Root aphids, phylloxera, root mealy bugs, or bulb mites???

F.Dupp · Jul 20, 2021

So I have been battling these little bastard bugs for far too long. It seems that they are unkillable, and no matter how long I shut down for, they just keep coming back. Im not even sure wtf they are. I thought they were micro RA, but Im beginning to have doubts after reading a few threads here by other growers who seem to have the same pest. They have survived being nuked with Merit 75, Kontos, Spinosad, and PyGanic. After hitting the plants with Kontos (with a small amount of Dawn dish soap mixed in) my plants are looking like shit. While the bugs are definitely damaging the plants, I am dealing out equal damage to the plants by trying to kill the bugs. This has me at my wits end. I have tried to get pics and video of them, but they are so small that its difficult to get the camera to focus. It almost appears that these things have tails like a mealy bug, or they are bulb mites that walk backwards??? My plants exhibit classic RA damage- Dying lower leaves, phantom deficiencies, root rot, loss of vigor and yield. I have also seen small black winged bugs which I believe were RA flyers. If it were not for the bug being white and crawling on a black net pot, I would never know I have them, as they are so small that you really have to look to see them.

mysticepipedon · Jul 20, 2021

What's the state of your grow? If early, you might want to restart.

There is a fungus that is supposed to be effective against root aphids, but I've never used it. It's in a product called Botanigard. Also check out what Arbico Organics might have available.

F.Dupp · Jul 20, 2021

Bro, I'm not even sure they are root aphids. I have used botaniguard in the past against them to no avail. I do have some Bioceres and Azaguard on it's way. I think Bioceres is a slightly different variation of the fungus at botanigard contains.

I run a perpetual system, and I currently have plants in three stages of flowering, plants in veg, and plants in the cloner. Shutting down and starting over isn't really an option. Besides, I have done that before and started up 6 months later only to see the infestation reoccur.

royfree2grow · Jul 20, 2021

Looks like Phylloxera to me, or another sap sucking root pest. No F way they survived merit 75, that is 75% imidacloprid- one of the nastiest systemic chemicals. How did you apply it?

F.Dupp · Jul 20, 2021

royfree2grow said:
Looks like Phylloxera to me, or another sap sucking root pest. No F way they survived merit 75, that is 75% imidacloprid- one of the nastiest systemic chemicals. How did you apply it?

I run a recirculating low pressure aeroponic system. I have a 30 gallon reservoir, to which I added three teaspoons of Merit 75. I let that run through the system for 3 days, before I drained the reservoir and added fresh water and nutrient solution.

This isn't the first time I have attacked these things with Merit 75. Both times the bugs appeared to be completely unaffected.

F.Dupp · Jul 20, 2021

The active ingredient of Kontos is Spirotetremat. According to some Canadian study that I read, spirotetramat is supposed to be the most effective control for phylloxera. I dosed my plants with Kontos at 1ml/gal last friday. It beat the s*** out of my plants, but doesn't appear to have affected the bug in any way.

royfree2grow · Jul 20, 2021

F.Dupp said:
I run a recirculating low pressure aeroponic system. I have a 30 gallon reservoir, to which I added three teaspoons of Merit 75. I let that run through the system for 3 days, before I drained the reservoir and added fresh water and nutrient solution.

This isn't the first time I have attacked these things with Merit 75. Both times the bugs appeared to be completely unaffected.

3 teaspoons (about 15ml) is way too low for 30 gal rez and running a systemic substance in a hydro system for three days is useless imo. Just to be clear, I dont advice using imidacloprid at all and i'd never use it on my product (i'd rather throw it). But my bet is if you used a higher dosage they'd be gone.

F.Dupp · Jul 20, 2021

royfree2grow said:
3 teaspoons (about 15ml) is way too low for 30 gal rez and running a systemic substance in a hydro system for three days is useless imo. Just to be clear, I dont advice using imidacloprid at all and i'd never use it on my product (i'd rather throw it). But my bet is if you used a higher dosage they'd be gone.

1 tsp per 10 gallons is the manufacturers recommended dosage. And if running it through my system is useless, how would you recommend that I apply it?

And I do not enjoy using imid. I do so out of desperation.

F.Dupp · Jul 20, 2021

I am open to any and all suggestions. As of yet, I have not found anyone who can positively identify this bug, much less tell me how to treat it.

royfree2grow · Jul 20, 2021

F.Dupp said:
1 tsp per 10 gallons is the manufacturers recommended dosage. And if running it through my system is useless, how would you recommend that I apply it?

And I do not enjoy using imid. I do so out of desperation.

I know man, im just giving it how it is cause i know this chemical and i dont want to sugar coat it, if you choose to use it anyway, its your decision.

Recommended dosage is too low for 20 years, pests got stronger an pest regulation and labeling dont always catch up. 3 tsp for 30 gal thats about 0.13ml/liter and thats too low my friend. I dont know your options and your setup but Id up it to 0.5ml/l trying it on a tester first. Very important to test first cause i burned an entire nft grow tent ounce for playing to much with that stuff.

F.Dupp · Jul 20, 2021

royfree2grow said:
I know man, im just giving it how it is cause i know this chemical and i dont want to sugar coat it, if you choose to use it anyway, its your decision.

Recommended dosage is too low for 20 years, pests got stronger an pest regulation and labeling dont always catch up. 3 tsp for 30 gal thats about 0.13ml/liter and thats too low my friend. I dont know your options and your setup but Id up it to 0.5ml/l trying it on a tester first. Very important to test first cause i burned an entire nft grow tent ounce for playing to much with that stuff.

I am willing to lose a crop in order to eradicate these demonic creatures. I will even jar it up and smoke it myself. I smoked two packs of Marlboro reds per day for 30 years. So I'm sure I have smoked much worse things than imid.

The imid application seemed to do nothing to harm my plants. The Kontos, on the other hand, has left them on the brink of death. I have had my lights dimmed for the last 2 days, as they seem to be showing signs of extreme phototoxicity since I applied the Kontos. And the Kontos recommended application is a soil drench, and I used the recommended dosage. So who knows?

F.Dupp · Jul 21, 2021

I have contacted the Director of IPM at a large CA cannabis facility. I will be sending her some bug samples so that she can scope them, give me a positive ID, and provide a plan to control them.

I will report the findings here in order to try to help anyone else dealing with mystery bugs.

Vintaw · Jul 23, 2021

Hey there fellow farmer I've also had some run-ins with quite the crappy bugs lately. however I used a fogger with azamax then Bush doctor force of nature a day later and I seem to be getting the bugs under control. I also have soil though I do not use a hydroponic set but the fogger I think that might be what's honestly doing the trick is breaking it down into microns so that the pests absorb it... I feel your pain I'm sorry I couldn't be more help I'll keep my fingers crossed

F.Dupp · Jul 23, 2021

Vintaw said:
Hey there fellow farmer I've also had some run-ins with quite the crappy bugs lately. however I used a fogger with azamax then Bush doctor force of nature a day later and I seem to be getting the bugs under control. I also have soil though I do not use a hydroponic set but the fogger I think that might be what's honestly doing the trick is breaking it down into microns so that the pests absorb it... I feel your pain I'm sorry I couldn't be more help I'll keep my fingers crossed

I also have a fogger, but that only seems to work on the critters above ground, unfortunately. Today I transplanted plants from veg to flower, and they all got dunked in Bioceres. So hopefully that will kill a few of them in a brutal manner. I also added Azaguard to one of my flower units. If it does some good, I will add it to the remaining units. My poor girls are still trying to recover from the Kontos mistake that has zero effect on the bugs but almost killed my plants.

Flexnerb · Jul 23, 2021

F.Dupp said:
I also have a fogger, but that only seems to work on the critters above ground, unfortunately. Today I transplanted plants from veg to flower, and they all got dunked in Bioceres. So hopefully that will kill a few of them in a brutal manner. I also added Azaguard to one of my flower units. If it does some good, I will add it to the remaining units. My poor girls are still trying to recover from the Kontos mistake that has zero effect on the bugs but almost killed my plants.

Can you post clear pictures instead of a video?

F.Dupp · Jul 24, 2021

Flexnerb said:
Can you post clear pictures instead of a video?

No, man. They're too small. These are magnified 15x

RealizedReal000 · Jul 24, 2021

How are you doing these photos and videos? We can’t see anything. Can you please try using something else? Maybe a jewelers loupe up to a phone or something.

ComfortablyNumb · Jul 24, 2021

Ladybugs. Toss in a couple of hundred, in two days, nothing but plants and fat ladybugs.

Flexnerb · Jul 24, 2021

A good guess would be some sort of bulb mite. If hey're A. Robini you might want to just pack them up for the garbage and sterilize your area..lmfao! Im not playing either. You can waste all the time you want if its rhem you are fucked if the merit didnt kill them. You might just have borgs on your hands

F.Dupp · Jul 24, 2021

RealizedReal000 said:
How are you doing these photos and videos? We can’t see anything. Can you please try using something else? Maybe a jewelers loupe up to a phone or something.

I downloaded a magnifying app for my phone. I am sending them off to the entomologist to get them identified. I will report the findings.

Root aphids, phylloxera, root mealy bugs, or bulb mites???

Root aphids, phylloxera, root mealy bugs, or bulb mites???

F.Dupp

mysticepipedon

F.Dupp

royfree2grow

F.Dupp

F.Dupp

royfree2grow

F.Dupp

F.Dupp

royfree2grow

F.Dupp

F.Dupp

Vintaw

F.Dupp

Flexnerb

F.Dupp

RealizedReal000

ComfortablyNumb

Flexnerb

F.Dupp

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