Led lumatek ats pro 310 watt running hot.

[George75]

Hello and happy new year.
This LED Ats Pro 310 watt raises the temperature in the tent, which is 2.5x 2.5 x 6 feet, from 42f until 44.5f so when I have an ambient home temperature of 68f in the tent I have 78 - 80.5f, with 2 plants.
Although I recently made the transition from HPS to LED and I don't know much, 44.5f above seems like a lot for LED although the tent is small for this light, normally a 3x3 tent is needed, but most people say that this LED runs very cool.
The exhaust fan is 148 cfm and I also have a carbon filter at 148 cfm, 3 oscillating fans and a 105 cfm intake fan.
If i take a 3x3 tent with exhaust fan 200 cfm or even bigger 265 cfm will i see a drop in temperatures?
Lumatek has not answered me yet and the store tells me that they are normal values but I have my doubts.
So what do you say?
Thank you very much!

 

[George75]

I forgot to tell you that i'm venting in the same room but i have a small window in the kitchen where tent is very close and that helps bring fresh air in the tent. I also open the windows in the living room very often. I'm growing plants for 4 years with this setup without any significant problems.

 

[Blastfact]

Normal,,, LED lights raise ambient temp in the tent no way around it. Most of the heat is generated by the driver. In the older lighting systems the heat was generated by the bulb and the driver/ballast. And ventilation systems could get very elaborate depending what you were running just to control the light and driver heat. It was common in a tent or built enclosure to have the light in a enclosure and move air over/through the light fixture separate of the grow space. And ventilating the grow space which also cooled the ballast. It was common to have twice if not three times the cfm needed now in our old HSP grow light setups. The heat the old systems put out was horrendous compared to even a cheap POS LED light now.

The cfm numbers your using mean nothing if you have a carbon filter in use. When the manufactures publish the cfm numbers that is without a filter on the unit. If you have a carbon filter on the suction side of the fan then you basically have cut your cfm in half/50%. If your carbon filter is on the discharge side of the fan it's about a 25% drop in cfm. And most people undersize there blowers/fans to begin with. Just the nature of the game. Good Luck!

 

[George75]

Thank you

Normal,,, LED lights raise ambient temp in the tent no way around it. Most of the heat is generated by the driver. In the older lighting systems the heat was generated by the bulb and the driver/ballast. And ventilation systems could get very elaborate depending what you were running just to control the light and driver heat. It was common in a tent or built enclosure to have the light in a enclosure and move air over/through the light fixture separate of the grow space. And ventilating the grow space which also cooled the ballast. It was common to have twice if not three times the cfm needed now in our old HSP grow light setups. The heat the old systems put out was horrendous compared to even a cheap POS LED light now.

The cfm numbers your using mean nothing if you have a carbon filter in use. When the manufactures publish the cfm numbers that is without a filter on the unit. If you have a carbon filter on the suction side of the fan then you basically have cut your cfm in half/50%. If your carbon filter is on the discharge side of the fan it's about a 25% drop in cfm. And most people undersize there blowers/fans to begin with. Just the nature of the game. Good Luck!

Thank you for your answer.
Led light indeed heat the tent a lot and the driver from ats is not detachable unfortunately but i've read from a lot of sources that if you have led light then the temperature must be 84-88f because leds lack infrared, heat radiation and that causes lower temps at leaf surface.
I have the exhaust fan sucking through the carbon filter are you sure about 50% reduction because seems a lot to me.

 

[Blastfact]

Thank you

Thank you for your answer.
Led light indeed heat the tent a lot and the driver from ats is not detachable unfortunately but i've read from a lot of sources that if you have led light then the temperature must be 84-88f because leds lack infrared, heat radiation and that causes lower temps at leaf surface.
I have the exhaust fan sucking through the carbon filter are you sure about 50% reduction because seems a lot to me.

If you reduce what the fan can move on the suction side it doubles your potential loss in discharge volume and pressure. It's a iron law. Fans are nothing but pumps. When you put a restriction on the suction side you put the fan/pump in a vacuum. You want all the unrestricted air the fan can get properly loading the fan and put the filter on the discharge side. When you are balancing pumps/fans you ALWAYS balance on the discharge side. I was a manufacture rep for several pump and blower company's for a couple of decades. Also putting the filter on the discharge side also quiets the fan down without using a seperate muffler which further reduces flow because it adds another pressure drop. If you use a prefilter that's another pressure drop. So when I use a prefilter I ask my wife to sew one end of the filter closed then put it in the filter pull it through the filter flange and cram the filter on the blower. You can set your blower on your desk and test with your hands. Turn the fan on any speed you want and feel the cfm on the discharge side block the discharge side and feel the pressure. Then start blocking with your other hand on the suction side. Your other hand will feel the massive drop in cfm and dead head pressure. There is a old rule in the pump world. Pumps pump they don't suck.... Good Luck!

 

[George75]

If you reduce what the fan can move on the suction side it doubles your potential loss in discharge volume and pressure. It's a iron law. Fans are nothing but pumps. When you put a restriction on the suction side you put the fan/pump in a vacuum. You want all the unrestricted air the fan can get properly loading the fan and put the filter on the discharge side. When you are balancing pumps/fans you ALWAYS balance on the discharge side. I was a manufacture rep for several pump and blower company's for a couple of decades. Also putting the filter on the discharge side also quiets the fan down without using a seperate muffler which further reduces flow because it adds another pressure drop. If you use a prefilter that's another pressure drop. So when I use a prefilter I ask my wife to sew one end of the filter closed then put it in the filter pull it through the filter flange and cram the filter on the blower. You can set your blower on your desk and test with your hands. Turn the fan on any speed you want and feel the cfm on the discharge side block the discharge side and feel the pressure. Then start blocking with your other hand on the suction side. Your other hand will feel the massive drop in cfm and dead head pressure. There is a old rule in the pump world. Pumps pump they don't suck.... Good Luck!

Thank you for the information, you seem to know a lot about the subject.
Can I ask another question? What size exhaust fan do I need for a 3x3 tent with carbon filter? Most say 200 cfm but gorilla grow tent says you can put between 200-300 cfm in a 3x3 tent with 1680D thickness fabric.
I plan to grow 4 autos, if I get a fan with 250 cfm with a speed controller will I be okay?
I plan to grow plants until May where the ambient temperature is 70f, so I will have high temperatures inside the tent and I need a powerful fan, but I'm not sure if the tent can handle it.

 

[Blastfact]

Thank you for the information, you seem to know a lot about the subject.
Can I ask another question? What size exhaust fan do I need for a 3x3 tent with carbon filter? Most say 200 cfm but gorilla grow tent says you can put between 200-300 cfm in a 3x3 tent with 1680D thickness fabric.
I plan to grow 4 autos, if I get a fan with 250 cfm with a speed controller will I be okay?
I plan to grow plants until May where the ambient temperature is 70f, so I will have high temperatures inside the tent and I need a powerful fan, but I'm not sure if the tent can handle it.

I run Gorilla Pro tents with the 1' extension with 6" AC Infinity Fans with carbon filter on the exhaust side of the blower setting on top of the tent roof on my 3 x 3 and 2 x 4. There rated for 402 cfm on high. But mine never run higher than 5 or 6. Always oversized your exhaust fan setup so you can run it at a slower speed and keep the noise down and loaded properly. I want to put in a 4 x 4 tent but that would be pushing on the available room I have. With a 4 x 4 I would run a 8" exhaust fan. Gorilla offers what they call a High CFM Kit. It's four bars that go inside the tent horizontally to help keep the tent walls from sucking in if by chance you crank the exhaust fan up. I use them to mount scrog net.

Currently I have the older AC Infinity 6" blowers with the molex connectors and 67 controllers. Three cheap generic 6" fans inside the tents and a Ink Bird T608 controller running standard Walgreens/Honeywell humidifiers. Everything will be in today for me to upgrade all of that. I will be putting in new 6" AC Infinity blowers with new carbon filters you can replace the carbon in a 69 Pro+ controller, two S6 oscillating fans and the large AC Infinity humidifier. All will be controlled with the 69 Pro+ controller.

 

[George75]

I run Gorilla Pro tents with the 1' extension with 6" AC Infinity Fans with carbon filter on the exhaust side of the blower setting on top of the tent roof on my 3 x 3 and 2 x 4. There rated for 402 cfm on high. But mine never run higher than 5 or 6. Always oversized your exhaust fan setup so you can run it at a slower speed and keep the noise down and loaded properly. I want to put in a 4 x 4 tent but that would be pushing on the available room I have. With a 4 x 4 I would run a 8" exhaust fan. Gorilla offers what they call a High CFM Kit. It's four bars that go inside the tent horizontally to help keep the tent walls from sucking in if by chance you crank the exhaust fan up. I use them to mount scrog net.

Currently I have the older AC Infinity 6" blowers with the molex connectors and 67 controllers. Three cheap generic 6" fans inside the tents and a Ink Bird T608 controller running standard Walgreens/Honeywell humidifiers. Everything will be in today for me to upgrade all of that. I will be putting in new 6" AC Infinity blowers with new carbon filters you can replace the carbon in a 69 Pro+ controller, two S6 oscillating fans and the large AC Infinity humidifier. All will be controlled with the 69 Pro+ controller.

Thank you friend, that was very helpful.

 

[Blastfact]

This is my setup and pics of high cfm bars installed with AC Infinity scrog net. The plants in the pics are test grow plants. They wanted to play games this morning so they went to the trash. Got other things to do.

 

[George75]

This is my setup and pics of high cfm bars installed with AC Infinity scrog net. The plants in the pics are test grow plants. They wanted to play games this morning so they went to the trash. Got other things to do.

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They look very healthy, why did you throw them away? But what can I say...you know better.

 

[George75]

Update, i have had this light for 18 days, the temperature that rises inside the tent is 42-44.5f above the temp of the house but 4 times it raised it by 50f without changing the ambient temp, now i have 86f inside the tent and 68f at home.
The driver is so hot that i cant touch it for more than 30 seconds.
All the professionals say that this is not normal and is due to a broken driver, also people say that this particular light is quite cool, something that contrast with what i see.
My exhaust fan is at 150cfm which is fine, the problem seems to be at the driver.

 

[amneziaHaze]

I have a 300w attis pro and i can touch the driver.its hot but not extreme.and my fan is 200cfm but i keep it at 6 from 10.
Room temperature is 18c and tent is 20 °C

 

[Blastfact]

Update, i have had this light for 18 days, the temperature that rises inside the tent is 42-44.5f above the temp of the house but 4 times it raised it by 50f without changing the ambient temp, now i have 86f inside the tent and 68f at home.
The driver is so hot that i cant touch it for more than 30 seconds.
All the professionals say that this is not normal and is due to a broken driver, also people say that this particular light is quite cool, something that contrast with what i see.
My exhaust fan is at 150cfm which is fine, the problem seems to be at the driver.

What voltage are you running the light at?

 

[George75]

What voltage are you running the light at?

230v. This light runs between 220-240v, at 100% is 230v so this is not a problem.

 

[George75]

I have a 300w attis pro and i can touch the driver.its hot but not extreme.and my fan is 200cfm but i keep it at 6 from 10.
Room temperature is 18c and tent is 20 °C

Thank you, that explains everything, my driver is faulty.

 

[Blastfact]

230v.

Make sure both legs are hot. If only one has power that will make insane amounts of heat...

 

[George75]

Make sure both legs are hot. If only one has power that will make insane amounts of heat...

What do you mean by legs? It's hot at the middle of the driver, edges are cooler.

 

[George75]

I did a test, I took the led out of the tent and turned it on. I used 2 thermometers where I put the sensors, with duct tape, on the driver and both show me a temperature of 108f and that's why I have 86f inside the tent. So, probably, this explains that it's not the size of the tent that's at fault but the driver.
Am I right?
PS. A temperature Gun would be more trustworthy at measuring temps surfaces, but that does not mean that thermometers are far away.

 

[George75]

Lumatek replied to me and they recommend a replacement, thats a relief.
I don't want to do an advertisement but they are very good company and they honor their warranty in contrast to many companies, which, as I read on Amazon, are completely indifferent if a problem comes out.

 

[Blastfact]

Make sure both legs are hot. If only one has power that will make insane amounts of heat...

230v is two legs/poles of 115v. If one leg/pole is dead amps will double as will heat. So make sure your powering the light correctly. Here in the USA our common power is 110/120v-1 phase. Clothes dryers, a/c, welders and stuff like that are 220/240v-1 phase. Emergency and specialty power is 277v. Industrial power starts with 208/230v-460v-3 phase and goes up from there. My HLG lights will run at 120/240-277v depending on the plug/cord cap used. And the power supplied. The drivers are smart sensing.