Who wants to kill some root aphids?

[eyecandi]

RA War Games!!!

aren't we all just having a blast with these little SOBs. I douched my entire veg with Triaz + the 5% Pyganic (liquid pyrethrins) yesterday. the easiest to check were the seedling/early veggers in cups (really gonna piss me off if I lose these) - I could def. see some dead tanks in the mass, but there were also a lot of live critters still (nothing I could define as a RA for sure, but one looked like a little white spidermite like critter). mothers get Imo tomorrow.

 

[Onespark]

Christ, hopefully with Spectracide, Merit 75, and ExciteR, I'll stand a chance...

That merit puts a dent in them after the spectracide knock down punch I bet. None of it saved me yet but that is pretty close to the line up we tried first. Used Bayer complete which has 1/3 of the IMID of Merit. Is Merit 75%? Bayer is like 18%. Watch out for the calm before the storm.

If you do bring the Met52 to the states, try to charge a fair price : )

That merit puts a dent in them after the spectracide knock down punch I bet. None of it saved me yet but that is pretty close to the line up we tried first. Used Bayer complete which has 1/3 of the IMID of Merit. Is Merit 75%? Bayer is like 18%. Watch out for the calm before the storm.

Fair is the name of the game. We are just trying to figure this bug out. Met is expensive as hell as it is. Well over $30 a pound. :worried ...Is what it is.

I bought Botaniguard before so I threw up earlier and I'm ok now...

 

[Onespark]

I hope my root aphids look like this. I'll post a pic if they do, but this is what's supposed to happen...

Found this pic by searching "Metharizium Anisopliae strain f52"
Then see images.

It should do this to fungus gnats and their larvae, too in theory...
I always have a gazillion fungus gnats with my root aphids. They all love rotting roots.

This picture made me cream myself...

 

[treehugger]

A few quick notes from Google Scholar, this fungus is for soil and soilless only, and its efficacy under optimum conditions is ~97%, but requires more than just spreading an inoculate on your soil.
Good news is that with proper prep, the fungus can persist at adequate levels throughout our normal potting period, but i saw nothing about whether its compatible with the chemical alternatives in use.

 

[altimood]

A few quick notes from Google Scholar, this fungus is for soil and soilless only, and its efficacy under optimum conditions is ~97%, but requires more than just spreading an inoculate on your soil.
Good news is that with proper prep, the fungus can persist at adequate levels throughout our normal potting period, but i saw nothing about whether its compatible with the chemical alternatives in use.

The instructions I'm following require mixing this stuff into the soil while wearing protective clothing and a respirator. The effects can last for 90 days. Is there more than that Treehugger? Please share.

 

[canaguy27]

I was at a mmc looking at their clones. I flipped one over and bam, the little fuckers were everywhere. They had infected their whole lot of clones. I told them about imid, but said they should just trash them all.

 

[Seamaiden]

I'm thinking they shouldn't just trash them, they need to treat this pest the way strangles is treated with horses. If you come into contact with a horse that has strangles it is SO virulent that you must burn your clothing and anything else that may have come into contact with the animal AND the ground it's been living on. Horrible disease, I burned my clothing and shoes gladly.

I hope my root aphids look like this. I'll post a pic if they do, but this is what's supposed to happen...

Found this pic by searching "Metharizium Anisopliae strain f52"
Then see images.

It should do this to fungus gnats and their larvae, too in theory...
I always have a gazillion fungus gnats with my root aphids. They all love rotting roots.

Oh. My. God. So that's the fungus that has taken over the body of a root aphid, yes? I'm suddenly feeling a little bad for them, it's a hell of a way to go.

Oh, wait... it's gone.

 

[treehugger]

The instructions I'm following require mixing this stuff into the soil while wearing protective clothing and a respirator. The effects can last for 90 days. Is there more than that Treehugger? Please share.

I did not see the usage precautions mentioned in my reading, those are both interesting and scary!

The study i read, mentioned that this fungus feeds on the chitin shell and structures of the insect, so to insure adequate food to sustain the fungus while it waits for a bug to happen by, they used crab meal to activate and populate an amount of inoculate that they then mixed with the soil. They tried several methods, this one produced the highest levels and longest persistence of protection.

What was most interesting was the possibility that young plants could be inoculated with this fungus and that they could carry the organism systemically to the tips of new root tips, even when divorced from the inoculating medium.

 

[Bud Spleefman]

Wait till that shit mutates and starts growing on people! Can you see some grower's hand and arm covered with that crap, as it grows towards his torso? Ugggggg!

Better wear the gloves when I plant those plants!

 

[chickenman]

wow what a mess, must be lucky we only get those damn spider mites, mostly during summer, seems neem works for us.. Good luck what a battle

 

[altimood]

I did not see the usage precautions mentioned in my reading, those are both interesting and scary!

The study i read, mentioned that this fungus feeds on the chitin shell and structures of the insect, so to insure adequate food to sustain the fungus while it waits for a bug to happen by, they used crab meal to activate and populate an amount of inoculate that they then mixed with the soil. They tried several methods, this one produced the highest levels and longest persistence of protection.

What was most interesting was the possibility that young plants could be inoculated with this fungus and that they could carry the organism systemically to the tips of new root tips, even when divorced from the inoculating medium.

The sample that I was given and that I'm using is in the form of cereal grains with the spores applied to them. The stuff is kind of dusty. You absolutely don't want to inhale or get it on your body as a precaution but that is also standard for many products like E20, Floramite, copper solution, DM Zone, etc. (Colorado commons, maybe not you TH!)
But it just mixes in to the medium. That's the extent of the science on this product. I'm also going to try it in coco and see what happens. I suppose it could be little scary. But respirators and protective clothing are commonplace for me at work. This is after all a biological insecticide. There's a lot of things to protect yourself from. But I hear you, and I understand that could deter one from using this stuff. I'm trying it because I personally don't believe anything else really works efficiently in controlling Phylloxera. I have traveled a long hard road with these things, so anyway. I would like to know your source for this stuff being carried systemically to root tips in cuttings. Not because I don't believe you, but because I want to know as many aspects about this that I can as well. There is definitely a shit ton of questions to be answered about this stuff and I do not claim in any way to be an expert on Met 52. For now I'm starting with just seeing if it kills phylloxera. All info from you TH or anyone else is GREATLY appreciated.:)
With my luck I'll end up looking like Stephen King in Creepshow!:rofl
So yes BS -where dem gloves at bra?!

 

[altimood]

EPA fact sheet



Here's a reference I found.

And check this out, too if interested:

 

[cemchris]

I'm thinking they shouldn't just trash them, they need to treat this pest the way strangles is treated with horses. If you come into contact with a horse that has strangles it is SO virulent that you must burn your clothing and anything else that may have come into contact with the animal AND the ground it's been living on. Horrible disease, I burned my clothing and shoes gladly.

Hahaha I found a lot of humor in this. Some truth to it too. I see everyone is still trying to treat them with it seems like no luck. I'm sticking to kill everything and start fresh. Anything I have to wear a respirator to mix into my medium I'm passing on. I would be afraid that if you disturbed the medium it could be come airborne again. Not to mention with fans and such blowing in the rooms. Indoors I don't see this being a good choice. Best of luck. Keep the fight strong.

 

[Onespark]

The study i read, mentioned that this fungus feeds on the chitin shell and structures of the insect, so to insure adequate food to sustain the fungus while it waits for a bug to happen by, they used crab meal to activate and populate an amount of inoculate that they then mixed with the soil. They tried several methods, this one produced the highest levels and longest persistence of protection.

That is a great idea! Thanks Treehugger. Do you have a link to that study? I just ground Met into the medium (rockwool cube in Hydroton) in the top of the RDWC last week and so far so good. Used H2O2 in the res and Met 52 in the crown. There were some aphids coming in and some roots turning brown. They all resumed growing and putting out white roots. The rest I mixed into soil plants with no root aphids in another room. H2O2 has to help the damage. Too bad it kills your bene's but easy choice if you want to harvest them still. My friend was just pulling down plants and he found aphids in his root autopsies. He was running H2O2 and they finished pretty healthy from what I hear.

 

[Onespark]

I see everyone is still trying to treat them with it seems like no luck. I'm sticking to kill everything and start fresh.

Haha for sure. You are right there. I have done that a few times and it sure wastes time. Never rent a warehouse that is old and dingy and leaky. If you do seal all your rooms really well. Drywall. Have a positive pressure situation. Hepa filters on everything. Every small hole is an opportunity to these critters. Otherwise all of this is what happens. Or so I have heard... lol

 

[altimood]

Met Test Action

Ok today I got a little restless so I decided to step it up a little. So I took a root sample of my own. It wasn't hard to find some root aphids colonizing in different areas on a root ball. So then I took the sample and threw it in a plastic storage container. I probably stuck 50 root aphids in this container and sprinkled some Met on top after throwing in a bit of extra soil and a couple shots of water to keep things moist...

The met is the green rice. Once again: camera phone, wiggity wack resolution.

Then I capped the container and shook it like a maraca. Supposedly in 3 to 5 days I should be able to see some root aphids looking like the pictures previously posted in this thread. There's my broken computer zoom cam. I'm gonna buy a new one so I can post pics of rrot aphids in that container after three to five days. HOPE THIS SHIZ WORKS. Tune in Saturday or Sunday for results...

 

[eyecandi]

i dunno, I'm happy with my initial results (5% liquid Py + Triaz for veg. moms got same + the bayer). 2 days after dosing not a single living thing other then silver crawlers and a worm + fungus - kinda cool under the scope, could easily find the dead RA by the death-stains on white perlite (under 30x loop) and fungus was covering and starting to decay some. not happy with the high costs though. still hoping to try the met52 to run out a few cycles and make sure they are gone.

 

[altimood]

i dunno, I'm happy with my initial results (5% liquid Py + Triaz for veg. moms got same + the bayer). 2 days after dosing not a single living thing other then silver crawlers and a worm + fungus - kinda cool under the scope, could easily find the dead RA by the death-stains on white perlite (under 30x loop) and fungus was covering and starting to decay some. not happy with the high costs though. still hoping to try the met52 to run out a few cycles and make sure they are gone.

So you mixed the Py + Triaz in a cocktail, right? That's my next move, although some of my plants fried a little with straight PyGanic (no cocktail). I switched for PyGanic back to Excite R. The PyGanic is definitely mellower. I ran the Py at 5ml but then went to 10. Excite R I'm going about 3ml. What did you run the PyGanic at EyeC? I'm only running liquid P on flowering victims.

 

[eyecandi]

correct, Py was mixed @ 10ml per gallon with @ 10ml per gallon of the triaz .... all veg got this mix and 2 dys later I went thru and douched them all with new bennies. no issues with the PyGanic other then cost ... at $175/qt it's redic. I've seen some others for @ $100/qt, but I'd rather just use a couple quarts to genecide the little SOBs and then use the Met52 as a kind of maintanance long term (mix the grains with initial soil transplants). first 4 weeks of flowering got liquid py only ..... can't destroy the meds with systemics, and perpetual harvests make a complete genocide next to impossible .... hence the 'maintanance plan'.

 

[altimood]

I've been dealing with RA's for so long now that it is just routine maintenance. Its funny. Not a single mite anywhere. But summer and high heat always tends to bring them around. For now just the RA's. Surviving though. I took a day off so I will be checking the Met samples tomorrow. Definitely anxious to see some crustified bugs and I'm keeping my fingers crossed for good results. Hitting 90 in the mile high today. Summertime! I predict many days over 90 degrees F this year. More AC on the way! Are you using H2o2 at all Ecandi? If the Met is working, I'm going to test to see if H202 is compatible. I haven't used it until recently but seems to greatly assist in the health of the roots after being attacked by RA's. BUT I understand it (H2o2) basically wipes out Bene's in the root zone. Met is a microbial spore so I have not been using the H202 in my Met containers.