Vote against taxes? = Repeal

[sky high]

Yeah....there was definitely an element of craziness and excitement in it all before the med laws and the >flaunt-it-in-their-face< approach of today. A huge part of the game was being clever enough to NOT be seen, and competition and dick swingin was non-existent.....whereas today the younger set has been brought up to play this all out like any other social media event and being seen (as a part of the "scene") is as big of a part of it all as growing is.

 

[Big Sky]

I think the overall solution to this is to have have the real growers and basement growers of colorado come forward, dispensaries to , and come up with there own tax on a level playing field rather than have a room full of rich coke snorting , baby banging , politicians doing for us!
i would be down for a 15-20% tax, although a little high, it could go into funding alternative energy, educational programs and health care-
but the problem is, when we give ourselves a tax, our money is spent on military, corporations, and war-
so its a catch 22-
we are all slaves bidding for hope-


now if we are just looking at cost here- 30% sounds like a lot-
but in the big picture most dispensaries I see are bankrolling with mid grade bud- average 2-250$ an oz
so for every million dollars you make you keep 70% of that- bummer-
700,000 big ones- they get 300,000$
not making money?

and in a bigger perspective-
we could live in florida or some shit and have some asshole judge throw the book at us and give ya 25-life for 5 or 10 plants in your garden-
so i bid voters of this beautiful state...think in the big picture-
lets show em how we can overcome and model/regulate this properly like we keep saying we can do what no other state can..
i believe in co..;)

 

[putembk]

I think the overall solution to this is to have have the real growers and basement growers of colorado come forward, dispensaries to , and come up with there own tax on a level playing field rather than have a room full of rich coke snorting , baby banging , politicians doing for us!
i would be down for a 15-20% tax, although a little high, it could go into funding alternative energy, educational programs and health care-
but the problem is, when we give ourselves a tax, our money is spent on military, corporations, and war-
so its a catch 22-
we are all slaves bidding for hope-


now if we are just looking at cost here- 30% sounds like a lot-
but in the big picture most dispensaries I see are bankrolling with mid grade bud- average 2-250$ an oz
so for every million dollars you make you keep 70% of that- bummer-
700,000 big ones- they get 300,000$
not making money?

and in a bigger perspective-
we could live in florida or some shit and have some asshole judge throw the book at us and give ya 25-life for 5 or 10 plants in your garden-
so i bid voters of this beautiful state...think in the big picture-
lets show em how we can overcome and model/regulate this properly like we keep saying we can do what no other state can..
i believe in co..;)

Don't think you are going to get basement/black market growers to come forward and participate in helping to get the taxes down for dispensaries. Also you were a little cloudy....do you want the tent growers to pay a tax. That's illegal, we can't currently sell to anyone. Sorry the higher the tax the better.

 

[Big Sky]

honestly i see your point but at the same time they should, they are the voters after all-
even though not allowed to sell, they can legally grow, 6 plants per person 21 years or older, 3 flowering 3 non flowering-
some households have 3-4 and even more people that fall under legal rec use/growing-
but your right, they wont do anything.

its just me voicing a concern and opinion thats all-

even as a caregiver with high plant counts, i still dont have to inflate the crap out of my product with a 30% tax-
say for example, i sell an oz for 200- ( platinum grade)
the tax comes in- i charge an extra 20 bucks an oz-
i give a little, they give a little, thats the fair thing to do-
still making money so in my opinion 30% is not bad-

im not in disagreement on the 30% which i thought i made obvious-
but my point was, if the growers dispensary or not, do not want a high tax, then let there voice be sounded! or shit down and let it roll-



Does anyone know what the tax on tobacco and alcohol are off hand?
curious how it compares-

 

[Big Sky]

my main concern is going to be the license fees....not the taxes in all honesty

 

[putembk]

The problem you are going to run into with your idea is the tent grower that has been around awhile already is pissed. They have watched the price drop by 50% or more and they are going to be to willing to do anything to drop their bottom line more.

 

[Big Sky]

dood if only i had a time machine! lol
in 1960 i could get an ounce for 10 bucks and it weigh about 40 grams-
200 bucks an oz is nothing to be ashamed of in my opinion-

so why are tent growers so pissed???

 

[putembk]

dood if only i had a time machine! lol
in 1960 i could get an ounce for 10 bucks and it weigh about 40 grams-
200 bucks an oz is nothing to be ashamed of in my opinion-

so why are tent growers so pissed???

Wow, you have been around. I'm serous. This has nothing to do with the subject but in the 60's you got a bag of mexican brick full of steams and seeds for $10. I was there as well. Your idea is well intended but people that have seen their lively hood cut by 50% over the last 3 years just might be pissed.

 

[Dopegeist]

Too lazy to read or something? I linked the article in the first post: http://www.denverpost.com/breakingn...ana-legalization-backers-say-repeal-effort-is

Nope.
Needs 2/3 to pass just to be brought before the people as a repeal of the amendment because 'you didn't approve our tax'. It passed with 53%, if they try to put a repeal to the vote...it won't happen.

Not a snowballs chance in hell...Just some fuckers trying to scare the sheeple into voting for an oversized tax, 'or else you could be voting to keep it legal.'

 

[mr duder]

But if the people don't pass a tax then will there be no retail sales? And also wasn't this amendment largely sold to the voters as a way to help our schools out while also cutting down on the costs of law enforcement? My older brother lives in Denver and would never in a million years smoke any pot legal or not but he voted yes and he said his reasoning was so the tax money can help our community.

 

[JeromeGarcia]

It will be 6-8 years before the first 40 million in tax is realized....they are barely pumpin $7 million a year into the state coffers now...

No...

3,000,000 ppl * $200/year = $600,000,000 (cannabis sold /year) $180,000,000.00/taxes year @30%

Knowing production limits... I'd say half of this demand will be met in the first year - and the State will get 90 million in taxes the first year.

 

[PButter]

No...

3,000,000 ppl * $200/year = $600,000,000 (cannabis sold /year) $180,000,000.00/taxes year @30%

Knowing production limits... I'd say half of this demand will be met in the first year - and the State will get 90 million in taxes the first year.

Who told you 3 or 1.5 million people are gonna do 200 bones of Colorado legal next year?

PB

 

[Seamaiden]

But if the people don't pass a tax then will there be no retail sales? And also wasn't this amendment largely sold to the voters as a way to help our schools out while also cutting down on the costs of law enforcement? My older brother lives in Denver and would never in a million years smoke any pot legal or not but he voted yes and he said his reasoning was so the tax money can help our community.

Ha! That was my reasoning for voting in the cigarette tax and the lottery (back when California had no lottery). Wanna know where the money goes now? Not to hospitals or schools. General fund.

I see that it means that We the People are not completely unwilling to pay into the kitty, but it sure would be nice to know, factually, that the taxes/funds we APPROVED (taxation without representation) go where we approved them to go.

 

[Texas Kid]

I think you are alot of years from realizing those kind of numbers..if ever...$600,000,000 in annual taxable sales is a reach for sure for me. I think that was the canna-tourism arguement that has been borrowed in that if 7 million people already visit Colorado annually and studies show that 50%+ support marijuana....Hmmmm so I guess that logically means 3 million people are goin to come here and buy $200 weed....really? and only at an 1/8th at a time, it'll take 8 purchases each to hit the $200 buck mark, not goin to happen IMO...its goin to be like a group of folks or a couple with kids comin up and buyin an 1/8th or two between them when they hit town and gettin blazed a few times if that because the thin air kicks their ass...so maybe a quarter oz in sales between the 6 to 8 people which is close to $90 between them all....I bet pre-rolled cones become big movers on the retail front

The ammend 64 advocacy groups were only projecting $60 million in total tax revenue by 2017..not sure what changed..I would love to see those numbers but the state doesn't even have that kind of production scaled up yet or anywhere near #350,000-#400,000lbs a year of total licensed/legal production that I can think of, we're not even keepin up with current red card demand...we are still a few years out from that kind of output and it won't be alot of indoor hydro..more like alot of huge outdoor, greenhouse, and light dep greenhouse setups will have to be brought online and that takes time

Alcohol only does a little over $35million in tax revenue a year right?

 

[Seamaiden]

How about ciggies? Do you know what the state brings in on those taxes?

 

[sky high]

The numbers I saw the other day were far lower and I still thought they were dreaming. (a predicted 18 million in annual taxes, maximum) They are NOT taking into account the sheer volume of people who are growing their own...and then some :D who will provide supply for many of the folks listed in these statistics.

Sea.....

1. The cigarette tax rate is 4.2 cents per cigarette. There is also a tax on other tobacco products of 40% of the manufacturer's list price. (these are wholesale taxes that are passed on in the purchase price))
   
   on top of that, sales tax is collected at the point of sale directly from the consumer.
   
   
   

 

[Texas Kid]

What gets me as crazy is that ammend 64 was to make it legal for anyone over 21 to posses small amounts and grow up to 6 plants(3/3), it made no metion of a required unreasonably high tax scheme, fixed pricing, fixed production, or even of a retail model..so now because they can't figure those things out it somehow voids the actual amendment that was voted on by the masses....gotta love politics

 

[sky high]

Gotta disagree, TK. The retail side of this Amendment was most definitely a part of 64 from the inception.

Just >another< excellent reason the Fed needs to nix the entire model before it goes much further. Let's not forget that the FED has stated at least 3 times (via memos) that they will NOT sanction retail sales.... while at the same time they have stated that they won't/can't really enforce what folks do in their homes. Challenging the retail side but letting the individual right (and sanctity of the vote) stand is where this will go, IMO. If they try to fuck with our State constitution by attempting to nullify our vote >and individual rights< they will have a REAL shit show on their hands with far more folks joining in the fight than just the weed peeps.

 

[true grit]

See not how myself or any voters i know took it- strictly as treating like alcohol for adults. Which meant adults could consume and grow legally, and IF a retail scheme was adopted it would be regulated like alcohol. There were no well laid plans other than figuring out taxation rate and how retail would shift eventually if it got there.

I'm bettin they will figure out a retail scheme with this tax or not just because they are greedy and legislators already have their hands in the cookie jar and ready for more.

 

[PButter]

It has been eye-opening for me watching this whole medical/legal dispensary and lobbyists pushing for their laws and gman's responses and back and forth over and over when I correlate these issues to other industry related issues and the interactions that result from the lawmakers and the lobbyists... Is this tangent fucked or are we watching how capitalism doesn't work for the people?