Low input daily coco feeding Idea (Reservoir) - Feedback?

bunkerking · Dec 1, 2019

also Only 2% Cal in my bottle.

So my combo might just = high calmag requirements?

Another thing. Im running microbes. Always breaking down and exposing new spots.
I do agree its an insane amount, but if i give it less. Problems show up fast.

Also im planning on running mk ultra for awhile. Only that one. Oregon - can only have 4 plants. Im more just trying to get the plant to grow right.
https://www.amazon.com/Bloom-City-Professional-Cal-Mag-Supplement/dp/B073ZNQWCM

bunkerking · Dec 1, 2019

Also i dont mind switching nutes next round. I was about to give up on growing, and this was my "last attempt" to see if we could get growth. Just to be 100% honest on why im here. Thats good to hear that general coco nutes will/should work with my strains. Makes me worry less about redialing in another nute program.

illmatik · Dec 2, 2019

Give the advanced nutrients coco line a try. I guarantee you won't look back. It seems like they've done all the legwork with getting coco dialed in, you just need to mix in their nutes and call it a day.

bunkerking · Dec 2, 2019

illmatik said:
Give the advanced nutrients coco line a try. I guarantee you won't look back. It seems like they've done all the legwork with getting coco dialed in, you just need to mix in their nutes and call it a day.

Yah. I didnt want to get a RO system but.... getting tired of hand feeding lol.

@Aqua Man - I was wrong. PH drifted .1 every 4-6 hours.

Vondank420 · Dec 2, 2019

Hope you dont mind if I point a couple things out.
First off 5ml/gal of FFGB is ample. More than that and your wasting it.
As you mentioned the coco your using must have not be properly buffered if your having to add that much Cal/Mag
5mg/gal is more than ample even for coco.
Coco is close to ph neutral 5.2 to 6.8
Coco that is triple washed or even more still has an ec of .2 to .5 more washing will have little effect to lower the ec more as CES are filled with cations NaCl+ , Potassium +
Cations- Calcium++ and Magnesium++ have double positive charges and replace /exchange NaCl and Potassium
Thus why cal/mag is used to buffer coco.
(Cheaper brands sometimes use calcium nitrate)
Next run I would either recommend buffering your own or purchase quality brand...
You should never have to be feeding coco at more than 5ml/gal.
One last thing about PH.
***And just to be clear I'm not saying to run your feeds outside of the optimal ph range*** but your coco ph just like any mediums ph will be the major driver of keeping your ph in check not so much nutrient feeds.
It's the molarity of an acid/base of liq vs the acid/base of semi-solid medium.
An so slight ph drifts above and below optimal will be corrected by the medium. In this case your coco...

bunkerking · Dec 2, 2019

Vondank420 said:
Hope you dont mind if I point a couple things out.
First off 5ml/gal of FFGB is ample. More than that and your wasting it.
As you mentioned the coco your using must have not be properly buffered if your having to add that much Cal/Mag
5mg/gal is more than ample even for coco.
Coco is close to ph neutral 5.2 to 6.8
Coco that is triple washed or even more still has an ec of .2 to .5 more washing will have little effect to lower the ec more as CES are filled with cations NaCl+ , Potassium +
Cations- Calcium++ and Magnesium++ have double positive charges and replace /exchange NaCl and Potassium
Thus why cal/mag is used to buffer coco.
(Cheaper brands sometimes use calcium nitrate)
Next run I would either recommend buffering your own or purchase quality brand...
You should never have to be feeding coco at more than 5ml/gal.
One last thing about PH.
***And just to be clear I'm not saying to run your feeds outside of the optimal ph range*** but your coco ph just like any mediums ph will be the major driver of keeping your ph in check not so much nutrient feeds.
It's the molarity of an acid/base of liq vs the acid/base of semi-solid medium.
An so slight ph drifts above and below optimal will be corrected by the medium. In this case your coco...

fair enough. I am about 5-8 days out from switching to 12/12.

Should i just drop the Calmag down abit (tiger bloom has some) and finish out this harvest? Get some better nutes and coco for when i transplant the clones.

Or Swap to a coco 2 part like Canna AB, AV Sensi , Cocotek for flower?

Enforcer · Dec 2, 2019

bunkerking said:
Crazy how much cal & mag it wants.
8ml Calmag = Clawing & yellowing.
8ml of GB = just slightly too much, PK toxicity.

Now that i got it more dialed in for nutes.
Id like to bump up the feedings/reduce some more work.

@Aqua Man : Cant i just check the PH of the Res once/twice a day and make tiny adjustments if needed?

Thinking about a drip line at some point. Not today but thinking about it.

There are several nutrient brands that are better suited to high fertigation coco growing than FoxFarms. Remo, Blue Planet, Canna, veg+bloom, and GH just to name a few.

I run Remo nutes in a 28gal res. Bloom lasts about a week, veg a little longer. They are ran on timers and pump the solution to a ring of four 2gph drippers in each pot. I check the pH once a day and only adjust it if it’s outside 6.0 - 6.5. When I refill the res I use a solution of H2O2 in a spray bottle to sterilize everything and wipe it down before refilling. This also help maintain a stable pH. If you start to get microbial growth it will drop the pH rather quickly. I have left my grow for 4 days before and everything kept on just fine. I just made sure the res was clean and full before I left. This is one of my favorite aspects to this style of growing.

cemchris · Dec 2, 2019

bunkerking said:
no Cal in GB. Green label. Not hydro.

Def get the Hydro. Reg GB has a ton of NH4 (ammonia nitrate) in it. Not sure if it's mixed like that directly for their soil lines. In something like coco you don't want to run high levels of NH4. N03:NH4 is like 10:1 at a min. Soil has lots of microbes that eat NH4 over time and break it down into N03 (plant available N). NH4 isnt plant available. Also NH4 will mess with medium PH big time. Most likely why your plants yellowed when you increased it and then got better when you backed off of it and up'd the calmg (N03 in calmg). You can almost run GB Hydro start to finish with a little booster from something else. I explained it in a thread a while back. Just can't find it atm.

cemchris · Dec 2, 2019

How the Ammonium-nitrate ratio affects your plants | CANNA Gardening USA

It’s a well-known fact that plants need sufficient nutrients to grow and that

www.cannagardening.com

Vondank420 · Dec 2, 2019

Vondank420 said:
Hope you dont mind if I point a couple things out.
First off 5ml/gal of FFGB is ample. More than that and your wasting it.
As you mentioned the coco your using must have not be properly buffered if your having to add that much Cal/Mag
5mg/gal is more than ample even for coco.
Coco is close to ph neutral 5.2 to 6.8
Coco that is triple washed or even more still has an ec of .2 to .5 more washing will have little effect to lower the ec more as CES are filled with cations NaCl+ , Potassium +
Cations- Calcium++ and Magnesium++ have double positive charges and replace /exchange NaCl and Potassium
Thus why cal/mag is used to buffer coco.
(Cheaper brands sometimes use calcium nitrate)
Next run I would either recommend buffering your own or purchase quality brand...
You should never have to be feeding coco at more than 5ml/gal.
One last thing about PH.
***And just to be clear I'm not saying to run your feeds outside of the optimal ph range*** but your coco ph just like any mediums ph will be the major driver of keeping your ph in check not so much nutrient feeds.
It's the molarity of an acid/base of liq vs the acid/base of semi-solid medium.
An so slight ph drifts above and below optimal will be corrected by the medium. In this case your coco...

No more than 5ml Cal/Mag

bunkerking said:
fair enough. I am about 5-8 days out from switching to 12/12.

Should i just drop the Calmag down abit (tiger bloom has some) and finish out this harvest? Get some better nutes and coco for when i transplant the clones.

Or Swap to a coco 2 part like Canna AB, AV Sensi , Cocotek for flower?

Drop cal/mag to at least 5ml/gal as well as GB.
You dont have to spend a bunch on nutes unless you want to try another brand.
It's really more important what's in them at what concentrations.
I love GB and with Cal/Mag , it's been my staple veg base for years at 5ml/gal both GB and Cal/Mag w RO. ( if you use tap back down cal/mag in relation to cal charge of tap water)

Other nutes I like for coco-- megacrop,
Canna, Jack's 321, H&G
But again it's more important balanced ratios that brands...
Make your own coco...
I'm not saying it's the best but if were not making our own we buy Canna Coco. It's almost as good as mine. JK. LOL

bunkerking · Dec 2, 2019

"However, ammonium in the roots has to be converted into organic N-compounds first. This process is fueled by carbohydrates and thus occurs at the expense of other plant life processes"

Interesting. ok hmmm....

I am willing to try 5ml GB + 5ML of Bloomcity 2% Calmag.

But I bet a dollar i'm gonna get clawing/mag def. I was at 8ml when that happened.

5ml calmag/GB in a better coco? Yah i could see that.
5ml calmag with FFTB in current setup. Could see that as well.

bunkerking · Dec 2, 2019

11ml calmag was the lowest i saw without issues. I can def drop it down there. See how things look.

Vondank420 · Dec 2, 2019

bunkerking said:
"However, ammonium in the roots has to be converted into organic N-compounds first. This process is fueled by carbohydrates and thus occurs at the expense of other plant life processes"

Interesting. ok hmmm....

I am willing to try 5ml GB + 5ML of Bloomcity 2% Calmag.

But I bet a dollar i'm gonna get clawing/mag def. I was at 8ml when that happened.

5ml calmag/GB in a better coco? Yah i could see that.
5ml calmag with FFTB in current setup. Could see that as well.

You could be right but noone knows how much buffering has happened so...
Drop the GB to 5ml/gal and drop the cal/mag to 10ml/gal then keep backing it down with each water/feed until you get to 5ml/gal.
My experience is FFTB is just ok. Could be great for others but our testing was just ok at best...

bunkerking · Dec 2, 2019

Vondank420 said:
You could be right but noone knows how much buffering has happened so...
Drop the GB to 5ml/gal and drop the cal/mag to 10ml/gal then keep backing it down with each water/feed until you get to 5ml/gal.
My experience is FFTB is just ok. Could be great for others but our testing was just ok at best...

*nods* That i can do. Will try that.

Aqua Man · Dec 2, 2019

cemchris said:
Def get the Hydro. Reg GB has a ton of NH4 (ammonia nitrate) in it. Not sure if it's mixed like that directly for their soil lines. In something like coco you don't want to run high levels of NH4. N03:NH4 is like 10:1 at a min. Soil has lots of microbes that eat NH4 over time and break it down into N03 (plant available N). NH4 isnt plant available. Also NH4 will mess with medium PH big time. Most likely why your plants yellowed when you increased it and then got better when you backed off of it and up'd the calmg (N03 in calmg). You can almost run GB Hydro start to finish with a little booster from something else. I explained it in a thread a while back. Just can't find it atm.

In my RDWC system I get around this using denitrifying bacteria. Same as my aquariums and super easy to test. I'm one of the very few that i know of to take advantage of this but I'm not sure it would work in coco being DTW. I avoid adding much ammonia/ammonium but mega crop does have some and those bacteria provide good benefits to root health also.

bunkerking · Dec 2, 2019

Any suggestions for* bloom feed?

I dont have anything yet and need to buy something.

and ok - I flushed with 10ml Calmag / 5ml GB.
Will try dropping it 1-2ml every res change. (about every 3-4 days)

Vondank420 · Dec 2, 2019

bunkerking said:
Any suggestions for* bloom feed?

I dont have anything yet and need to buy something.

and ok - I flushed with 10ml Calmag / 5ml GB.
Will try dropping it 1-2ml every res change. (about every 3-4 days)

I'm probley the wrong guy to talk to about bloom boosters.
I'm super simple --- Rock Phos at transplant befor flip to flower then I do a PK 13/14 for week 5 to 6(no other nutes during P/K week.
Some of the other growers can recommend bloom products if you want to try...

Aqua Man · Dec 2, 2019

Just my opinion. Stick to veg nutes. Depending on growth rates, how healthy the plant is, and base nutes a small increase in K may help but not needed. I did use a small pk boost in flower weeks 3-5ish but I will not be doing that anymore. My first time doing it I added to much and ended up with Phos tox I then cut it to tiny amounts but feel its not beneficial as my base nutes already contain a fair bit of K and I feel P is something we overfeed.

bunkerking · Dec 2, 2019

Aqua Man said:
Just my opinion. Stick to veg nutes. Depending on growth rates, how healthy the plant is, and base nutes a small increase in K may help but not needed. I did use a small pk boost in flower weeks 3-5ish but I will not be doing that anymore. My first time doing it I added to much and ended up with Phos tox I then cut it to tiny amounts but feel its not beneficial as my base nutes already contain a fair bit of K and I feel P is something we overfeed.

Really? Run 6-4-4 the entire cycle? I wont be using pk boosters.
I'm just assuming i need Bloom nutes?

Vondank420 · Dec 2, 2019

bunkerking said:
Really? Run 6-4-4 the entire cycle? I wont be using pk boosters.
I'm just assuming i need Bloom nutes?

Your 8-4-4 with Cal/Mag

Low input daily coco feeding Idea (Reservoir) - Feedback?

Low input daily coco feeding Idea (Reservoir) - Feedback?

bunkerking

bunkerking

illmatik

bunkerking

Vondank420

bunkerking

Enforcer

cemchris

cemchris

How the Ammonium-nitrate ratio affects your plants | CANNA Gardening USA

Vondank420

bunkerking

bunkerking

Vondank420

bunkerking

Aqua Man

bunkerking

Vondank420

Aqua Man

bunkerking

Vondank420

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