Lack of Vertical Integration Will Kill the Basement Grower

[caveman4.20]

I have yet to see a massive grow taken care of like a smaller one say ten 1,000's or less compared to 20+ 1000's seems like too many cut corners in massive grows just my two cents

 

[outwest]

I'm not assuming anything. You are putting words in my mouth. I understand that most Americans prefer shitty beer. Like I keep saying the big beer guys attempts at producing craft beers have been miserable. They have all the funding, research, and most importantly marketing dollars. They still can't brew craft beer.

outwest

 

[caveman4.20]

The way I see it if big money could grow a shit load of connoisseur bud dispensaries would be doing it. 8 maybe nine out of ten dispensaries in Colorado is not medicine grade it's what in high school we called "work"
... As in barely good enough to work with and it needs work before I smoke it!

 

[ttystikk]

This isn't about basement growers, it's about commercial entities producing weed. The AAA won't come from Phillip Morris, just like AAA beer doesn't come from Coors. Has nothing to do with prohibition.

outwest

You are going to have a very tough time convincing me that with all of their money, neither Coors nor Budweiser could brew a decent microbrew style beer?! Puh-leeze!

These companies have been brewing beer- by any standard, beer of high quality- for generations. First, tastes have evolved and there are more craft beer enthusiasts- not that all the New Belgium drinkers and all the Sam Adams aficionados amount to more than a few percentage points of the market share of ImBev, the Belgian(?!) multinational corporate giant owner of Budweiser.

These corporations certainly COULD brew microbrews but don't because they know they could never make money doing it, because they are too big and that market niche is too small.

Likewise, New Belgium could start mass producing a light pilsner- they already make several- and attempt to go after Coors. They'd get slaughtered, because Coors' entire production strategy is built around producing beer in the volumes they do.

Philip Morris will likely not produce connoisseur grade weed, for the same reason Coors doesn't brew Fat Tire. Instead, there will- someday- be an opportunity for another, much smaller company, full of people passionate about their craft, who will fill this niche. I'll bet we Farmers would have a lot more in common with those guys than the 'corporate' label might suggest...

 

[sanvanalona]

It will only take time for the big grows to be very comparable, case in point, in the mid/late nineties B.C. was going off and producing some of the finest indoor cannabis in mass.....seriously saw hash plant, super skunk, williams wonder, northern lights that I would love to have again and it would come big time! So it is possible, I believe, to produce top notch chronic on a big level.

The good thing is, and those that have popped seeds are very well aware of this, to bring new strains to the table it takes time. too much time for a big operation to invest in, so maybe we small guys can produce the next big strain, ala, og, chem, cookies, and keep that for a minute til the big boys run em....just a thought.

 

[caveman4.20]

Sanvan you must be in Cali and I'm assuming Cali dispensary bud is better than Co dispensary bud?

 

[outwest]

You are going to have a very tough time convincing me that with all of their money, neither Coors nor Budweiser could brew a decent microbrew style beer?! Puh-leeze!

These companies have been brewing beer- by any standard, beer of high quality- for generations. First, tastes have evolved and there are more craft beer enthusiasts- not that all the New Belgium drinkers and all the Sam Adams aficionados amount to more than a few percentage points of the market share of ImBev, the Belgian(?!) multinational corporate giant owner of Budweiser.

They have tried mass producing craft beers, and failed. Shock Top? Blue Moon? Laughable by any one with a palate. I'm not saying they can't, but as far as I can tell, they've tried, and failed, and its not because there is no money in it.

outwest

 

[sanvanalona]

Sanvan you must be in Cali and I'm assuming Cali dispensary bud is better than Co dispensary bud?

Not quite sure what you mean by this. I have never had CO dispensary bud, but I am sure there are amazing things out there....isn't there? As far as what is better, cali or co, apples and oranges you know? But yeah I am in Cali at the moment. Nor cal to be exact.

 

[ttystikk]

They have tried mass producing craft beers, and failed. Shock Top? Blue Moon? Laughable by any one with a palate. I'm not saying they can't, but as far as I can tell, they've tried, and failed, and its not because there is no money in it.

outwest

LOL I knew you were going to use those two examples! You're right, they're crap, and they actually prove my point; Coors was trying to make a craft beer, for cheap, using mass production equipment and processes. And they, rightly, got taken to school by those who do it as their core competency. Coors no doubt looked at building is own 'New Belgium' style campus... and realized that they would make more money sticking to what they do best... ceramics, lol.

 

[squiggly]

They have tried mass producing craft beers, and failed. Shock Top? Blue Moon? Laughable by any one with a palate. I'm not saying they can't, but as far as I can tell, they've tried, and failed, and its not because there is no money in it.

outwest

An average 150% growth in sales per year since inception is failure now?

I'm so confused.

I swear you must live in your own private world if that's your conception of things. Just because you don't like something doesn't mean its a failure.

 

[outwest]

An average 150% growth in sales per year since inception is failure now?

I'm so confused.

I swear you must live in your own private world if that's your conception of things. Just because you don't like something doesn't mean its a failure.

Profits don't = quality beer. Just because they brew a beer call it craft and sell it to the same folks buying the cheaper stuff doesn't make it craft beer. The question is whether or not big brewers can create a true connisseur product. Yes they can brew beer at volume cost effectively. Yes they can effectively market it, sell it to the masses, and make a profit, but none of that actually makes it a connisseur product.

Have the big beer producers created a try craft product?

Lastly, squiggs, Let's keep personal attacks out of this, especially when they are unfounded and off base.

outwest

 

[squiggly]

Profits don't = quality beer. Just because they brew a beer call it craft and sell it to the same folks buying the cheaper stuff doesn't make it craft beer. The question is whether or not big brewers can create a true connisseur product. Yes they can brew beer at volume cost effectively. Yes they can effectively market it, sell it to the masses, and make a profit, but none of that actually makes it a connisseur product.

Have the big beer producers created a try craft product?

Lastly, squiggs, Let's keep personal attacks out of this, especially when they are unfounded and off base.

outwest

I made no personal attack. I used a literary device. There is a difference.

In what conception of economy does people buying your beer and continuously buying more and more of it not mean that some of them find it to be a quality product?

Again, you're substituting your personal tastes for the tastes of all people, and that's not how reality works.

In the real world, profits generally do correlate with quality (of perishable goods).

 

[ttystikk]

Profits don't = quality beer. Just because they brew a beer call it craft and sell it to the same folks buying the cheaper stuff doesn't make it craft beer. The question is whether or not big brewers can create a true connisseur product. Yes they can brew beer at volume cost effectively. Yes they can effectively market it, sell it to the masses, and make a profit, but none of that actually makes it a connisseur product.

Have the big beer producers created a try craft product?

Lastly, squiggs, Let's keep personal attacks out of this, especially when they are unfounded and off base.

outwest

Hmmmm. If I'm getting the drift of the conversation right, I'm hearing that us little guys will always be able to create a better product than the factory grows... and the average customer won't care.

 

[outwest]

I made no personal attack. I used a literary device.

In the real world, profits generally do correlate with quality (of perishable goods).

No in the real world profits mean you are generating more income than it cost you to do business. Wal-Mart is extremely profitable, and it has nothing to do with quality.

outwest

 

[ttystikk]

No in the real world profits mean you are generating more income than it cost you to do business. Wal-Mart is extremely profitable, and it has nothing to do with quality.

outwest

Spot on! So where does that leave us, the quality suppliers?

 

[NaturalTherapy]

Hmmmm. If I'm getting the drift of the conversation right, I'm hearing that us little guys will always be able to create a better product than the factory grows... and the average customer won't care.

So long as it fucks them up, then yes I think quality is of little concern to most consumers. If alcohol users are any example anyway... And it comes down to what most folks can afford. Most can only afford mid grade consumer products at any level, why would their drugs be different?

 

[fuzzy]

I try to get my peeps the best meds i know i can grow at a reasonable donation.And, i ask for feedback on how they liked it and what they prefer for their ailments.But by no means do i try to squeeze blood out of a turnip,lol.peace,fuzzy

 

[Shamus]

LOL this is rediculous.. to assume that we are not they is preposterous.. u put 4 dudes with 20-30K watt set ups together... uhm greenhouse.. good genetics and passionate homies and cover all the bases and youll make a ripple trust IDGAF what one says its 100% here say till it really happens and brewing beer is just an OK example, there will
1. ALWAYS BE NOSTALGIC GENETICS UNOBTAINABLE TO WHORES AND BIG BUSINESS.. lets see em get some of these elites.. lol
2. WONT even FUCK WITH SATIVAS.. itll be 55's all day (bred in house) with a few sativa varieties available at best n i feel the more intricate the op the more money u lose running sats.. (and this is considering them being not us.. for some reason.. i dont see how there isnt room for big growers/"co-ops" to stand the fuck up when the time comes and take this industry by the motha fuckin balls.. we control it now and we always will ;) this is one industry we can keep them out of...)
3.and i dont know if many of you are considering the big business/cannabis stigma and the inter pollustion of money between big business.. this wont do that because this sister company's co sponsers executive is a hard core right wing or could potentially hurt a larger revenue from bad rep ect..
WHOLE NEW MEANING TO DRUG STORE on the front of every newpaper this that or another could potentially cause more harm then good..
4.

if you feel differently thats cool.. more power to ya. this is just my opinion

 

[ttystikk]

I try to get my peeps the best meds i know i can grow at a reasonable donation.And, i ask for feedback on how they liked it and what they prefer for their ailments.But by no means do i try to squeeze blood out of a turnip,lol.peace,fuzzy

You're an honest and honorable man, and I mean it from the very bottom of my heart when I tell you that you'd make a lousy corporate hack.

You're welcome!

 

[squiggly]

No in the real world profits mean you are generating more income than it cost you to do business. Wal-Mart is extremely profitable, and it has nothing to do with quality.

outwest

That's a different type of business entirely, you're showing your lack of prowess with economic science here.

Spot on! So where does that leave us, the quality suppliers?

I have to disagree, you've fallen victim to the same oversimplification. All business ventures and revenues are not created equally.