Should I follow the feeding guide for the brand of soil I'm using?

[CarpeDiamonds]

well you have to start at the beginning and you should see the soil ppm come down over time. But it goes up too as elements become available.

i wasnt following from the beginning so i dont really know what happened. And again i dont know about that soil you got.

good luck. We all go through this learning curve.

Thanks mate, appreciate your input.

 

[Aqua Man]

Sorry bro been really busy lately and not on much. Missed the tags so always good to send a msg as I get like 100 notifications a day so if not on much I miss a lot.

I read through some here but wanna start at the beginning and look at everything related.

@Kampbe1l has some good info and few others here. Personally I think we need to go through and look at all the conditions.

From what I gather these are salt based nutrients correct?

They do not have nutrients added correct?

Room temps and RH?

SOIL temps? Very important.

Light and distance? (If you can provide a lux value)

Watering practices?
(How much? how do you determine when to water? what is the temp of the water you are feeding?)

Age of plants?

Ppm of source water?

Anything added to the soil?

Let's start there.

IMO let's not chase a diagnosis and ghosts all over. To many variables here So lets look at every aspect and provide a good overall environment. When you do this you would be surprised how many things it can fix or prevent. Gonna take a bit to go over but you don't always need to know whats wrong to fix it.

 

[CarpeDiamonds]

Sorry bro been really busy lately and not on much. Missed the tags so always good to send a msg as I get like 100 notifications a day so if not on much I miss a lot.

I read through some here but wanna start at the beginning and look at everything related.

@Kampbe1l has some good info and few others here. Personally I think we need to go through and look at all the conditions.

From what I gather these are salt based nutrients correct?

They do not have nutrients added correct?

Room temps and RH?

SOIL temps? Very important.

Light and distance? (If you can provide a lux value)

Watering practices?
(How much? how do you determine when to water? what is the temp of the water you are feeding?)

Age of plants?

Ppm of source water?

Anything added to the soil?

Let's start there.

IMO let's not chase a diagnosis and ghosts all over. To many variables here So lets look at every aspect and provide a good overall environment. When you do this you would be surprised how many things it can fix or prevent. Gonna take a bit to go over but you don't always need to know whats wrong to fix it.

Alright I'll try to provide as much info as possible.
Not exactly sure on the nature of the nutrients besides the fact that they're designed for this soil. I think some of the elements are in chelates. I can post the ingredients on the back if you like.
I've only feed two of the plants of the cohort Terra veg which is a veg solution and that was only recently. J1 and J2 I fed once 5 days ago using a spray bottle till the top soil was moist. J1 I fed again 2 days ago till runoff and then tested the ppm. The rest I've just been watering with my tap water and occasionally Rhizotonic which is for root development. I check to see if the soils dry using a wooden kebab skewer. If it comes out dry I water. Before I transplanted them I used to spray water with a spray bottle till the soil was moist and never got any runoff. I stopped doing that after I transplanted which was recently. The ppm of the tap water is 100ppm and the pH is like 7.3 -7.8. I also have a water report for my area. Alkalinity says 46.2 - 56.4 mg Calcium carbonate per L TDS is 138 - 164 mg/L. Let me know if there's any other info from the report you want to know.
The temperature of the grow space ranges from 20-25C and the humidity ranges from 60-75%. Sometimes I've seen it go higher or lower but its usually stays in the middle. Soil temps I've occasionally checked with a probe its like 25 C. LED distance from the bottom is 57cm, but since the plants have grown and I changed the pots maybe a bit shorter now. The LED panel runs at 60W. The par values on the instructions it lists is 165 micromole/meter squared/second at 0.46m.
The oldest plant (No.2) is 27 days plants J1 and J2 22 days and K1 and K2 18 days.
To J1 and J2 I scratched about 5.8 grams of dolomite lime (14% calcium carbonate and 8% magnesium carbonate) onto the surface of the soil and watered. To K1 and No.2 I premixed 11 grams of the dolomite lime into the soil before transplant. That was to raise the pH after a suggestion that the symptoms were caused by pH fluctuations.
As for the temp of the water I feed them with, room temp I guess, unless I run out of water and grab more water from the tap in which case I'm not sure, possibly slightly below room temp?
If you need anymore info I've probably written it down somewhere as I like to log everything down.

 

[Aqua Man]

Yeah sounds like a watering issue. Remember the signs your seeing are likely from a week or so ago and they won't get better so at this point only look to new growth.

I would try feeding 1/4 strength nutes with good runoff and then let dry well.

Fedd feed water

And lower the RH 55-60 lights on and even lower at night if possible. Immobile nutrients generally follow the water flow through the plant and lowering the RH a bit will increase the flow and uptake from the soil. You RH is a bit to high for this IMO.

Your tap is fine and I would not add anything else to that soil. It may create an issue.

The ppm going up and ph going down is likely from the nutrients and plant respiration. Time you take the ph can affect this also.

ALWAYS water in the forst few hrs of lights on and get good runoff. Equally important let them dry enough between watering.

Then ignore all previous growth... it will get worse. Look to new growth only. It will take around a week to see changes so just stick to concentrating on these things and don't go chasing a solution.

 

[CarpeDiamonds]

Yeah sounds like a watering issue. Remember the signs your seeing are likely from a week or so ago and they won't get better so at this point only look to new growth.

I would try feeding 1/4 strength nutes with good runoff and then let dry well.

Fedd feed water

And lower the RH 55-60 lights on and even lower at night if possible. Immobile nutrients generally follow the water flow through the plant and lowering the RH a bit will increase the flow and uptake from the soil. You RH is a bit to high for this IMO.

Your tap is fine and I would not add anything else to that soil. It may create an issue.

The ppm going up and ph going down is likely from the nutrients and plant respiration. Time you take the ph can affect this also.

ALWAYS water in the forst few hrs of lights on and get good runoff. Equally important let them dry enough between watering.

Then ignore all previous growth... it will get worse. Look to new growth only. It will take around a week to see changes so just stick to concentrating on these things and don't go chasing a solution.

Thank you for the thorough response I really needed that. I forgot to mention that at the moment my lights are on 24/7 for veg. Is this bad or could be effecting anything?
Also the symptoms have been progressing up the plant. They haven't stayed at a particular leaf level but slowly moved to higher leaves in some cases.
Should I invest in a dehumidifier? Might be a bit tricky getting it to fit. Or maybe in future change to a stronger fan for the space.

 

[Greenjourneyman]

Controlling rH can be a real pain. Dehumidifier at least in the same space as your tent is a must. Doesn’t always need to be inside the tent.

 

[Aqua Man]

Thank you for the thorough response I really needed that. I forgot to mention that at the moment my lights are on 24/7 for veg. Is this bad or could be effecting anything?
Also the symptoms have been progressing up the plant. They haven't stayed at a particular leaf level but slowly moved to higher leaves in some cases.
Should I invest in a dehumidifier? Might be a bit tricky getting it to fit. Or maybe in future change to a stronger fan for the space.

Oh yeah what lights are you using? This could definitely be an issue. Depending on intensity you ideally want 18/6 or atleast some dark period

 

[CarpeDiamonds]

Controlling rH can be a real pain. Dehumidifier at least in the same space as your tent is a must. Doesn’t always need to be inside the tent.

What about those cupboard dehumidifying packs. You know those ones that work with crystals that absorb water, would something like that work if I place it in my space?

 

[CarpeDiamonds]

Oh yeah what lights are you using? This could definitely be an issue. Depending on intensity you ideally want 18/6 or atleast some dark period

The light is a cheap LED grow light I bought off ebay. Never really expected much from it. It said it was suitable to replace a 300W HID. It runs at 60W.
Brightness ratio (red:Blue) 8:1 - 9:1
100 diodes in total
84Pcs Red 620-630nm
10 pcs Blue 460-470nm
2Pcs White 6000-6500K
2 Pcs UV 390-400nm
2 Pcs IR 725-735nm
There's a par chart on the instructions but its a bit hard to read.
79": 12μmol/m^2s
59": 21μmol/m^2s
36": 52μmol/m^2s
18": 165μmol/m^2s

It recommends:
Seedling stage: 16-18hrs on 36-59 Inch
Veg Stage: 12-16hrs on 18-36 Inch
Flowering Stage: 10-12hrs on 12-18 inches

 

[CarpeDiamonds]

Something like this do the job for now? It contains calcium chloride.

 

[CarpeDiamonds]

Current distance from the tallest plants J1 and J2 is 26cm (10inches). Distance from the shorter plants K1 and No.2 is 36cm (14.17Inches)
Current temp and humidity 25C 66%
Should probably raise the light aye?

 

[Greenjourneyman]

Only raise the light if you get the inverted heat curl. With an 84w draw from the wall you are lucky if the light pushes 160 onto your plants.
the cheap bruple leds are not to be entirely trusted. I’ve suspended them inches over mature plants with no ill affect.

 

[CarpeDiamonds]

Only raise the light if you get the inverted heat curl. With an 84w draw from the wall you are lucky if the light pushes 160 onto your plants.
the cheap bruple leds are not to be entirely trusted. I’ve suspended them inches over mature plants with no ill affect.

Alright cool. I just don't want it to get too close because I read you need to bring the lights closer in flowering as they're going to demand more light. Is that correct?

 

[Aqua Man]

What about those cupboard dehumidifying packs. You know those ones that work with crystals that absorb water, would something like that work if I place it in my space?

Not effective enough.

 

[Aqua Man]

The light is a cheap LED grow light I bought off ebay. Never really expected much from it. It said it was suitable to replace a 300W HID. It runs at 60W.
Brightness ratio (red:Blue) 8:1 - 9:1
100 diodes in total
84Pcs Red 620-630nm
10 pcs Blue 460-470nm
2Pcs White 6000-6500K
2 Pcs UV 390-400nm
2 Pcs IR 725-735nm
There's a par chart on the instructions but its a bit hard to read.
79": 12μmol/m^2s
59": 21μmol/m^2s
36": 52μmol/m^2s
18": 165μmol/m^2s

It recommends:
Seedling stage: 16-18hrs on 36-59 Inch
Veg Stage: 12-16hrs on 18-36 Inch
Flowering Stage: 10-12hrs on 12-18 inches

Yeah stay at 18/6veg and probably gonna be to little in flower. Better suited for autos since you can leave em 18/6 or 24 hr.

 

[CarpeDiamonds]

Yeah stay at 18/6veg and probably gonna be to little in flower. Better suited for autos since you can leave em 18/6 or 24 hr.

Just out of curiosity, what's the advantage of going 18/6 for my situation? I thought 24/0 would veg them a lot faster. Also should I set the 6 hours off for at night so that when I eventually switch to 12/12 there's no light leaks?

 

[Aqua Man]

Just out of curiosity, what's the advantage of going 18/6 for my situation? I thought 24/0 would veg them a lot faster. Also should I set the 6 hours off for at night so that when I eventually switch to 12/12 there's no light leaks?

Well light intensity is part of it but the plant carries out different processes during photosynthesis than it does during the calvin cycle. If you have a higher intensity plants can end up switching partially or fully to photorespiratuon as they reach closer to the light saturation point. The dark period allows the plant to reset in a sense to put it simply. Then when the light come back on it ready to blast off again

If you want a better understanding look into DLI ( daily light integral ) plants can only use so much light over a period of time before photosynthetic rates decline and photorespiration starts severely reducing growth and creating issues. It has to do how the plant fixes carbon and if you increase the Co2 concentration it will increase the the time before this occurs.

Anyhow I referenced so I dont have to type it all out because there is quite a bit to it and its Important to understand how and why a certain light cycle would benefit you most.

 

[Aqua Man]

Under low intensity light 24/0 the plant can keep up but under mid to high light it cannot so the calvin cycle is needed.

This is why we can blast em with 65k lux or around 900-1000ppfd during flower under 12/12 but if you did that under 24/0 you will fry em

 

[CarpeDiamonds]

Under low intensity light 24/0 the plant can keep up but under mid to high light it cannot so the calvin cycle is needed.

This is why we can blast em with 65k lux or around 900-1000ppfd during flower under 12/12 but if you did that under 24/0 you will fry em

Thanks for explaining that, I'll definitely do some more reading. So do you consider my light medium intensity then? I thought it was quite a weak light. Also my temp and humidity at the moment is 27C and 63%. Is 27 alright as long as the humidity is lowered? Entering deeper into aussie summer. weathers been fluctuating lately between cold rainy days and hot spells.

 

[Aqua Man]

Thanks for explaining that, I'll definitely do some more reading. So do you consider my light medium intensity then? I thought it was quite a weak light. Also my temp and humidity at the moment is 27C and 63%. Is 27 alright as long as the humidity is lowered? Entering deeper into aussie summer. weathers been fluctuating lately between cold rainy days and hot spells.

27 is about ideal and so is 50-65% humidity aboit 60% but your good.

Light is a bit weak i always like a dark period... during the calvin cycle plants move sugars and starches to the roots this attracts and feeds beneficial microbes. Not as important if using synthetic nutes but still imo beneficial. Try 20/4. I wouldn't worry too much over it but in 12/12 you will want much higher intensity. To make up for the lack of photoperiod.

Honestly 18/6 20/4 not gonna make or break ya man.