KNF fermentation, lets have a discussion.

[RippedTorn]

I'd love to hear from the farmers who use knf brews to see the hows and what's of what you're doing.

Maybe I'm over thinking some of the processes, but as a beer brewer my mind tends to think about fermentation from a fairly technical standpoint.

Your in the wrong place for that. Memorizing the cool acronyms is about as technical as internet folk like to get.

Molasses is a tried and true additive and growing and is what I use to feed my microbes.

Why don't you feed them fruit? How many people using molasses have ever looked in the microscope? It's just an internet sheep thing, not proven superior in any way.

 

[Kanzeon]

Thanks for the bro science, unabomber.

 

[tomatoesarecooltoo]

Stumbled upon this resource.
Covers which knf inputs to use at which time, from clone to finish

Modern Natural Farming Workshop.pdf

drive.google.com

 

[ezenzyme]

the KNF i am familiar with is EM. My friend has a IBC tote with the top cut off it with the culture on the bottom, he bought over the counter em dropped it in put some water and feeds it watermelons or sweet potatoes, mangos, bananas. Theres cultures of different kinds growing much like a culture on a pitri dish. tons of dead flys and not aerated at all. About 75 gal at the bottom of the tote. Pull out a gal of two, and dilute. Me coming from the school of aerated oxygenated it seems nasty anaerobic grossness. Pauls Staments says to culture your own to cook rice and bury it in cheese cloth somewhere thats really alive for a few weeks and use that as a starter culture, also had a friend tell me to do that for a inoc for teas and even putting it in the soil...Also whos checked out the Grow Kashi video on youtube with the soil king? Using Bu s blend and EM to grow huge white fungal hyphe its nuts. The whole world of anaerobic and fermented seems really foreign in america, seems the school of thought is aerated oxygenated.

 

[tomatoesarecooltoo]

the KNF i am familiar with is EM. My friend has a IBC tote with the top cut off it with the culture on the bottom, he bought over the counter em dropped it in put some water and feeds it watermelons or sweet potatoes, mangos, bananas. Theres cultures of different kinds growing much like a culture on a pitri dish. tons of dead flys and not aerated at all. About 75 gal at the bottom of the tote. Pull out a gal of two, and dilute. Me coming from the school of aerated oxygenated it seems nasty anaerobic grossness. Pauls Staments says to culture your own to cook rice and bury it in cheese cloth somewhere thats really alive for a few weeks and use that as a starter culture, also had a friend tell me to do that for a inoc for teas and even putting it in the soil...Also whos checked out the Grow Kashi video on youtube with the soil king? Using Bu s blend and EM to grow huge white fungal hyphe its nuts. The whole world of anaerobic and fermented seems really foreign in america, seems the school of thought is aerated oxygenated.

Thats intense. Whatever works for him. What did it smell like?

 

[ezenzyme]

Thats intense. Whatever works for him. What did it smell like?

Raw AF!!! Also with compost tea, letting it sit for long periods of time, full half full and bottoms and just airate for twelve hours before use. But heres what i think, that the idea of cannabis being fungal loving plants is far from the truth, i believe that a balanced biome is optimal and a lot of KNF has to do with anaerobic activity, and fermentation. For me the opposite end of what i was taught, and what a lot of western minds believe like Elaine Ingriam and some of the leading soil scientists in 'merica. So there is a lot of unexpained there, thats what is really intriuging to me. With my newly acquired knowledge of enzymes and and the actual roles that they play theres a lot more i want to know about the microbial activity in anaerobic stuff like that. Yeasts, enzymes, bacteria, all these things play i unseen role in our everyday life, from the reaction of enzymes to convert starches to sugars to create vodka, bread, and beer, but with in us as well knowing that fungus in our lungs and bacteria in our tummys. life. Wheres all the soil science nerds at?!?!?

 

[oldskol4evr]

this is new to me,ive never used yeast to ferment,also using the flask does it make the process faster?
my normal method is 1:1, equal weights of plant and molasess,i have used brown sugar but find it gets hard in bottom of my mason jars,also using molasses i dont have to worry about my jars pinging as much.
i use 5 gal buckets with sealed lids,paint buckets,they have a second small lid i drill 1/4 inch hole in that small lid and run 1/4 tubing to a coke bottle with same 1/4 in hole,run tube to bottom of the bottle and fill half bottle with water,the gas off if the fermentation makes bubbles when it is done bubbling it ready for use.
it can take up to 2 months though depends on weather,now the OHN that gets expensive to make ,unless you have cheap vodka to spare hahahah that is a 6 week process alone,every week your refreshing the vodka.
i used all my stuff which i made from my garden veggies,lasted 2 years did very well as far as did it do better i cant really say the heat is a bitch on any plant life were i live,but cost wise you better believe it better.
im convinced on one thing comfrey and nettle can feed any plant and that alone is all you need,that stanky ass shit is some potent stuff and plants love it,i run with it in my outdoor veggie garden and my tent ,both did very well considering the cost of making it,pretty much the cost is for molasess all plants are free just pick the new growth in the dark .for the one fella that ask why use mollases,because the bacteria feed on it,if you dont believe it ferment with it and jar the feed up as the weather changes the activity is known real easythe lids ping and you have to go burp jars just like your weed

 

[tomatoesarecooltoo]

Raw AF!!! Also with compost tea, letting it sit for long periods of time, full half full and bottoms and just airate for twelve hours before use. But heres what i think, that the idea of cannabis being fungal loving plants is far from the truth, i believe that a balanced biome is optimal and a lot of KNF has to do with anaerobic activity, and fermentation. For me the opposite end of what i was taught, and what a lot of western minds believe like Elaine Ingriam and some of the leading soil scientists in 'merica. So there is a lot of unexpained there, thats what is really intriuging to me. With my newly acquired knowledge of enzymes and and the actual roles that they play theres a lot more i want to know about the microbial activity in anaerobic stuff like that. Yeasts, enzymes, bacteria, all these things play i unseen role in our everyday life, from the reaction of enzymes to convert starches to sugars to create vodka, bread, and beer, but with in us as well knowing that fungus in our lungs and bacteria in our tummys. life. Wheres all the soil science nerds at?!?!?

Yeah, discounting all aerobic or all anaerobic life is crazy. Theirs ton's of goodies and baddies of both kinds.

 

[shaganja]

Kelly from dragonfly earth tells us plants from fpj are from your surrounding area. You look for plants that are very vigorous. The first one most of us around the u.s. see is dandelion. It grows everywhere. The second one I use is horsetail. Then you see clover growing everywhere. Its like mother nature knows what plants you need, because she has them ready for you, when you need them. The last one I am doing this year is seaweed. And its funny that seaweed is ready to harvest when you need it also, right on time for flower. I have pics on my thread, "no till regenerative". And its so easy. Mix your plant with brown sugar in a bucket. And cap it with an inch of the brown sugar. Let her sit for 7 to 10 days. When you pull the cap, your juice should be booze like. MOST IMPORTANT. Dilute your juice, so tastes more like wine. When it tastes good enough to drink, its ready. I burned landrace plants last season due to not diluting my horsetail juice.

 

[ChooliCabooli]

Try using the KNF LABS (lactobacillus serum) to accelerate the fermentation process. There are plenty of protocols for making LABS online. It’s cheap and easy. Mash the fruit to speed up the process even further (as little as 1 week vs. 1 month for whole fruits) and mix thoroughly with the lactobacillus... LABS will not only speed up fermentation, but it will also increase resin and terpene production. Watering with LABS diluted 1:1000 (yes, 1:1000) will act similarly to a compost tea, converting latent food present in the soil into bioavailable form. Be careful, because less is more. You can kill your plants by going too strong. You can also ferment bulk products like kelp, alfalfa, fish meal, bone meal, etc. to turn them into fast acting liquid fertilizers. This is game changing strategy. You’ll be creating an end product that’s even better than what you can buy in the stores, because the microbiology hasn’t been killed off to make the product shelf stable. If you want to know what exactly you’ll be getting out of fermenting fruits, just look up the nutritional content of a given fruit online and you’ll have a ballpark idea. I know the peaches and apricots I’m fermenting are rich in potassium and also contain a decent amount of phosphorous. If you’re truly interested in creating your own homemade fertilizers, I’d suggest acquiring the “JADAM Organic Farming: The way to ultra-low-cost agriculture” book. It’s widely available online and has protocols for producing quite an array of preparations. JAH Bless!

 

[ezenzyme]

So tell me, with a 1;1000 dilution that in so little it cant be to much of a nutrient solution. I have used 5 gal in a 250 of lab cow manure ferment and that didnt burn them too much. So my theory with the crazy dilution rate is that there is too much lactic acid is most fermentations making it rather acidic, shorter fermentation period will still have billions of bacteria but not so much booze, and acids. Do you think my kombucha would work as a LAB inoc?

 

[Grapefruitroop]

Watering with LABS diluted 1:1000 (yes, 1:1000) will act similarly to a compost tea, converting latent food present in the soil into bioavailable form. Be careful, because less is more. You can kill your plants by going too strong.

I do 1 liter of LAB to 80 liter of water !! One time per cycle...

 

[ChooliCabooli]

So tell me, with a 1;1000 dilution that in so little it cant be to much of a nutrient solution. I have used 5 gal in a 250 of lab cow manure ferment and that didnt burn them too much. So my theory with the crazy dilution rate is that there is too much lactic acid is most fermentations making it rather acidic, shorter fermentation period will still have billions of bacteria but not so much booze, and acids. Do you think my kombucha would work as a LAB inoc?

The 1:1000 dilution rate is for watering with straight LABS serum. This inoculates the food in your soil with microbes (lactobacillus) that will feed on the food stores present, and convert them into plant available form more quickly. Be careful going too strong right after a top dress, especially one with a lot of N, as it can unlock too much all at once. I learned that the hard way. I add a cup, or so, of LABS to a 5 gallon bucket of fruit mash to speed the process along. You’ll want to only fill your bucket 2/3 full as fermentation will cause the fruit solids to rise to the surface, which can cause juices to overflow. You can use the finished fruit product at a much lower dilution rate. I can’t make enough of it to fulfill my needs, since I only have access to a few fruit trees, so I just give them what I’ve got and supplement with other nutrient sources. I’ve heard people say you can use a dilution rate as low as 1:30, but I can’t personally recommend that, as I’ve never tried it. If I could produce enough, I would start at 2T./gallon and work my way up by testing on a plant, and seeing how it responds, before going hard on everything else. This article: https://www.redbudsoilcompany.com/b...-juice-recipe-for-flowering-plants-knf-inputs
...recommends 1/2oz per gallon. There is tons of information out there

 

[ChooliCabooli]

I do 1 liter of LAB to 80 liter of water !! One time per cycle...

That’s good info to know... I try to go bi-weekly with the standard 1:1000 rate. From my understanding, the microbe populations boom then taper off as the food stores are eaten up, which is a big reason why I make repeated applications. I feel that closer applications toward the second half of flowering will help get the nutrients out of the soil, creating a cleaner end product. LABS is said to increase resin and terpene content, so why not, right

 

[ChooliCabooli]

So tell me, with a 1;1000 dilution that in so little it cant be to much of a nutrient solution. I have used 5 gal in a 250 of lab cow manure ferment and that didnt burn them too much. So my theory with the crazy dilution rate is that there is too much lactic acid is most fermentations making it rather acidic, shorter fermentation period will still have billions of bacteria but not so much booze, and acids. Do you think my kombucha would work as a LAB inoc?

I bet kombucha would help break things down, but I have no idea to what extent, or how it would fare in your soil in the long term. Lactobacillus is a facultative anaerobe, meaning that it is anaerobic by nature, but also does well in aerobic environments. It is also pretty salt tolerant, can withstand a wide variety of environmental conditions, and has proven to be effective in agricultural studies. I experiment with small tweaks here, and there, well... because a wheel is shaped like a wheel for a reason. Sometimes just a small tweak is all you need to make something better

 

[ChooliCabooli]

I bet kombucha would help break things down, but I have no idea to what extent, or how it would fare in your soil in the long term. Lactobacillus is a facultative anaerobe, meaning that it is anaerobic by nature, but also does well in aerobic environments. It is also pretty salt tolerant, can withstand a wide variety of environmental conditions, and has proven to be effective in agricultural studies. I experiment with small tweaks here, and there, well... because a wheel is shaped like a wheel for a reason. Sometimes just a small tweak is all you need to make something better

So tell me, with a 1;1000 dilution that in so little it cant be to much of a nutrient solution. I have used 5 gal in a 250 of lab cow manure ferment and that didnt burn them too much. So my theory with the crazy dilution rate is that there is too much lactic acid is most fermentations making it rather acidic, shorter fermentation period will still have billions of bacteria but not so much booze, and acids. Do you think my kombucha would work as a LAB inoc?

There is lactobacillus in the kombucha scobee, so if you inoculate with that, it should have the beneficial effect of LABS... though it will probably take longer for the population to grow equivalent to that of what would be present in LABS, slowing the breakdown process. Not a problem, if you’re not in a rush. Are you talking homemade kombucha, or store bought? Just like fertilizers, many kombucha brands are processed to kill off a good portion of the microbes, so that the bottles don’t explode in transit. Homemade will work much better

 

[Nightstick008]

I'm all about the microbes. I started using a packet of yeast and ph water with two tablespoons of Molases along with some epson salt. I mix it in a gallon jug and leave it overnight. I then water it into my cannabis plants. I have been using this supplemental once after four weeks and again at the end. Between I use normal mycos amendments. Science seems to agree. Plants respond well.