Survey: Is Infrared Diode A Must on Light?

ViparSpectra · Dec 1, 2022

Hello THC growers, ViparSpectra would like to take a quick easy survey with you, which will take only 30 seconds.

Q: Based on your experience, do you think infrared diodes, usually 730nm are necessary to include on LED grow light?

What's your answer? And why? Thank you.

rangabud · Dec 1, 2022

Yet to find out as my new light doesn't have any IR, was a little concern for me but the light has good reviews so I'm trying it. Se7000

Zill · Dec 2, 2022

Viper,

Plants reflect all infrared radiation. The only benefit you might be able to rightfully claim is that your bulbs emitting infrared will help maintain temperature in a tent.

Zill.

Observationist · Dec 2, 2022

Zill said:
Viper,

Plants reflect all infrared radiation. The only benefit you might be able to rightfully claim is that your bulbs emitting infrared will help maintain temperature in a tent.

Zill.

Whaaaa

ViparSpectra · Dec 2, 2022

rangabud said:
Yet to find out as my new light doesn't have any IR, was a little concern for me but the light has good reviews so I'm trying it. Se7000

@rangabud Like @Zill said if the light bulbs emitting infrared(Our led light which is no IR, but light bulbs emitting infrared), do you still concerns with it?

Zill · Dec 2, 2022

No concerns. But, Zero benefit for the plant.

Moe.Red · Dec 2, 2022

regardless of what was said above, 730nm is Far Red and does have impact on the plants. You can get additional photosynthesis via the Emerson effect. You can change plant morphology as far red signals to the plant it is in shade. You can potentially have a higher DLI in flower using Far Red to put the plants to sleep faster.

When people hear iR they think light outside the par spectrum which is just heat. But 730nm is in the par range, just not the classic 400-700.

If I had far red built in to my primary light I would want separate control over that channel both intensity and on off time and be at least 60W in a 4x4 space or I would just use external lights anyhow. So make it useable or don’t add it. If it comes on with the main light and no other control is provided I see this as a big negative and would prevent me from buying the light.

Zill · Dec 2, 2022

Infar red is not part of the photosynthetic action spectrum. It does nothing but get reflected.

Moe.Red · Dec 2, 2022

Zill said:
Infar red is not part of the photosynthetic action spectrum. It does nothing but get reflected.

730nm is far red. You are flat wrong.

linuxr · Dec 2, 2022

https://youtu.be/sS7aAcacfgk

Moe.Red · Dec 2, 2022

My view of this thread is not a debate over 730nm light impact on plants (we know it does) but as a manufacturer doing market research to find out what end users want.

I’m pleased someone is asking!

I stand by my statement about real world use ability in post 7 above. I have done significant testing with far red and even have an apogee par/ far red meter with a switch to go between classic par range and far red range.

What I see in most lights out there is they add a few token 730nm diodes just to say they have them. But in real life they are useless and I would rather have no far red.

You need to be able to set a different photoperiod than the main light and there needs to be sufficient power to have an impact in the given coverage space for the light. Very few manufacturers build to this requirement. So it’s just marketing to put them in the light, not customer use ability.

Madmax · Dec 2, 2022

Will this cause more stretch moe through lights on..the reason I ask is that I ran far red pucks x2. 6watt ea after lights out for 15 mins or so .trying to speed up bud onset..it did speed them up 4 day-5days quicker but I was getting 2’ stretch from 1’ without..I had to stop using them as I was losing canopy to light room..

Moe.Red · Dec 2, 2022

Madmax said:
Will this cause more stretch moe through lights on..the reason I ask is that I ran far red pucks x2. 6watt ea after lights out for 15 mins or so .trying to speed up bud onset..it did speed them up 4 day-5days quicker but I was getting 2’ stretch from 1’ without..I had to stop using them as I was losing canopy to light room..

Hey Max,

Check out this for some easily understandable explanations

How Does the Far Red Light Spectrum Affect Plants? - California LightWorks

Learn more about this less-talked about end of the light spectrum can impact your crop.

californialightworks.com

The ratio of red to far red is important. You would have to look at what 12W FR vs X watts of Red (whatever you were doing with your fixture) was signaling to the plant. Also it means different things at different stages of plant growth.

In general, Far Red will produce a phytochrome response that signals to the plant it is in shade and to stretch to get to direct sunlight. I think that is what you were describing.

None of this has anything to do with the Emerson Effect, which is yet another use for Far Red. This gets into quantum physics and how a single photon can be in 2 places at once, and how two wavelengths together (red and far red) increase the quantum yield of photosynthesis. It's totally wild, and has been well understood for a long time, being first discovered in 1957. If you like quantum physics which can be pretty mind melting, I'd read up on it.

BigBlonde · Dec 2, 2022

ViparSpectra said:
Hello THC growers, ViparSpectra would like to take a quick easy survey with you, which will take only 30 seconds.

Q: Based on your experience, do you think infrared diodes, usually 730nm are necessary to include on LED grow light?

What's your answer? And why? Thank you.

Necessary? Apparently not, because successful crops happen without them.

Beneficial? Perhaps, but I have to leave that to the experts. It makes intuitive sense to control them separately from the main lights or selling them separately. I wouldn't replace the perfectly good XS2000 lights I already have to buy an upgrade with 730nm LEDs.

MIGrampaUSA · Dec 2, 2022

Moe.Red said:
regardless of what was said above, 730nm is Far Red and does have impact on the plants. You can get additional photosynthesis via the Emerson effect. You can change plant morphology as far red signals to the plant it is in shade. You can potentially have a higher DLI in flower using Far Red to put the plants to sleep faster.

When people hear iR they think light outside the par spectrum which is just heat. But 730nm is in the par range, just not the classic 400-700.

If I had far red built in to my primary light I would want separate control over that channel both intensity and on off time and be at least 60W in a 4x4 space or I would just use external lights anyhow. So make it useable or don’t add it. If it comes on with the main light and no other control is provided I see this as a big negative and would prevent me from buying the light.

I have far red in the Grower's Choice bloom bars. It's actually a mix of 730nm, 660nm, and then there's the 310nm. It's my opinion after having run the bloom bars for a while, you're better off running them on a second channel or timer. Emerson effect has a dramatic influence on flowering. In my case, I've turned off the 310nm on the bloom bars. I'm running the reds which I can control through my light controller (and then running UVB reptile lights on a separate timer). Another idea is something like this on its own timer:

BUD BOOSTER - UV, 660nm or 730nm or 660/730nm "Emerson effect" LED Sun

This is for 1 30mm x 400mm BUD BOOSTER Sun Board with the option of 30mm Double sided Thermal conductive adhesive tape pre-applied CLICK HERE FOR THE STRIPS WITH HEATSINKS WE NOW HAVE FOUR DIFFERENT BUD BOOSTER STRIPS: STRIP 1 HAS: 48 - 660NM DEEP RED LEDs STRIP 2 HAS: 48 - 730NM FAR RED LEDs...

growdaddyleds.com

Anthem · Dec 2, 2022

Zill said:
Viper,

Plants reflect all infrared radiation. The only benefit you might be able to rightfully claim is that your bulbs emitting infrared will help maintain temperature in a tent.

Zill.

Man you sure put your foot in your mouth a. lot

MIGrampaUSA · Dec 2, 2022

Anthem said:
Man you sure put your foot in your mouth a. lot

@ViparSpectra to the point here ... Yes, it's my opinion that 660/730 is good but should be able to be controlled/timed separately. If your company were to add this feature to the lights, your lights will sell. Everyone offers lights with these color temps. Only a handful of companies are offering lights where the grower has total control of when these reds are on.

Moe.Red · Dec 2, 2022

MIGrampaUSA said:
@ViparSpectra to the point here ... Yes, it's my opinion that 660/730 is good but should be able to be controlled/timed separately. If your company were to add this feature to the lights, your lights will sell. Everyone offers lights with these color temps. Only a handful of companies are offering lights where the grower has total control of when these reds are on.

My thoughts exactly.

Or an option to bolt on a bar or 2 with its own driver.

Fwiw I run raging kush 2 to get this kind of functionality and it don’t come cheap.

steamroller · Dec 2, 2022

Moe.Red said:
My thoughts exactly.

Or an option to bolt on a bar or 2 with its own driver.

Like these ;

Mars Hydro UR45 LED Grow Light For UV & IR Supplement

www.mars-hydro.com

ninjadip · Dec 2, 2022

ViparSpectra said:
Hello THC growers, ViparSpectra would like to take a quick easy survey with you, which will take only 30 seconds.

Q: Based on your experience, do you think infrared diodes, usually 730nm are necessary to include on LED grow light?

What's your answer? And why? Thank you.

Yes it is important. I believe in Bruce bigbee work about it

Survey: Is Infrared Diode A Must on Light?

Survey: Is Infrared Diode A Must on Light?

ViparSpectra

rangabud

Zill

Observationist

ViparSpectra

Zill

Moe.Red

Zill

Moe.Red

linuxr

Moe.Red

Madmax

Moe.Red

How Does the Far Red Light Spectrum Affect Plants? - California LightWorks

BigBlonde

MIGrampaUSA

BUD BOOSTER - UV, 660nm or 730nm or 660/730nm "Emerson effect" LED Sun

Anthem

MIGrampaUSA

Moe.Red

steamroller

Mars Hydro UR45 LED Grow Light For UV & IR Supplement

ninjadip

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