T
TheTwistedOne
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- Apr 24, 2023
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This has been a hit and miss subject complete with opinions from both sides of the isle for a very long time. We then have vendors making claims their product can create wonderful terpene profiles just by adding their productā¦..usually what seems to be potassium into the mix. Instead of offering opinions, I aim to try and offer facts, and with the input of you folks, I aim to be backing it up with honest, unfiltered side by side testing.
Why is this so important to me? Well, for one I grow hydroponically, and when Oklahoma legalized, I wanted to grow commercially, and do it the only way Iāve done it since the 70āsā¦.hydroponically. Some might say Iām not thinking rightā¦commercially speaking of course.
Itās been an education to say the least, and thatās an understatement. Itās a good thing I like challenges.
Anyway, having grown for years, and providing stinky medication to a select few, I never had any lab testing for THC or Terpenes, only ādamn thatās some stinky dankā or something about feeling nailed to the couch, but thatās about it, so I never had any factual data, and we all know whatcha got currently is always better than the last, right?
Now I do have some of that factual data and Iām looking at ways to improve it. Donāt get me wrong, we put out a stellar product, but now that I am armed with some data, I need to find ways to improve the product anyway I can. Never quit improving is my motto. If I had a day I didnāt learn something newā¦.I had a bad day.
First up is how we grow. Some call it DWC however I call it a hybrid of sorts. I use 5 gallon buckets with large net pots and my media is expanded clay. I top feed through homemade drip rings. The buckets maintain 3/4 gallon and the rest return to temperature controlled reservoirs. Just about everything in our facility has been created and not bought, so donāt laugh too hard at my country boy engineering. No degree here. School of hard knocksā¦
. Whether itās the rolling tables, hydroponics systems or chillers, Iāve built it all. Being a country boy with limited resources has its plus side I guess. Survival of the fittest, right?
Hereās a shot of a row in our flower room showing how we feed.
The reservoir is maintained at 68 deg, plus or minus 1 deg at all times. All my lighting is based upon the Samsung LM301 chipset. Drivers are Meanwell and overclocked to 550 watts driving four 288 boards per driver. I have 137.5 watts per plant on average. Humidity is tightly controlled using something I didnāt build, even though Iām an HVAC contractorā¦.an Anden dehumidifier. Yes. It is āthe bombā.
Growing this way allows me several advantages, one of which in a sealed room with co2 in flowering I can maintain between 82-85 degrees while my root zones have a constant 68 deg nutrient solution running down them 24 hrs a day. I COULD run a 90 deg room without effecting my root zone if I ever chose to.
It also gives me a level of control Iāve became spoiled on, however it is also probably one of the most expensive methods to grow cannabis, and when I look at how bad our market in Oklahoma has been beat down, I presume to our final cost of getting our medicine to the market is notably more expensive than about any other method of growing, so thereās that as well. I knew this going into the commercial end of it, and had hoped to carve a small enough nitch to survive the onslaught of out of state money driving wholesale pricing to rock bottom by providing a superior product. Thatās the goal anyway.
Now this brings us pretty close to why I created this thread. Weāve hit a milestone and a wall at pretty much the same time. The good news is we pretty much are putting out the highest non-infused THC cannabis on our local market, with sales of such to insure our survival in this depressed market. I thank the Godās of MayJane for that! The last three grows, we managed to exceed 30% on our THC testing, with the highest tested at 35.86 THC. We seem to be able to pull it off consistently, which I am immensely pleased.
Now the brick wall.
Since we began lab testing, the highest terpene profile we have landed was a 3.08 with a White Truffle strain. She clocked 31.1 THC. The last two strains were a Peanut Butter Pie which clocked our highest ratio of THC in our history, and she clocked so high the lab had to break out the backup sample (we are all required to include btw
) and perform a retest. Same result. 35.86 THC with a terpene profile of 1.73 respectively. Our GMO Pie hit the scales at 31.1 THC with a terpene profile of 2.73.
Why all these numbers? Because they are showing a pattern that seems to be linked to THC percentages. The higher the THC content, the lower the terpene profile. Iāve had two independent labs agree with me on that.
Now weāve reached the point where organic growers will swear the only way to get high terpene numbers is to grow organically, and a plethora of other opinions. I respect each one of them, but thatās not what this thread is about. Itās about improving terpenes for those of us who grow hydroponically.
How can we go about this? Two ways. Input from you, the reader and backing testing up like a clinical trial.
Iāll kick this off on our first side by side testing with a product known as āTerpinatorā. Now, always my first thought is āwhatās in itā, and when I look, it isnāt that impressive looking. This said for every person that swears by this product I can find one who swears against it. I aim to find out, at least from a hydroponic view.
This is the test run using Terpinator, and we are right at 6 weeks into flower on our Peanut Butter Pie and have been feeding them Terpinator at manufactures recommendation, and are now currently feeding at eh rate of 30ml per gallon. In about a week, weāll begin flushing, using nothing but RO water with a continued use of the Terpinator throughout the flush as recommended. It does very little to increasing salinity so Iām not worried about running it throughout the flush cycle.
The last grow was this identical strain from the very same identical mother of our Peanut Butter Pie, grown in the same environment with the very same nutrient program and I have the lab results from that grow. Harvest and cure are identical. Iām rooting for the boys at Terpinator, but as it stands, the jury is still out.
We also have an R&D room set up to perform additional testing, and this is where Iām needing your 100ās of years of combined knowledge. If you have formula, and you know it works, bring it on and letās discuss it. It just might be a piece of this puzzle. If we can keep this thread focused on improvement, it will be a win-win for everyone.
In closing, I truly look forward to this endeavor and hope to be able to offer some provable scientific data and bring it to the table for all to benefit from. With your help, Iām betting we can.
-The Twisted One
Why is this so important to me? Well, for one I grow hydroponically, and when Oklahoma legalized, I wanted to grow commercially, and do it the only way Iāve done it since the 70āsā¦.hydroponically. Some might say Iām not thinking rightā¦commercially speaking of course.
Itās been an education to say the least, and thatās an understatement. Itās a good thing I like challenges.
Anyway, having grown for years, and providing stinky medication to a select few, I never had any lab testing for THC or Terpenes, only ādamn thatās some stinky dankā or something about feeling nailed to the couch, but thatās about it, so I never had any factual data, and we all know whatcha got currently is always better than the last, right?
Now I do have some of that factual data and Iām looking at ways to improve it. Donāt get me wrong, we put out a stellar product, but now that I am armed with some data, I need to find ways to improve the product anyway I can. Never quit improving is my motto. If I had a day I didnāt learn something newā¦.I had a bad day.
First up is how we grow. Some call it DWC however I call it a hybrid of sorts. I use 5 gallon buckets with large net pots and my media is expanded clay. I top feed through homemade drip rings. The buckets maintain 3/4 gallon and the rest return to temperature controlled reservoirs. Just about everything in our facility has been created and not bought, so donāt laugh too hard at my country boy engineering. No degree here. School of hard knocksā¦
. Whether itās the rolling tables, hydroponics systems or chillers, Iāve built it all. Being a country boy with limited resources has its plus side I guess. Survival of the fittest, right?Hereās a shot of a row in our flower room showing how we feed.
The reservoir is maintained at 68 deg, plus or minus 1 deg at all times. All my lighting is based upon the Samsung LM301 chipset. Drivers are Meanwell and overclocked to 550 watts driving four 288 boards per driver. I have 137.5 watts per plant on average. Humidity is tightly controlled using something I didnāt build, even though Iām an HVAC contractorā¦.an Anden dehumidifier. Yes. It is āthe bombā.
Growing this way allows me several advantages, one of which in a sealed room with co2 in flowering I can maintain between 82-85 degrees while my root zones have a constant 68 deg nutrient solution running down them 24 hrs a day. I COULD run a 90 deg room without effecting my root zone if I ever chose to.
It also gives me a level of control Iāve became spoiled on, however it is also probably one of the most expensive methods to grow cannabis, and when I look at how bad our market in Oklahoma has been beat down, I presume to our final cost of getting our medicine to the market is notably more expensive than about any other method of growing, so thereās that as well. I knew this going into the commercial end of it, and had hoped to carve a small enough nitch to survive the onslaught of out of state money driving wholesale pricing to rock bottom by providing a superior product. Thatās the goal anyway.
Now this brings us pretty close to why I created this thread. Weāve hit a milestone and a wall at pretty much the same time. The good news is we pretty much are putting out the highest non-infused THC cannabis on our local market, with sales of such to insure our survival in this depressed market. I thank the Godās of MayJane for that! The last three grows, we managed to exceed 30% on our THC testing, with the highest tested at 35.86 THC. We seem to be able to pull it off consistently, which I am immensely pleased.
Now the brick wall.
Since we began lab testing, the highest terpene profile we have landed was a 3.08 with a White Truffle strain. She clocked 31.1 THC. The last two strains were a Peanut Butter Pie which clocked our highest ratio of THC in our history, and she clocked so high the lab had to break out the backup sample (we are all required to include btw
) and perform a retest. Same result. 35.86 THC with a terpene profile of 1.73 respectively. Our GMO Pie hit the scales at 31.1 THC with a terpene profile of 2.73.Why all these numbers? Because they are showing a pattern that seems to be linked to THC percentages. The higher the THC content, the lower the terpene profile. Iāve had two independent labs agree with me on that.
Now weāve reached the point where organic growers will swear the only way to get high terpene numbers is to grow organically, and a plethora of other opinions. I respect each one of them, but thatās not what this thread is about. Itās about improving terpenes for those of us who grow hydroponically.
How can we go about this? Two ways. Input from you, the reader and backing testing up like a clinical trial.
Iāll kick this off on our first side by side testing with a product known as āTerpinatorā. Now, always my first thought is āwhatās in itā, and when I look, it isnāt that impressive looking. This said for every person that swears by this product I can find one who swears against it. I aim to find out, at least from a hydroponic view.
This is the test run using Terpinator, and we are right at 6 weeks into flower on our Peanut Butter Pie and have been feeding them Terpinator at manufactures recommendation, and are now currently feeding at eh rate of 30ml per gallon. In about a week, weāll begin flushing, using nothing but RO water with a continued use of the Terpinator throughout the flush as recommended. It does very little to increasing salinity so Iām not worried about running it throughout the flush cycle.
The last grow was this identical strain from the very same identical mother of our Peanut Butter Pie, grown in the same environment with the very same nutrient program and I have the lab results from that grow. Harvest and cure are identical. Iām rooting for the boys at Terpinator, but as it stands, the jury is still out.
We also have an R&D room set up to perform additional testing, and this is where Iām needing your 100ās of years of combined knowledge. If you have formula, and you know it works, bring it on and letās discuss it. It just might be a piece of this puzzle. If we can keep this thread focused on improvement, it will be a win-win for everyone.
In closing, I truly look forward to this endeavor and hope to be able to offer some provable scientific data and bring it to the table for all to benefit from. With your help, Iām betting we can.
-The Twisted One
