Requesting Guidance on this breeding journey

[GimpDaddy]

Greetings Gardeners!
On my last trip home to Hawaii, a friend gifted me his prized genetics, and gave me his blessing to breed with them.
I would really like to preserve these genetics, and I am excited about this new breeding project.
I have learned so much, just reading through the threads in this forum, but I still have dozens of questions. This is what i

The Gift
The Gift is a Pure Indica Pakistani Landrace, that was originally brought to Hawaii in the 1960’s. The genetics were kept in clone form and held by a single (Hawaiian Syndicate) family exclusively for over 30 years. It is supposed to produce small, rock-hard nugs.
FLOWER TIME IS 35-40 days.

 

[GimpDaddy]

I was given these genetics in seed and clone form.
my buddy gave me the clones, the day we left. I had a bad feeling about trying to fly with a bunch of unrooted cutting in my luggage, so I dropped of my cuttings with a trusted friend, and flew home with my seeds (Tangie x The Gift)[f1]

following my hunch was the right decision, because we missed our flight AND TSA searched my bags. Fortunately my seeds were NOT confiscated.
My trusted friend was able to get a few of the clones to root successfully, and has promised to send clones to me via clone shipper, in the near future.

 

[revfunk]

35-40 days?!?!?

 

[GimpDaddy]

All 3 (Tangie x The Gift) germinated and produced males - which are currently segregated in my grow tent.

I am planning on breeding for that specific trait: 35-40day flowering time.

I’m somewhat familiar with the basic ideas behind selfing, cubing, hybridization, etc. but they are all still a bit confusing to me.
Breeding hybridization for example:

(A x B) x (C x D)

but also

(A x B) x (B x C) to introduce traits from plant A.

I am in a unique position to do both here

 

[GimpDaddy]

Yes. It’s why it was such a closely guarded secret, for so long.

that is the trait that I’m going to try to pass on/isolate.
But I don’t know whether it was Dominant or Recessive

 

[GimpDaddy]

35-40 days?!?!?

Yes. That’s the trait I’m trying to pass on

 

[MIMedGrower]

Yes. That’s the trait I’m trying to pass on

I was using a breeder with a ton of experience and connections that said his new strain was truly 7 weeks.

Unfortunately that is only his opinion as every seed of the strain took 9.5 to be truly done in my room.

And after growing hundreds of different plants i can say the same about every strain by every breeder i have tried.

7 weeks is usually still 50/50 white and dark pistils. For our needs of complex and truly potent mix of canabanoids with full head and body effects plants need more time.

And there are so many complaints from early cut weed i never read someone complaining about waiting too long. ;-)

 

[revfunk]

I was using a breeder with a ton of experience and connections that said his new strain was truly 7 weeks.

Unfortunately that is only his opinion as every seed of the strain took 9.5 to be truly done in my room.

And after growing hundreds of different plants i can say the same about every strain by every breeder i have tried.

7 weeks is usually still 50/50 white and dark pistils. For our needs of complex and truly potent mix of canabanoids with full head and body effects plants need more time.

And there are so many complaints from early cut weed i never read someone complaining about waiting too long. ;-)

^^^^^

 

[GimpDaddy]

I was using a breeder with a ton of experience and connections that said his new strain was truly 7 weeks.

Unfortunately that is only his opinion as every seed of the strain took 9.5 to be truly done in my room.

And after growing hundreds of different plants i can say the same about every strain by every breeder i have tried.

7 weeks is usually still 50/50 white and dark pistils. For our needs of complex and truly potent mix of canabanoids with full head and body effects plants need more time.

And there are so many complaints from early cut weed i never read someone complaining about waiting too long. ;-)

your wisdom and input are MUCH appreciated.
I’m absolutely guilty of being an impatient grower, and the most common piece of advice my mentors give me around harvest time is “wait another week”

I have never seen the finished product, myself. Only the cuttings and seed that I was given (along with a gift basket of other select Hawaiian genetics).

I see what you’re saying about the benefits of allowing the Cannabinoids to reach their full-maturity, but I would argue that there is usually an exception to the rule. A close friend of mine intentionally grows Landrace sativas that are 14-16week finishers, and cuts them at 12weeks because the racy High is what helps him to best manage his PTSD and anxiety.

 

[GimpDaddy]

I was using a breeder with a ton of experience and connections that said his new strain was truly 7 weeks.

Unfortunately that is only his opinion as every seed of the strain took 9.5 to be truly done in my room.

And after growing hundreds of different plants i can say the same about every strain by every breeder i have tried.

7 weeks is usually still 50/50 white and dark pistils. For our needs of complex and truly potent mix of canabanoids with full head and body effects plants need more time.

And there are so many complaints from early cut weed i never read someone complaining about waiting too long. ;-)

Of course, it is entirely possible that the whole 35-40 day finishing time was environmentally triggered. Supposedly it was kept in clone form since the 1960’s; and even I can verify that Hawaii’s climate & light cycle trigger most strains to flower immediately, once put outdoors.

 

[revfunk]

your wisdom and input are MUCH appreciated.
I’m absolutely guilty of being an impatient grower, and the most common piece of advice my mentors give me around harvest time is “wait another week”

I have never seen the finished product, myself. Only the cuttings and seed that I was given (along with a gift basket of other select Hawaiian genetics).

I see what you’re saying about the benefits of allowing the Cannabinoids to reach their full-maturity, but I would argue that there is usually an exception to the rule. A close friend of mine intentionally grows Landrace sativas that are 14-16week finishers, and cuts them at 12weeks because the racy High is what helps him to best manage his PTSD and anxiety.

That's true, exceptions exist but are rare. For example, Oldsog went through many original SSH beans a few decades ago and found one Haze pheno that finishes in 7 weeks but retains the typical sativa effects. We still have that beauty and she is quite exceptional. Here's an old pic of her about 6ish weeks into flower.

Cheers

 

[MIMedGrower]

That's true, exceptions exist but are rare. For example, Oldsog went through many original SSH beans a few decades ago and found one Haze pheno that finishes in 7 weeks but retains the typical sativa effects. We still have that beauty and she is quite exceptional. Here's an old pic of her about 6ish weeks into flower.

Cheers

Sure looks pretty done.

 

[revfunk]

Sure looks pretty done.

Yup. It still blows my mind lol

 

[GimpDaddy]

My Question is this:

if I have 3 f1 Males that are (The Gift x Tangie)

and 3 females that are (Kosher x Tangie)

should I collect the Pollen from all three males, and breed them in pairs with the 3females?
Or
Collect pollen from all 3 males, mix the pollen, and pollinate all females with mixed pollin (then pheno hunt for the desired trait throughout subsequent generations)

Or
Save the Pollen from the most vigorous (The Gift x Tangie) male, and pollinate all subsequent generations with pollin from original f1 male?

 

[GimpDaddy]

Going to continue with this breeding project, under the guidance of my mentors. Keeping my fingers crossed that my original cut of The Gift will be returned to me shortly.
Observations:
I can see slight differences in the three males. One of them has leaf structure that is more non-uniform, this male also appears to be maturing a bit faster (balls are forming already)
Another male, is a bit more vigorous, with heavy stacking in the nodes. Really responds well to stacking and training.
All three males seem to be light feeders, barely sipping at the moisture in the soil.

the Molokai Frost was starting to droop, was fed, and quickly recovered.

 

[GimpDaddy]

Checked the tent today, and OMG I GOT A FEMALE!!!!
There’s definitely going to be an f2 crossing of (Tangie x The Gift)

 

[GimpDaddy]

 

[GimpDaddy]

More news from the tent:

my only Molokai Frost, is a late-showing female!!
I couldn’t be more excited about working with these genetics.

We are digging a hole for her right now.
Let the games begin

 

[dire wolf]

Hey gimp , i feel like you need to start with the clone that you were gifted , next time , make a sandwich , stack it up with lettuce and mixed greens , put all kinds of crap on it stick a few clones in the salad mix ,,wrap it up put it in a baggie with a bag of chips and a pickle ..... no one will see it
Im not kidding

 

[revfunk]

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Beautiful!!!!!