Learning HydroBuddy - Nutrients Needs per Growing Phase?

[ExNavyInSTL]

Excellent words!

I consider myself very lucky that I seemed to have created a non-damaging recipe on the first go-round. There's no doubt it could probably be tweaked for different genetic needs. Right now I am happy to land the arrow somewhere on the target.

Whatever I did has worked wonderfully so far.

As I said earlier, I am not so confident that I don't still bump up with a shot of Cal-Mag here and there.

I am starting to wonder if we do need a lot of extras like Recharge or other organic addictives when growing with clean salts in coco. I am not so sure the plants are taking up what they need any better with such things.

I think I will hold onto my Mr. Fulvic because of the chelation benefits to cover if I get my EDTA wrong. That's my thinking. PLus, I see the benefits of Kelp.

Mono-silicic or another quick-take-up version of silica will stay in my quiver as well.

I'm completing year 2 of growing and seem to have bought way too many things. Although I read on the forums that seems to be a common occurrence with newbies. : )

For now, I am sticking with my recipe but, I may play with bringing down Nitrogen in the future for flower. Mine do have some pretty dark leaves.

Just remember that is taking into consideration what raw numbers the plants like/tolerate. That isnt taking into account PH balance for a nutrient/stock solution or a long term feeding program for a specific medium like coco which can care about K numbers. I think this is where i spent most of my time tweaking. Finished flower do care about Mg & Ca numbers. What a lot of these academics aren't is smokers. Always remember that.

Calcium will always be the bane of stock solutions and/or A/B's. Nitrate is really the only form that plays nice at concentration. Carb and sulfate are usable (even chloride if you wanna fuck with it) but all 3 of those have drawbacks especially sulfate (i laugh at your 1.6-2g per L solubility)

Just make sure you use the right numbers vs the labels

 

[ExNavyInSTL]

I agree with you for sure. And I looked at common discussions where people might say that Mg should be at least half of CA.

However, I didn't push it that high because I bumped up my calcium super high to compensate for my Coco's thieving ways with CA.


Thoughts on Measuring Run-Off:

Another important lesson I have learned is to monitor your run-off, especially in SIP buckets. With SIPS I find it is a good idea not only to test what comes out of the over-flow hole.

But also, randomly take a syringe and draw a sample out bucket's reservoir sometime later. That way you see what the roots are sitting in or drawing the next day before you feed again. Those two numbers can vary a lot. What pours out during feeding is diluted with the perfectly tested stuff going in the top to push out the old.

Last grow I realized I did not have deficiencies or toxicities when I looked at my sad leaves. I was having pH problems, So, I flushed through a bunch of RO water until I got the same EC coming out as normally going in. It is going to rise again, but the tolerance range seems to be pretty high (to a point that I don't where it ends).

I was listening to the Athena Nutrients podcast and I think they said they have no issues with 7 - 8 EC runoff by the end. I could be wrong there, but I remember being shocked by how high the number was. I always thought that perfection was tweaking as you go to keep what comes out close to what goes in. And make your pH adjust incrementally (if needed) as you keep cycling to hit the ideal EC runoff.


As for my K:

My raising of K (If I remember right) wasn't for K's sake. It was more because of the compromise you have to make with using combination salts.

For example, I'm using Potassium Nitrate to help with Nitrogen, because I have to watch the Cal/Nit so I don't push the Nitrogen too high while trying to hit my Calcium needs. I'm using M-K-P for my Phosphorus which in turn moves up the K also.

At some point, you just say F**k it ... I am in the safety range even if it is not what someone says is ideal.

I allowed my K to go to 175 because it is not detrimental to the plant, even if it is not ideal.


Additionally:

I was rereading some comments of mine above I have changed some of my thoughts through all this because of the learning curves that come with experimenting.

Now, even though when I add 19ml of A&B to a gallon I might be nearer 2.1 to 2. I still keep adding RO water until it settles at 1.8. I could probably go even lower. I see people who people who say they never go above 1.5 or so. That's an experiment for a future run.

Plus, for anyone reading this who is thinking about making your own, whatever you do is rarely likely to be the same ever again. We are talking some measurements on the scale to the third digit after the decimal. As you work down your recipe in the mixing order. I promise you will be saying "That's close enough, " by the second batch you make. : )

I'm not growing show plants and because of my marginal COPD, I don't smoke it (I do Vape from time to time). This means taste is not on my list of concerns for myself. But, I certainly see nowadays that taste and terpenes are a serious matter.

Cannabis is a hyper accumulator. Ratios are more important than ppms. Raising Ca and wondering why you feel inclined to bump K. If hydro is as picky as foliar sprays and I imagine it's about the same, there's not a target ppm on earth that makes sense. You can't triple P and expect things to remain the same because it's "in range".

 

[Trash_2002]

I agree with you for sure. And I looked at common discussions where people might say that Mg should be at least half of CA.

However, I didn't push it that high because I bumped up my calcium super high to compensate for my Coco's thieving ways with CA.


Thoughts on Measuring Run-Off:

Another important lesson I have learned is to monitor your run-off, especially in SIP buckets. With SIPS I find it is a good idea not only to test what comes out of the over-flow hole.

But also, randomly take a syringe and draw a sample out bucket's reservoir sometime later. That way you see what the roots are sitting in or drawing the next day before you feed again. Those two numbers can vary a lot. What pours out during feeding is diluted with the perfectly tested stuff going in the top to push out the old.

Last grow I realized I did not have deficiencies or toxicities when I looked at my sad leaves. I was having pH problems, So, I flushed through a bunch of RO water until I got the same EC coming out as normally going in. It is going to rise again, but the tolerance range seems to be pretty high (to a point that I don't where it ends).

I was listening to the Athena Nutrients podcast and I think they said they have no issues with 7 - 8 EC runoff by the end. I could be wrong there, but I remember being shocked by how high the number was. I always thought that perfection was tweaking as you go to keep what comes out close to what goes in. And make your pH adjust incrementally (if needed) as you keep cycling to hit the ideal EC runoff.


As for my K:

My raising of K (If I remember right) wasn't for K's sake. It was more because of the compromise you have to make with using combination salts.

For example, I'm using Potassium Nitrate to help with Nitrogen, because I have to watch the Cal/Nit so I don't push the Nitrogen too high while trying to hit my Calcium needs. I'm using M-K-P for my Phosphorus which in turn moves up the K also.

At some point, you just say F**k it ... I am in the safety range even if it is not what someone says is ideal.

I allowed my K to go to 175 because it is not detrimental to the plant, even if it is not ideal.


Additionally:

I was rereading some comments of mine above I have changed some of my thoughts through all this because of the learning curves that come with experimenting.

Now, even though when I add 19ml of A&B to a gallon I might be nearer 2.1 to 2. I still keep adding RO water until it settles at 1.8. I could probably go even lower. I see people who people who say they never go above 1.5 or so. That's an experiment for a future run.

Plus, for anyone reading this who is thinking about making your own, whatever you do is rarely likely to be the same ever again. We are talking some measurements on the scale to the third digit after the decimal. As you work down your recipe in the mixing order. I promise you will be saying "That's close enough, " by the second batch you make. : )

I'm not growing show plants and because of my marginal COPD, I don't smoke it (I do Vape from time to time). This means taste is not on my list of concerns for myself. But, I certainly see nowadays that taste and terpenes are a serious matter.

Athena is BS, tipical go big or go home mentality, charging gold for the same common salts. 7-8 EC runoff, good for them to make more money that's all marketing BS.

But one thing is clear, media and run off EC will be higher than what we input that's a fact and we just have to accept it. Flushing should just be done in very specific cases imho. In 100% organics soil with periodic amendments NEVER flush for example, just make a good organic mix to begin with.

Runoff PH has little to do with media pH too in my experience. Runoff reading only if it's coco and IF you capture it without any contamination from the trays, still PH gonna be lower than what goes in and lower than the media most of the times since we are leaching away accumulated nitrates and acid salts from the media most of the time.

 

[Chronic Monster]

Cheap alternatives to overpriced hydroponic nutrients

Good Morning :) So I came across a very interesting thread by Sky High this morning talking about why pay more for a cutesy label and after reading some of DesertS posts on nutrient profiles, I got to thinkin. What are large scale nurseries using in their hydroponic applications? I...

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I started that thread, lol... nice to see you still around after all these years brother, hope life is well!