used dirt + new dirt = claws. how to fix?

[shaganja]

Thanks, also, with wood ash, while it is great at adding K, it also moves the PH up, perhaps too quickly or out of range.

t

Maybe invest in some nutrients instead of all these potting soils it kinda seems like a gimmick in my opinion I wish you the best of luck as I’m not experienced with outdoor plants

Guys, there are seedling soils everywhere. Why is that so new? There are veg. And flower. Same as a bottle of chems for veg. And you bloom chems for flower? Why is a living soil that does the same a gimmick? Advanced had 9 bottles! Lol

 

[az2000]

Are you saying living soils are stupid? Do you know how many companies are making this type of product?

I've wanted to grow in a total/living soil. But, it sounds like the only way to do that is to make your own. The impression I've gotten is that many of the soils sold as such haven't "cooked" long enough, they burn plants (or deficient because the organic material hasn't broken down enough).

A few years ago I saw a thread (<<link, different forum) where a guy used Espoma Tomato Tome. The last I saw, he was using 90% Pro-Mix HP, 10% worm castings, 1.25 Tbsp dolomite (per gal of soil mix). And, 2 to 2-1/4 cups "tone" for every 8 gallons of soil mix. (The "tone" was Espoma Garden and Bio, not Tomato). He said it was ready to go, didn't need to "cook," didn't burn.). I always wanted to do that (4 years now). I don't trust bagged soil. And, I don't have the long-term ambition to "cook" my own soil. The idea of mixing "tone" is appealing.

 

[BudBogart]

t

Guys, there are seedling soils everywhere. Why is that so new? There are veg. And flower. Same as a bottle of chems for veg. And you bloom chems for flower? Why is a living soil that does the same a gimmick? Advanced had 9 bottles! Lol

There is nothing wrong with it, especially when compared to other nutrient regimens, some, like you say have nine or more bottles, as long as you know they are schemes to remove your money from your pocket. . IMO, one scheme is as silly as another, at least for a soil grower.
I use a quality soil (you choose), mix some EWC and some bone meal, some ashes from the wood stove for potash.
The EWC and ashes are immediately available for N and K, The bone meal will break down over weeks making phosphorus available just in time for flowers and you have a pretty good mix and a start on your own living soils. The plants will draw what they need from the soil and finish as nature intended in a slow gradual fade to harvest.

 

[Kingjoshh]

Guys, there are seedling soils everywhere. Why is that so new? There are veg. And flower. Same as a bottle of chems for veg. And you bloom chems for flower? Why is a living soil that does the same a gimmick? Advanced had 9 bottles! Lol
[/QUOTE]
Mate 3 different soils? Living soil isn’t a gimmick pre loaded soil that your buying 3 different bags and top dressing is . If you bought one good soil. One good veg bottle and one good bloom booster that’s all you need and way more simple and you are set no one asked you to buy an advanced 9 bottle line dude. Don’t get offended that I said it was a gimmick because at the end of the day has it worked for you? No

 

[oldskol4evr]

define living soil? soil that is disturbed all the time isnt living soil,when you break up the colony it pretty much over until it repairs itself,adding a feed no matter what doesnt make it come alive,organic matter is needed for the colony to survive,sure you can add mycos and things along that nature and get results but not living for long term effect,when you harvest a plant,cut it off right at soil level,plant another seed,the new seed will follow the hiway of roots as the active life consume it making it organic matter,up potting doesnt help the colony either,were patience comes in,if it takes 2 months for the plant to fill the say 5 gal bucket so be it patience is key,folk talk about bag soil,ya most are for sales but the stuff still works if left alone to build the colony,throw natural things at your soil,like plant juice,right fermented plant juice from a harvest veggie plant or wild comfrey,stinging nettle,plants from around your area,worms in buckets hell ya cardboard in your pots with coffe grinds egg shells,stuff they need to feed on there important to the colony too,bag soil is just a base for you to get started,the only water only soil there is is what you build and pamper and keep the life happy inside it,what you should have done was wash the old soil let dry,add new soil and amend with a few things you feel they need later in flower stage,there is no veg and bloom soil,soil is soil filled with life,if you want to veg for 2 months do so feed what a veg plant needs same with bloom,natural living soil doesnt have a slot for timed production it does it thing by nature and when it want to.
so bag soil is just something to get you started not a right or wrong soil just a starter the rest is all you,all the soil i have on my rock i live is made by me,i have a 50x50 bottom garden and 25 18 gal totes on my top container garden,numerous trees planted in my soil,all i built myself,yes it took a few years to become soil,mainly from composted organic matter,guess what all was started from reg ole peat moss and i do all right,i grow enough to feed a family of 7 all year long ,so dont complain do research on plant nutrients look for slow release,med release,fast release,long term effect and what to expect,so when you plant something you know not what to give it,build your life in the soil and most thing to never forget when your not using the beds pots gardens water it even in winter that what keeps your soil alive

 

[Jimster]

Just because a growing medium says it's organic, don't think for a minute that it can't or won't kill your plants by overloading nitrogen and other compounds. My take on it is that compost of any type should be used as an additive to your main growing medium and not the growing medium itself. I use about 15-20% mixed in with 80-85% Promix, and have never had any issues with too much/little nutrients or Ph issues. Compost can be insanely high in Nitrogen, and cow manure is VERY hot by itself.
I hope this helps out a little. I use very little nutrients with Promix, which is very low in nutrients by itself. I only feed every 2 weeks on avg, and use a regular dose of 20-20-20. I have no issues at all. Many of the products out there are simply designed to make the seller's rich. The basic ingredients in almost any fertilizer are dirt cheap. The fancy graphics on the label cost more than the contents to manufacture. I've been doing this for quite a while and with the new attitude regarding growing, the shucksters are out there trying to separate the cash from newer grower's pockets with promises of redwoods and buds the size of baseball bats. Don't fall for it. Ask any of the older guys on the site and they can help you separate the truth from the BS.

 

[shaganja]

Just because a growing medium says it's organic, don't think for a minute that it can't or won't kill your plants by overloading nitrogen and other compounds. My take on it is that compost of any type should be used as an additive to your main growing medium and not the growing medium itself. I use about 15-20% mixed in with 80-85% Promix, and have never had any issues with too much/little nutrients or Ph issues. Compost can be insanely high in Nitrogen, and cow manure is VERY hot by itself.
I hope this helps out a little. I use very little nutrients with Promix, which is very low in nutrients by itself. I only feed every 2 weeks on avg, and use a regular dose of 20-20-20. I have no issues at all. Many of the products out there are simply designed to make the seller's rich. The basic ingredients in almost any fertilizer are dirt cheap. The fancy graphics on the label cost more than the contents to manufacture. I've been doing this for quite a while and with the new attitude regarding growing, the shucksters are out there trying to separate the cash from newer grower's pockets with promises of redwoods and buds the size of baseball bats. Don't fall for it. Ask any of the older guys on the site and they can help you separate the truth from the BS.

i understand that i messed up by using old used salty stuff, and putting with new. i was just looking for pointers on how to rescue it. im not sure dissing the composted soil i use is directly at fault. i have used this brand for 3 seasons and it works great! making my own is in the plans, but i own a food trailer and have little time. im lucky i get to garden today. this is why is use it. simple. drop and grow. that manure at the end is a flowering OPTION. some plants are way hungry during flower right? i also use a self water air pot for the same reason. simple. hard to fail at. why are we not dissing fox farm, or anyof those? i dont get it.

 

[Jimster]

i understand that i messed up by using old used salty stuff, and putting with new. i was just looking for pointers on how to rescue it. im not sure dissing the composted soil i use is directly at fault. i have used this brand for 3 seasons and it works great! making my own is in the plans, but i own a food trailer and have little time. im lucky i get to garden today. this is why is use it. simple. drop and grow. that manure at the end is a flowering OPTION. some plants are way hungry during flower right? i also use a self water air pot for the same reason. simple. hard to fail at. why are we not dissing fox farm, or anyof those? i dont get it.

If you read many of my posts, I DO "diss" on Fox Farms soil. I answer 10X more posts about people overfeeding plants, with a ton of them being newer growers using Fox Farms stuff... and then pouring nutrients and fertilizers/Cal-Mag, Ph up/down, molasses, and all kinds of other stuff on top of it when the soil is too hot for the plants they are growing. I'm not dissing your compost, I have added it to my growing medium (Promix) for 35 years. I was just trying to explain what can happen when people just assume that anything "organic" can't possibly do anything bad to their plants... overdosing it with hot manure included. I grow with very little added nutrients. Wood ashes, 15-20% compost/manure (from Loews @$1.79/bag), and 20-20-20 fertilizer every 10-15 days. I have decent results, I like to think.
Recovering from your problems could be difficult because even if you flush it to remove the excess nutrients, they will quickly be replaced by the stuff that you are growing in. A flush is probably your best option if your problem is a nutrient overload, if your problem is Ph related, then you have to figure out what is throwing it off.
Nobody is here to give you a hard time. I could pick 3 members on this thread that have 100 years of growing experience between them. I am trying to help you and if I somehow offended you, I apologize. Perhaps someone better qualified than myself would be of better advice.

 

[shaganja]

i understand that i messed up by using old used salty stuff, and putting with new. i was just looking for pointers on how to rescue it. im not sure dissing the composted soil i use is directly at fault. i have used this brand for 3 seasons and it works great! making my own is in the plans, but i own a food trailer and have little time. im lucky i get to garden today. this is why is use it. simple. drop and grow. that manure at the end is a flowering OPTION. some plants are way hungry during flower right? i also use a self water air pot for the same reason. simple. hard to fail at. why are we not dissing fox farm, or anyof those? i dont get it.

If you read many of my posts, I DO "diss" on Fox Farms soil. I answer 10X more posts about people overfeeding plants, with a ton of them being newer growers using Fox Farms stuff... and then pouring nutrients and fertilizers/Cal-Mag, Ph up/down, molasses, and all kinds of other stuff on top of it when the soil is too hot for the plants they are growing. I'm not dissing your compost, I have added it to my growing medium (Promix) for 35 years. I was just trying to explain what can happen when people just assume that anything "organic" can't possibly do anything bad to their plants... overdosing it with hot manure included. I grow with very little added nutrients. Wood ashes, 15-20% compost/manure (from Loews @$1.79/bag), and 20-20-20 fertilizer every 10-15 days. I have decent results, I like to think.
Recovering from your problems could be difficult because even if you flush it to remove the excess nutrients, they will quickly be replaced by the stuff that you are growing in. A flush is probably your best option if your problem is a nutrient overload, if your problem is Ph related, then you have to figure out what is throwing it off.
Nobody is here to give you a hard time. I could pick 3 members on this thread that have 100 years of growing experience between them. I am trying to help you and if I somehow offended you, I apologize. Perhaps someone better qualified than myself would be of better advice.

Thanks. Easy to get offended when you put all this work into it, and hear you use immature silly stuff. Here's how it all looks!

 

[az2000]

why are we not dissing fox farm, or anyof those? i dont get it.

I said the same thing a week or two ago. Someone has a problem with MiracleGro potting mix (notoriously too hot, although the "Organic" version appears to be relatively safe) and there's a reflexive cry: "never use MiracleGro!!!". But, you see the same problem *every* day with Fire Fox Farms (particularly Boiling The Ocean Forest). As far as I can tell, Fire Fox Farms doesn't even put the NPK on the bag.

You should try that "tone" soil. I totally understand your desire to have a plant grow itself (low maintenance). That's why that "tone" soil looked attractive to me a few years ago.

I think your risk is that you're betting 100% on the quality/completeness of the bagged soil. But, the people who make it are ultimately driven by the motto: "time is money." Volatility seems to be the problem with those soils. It might work for awhile, then goes to hell with a new bag.

That "tone" idea (or Jimster's mix) has 75% as medium (inert peat & perlite). Only 25% of the soil is subject to the vagueries of compost (or worm casting). And then the "tone" is small amount of the mix. Presumably the "tone" is quality controlled (mass produced, carries a guaranteed analysis). But, it might not be enough to carry the entire grow. You might have to feed an occasional guano tea (or just some mixed nutrients).

That sounds like more work. But, the volatility of bagged "complete" soils might take more time in the long run.

If you were willing to water/feed every 2-3 days, you could use my light-airy soil and a one-part fertilizer. It's simple and you're even less dependent upon the soil being right. (But, takes more time every 2-3 days.).

 

[az2000]

Here's how it all looks!

From the photo, why aren't you growing directly in the ground? The ground would have to be level (not sunken like that). Maybe create "raised beds?" Wouldn't that be the most effortless growing?

 

[Burned Haze]

I grow all outdoors notill/ lasuana topping with my veggies and cannabis and brew my bennies and fungi weekly and after water add em in

Easy and worth it, just have to pay to play and learn what’s really not a gimmick or not cause a lot of brands are that. Don’t waste your cash or time on snake oil or overcostly stuff with a nice name on it.

If you want a simple and easy 3 part dry base dry amendment that you apply only 2 parts every every 1-2 weeks depending on the week ( roots organics :uprising foundation grow or bloom )


what I love about their products is as along as you have a good amount of myko’s in your starter roots and healthy plants and water em, man oh man you will have some healthy plants the whole season ( been using it for 3 years now and love it )

you can add other stuff like humid acid or a a dry based cal/mag but I apply min and see my plants fly like a roller coaster , I do apply a lot of fish bone meal extra and some extra feather meal lol ( cheap and makes your main amendments so much stronger )

 

[MIMedGrower]

Are you saying living soils are stupid? Do you know how many companies are making this type of product? Why are they not simple. They use cow, worm , and chicken. Sounds pretty simple to me. We have one in Detroit a lot of ppl are using. Maybe this should be a thread. Living soils do you use them? Yes or no. Tell us why. You still need to tell me why.

what is os, awesome king of knowledge, superior grower michigan med guy? the u.p. needs to know.

Os was a typo. Meant is. And i never said living soil is bad. But you sure cant get it in a bag just ammended soil. And 4 different bags with the booster needed to cure deficiencies is too much and it still will only work well depending on strain.

Pro mix and a dry slow release organic fert would likely be more reliable. Still water only. And if you want the best potential from our valuable plant you need to fertilize as needed. Weather organic or bottled. If the soil has too much in it nothing you can do to correct issues.

sorry. Im blunt with the truth. Best of luck.

 

[MIMedGrower]

t

Guys, there are seedling soils everywhere. Why is that so new? There are veg. And flower. Same as a bottle of chems for veg. And you bloom chems for flower? Why is a living soil that does the same a gimmick? Advanced had 9 bottles! Lol

Marijuana a tually only uses 1 ratio all the way through. The nute companies made up the bloom boosters to seperate us from our money.

The president of dyna grow admits it in this interview. And shares his tissue test results with actual nutrient content of a plant.

 

[az2000]

Marijuana a tually only uses 1 ratio all the way through. The nute companies made up the bloom boosters to seperate us from our money.

The president of dyna grow admits it in this interview. And shares his tissue test results with actual nutrient content of a plant.

I'm increasingly not seeing little benefit to varied ratios (versus a 1-1-1 ratio all the way through). I like to boost N in veg, and P in flower. Maybe it's a "control thing." I see differences. But, they may not be beneficial differences. The plants look healthy with just 1-1-1 all the way through. More natural than cutting N in late flower.

I don't think it hurts to vary ratios if it's within reason. But, I don't think people need to use proprietary "lineups" to do that either. I have a spreadsheet that will unpack any "schedule." You can see the NPK ratio and PPM strength for every week of the grow, mixing 12 cartoon-labeled bottles. Once you know that, you mix basic stuff off the shelf to approximate the same thing.

At least then the person is varying the ratios, and aware of what's being fed. They save money. They can "read their plant" better (instead of "5ml of the funny monkey, with 13ml gay giraffe..."). That's what I don't like about the boutique lineups. They obscure what's actually being fed. It's a franchised program. Not enabling you in your relationship with the plants. It takes you out of the driver seat to some extent.

 

[shaganja]

From the photo, why aren't you growing directly in the ground? The ground would have to be level (not sunken like that). Maybe create "raised beds?" Wouldn't that be the most effortless growing?

Tried that first season. I live on a river. All clay. Root system stayed small and yield was small. When that pit. (The beginning of an underground greenhouse. Lengthening the short season we have up here. Needs some money to finish.) Gets wet after rain, water just sits for days. Clay just holds the water.

 

[shaganja]

Os was a typo. Meant is. And i never said living soil is bad. But you sure cant get it in a bag just ammended soil. And 4 different bags with the booster needed to cure deficiencies is too much and it still will only work well depending on strain.

Pro mix and a dry slow release organic fert would likely be more reliable. Still water only. And if you want the best potential from our valuable plant you need to fertilize as needed. Weather organic or bottled. If the soil has too much in it nothing you can do to correct issues.

sorry. Im blunt with the truth. Best of luck.

No worries. Have a grow buddy just like you. Says what he thinks that's it. Kinda refreshing if you can get over the matter of factness. Lol