I Need Better Nutes

[MIMedGrower]

kelp4less.com

Good source.

You can get good prices at the local feed coop too. They usually have humic acid way cheaper than our overpriced industry stores too.

The food crop farmers know whats up.

 

[Beachwalker]

LIGHTs = FOOD..Nutes = Vitamins..
Better buds need better lights and grower skills..Nutes come in 3rd!

Agree, newts are at the end of the list, but I do add TM-7

 

[Ikkt]

Thanks!

And right, forgot the micro/trace elements in Potassium humate (It's often very high in Iron, mine is 1%! fulvic acid perhaps too, don't know), any Kelp like Asco. Nodosum and Worm tea.
But for me that's a double edged sword, I don't really like things with unknown composition. But with those natural products you have no choice.

Some liquid products may be nice, out of habit I use algamic from biobizz.
But the powder/dry products have the great benefit of a nearly unlimited shelf life if properly stored and that's a very big one for me! If I buy a kilo/2 pounds it lasts maybe up to a decade with my micro grows these days.
And as most of those things are given best by foliar feeding you don't need much.

 

[hawkman]

There are only a few additives that really work and none of them is anything near a "game changer" or something. They are all scientifically proven to work.
There are no magic bottles, otherwise they would be standard in Horticulture.
A plant is not an engine. You can't supercharge it. plain and simple.

Most stuff with profound effects has nasty pgrs or the like in it and if you really want to use those use them pure and know exactly what you got.
Most "Grower nutrient lines" with their tens of bottles are a rip off big time, often the bottle of the 50-100$ stuff costs the manufacturer more than what's in it. Don't fall for that!

If you want to "step your game up" start to know more about what your doing!
Start with basic biology and horticulture knowledge.
Don't compare nutrient lines, compare what's in them. Get to know your ppms of everything in your nutrient solution. Hydrobuddy with the function "calculate from weight" is a good tool to start.
Then you can fine tune your nutrients but more important your environment till you reach the genetic potential of your cultivars. That's all there is. More isn't possible. No Turbochargers in the plant world!

Additives that work, tried and true, scientific proven stuff (and cheap without the fancy bottle), Google and read up to know more about them. Lots of studies on G. scolar:

- Fulvic acid and potassium humate * powder - Nutrient uptake, auxin like effects, general vitality/health.
- Amino acids * agri/horticulture grade - Ca uptake, good form of N, drought and salt resistance.
- Ascophyllum Nodosum, not just any "kelp" * agri/horti grade powder - has aminos, sugars, vitamins and a lot of plant hormones like cytokinins, general plant vitality, bushier plants, good for stressed plants.
- Chitosan * agri/horti or reagent grade powder (lactate/acetate/glutamate - water soluble!) - great stuff, helps with general plant health, mysterious deficiencies just disappear, more resin, SAR, mold and mildew resistance and on and on.
- UVC light treatment * build your own cheap, but take precautions, you don't want any contact! - kills spores and nasty stuff, induces SAR, induces jasmonic acid/jasmonate production, more smell more resin, my plants love it. But don't burn em with it, start slowly, take a plant to experiment. I give mine a treatment per week.
- Worm casting tea sprayed till early/mid flower * make your own - general health, no bud rot no mildew.
- Triacontanol * reagent grade or whatever - kind of plant steroid for a short burst of extra power, helps with budsetting and with more resin, active ingredient in most boosters that don't contain harmful nasty pgrs.

If you learn to use your basic nutrients and those additives listed nobody even with a hundred bottles will be outgrowing you except he has way better genetics/environment!

As someone said already:
If you want to be a better grower learn to be a better grower. That is hard work and no bottle whatsoever can replace hours of learning the basics of gardening/biology/horticulture and not to forget the years of experience!


Edit:
Monopotassium phosphate has way too much P, you can use dipotassium phosphate or tripotassium phosphate (sp?) instead!

do you make your triacontanol ? I believe that Mammonth and Massive Bloom have this in them

 

[Ikkt]

@Beachwalker what's in TM-7?

 

[MIMedGrower]

Thanks!

And right, forgot the micro/trace elements in Potassium humate (It's often very high in Iron, mine is 1%! fulvic acid perhaps too, don't know), any Kelp like Asco. Nodosum and Worm tea.
But for me that's a double edged sword, I don't really like things with unknown composition. But with those natural products you have no choice.

Some liquid products may be nice, out of habit I use algamic from biobizz.
But the powder/dry products have the great benefit of a nearly unlimited shelf life if properly stored and that's a very big one for me! If I buy a kilo/2 pounds it lasts maybe up to a decade with my micro grows these days.
And as most of those things are given best by foliar feeding you don't need much.

Does cold pressed seaweed extract go bad?

I believe it has like 75 guaranteed micro nutrients and no break down time.

 

[Buzzer777]

Agree, newts are at the end of the list, but I do add TM-7

What is TM7 plz?

 

[Ikkt]

@MIMedGrower
Don't know, I only know algamic. Kept it in the fridge like many things and after a year or some longer it was more olive than bright green and smelled like old Kelp on a Baltic sea beach instead of fresh ocean like it does when new.
I used it up nonetheless but it definetly changes. And that was with keeping in the freezer and filling something in a smaller bottle to not contaminate the big fridge bottle. So I would say: Maybe ;)

@hawkman

I had a unknown stock solution from a friend, so I can only guess ppms and what the solvent was.
It's gone and now I've got a gram of pure Tria in the fridge, planning to make a stock solution in 50/50 Polysorbate/isopropyl alc.
Its dirt cheap so I'd never buy a ready made product especially if it has no guaranteed analysis. I never buy stuff that doesn't disclose what's in it or claims to have some magic ingredients (=Scam!).
I try to remember and post it here when I made a working stock solution and tested a known ppm dose the coming run!

 

[Beachwalker]

What is TM7 plz?

https://www.amazon.com/BioAg-TM-7-3...keywords=tm+7&qid=1556227180&s=gateway&sr=8-3

 

[Buzzer777]

https://www.amazon.com/BioAg-TM-7-3...keywords=tm+7&qid=1556227180&s=gateway&sr=8-3


View attachment 867667

TY

 

[cemchris]

Just like what @Ikkt said. Always trust lab analysis vs what a label says. So many claims when you get into pure products. Kind of like what Custom did with all the silica sups. Real world is a lot different from marketing and what they claim.

For example when Oregon tested mycorrhizal products from what their tests claimed vs what was actually on the shelf. It's easy to waste money. Just be careful and trust your gut. If they spent time and money on a colorful label....they prob skimmed on the product when dealing with pure forms or highly concentrated components.

As you can also see just something like Hydroguard vs the Enhancer-O from eco labs in FL. There is a huge margin of difference in the concentration and like 20 bucks price difference between the gallons and most people have prob never heard of that or suggested to use it.

Don't get hung up on products. Get hung up on what specific ingredient does what and buy the most concentrated form that you are comfortable with to save the most money. Nute cost, besides equipment and electricity, is the biggest expense in this hobby.

 

[cemchris]

Something else to consider. If you arent sure get it tested if no one has yet. Sometimes this can be as cheap as 60-100 bucks for specific things from a college or a testing lab and that little investment could save you hundreds or more in the long run.

 

[Ikkt]

Oh, I'm surprised about the results for GH!
But that the product from AN is just crap and colored water isn't a big surprise regarding their track record of shady marketing practices promoting inferior ingredients as the best thing since sliced bread and outright fraud with hazardous, prohibited substances in their products while claiming magical formulations or rare ingredients to justify the ridiculous price tag.

But since I use professional Horticulture/agriculture fertilizers/products only and stay away from those shady, dubious hydro/grower companys I don't care much.


I can only say:

Buy more professional Fertilizer!
Design a fancy bottle yourself and invent your own unsubstantiated claims if you need them!

But don't buy a 20% Monopotassiumphosphate solution for the price of 2kg of the pure stuff, or even worse, "booster" with hazardous pgrs or sugar water for 100 bucks a gallon.

 

[Ikkt]

@cemchris

Yes, that's a good idea especially if you've got a larger operation.
But it's only reasonable cost wise to test if something on the label really is in something.

If you just want to know what's in something and got no real idea what it could be, it costs a fortune!
Thats a lot of expensive lab work to be done unfortunately.

On the other hand you could just buy professional products and know that they're properly labeled and contain what they claim and not much else.
Visit your local agricultural store and see what they got!
(Here the labeling laws are way more strict, something like Superthrive is illegal to sell. So I can really trust the label. But as far as I know America is moving towards more strict labelling laws.)

 

[hawkman]

there is a site /organization that list nutrients that have heavy metals and toxic chemicals (arcenic) which Terpinator is listed with small amounts - it's a government agency under Plant Food Department - will get you the correct agency

 

[Ikkt]

All fertilizers contain heavy metals, mineral fertilizers and organic fertilizers.
Real soil contains heavy metals as well and sometimes quite a lot and I'd bet soilless mixes and coco too.

Some of them, like Fe, Cu, Mo, Mn etc, are essential for plants (and for almost every living thing...).
So it's really about what exactly and the amount, you have to look at it very differentiated.
It's not that easy I'm afraid.

It would be interesting to know what the scientific consent is on how much is too much in fertilizers/plant products. But I'm not sure that there even is one.

Without further knowledge I just stay with professional products.
Over here they have to be approved to be used on food crops as far as I know, so I feel pretty save. Don't know about the situation in America.
But for situations without real regulations like the "hydro" market it would sure be very interesting to know more about it.

And some products, like products that are not mineral fertilizers (terpinator?), shouldn't contain any measurable amount I guess.


(Edit:
The first lines are not especially directed to you hawkman, just general. "Heavy metals" is often used as buzzword in scare tactics so I thought I should write something about that they're everywhere, always and partially even essential...)

 

[Edinburgh]

I use botanacare pro grow, botanacare pro bloom soil and atami bloombastic, I luv the botanacare but the Atami is in my opinion is great stuff.

 

[hawkman]

All fertilizers contain heavy metals, mineral fertilizers and organic fertilizers.
Real soil contains heavy metals as well and sometimes quite a lot and I'd bet soilless mixes and coco too.

Some of them, like Fe, Cu, Mo, Mn etc, are essential for plants (and for almost every living thing...).
So it's really about what exactly and the amount, you have to look at it very differentiated.
It's not that easy I'm afraid.

It would be interesting to know what the scientific consent is on how much is too much in fertilizers/plant products. But I'm not sure that there even is one.

Without further knowledge I just stay with professional products.
Over here they have to be approved to be used on food crops as far as I know, so I feel pretty save. Don't know about the situation in America.
But for situations without real regulations like the "hydro" market it would sure be very interesting to know more about it.

And some products, like products that are not mineral fertilizers (terpinator?), shouldn't contain any measurable amount I guess.


(Edit:
The first lines are not especially directed to you hawkman, just general. "Heavy metals" is often used as buzzword in scare tactics so I thought I should write something about that they're everywhere, always and partially even essential...)

Thanks - Ikkt !!!

 

[katsu]

I'm a little late to the party, but just wanted to comment on what a spectacular grow and show you put on. Mad props!!!

 

[hawkman]

All fertilizers contain heavy metals, mineral fertilizers and organic fertilizers.
Real soil contains heavy metals as well and sometimes quite a lot and I'd bet soilless mixes and coco too.

Some of them, like Fe, Cu, Mo, Mn etc, are essential for plants (and for almost every living thing...).
So it's really about what exactly and the amount, you have to look at it very differentiated.
It's not that easy I'm afraid.

It would be interesting to know what the scientific consent is on how much is too much in fertilizers/plant products. But I'm not sure that there even is one.

Without further knowledge I just stay with professional products.
Over here they have to be approved to be used on food crops as far as I know, so I feel pretty save. Don't know about the situation in America.
But for situations without real regulations like the "hydro" market it would sure be very interesting to know more about it.

And some products, like products that are not mineral fertilizers (terpinator?), shouldn't contain any measurable amount I guess.


(Edit:
The first lines are not especially directed to you hawkman, just general. "Heavy metals" is often used as buzzword in scare tactics so I thought I should write something about that they're everywhere, always and partially even essential...)

Thanks for your information Peace