Tea Recipe

Capulator · Feb 22, 2013

organicozarks said:
Buy a microscope. Much cheaper in the long run. Unless you are getting your tea tested within 4-5 hours or brewing it then the test is not accurate. The microbes die off in 6-8 hours. I have scoped tea that was only 4 hours old, and the microbial life diminished by almost half. So tell me how I am suppose to over night a sample, and get an accurate result? Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure this one out.

Below is a tea that was brewed at 64 degrees for 24 hours. It did not pass the test. With a temp that low I would have to extend the brew time by another 12 or more hours, and also add more food. By the looks of it the average person would think that it was an acceptable tea.

View attachment 291923

Here's one with no compost or fungus food. just spores and molasses 24 hours.

Capulator · Feb 22, 2013

organicozarks said:
Buy a microscope. Much cheaper in the long run. Unless you are getting your tea tested within 4-5 hours or brewing it then the test is not accurate. The microbes die off in 6-8 hours. I have scoped tea that was only 4 hours old, and the microbial life diminished by almost half. So tell me how I am suppose to over night a sample, and get an accurate result? Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure this one out.

Below is a tea that was brewed at 64 degrees for 24 hours. It did not pass the test. With a temp that low I would have to extend the brew time by another 12 or more hours, and also add more food. By the looks of it the average person would think that it was an acceptable tea.

View attachment 291923

Do you know what species specifically are in your teas or are you just going for aerobic microbes?

Obviously you know your shit, so thanks for stopping in here to drop some knowledge!

organicozarks · Feb 22, 2013

Just going for aerobic teas. Takes a lot of money to have the equipment to separate each different strain of bacteria and identify them. My pockets ain't that deep. :)

We Solidarity · Feb 22, 2013

i don't use a microscope - i just wait until the cultures get big. I always figured more robust cultures = stronger tea, but I really need to start scoping it to make sure i'm not having some kind of single - species takeover.

these are my signs of a finished tea, all with biowar packs.

big - ass culture, and you can see all the little bits of stuff floating around

through the bottom of a cup:

and the side of my bag of EWC - i usually call tea done when the bag is "hairy" like this:

Capulator · Feb 22, 2013

organicozarks said:
Just going for aerobic teas. Takes a lot of money to have the equipment to separate each different strain of bacteria and identify them. My pockets ain't that deep. :)

I think you would appreciate the addition of these packs to your tea. Especially the root/foliar.

squiggly · Feb 22, 2013

organicozarks said:
Buy a microscope. Much cheaper in the long run. Unless you are getting your tea tested within 4-5 hours or brewing it then the test is not accurate. The microbes die off in 6-8 hours. I have scoped tea that was only 4 hours old, and the microbial life diminished by almost half. So tell me how I am suppose to over night a sample, and get an accurate result? Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure this one out.

You are correct. It takes a biochemist.

Quantification of a sample doesn't always require live organisms. There are more ways than one to give you accurate estimates/counts. If it was me I'd simply do a Biorad protein assay and get a pretty good idea from that how much protein was in the sample and thus around how many organisms there were.

There are way more advanced methods than this that I'm sure I haven't even been clued into (as I'm no biochemist).

I mean think of it this way, they aren't going through and individually counting these fuckers--so what would it matter if you "saw" less of them in the scope? That isn't how they are asking their question here.

Beyond all of that, they are referencing spore count for this assay--which does not refer to vegetative organisms.

midwestdensies · Feb 22, 2013

india must have crazy herb, smart mofos way ahead of our studies.

interesting things cap Id love a follow up with your findings

organicozarks · Feb 22, 2013

squiggly said:
You are correct. It takes a biochemist.

Quantification of a sample doesn't always require live organisms. There are more ways than one to give you accurate estimates/counts. If it was me I'd simply do a Biorad protein assay and get a pretty good idea from that how much protein was in the sample and thus around how many organisms there were.

There are way more advanced methods than this that I'm sure I haven't even been clued into (as I'm no biochemist).

I mean think of it this way, they aren't going through and individually counting these fuckers--so what would it matter if you "saw" less of them in the scope? That isn't how they are asking their question here.

Beyond all of that, they are referencing spore count for this assay--which does not refer to vegetative organisms.

They are actually counting these fuckers. That is what the scopes are for. I was trained to use a scope by a person that was trained at the soil food web labs. They do indeed count these fuckers, and then try to do some wannabe math to make up for the fact that the sample is mostly dead. I am sure there are ways that you describe, but to my knowledge I have not heard of any of the testing labs using them. Being that you have the knowledge you could easily do this with the right equipment. Could be worth it financially in the long term.

The fact that they count these fuckers is the sole reason it is very hard to take these labs seriously. Microbeman has been to the soil food webs lab, and he has said basically the same thing. I guess they have invented their own math to make this business work. :)

Seamaiden · Feb 22, 2013

Oo, if there are dead organisms present in the sample, wouldn't it be a forgone conclusion that at some time previous to scoping they were alive? I mean, what does it matter, really, if they're dead by the time they get to lab or not, if they're included in the assay?

If it does matter whether or not they're alive, then I would like to know what the real difference(s) is/are. :)

squiggly · Feb 22, 2013

Seamaiden said:
Oo, if there are dead organisms present in the sample, wouldn't it be a forgone conclusion that at some time previous to scoping they were alive? I mean, what does it matter, really, if they're dead by the time they get to lab or not, if they're included in the assay?

If it does matter whether or not they're alive, then I would like to know what the real difference(s) is/are. :)

Well some will be broken down by other organisms before they arrive, so there is that.

I imagine by "counting" them, organizozarks, you mean they section out an area and count it then multiply through by the number of areas there are in the entire sample. This is an extremely "guessy" method and I can't believe any respectable labs would do it this way and this way only. This would be a way to get an estimate for yourself against which you might compare your further results. To my mind this would be the first step in an assay, but not the last one. Results must be confirmed in science. If a lab does it this way, it's a bad lab--plain and simple.

There have got to be 25 different ways to quantify the amount of life in a sample, so I wouldn't immediately write off every single lab as doing it this way alone. If that were to be the case, then we really shouldn't be calling any of them labs. We should be calling them places with microscopes and untrained management.

Shamus · Feb 23, 2013

When running a worm farm will the foliar/any pack kill them?

kushtrees · Feb 23, 2013

This seems like a dumb question but what the heck...

Is there any less benefit from watering with tea during the night cycle? I dnt have time to do it during lights on and was just curious

ftwendy · Feb 23, 2013

Watering at night is generally a bad idea, ime... inviting humidity spikes and drowned roots. Sometimes you just have to be a slave to the plant. :)

Capulator · Feb 25, 2013

ShamusMcGillicuddy said:
When running a worm farm will the foliar/any pack kill them?

nope.

Capulator · Feb 25, 2013

kushtrees said:
This seems like a dumb question but what the heck...

Is there any less benefit from watering with tea during the night cycle? I dnt have time to do it during lights on and was just curious

ftwendy said:
Watering at night is generally a bad idea, ime... inviting humidity spikes and drowned roots. Sometimes you just have to be a slave to the plant. :)

There are some very good growers that swear by watering with only water at night, no nutes. So, nutes during the day, only water at night. Plants do drink at night, so yes you can apply tea at night. You do want to be careful with over watering, but when you water should not be a consideration.

ftwendy · Feb 25, 2013

No fooling? Wow.

I never knew that you could water at night as part of a regimen... I've only done it in emergency situations. I have an automatic setup that applies fresh water three times during the lights on (I manually apply feedings daily in a dtw setup). I've always gone through a few days of interrupted sleep while waiting to dial in the timing of waterings when I transfer plants from veg into the flower area... all so I could avoid applying water during the dark. Seems like wasted effort now. I've been doing that for years. :)

Do you apply water at night?

squiggly · Feb 25, 2013

ftwendy said:
No fooling? Wow.

I never knew that you could water at night as part of a regimen... I've only done it in emergency situations. I have an automatic setup that applies fresh water three times during the lights on (I manually apply feedings daily in a dtw setup). I've always gone through a few days of interrupted sleep while waiting to dial in the timing of waterings when I transfer plants from veg into the flower area... all so I could avoid applying water during the dark. Seems like wasted effort now. I've been doing that for years. :)

Do you apply water at night?

I mean just think about it dude. Does it rain at night?

I am like a super nerd scientist, but more often than not the people I see having any kind of trouble are the people who have thought the most about shit.

Seed in dirt, and get out of the way. It has always worked for me (but then I again I'm organic soil and mostly worry about keeping the soil alive).

budboy299 · Feb 25, 2013

watering with a timer...I used to do it at night.
but if you hand water...its really easy to accidentally get some light in and potentially hermie the plant, or stall their budding substantially

If you think about it...when you water in nutes, they don't suddenly become only water at night. That nute soaked medium is sitting there all night too. Also with DWC the nutes are all over the roots day AND night. The plant simply does not use nearly the amount of nutes at night as it would during the day when photosynthesis is occuring. But it certainly does not seem to hurt the plant in any way directly.

ftwendy · Feb 25, 2013

LOL... does it rain at night? Sure it does. It also snows occasionally. :)

I've always sought to time my 'good night' plain water applications so that there was apx. 50-75% of my final dose remaining in the root zone when the lights went out. Closer to 50% is what I shoot for. That way the ladies have water, are not starved for oxygen, and are ready for more wet goodies when the lights click on the next am.

It's easy to understand fresh water applications at night being a major benefit during late veg and the first few weeks of bloom (esp to increase stretch) -- however, do these dark waterings happen throughout the entire flowering period?

What is your water and feeding schedule? When, what, and how much are you applying?

Thanks! ftw

We Solidarity · Feb 25, 2013

ftwendy said:
LOL... does it rain at night? Sure it does. It also snows occasionally. :)

I've always sought to time my 'good night' plain water applications so that there was apx. 50-75% of my final dose remaining in the root zone when the lights went out. Closer to 50% is what I shoot for. That way the ladies have water, are not starved for oxygen, and are ready for more wet goodies when the lights click on the next am.

It's easy to understand fresh water applications at night being a major benefit during late veg and the first few weeks of bloom (esp to increase stretch) -- however, do these dark waterings happen throughout the entire flowering period?

What is your water and feeding schedule? When, what, and how much are you applying?

Thanks! ftw

maybe this should be made a a new thread before it gets carried away ~ this one is about tea recipes and the best way to use caps bennies.

on that note, can anyone recommend a microscope for viewing tea? I'm about to pick one up I think

Tea Recipe

Tea Recipe

Capulator

likes to smell trees.

Capulator

likes to smell trees.

organicozarks

We Solidarity

Capulator

likes to smell trees.

squiggly

midwestdensies

organicozarks

Seamaiden

Living dead girl

squiggly

Shamus

kushtrees

ftwendy

Capulator

likes to smell trees.

Capulator

likes to smell trees.

ftwendy

squiggly

budboy299

ftwendy

We Solidarity

Tea Recipe

Tea Recipe

Capulator

likes to smell trees.

Capulator

likes to smell trees.

organicozarks

We Solidarity

Capulator

likes to smell trees.

squiggly

midwestdensies

organicozarks

Seamaiden

Living dead girl

squiggly

Shamus

kushtrees

ftwendy

Capulator

likes to smell trees.

Capulator

likes to smell trees.

ftwendy

squiggly

budboy299

ftwendy

We Solidarity

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