Led Mag defic dont ya love it?

Loopusmagpie2u · Oct 25, 2021

I know its a discussed topic non stop. Some people argue to death led doesnt cause the need for more mag. I also feel calmag is such a boy who cried wolf scenario. Cal/mag has been screamed so many times nobody would actually believe they had a calcium or magnesium problem if that was indeed the problem. I have ran tests and it is 1000% IMO and IME that Led dialed rooms need a lot of magnesium, strain specific. Here is a peanut butter breath the older growth is showing some deficiencies. I gave 0 magnesium supplement this first week after transplant and turned lights up to 400ppfd. The plant in 2 days had interveinal chlorosis within 5 days it turned necrotic. I then foliared magnesium and root drenched magnesium with my nutrient schedule and viola the new growth is lush and healthy. I should mention my soil slurry is right on point at 6.6ph 500ppm 1 day after a 1800ppm organic bottle feed at 6.4ph. My starting water is 140ppm 7.2ph. I added 7.5ml of mag amped/gallon in each feed these last few days. Hlg 600r 36” from canopy. Ppfd was raised from 300-400 over a weeks time. The older leaves were healthy before the light increase, you can see the middle of the damaged leaves are a nice green with a healthy vein.

Old growth pre mag supplements soon as I increased ppfd:

Few days after supplementing magnesium.

growsince79 · Oct 25, 2021

Agree. And the 3000k seem to be harder on them than 4000k or 5000k. But you can blast absolutely blast them with HPS and they're ok.

Aqua Man · Oct 25, 2021

Along with the high energy-efficiency potential, light-emitting diode (LED) lighting provides the possibility for spectrum control. Our study presents the original data on the influence of LED light spectrum quality on the growth and macro- and micro-nutrient uptake of lettuce (Lactuca sativa L. cv. Frillice) plants cultivated in indoor conditions and without daylight. Four LED light spectral combinations were investigated using conventional high-pressure sodium (HPS) lighting as a control. In general, the LED light spectra were more favourable than the HPS light spectrum for promoting the growth and nutrient uptake of plants. In particular, the light spectrum provided by the combination of the far-red, deep-red and blue LEDs had the highest growth and nutrient uptake indices. This spectral combination particularly enhanced the uptake of potassium, calcium and magnesium in comparison to control plants grown under conventional HPS lamps. The uptake of iron and zinc were significantly influenced by the spectral changes of the red and blue light.

Aqua Man · Oct 25, 2021

It absolutely does.

esther917 · Oct 25, 2021

Aqua Man said:
It absolutely does.

Does what?

Aqua Man · Oct 25, 2021

esther917 said:
Does what?

Increase demand for calcium, magnesium, potassium, zink and iron

Aqua Man · Oct 25, 2021

Loopusmagpie2u said:
I know its a discussed topic non stop. Some people argue to death led doesnt cause the need for more mag. I also feel calmag is such a boy who cried wolf scenario. Cal/mag has been screamed so many times nobody would actually believe they had a calcium or magnesium problem if that was indeed the problem. I have ran tests and it is 1000% IMO and IME that Led dialed rooms need a lot of magnesium, strain specific. Here is a peanut butter breath the older growth is showing some deficiencies. I gave 0 magnesium supplement this first week after transplant and turned lights up to 400ppfd. The plant in 2 days had interveinal chlorosis within 5 days it turned necrotic. I then foliared magnesium and root drenched magnesium with my nutrient schedule and viola the new growth is lush and healthy. I should mention my soil slurry is right on point at 6.6ph 500ppm 1 day after a 1800ppm organic bottle feed at 6.4ph. My starting water is 140ppm 7.2ph. I added 7.5ml of mag amped/gallon in each feed these last few days. Hlg 600r 36” from canopy. Ppfd was raised from 300-400 over a weeks time. The older leaves were healthy before the light increase, you can see the middle of the damaged leaves are a nice green with a healthy vein.

Old growth pre mag supplements soon as I increased ppfd:
View attachment 1181906 View attachment 1181907 View attachment 1181911

Few days after supplementing magnesium.
View attachment 1181908 View attachment 1181909 View attachment 1181910

Sorry should have quoted the OP. I am 100% in agreement with you. And spectral effects are in large part why in addition to intensity.

They also playba huge rode on the type of type of growth produced and therfore the overall structure of the plant.

In terms of growth rates intensity will trump spectrum to a point but once you close to maxing the absorption of a spectrum (because plants have different photorecptors and they produce different compounds and hormones that tell the plant what to do) then spectrum is important to maximizing further.

Eg green light which is usually lacking in HID compared to LED penetrates the most actually going through the leaves. So while blue and red are most efficient they are absorbed or reflected in much greater amounts than green.

Why does this matter because if you have a decent ratio of green in the spectrum it means the leaves under the canopy will now be photosynthesizing and contributing to photosynthesis and increasing the over photosynthesis of the plant.

Like nutrients (Although not as well known or understood yet) ratios of spectrum has a huge influence and is the key to increasing quality and quantity further than we are now.

Aqua Man · Oct 25, 2021

An interesting study here.

An Overview of LEDs’ Effects on the Production of Bioactive Compounds and Crop Quality

Light-emitting diodes (LEDs) are characterized by their narrow-spectrum, non-thermal photon emission, greater longevity, and energy-saving characteristics, which are better than traditional light sources. LEDs thus hold the potential to revolutionize ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

And a good read on spectral effects here.

Frontiers | An Update on Plant Photobiology and Implications for Cannabis Production

This review presents recent developments in plant photobiology and lighting systems for horticultural crops, as well as potential applications for cannabis (...

www.frontiersin.org

Madmax · Oct 25, 2021

I even get mag def the first 2-3 weeks of veg under t5ho then at beginning of flower but once treated i dont get it again my nutes do have a small amount of cal/mag in them. My rooms not dialed in but its close...i agree also its strain specific as i didnt get it in flower this grow as ive been giving it once a week seems to keep it in check..

Your fat finger mr magoo syndromes playing up again Aqua...im frocked without my glasses .

PipeCarver · Oct 25, 2021

Aqua Man said:
An interesting study here.

An Overview of LEDs’ Effects on the Production of Bioactive Compounds and Crop Quality

Light-emitting diodes (LEDs) are characterized by their narrow-spectrum, non-thermal photon emission, greater longevity, and energy-saving characteristics, which are better than traditional light sources. LEDs thus hold the potential to revolutionize ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

And a good read on spectral effects here.

Frontiers | An Update on Plant Photobiology and Implications for Cannabis Production

This review presents recent developments in plant photobiology and lighting systems for horticultural crops, as well as potential applications for cannabis (...

www.frontiersin.org

So does all this mean that even with well water ( I've never used cal/mag ) should I supplement my grow under an sf1000 with it. I have a bottle of the stuff, I bought when I thought it was needed but you saw my 120ppm well water chemical analysis 2 years ago and said it wasn't necessary under my t5's or my hps.

I just turned a girl 2 days ago, under the sf1000 would adding cal/mag be beneficial at this point?...I'm expecting a larger light this week (SE3000) then I'll replace the sf1000 with this new light to finish flowering.

mysticepipedon · Oct 25, 2021

PipeCarver said:
So does all this mean that even with well water ( I've never used cal/mag ) should I supplement my grow under an sf1000 with it. I have a bottle of the stuff, I bought when I thought it was needed but you saw my 120ppm well water chemical analysis 2 years ago and said it wasn't necessary under my t5's or my hps.

I just turned a girl 2 days ago, under the sf1000 would adding cal/mag be beneficial at this point?...I'm expecting a larger light this week (SE3000) then I'll replace the sf1000 with this new light to finish flowering.

I don't know what your well water has in it, regarding Mg. I would consider adding a little cal/mag to one plant and see how it does compared to the others. But the Mg, N and K thing has kicked my butt, trying to figure out if I could fortify a soil enough to remain organic (I decided to go pseudo-organic — organic with regular feedings of organic supplements).

BTW, alfalfa meal seems to have some Mg, but I didn't put enough of it in the soil to satisfy the plants.

MilkyTrichomes · Oct 25, 2021

mysticepipedon said:
I don't know what your well water has in it, regarding Mg. I would consider adding a little cal/mag to one plant and see how it does compared to the others. But the Mg, N and K thing has kicked my butt, trying to figure out if I could fortify a soil enough to remain organic (I decided to go pseudo-organic — organic with regular feedings of organic supplements).

BTW, alfalfa meal seems to have some Mg, but I didn't put enough of it in the soil to satisfy the plants.

How much alfalfa did you use and how much more would have been better? I’ve got a few pellets in the soil of a 5 gal fabric pot and would rather use that (top dress) than cal/mag if it works. The liquid is a known quantity but the pellets break down on their own schedule.

PipeCarver · Oct 25, 2021

mysticepipedon said:
I don't know what your well water has in it, regarding Mg. I would consider adding a little cal/mag to one plant and see how it does compared to the others. But the Mg, N and K thing has kicked my butt, trying to figure out if I could fortify a soil enough to remain organic (I decided to go pseudo-organic — organic with regular feedings of organic supplements).

BTW, alfalfa meal seems to have some Mg, but I didn't put enough of it in the soil to satisfy the plants.

I only have the one plant under led lighting. I was offered this light from Spider Farmer and I'm just learning growing with these lights. So far its doing fine but I was wondering if a cal/mag supplement would be beneficial or detrimental under normal circumstances with led lights.

The water test is a 20 year old analysis we had done after our drilled well was installed. I'm assuming the water is still the same getting another done now is an added expense I don't need. All we're concerned with now is the Coliform count when Checking for bacteria in the water.

Moshmen · Oct 25, 2021

PipeCarver said:
So does all this mean that even with well water ( I've never used cal/mag ) should I supplement my grow under an sf1000 with it. I have a bottle of the stuff, I bought when I thought it was needed but you saw my 120ppm well water chemical analysis 2 years ago and said it wasn't necessary under my t5's or my hps.

I just turned a girl 2 days ago, under the sf1000 would adding cal/mag be beneficial at this point?...I'm expecting a larger light this week (SE3000) then I'll replace the sf1000 with this new light to finish flowering.

I add about 1/2 gram of epsom to every water both flower and veg and I’ve had very limited calmag problems since! I mix tap water (400 ppm) and purified water down to 200 ppm then add my nutes - just my experience

mysticepipedon · Oct 25, 2021

MilkyTrichomes said:
How much alfalfa did you use and how much more would have been better? I’ve got a few pellets in the soil of a 5 gal fabric pot and would rather use that (top dress) than cal/mag if it works. The liquid is a known quantity but the pellets break down on their own schedule.

That's right. I have no idea what the alfalfa meal's schedule is on breaking down and releasing it's goodies.

I put in 1 tablespoon/gallon of soil mix (15 ml/3.8L). I put that in on top of a 6-4-5 fert from Fox Farms, so I didn't want to over-do it. But I didn't near over-do it.

Alfalfa meal is 2.5-0.5-2.5, so I cut the dosage of the Fox Farms by half. I could have doubled the amount of alfalfa meal, I'm sure.

Pellets will work differently than the loose stuff. More surface area means quicker bio and chemical reactions for the loose stuff.

Aqua Man · Oct 25, 2021

PipeCarver said:
So does all this mean that even with well water ( I've never used cal/mag ) should I supplement my grow under an sf1000 with it. I have a bottle of the stuff, I bought when I thought it was needed but you saw my 120ppm well water chemical analysis 2 years ago and said it wasn't necessary under my t5's or my hps.

I just turned a girl 2 days ago, under the sf1000 would adding cal/mag be beneficial at this point?...I'm expecting a larger light this week (SE3000) then I'll replace the sf1000 with this new light to finish flowering.

I mean it depends on your base nutrients and ratios. If you don't see a deficiency then you don't need to adjust.

I use mega crop and I add 1 gram per gal of Epson salt because I need it

PipeCarver · Oct 25, 2021

Aqua Man said:
I mean it depends on your base nutrients and ratios. If you don't see a deficiency then you don't need to adjust.

I use mega crop and I add 1 gram per gal of Epson salt because I need it

Ya thanks, I just see all this talk on cal/mag and it seems to be go to cure all for whats ailing plants. I do get spots, turned leaves, and other minimal concerns. Some leaves don't look right on every grow most look just fine I just shrug it off to me fking up some how or I've done some abuse to them somewhere along the way....I do have one sad looking girl lol poor thing I don't think even cal / mag would have helped her...Not sure what I did but she's looking pretty rough with tiny little buds at 6+ weeks..

Aqua Man · Oct 25, 2021

PipeCarver said:
Ya thanks, I just see all this talk on cal/mag and it seems to be go to cure all for whats ailing plants. I do get spots, turned leaves, and other minimal concerns. Some leaves don't look right on every grow most look just fine I just shrug it off to me fking up some how or I've done some abuse to them somewhere along the way....I do have one sad looking girl lol poor thing I don't think even cal / mag would have helped her...Not sure what I did but she's looking pretty rough with tiny little buds at 6+ weeks..

Most of the time it's mag... calcium is usually fine. Most water sources have adequate cal and lack in mag as often I found in fertilizer also. I haven’t ever needed more calcium but almost always needed additional mag.

Ppl usually say just add cal mag when infact its usually the extra N, mag or iron that's needed.

Moshmen · Oct 25, 2021

Aqua Man said:
Most of the time it's mag... calcium is usually fine. Most water sources have adequate cal and lack in mag as often I found in fertilizer also. I haven’t ever needed more calcium but almost always needed additional mag.

Ppl usually say just add cal mag when infact its usually the extra N, mag or iron that's needed.

Bought a gallon jug of calmag 2 years ago for my soil grow , used it and fucked 2/3 grows stopped using it and it’s been sitting for 2 years prolly should pitch it ! Lol along with GH nutes ,
For my grow in promix calmag is def EVIL

PipeCarver · Oct 25, 2021

Moshmen said:
Bought a gallon jug of calmag 2 years ago for my soil grow , used it and fucked 2/3 grows stopped using it and it’s been sitting for 2 years prolly should pitch it ! Lol along with GH nutes ,
For my grow in promix calmag is def EVIl

Yas I also use the GH nutes. in promix or other peat mixes. I just bought a quart a couple of years ago I thought I should have it....Why.?..Who the fk knows...lol thought I might need it some day I guess....Its just when I see anything wrong I think Cal/mag the wonder juice? maybe I'm missing something not using it... I think as Aqua man says mag and not the calcium might be more beneficial to my grow....I should start using 1tsp or 5ml /gal Epsom salts on every watering

Led Mag defic dont ya love it?

Led Mag defic dont ya love it?

Loopusmagpie2u

growsince79

Aqua Man

Aqua Man

esther917

Aqua Man

Aqua Man

Aqua Man

An Overview of LEDs’ Effects on the Production of Bioactive Compounds and Crop Quality

Frontiers | An Update on Plant Photobiology and Implications for Cannabis Production

Madmax

PipeCarver

An Overview of LEDs’ Effects on the Production of Bioactive Compounds and Crop Quality

Frontiers | An Update on Plant Photobiology and Implications for Cannabis Production

mysticepipedon

MilkyTrichomes

PipeCarver

Moshmen

mysticepipedon

Aqua Man

PipeCarver

Aqua Man

Moshmen

PipeCarver

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