react and just start going crazy. Start thinking about how you'll tie down those two new shoots that pop up. The earlier the better, once they're about say 3-5 inches tall. It should be super easy since your plants are a great height and won't be bending too much. I used string and tape but next time I'll use a coated wire because it's more sturdy and I've had the tape come undone a couple of times.

 

[Nectarivorous]

Exactly! Overwatering is frequency not amount. As long as you aren't doing it too often, too much shouldn't matter.



I've been trying to spread my waterings out a lot recently and every morning I think I'm going to open the room and see droop but I see the exact opposite. It's been pretty remarkable. Has really taught me to lay off the water and just wait till the plants tell me they need more.



Dude! It's crazy how they react and just start going crazy. Start thinking about how you'll tie down those two new shoots that pop up. The earlier the better, once they're about say 3-5 inches tall. It should be super easy since your plants are a great height and won't be bending too much. I used string and tape but next time I'll use a coated wire because it's more sturdy and I've had the tape come undone a couple of times.

Yeah man I gave that sad girl nothing today and she's still lovely and green, the leaves are starting to breathe again. Got away with a not too expensive lesson. You can see how those episodes lead to root rot which affects every bit of growth that comes after. I will be using Cannazym once flower starts to help break down those dead roots and get a huge healthy root mass. I went to dig away at the topsoil and there is already a mass of roots right to the edge of the pot, just an inch down, in all of them. All white and healthy, can't believe how quickly they're filling out those 8 gal pots. Only 4 weeks today since seed in coco.

The second lowest node shoots have gone from two small leaves to big leaves with an almost complete second node in under 24 hours since topping. These things are like the hulk - except I like them when they're angry. I'm gonna use frictionless garden wires, my pots have pre-drilled holes for hooking wires through so should be straight forward. As you say won't need to pull em down much just keep em where they are. I'm hoping in a couple weeks we'll be reaching for the trellis and eventually starting flower not miles above where we are now.

 

[Nectarivorous]

Mmmkay. So the learning continues. Today's learning resulted from deciding to rotate girl 2 from the back corner to the front, which gets more of the fan and more natural dry air from outside due to being closer to the opening where I do my work. I swapped with girl 3 which was the left front one that popped upside down and struggled to get started. Didn't break ground until 24 days ago. This is the bottom of its 8 gallon pot now:

I had no idea. I genuinely thought I was still dealing with a root ball about the size of the plant and the rest was waiting to be filled. Not even close. No wonder I misunderstood their watering needs. The roots at the bottom will pretty much have access to the runoff in the bottom pot so all I need to do is make sure the nutes flow through the pot and give lots of time between to let the roots up top absorb oxygen.

I was also given a massive nute tank by the guy I got it off I'm sure it'll be handy later when they're drinking a gal a day each, but I think he's off the mark saying to use it yet. I am changing to using a 9 litre bucket and mixing fresh to exactly what the plants and the runoff EC tell me they need. I'll tip the 15 litres left in the big tank onto the garden tomorrow. I also struggled with my pH when I first made that water, went way below, then had to add up, went too high, then too low. Long story short a bit of both went in, and high school chemistry tells me when I neutralise acid with base one of the products is salt. I nailed it this time and used no up just down.

I may be imagining it, but when I looked at the roots on the sad girl that were coming out the bottom of her pot, they looked more Brown than girl 3. Not rotting and still lots of white. But more brown. May just be a character of the plant but it's possible the overwatering has caused some root damage?

 

[Capital_Florica]

All white and healthy, can't believe how quickly they're filling out those 8 gal pots. Only 4 weeks today since seed in coco.

This is all making me want to give coco a try, haha. The speed at which you're seeing growth is really remarkable and feels unobtainable in pure soil mixes.

rotate girl 2 from the back corner to the front

Good move, I'm sure it was a pain in the ass but this will definitely help, the whole moving plants around in your room and putting them in the best spot for them is something I think a lot of people overlook.

Not rotting and still lots of white. But more brown. May just be a character of the plant but it's possible the overwatering has caused some root damage?

Browning shouldn't ever be a trait. Touch a couple of the brown ones and if they feel mushy, it's rot. Nutrients can also stain the roots though it seems less prevalent. I've seen people recommend using H202 to treat it, either by soaking for a bit or adding it to the rez though diluted with water before. Also make sure you've got enough aeration in your rez, either turn up your bubbler or add a second. If you're just using the bucket, I'd throw a bubbler in it for a couple hours before to put more oxygen in the water. And make sure your water stays below 70, might need to add a chiller or just start with really cold water and then after sitting for a couple hours with the bubbler it'll warm up some but hopefully not above 70 degrees. Overwatering is probably the main cause for root damage, though that doesn't mean it's guaranteed to turn into root rot. The lack of oxygen really messes things up. I haven't messed with hydro before so I'm not certain on all of this, but hopefully it'll give you some ideas to research.

 

[Nectarivorous]

This is all making me want to give coco a try, haha. The speed at which you're seeing growth is really remarkable and feels unobtainable in pure soil mixes.



Good move, I'm sure it was a pain in the ass but this will definitely help, the whole moving plants around in your room and putting them in the best spot for them is something I think a lot of people overlook.



Browning shouldn't ever be a trait. Touch a couple of the brown ones and if they feel mushy, it's rot. Nutrients can also stain the roots though it seems less prevalent. I've seen people recommend using H202 to treat it, either by soaking for a bit or adding it to the rez though diluted with water before. Also make sure you've got enough aeration in your rez, either turn up your bubbler or add a second. If you're just using the bucket, I'd throw a bubbler in it for a couple hours before to put more oxygen in the water. And make sure your water stays below 70, might need to add a chiller or just start with really cold water and then after sitting for a couple hours with the bubbler it'll warm up some but hopefully not above 70 degrees. Overwatering is probably the main cause for root damage, though that doesn't mean it's guaranteed to turn into root rot. The lack of oxygen really messes things up. I haven't messed with hydro before so I'm not certain on all of this, but hopefully it'll give you some ideas to research.

It was a bit of a job haha! But well worth it, she is at least 50% less droopy than when I moved her, and her sister is now in a slightly warmer more humid spot and is just praying to the lights. In fact both the ones that have been topped in the last day after are just exploding.

I should have said I have a bubbler, and I run it pretty much 24 hours a day, but is in that big 70 litre nutrient tank. Now I have made up 5 litres in my little bucket and have the bubbler in there, should be much more effective. Will hit the girls with that in a few hours before lights out and see how they respond. Have to assess droopy girl. I've got so much more peace of mind about the water now I know what those roots look like. I've been feeling those heavy pots and assuming most of that water is unavailable to their 'little' root systems. Totally underestimated my girls and the power of Coco.

Had another look at those roots, the only brown bits are the tips that reach the reservoir in the drain pot and sit in nutes. Given the overall health of the plant and continued growth I'm not concerned about root issues really. The older leaves are still drying out but the new stuff has mostly developed since the overwatering issue and look great, though growth was definitely slowed a little by it. Cannazym will help with any roots that didn't make it though

I kind of feel like if I've got roots all the way into the reservoir it's very much a hydro system now. They are gonna have constant access to nutes through those roots so the top ones need loads of access to oxygen.

 

[Capital_Florica]

It was a bit of a job haha! But well worth it, she is at least 50% less droopy than when I moved her, and her sister is now in a slightly warmer more humid spot and is just praying to the lights. In fact both the ones that have been topped in the last day after are just exploding.

I should have said I have a bubbler, and I run it pretty much 24 hours a day, but is in that big 70 litre nutrient tank. Now I have made up 5 litres in my little bucket and have the bubbler in there, should be much more effective. Will hit the girls with that in a few hours before lights out and see how they respond. Have to assess droopy girl. I've got so much more peace of mind about the water now I know what those roots look like. I've been feeling those heavy pots and assuming most of that water is unavailable to their 'little' root systems. Totally underestimated my girls and the power of Coco.

Had another look at those roots, the only brown bits are the tips that reach the reservoir in the drain pot and sit in nutes. Given the overall health of the plant and continued growth I'm not concerned about root issues really. The older leaves are still drying out but the new stuff has mostly developed since the overwatering issue and look great, though growth was definitely slowed a little by it. Cannazym will help with any roots that didn't make it though

I kind of feel like if I've got roots all the way into the reservoir it's very much a hydro system now. They are gonna have constant access to nutes through those roots so the top ones need loads of access to oxygen.

70 liters is a good amount, probably wouldn’t hurt to have a second bubbler in there when you resume using it. Haha yes, imagine that 5 liter will be nicely aerated.

So the net pots are sitting in the mini trash cans, how much water is below them, in the mini trash cans? Like not enough to the point where the majority of roots will be in it? The majority is still in the net pots right? Whatever is at the bottom of the mini trash cans is run off right?

Such a great sign the roots have already reached bottom

 

[Nectarivorous]

70 liters is a good amount, probably wouldn’t hurt to have a second bubbler in there when you resume using it. Haha yes, imagine that 5 liter will be nicely aerated.

So the net pots are sitting in the mini trash cans, how much water is below them, in the mini trash cans? Like not enough to the point where the majority of roots will be in it? The majority is still in the net pots right? Whatever is at the bottom of the mini trash cans is run off right?

Such a great sign the roots have already reached bottom

I know right?? I'm staggered at how quickly they filled them.

Mini trash cans made me laugh so much That's just what they sold me. The pots are exactly the same thing but with mesh bottom and they nest inside. There's a gap of about 2 inches between the bottoms, with about a half inch of runoff at the bottom, no standing water. Because of the gap any bits of root that cross the gap to drink will be mostly in air like a hydro setup which should be ideal.

 

[Capital_Florica]

Mini trash cans made me laugh so much

Hahaha they look like the perfect fit. I love it!

Ah okay, that makes sense. Lookin’ like some strong root growth so far man.

 

[Nectarivorous]

Yep definitely a bit of mush on the end of the roots of the sad one. Ended up giving her water tonight, think I missed the bit where she came good and she's actually been dehydrated for a day. She loved the drink and I was able to top her. Girl 4 will be ready in three days then it's training time

 

[Nectarivorous]

Hey mate, thought you might like to see the big girl 72 hours after topping. Secondary shoots are already pushing the big fan leaves out the way. Gave them their first flush yesterday, quarter strength nutes with Calmag and cannazym to help break down some of those soggy ends on the roots. Will have a look soon to see how they've responded twelve hours later. But thought you'd be interested to see just how well she's responded! Managed to get a little close up of node one and how swollen she is already. Picture of the droopy girl after she was topped two days ago and all the crap leaves taken off. Cheers mate.

 

[Capital_Florica]

Hey mate, thought you might like to see the big girl 72 hours after topping. Secondary shoots are already pushing the big fan leaves out the way. Gave them their first flush yesterday, quarter strength nutes with Calmag and cannazym to help break down some of those soggy ends on the roots. Will have a look soon to see how they've responded twelve hours later. But thought you'd be interested to see just how well she's responded! Managed to get a little close up of node one and how swollen she is already. Picture of the droopy girl after she was topped two days ago and all the crap leaves taken off. Cheers mate.

Awesome pictures brother! Really glad to see that she is responding well and showing vigor. It's a really fun transformation to observe and see all the lower shoots start growing towards the top.