H
Hugo
- 53
- 8
You only scrog for 7 days???
KMK
You for real? which breeders are breedn with short plants? Not many, and hell yah plants with a good stretch yield hella better, ive grown plenty of short breeds, it aint close, so before you spout off know what your talkn about.
Short plants or large plants, that doesn't matter to me. The real question I'm trying to get the answer to is:
Do you guys try and attempt to keep the stretch to a minimum during veg to keep nodes tight?
Will this maximize the yield(I always believed so)?
I understand that through that 2 week window after flip that some plants may double in size, and other breeds naturally tend to triple in size,
But,
Through super cropping/topping/fim etc along with, and in my eyes most effective.,...
Negetaive differential(nighttime temps a few degrees warmer than daytime temps)....
Do u guys try and manipulate the stretch so that it's not extreme?
Do u try and keep the nodes tight on those stretchy breeds?
Or,
Do u find the big spaces will join up anyhow to form a long solid cola..?
Please advise.
I think it depends on the light setup, balancing act between budsite #s and the larf line. Vert vs horizontal, scrog or tree shape, high ceilings, double stack, etc. I bet the guys trimming with machines may have an opinion. A little internodal space can sometimes be a benefit, better for getting light through the foliage, better for airflow. More than anything just how the plant likes to grow (maybe 'modern' genetics alludes to the OGK-style varieties adapted for efficient production?)
Last run I kept my temps tight like Hugo says, wish I would've let them swing a little for more stretch, but all new strains and I was being too conservative. All except for one spindly sativa-style plant, I would've yielded better if I had let them stretch higher (my limiting factor is heat, so less light density than I'd like, vegged and flowered both vert with multiple 1Ks). Also, most had heavy topping/training, so the small stretch that did occur was split over multiple main branches. Most of the action was within 16-20" from the tops and I pruned the larf, some solid colas depending on strain. Not advice, but hope this helps you compare..
It comes down more to the genetics. Some plants are just strechy bitches no matter how you put it. As far as yield goes lol that's a funny argument. Indies and sat dom stuff yield for me. Depends on the strain.
Do you guys try and attempt to keep the stretch to a minimum during veg to keep nodes tight?
IMO/E, No, I use a trellis to keep the canopy in line and the stretch only helps me fill in the canopy.
IF the strain is a stretcher you fill the screen/canopy less, prior to flip.
IF the strain doesn't stretch much veg it longer till the screen is fuller, and leave enough space to fill in the remainder of the screen/canopy during the stretch.
Stretch is in the eye of the beholder. What you do with a plants stress is up to you. Some train, some lst, some trellis, some hit plants with light from all angles, which I would see having a slight effect on plants stretch since there isn't an "up" to the plant as far as light is concerned. Now all of this is speculation from experience and common sense. I don't go ape shit on a 100% sativa, and expect 10% stretch, know your genetics, and what the characteristics of the strain/genotype are. Sativa dominant plants will have a stretch in one way or another, as well as a greater distance between nodes, naturally. Same with indica, just MIGHT not be as much of a stretch; due to the environment they came from. It's all relative to the genetics.
Now, why do Farmers seem to have more space between nodes then YOU, prior to flip? This is the real question being asked, or so it seems to me.
Will this maximize the yield(I always believed so)?
I believe that you know what your talking about, and you are on the right page, we are just talking the wrong language, some how. If you keep your nodes as tight as possible, no matter what your technique, I believe that you can maximize the most vertical space, an make beautiful heavy colas, that are sexy indeed. Like 2 oz colas! It is all up to the Farmer and what type of finished product you are looking to achieve, IMO. IF you are making hash oil ,for instance, and bag appeal isn't a priority what so ever then you might just grow huge pillar buds that you can break down for production. If bag appeal is your plan then you might want to scrog or sog to get those nice "small-medium" sized colas that you can actually move without separating the cola much. Say 4g buds. IMO I like the SCROG buds due to the size and the shapes that you get afterwards. Though outdoors I want HUGE long colas that are like 3' x 6" lol Again all in the eye of the beholder.
I understand that through that 2 week window after flip that some plants may double in size, and other breeds naturally tend to triple in size,
But,
Through super cropping/topping/fim etc along with, and in my eyes most effective.,...Negetaive differential(nighttime temps a few degrees warmer than daytime temps)....
Do u guys try and manipulate the stretch so that it's not extreme?
I think you can tame the plant during the stretch, or SHOULD train the plant to best support the future weight of the colas in question. There are tricks to minimizing the stretch, IE light spectrum, temps, carcinogens lol.
Do u try and keep the nodes tight on those stretchy breeds?
Or,
Do u find the big spaces will join up anyhow to form a long solid cola..?
Please advise.
Yes, I try to keep all my nodes in check prior to flipping to bloom. You are building the foundation for the structure of your colas/buds. Some plants, like Thai, have a decent distance between nodes, but the cola comes together by the time flowering has completed, should you have all your ducks in order that run. As we who grow sativas know, you don't just grow a sativa, you have to think that shit out, sometimes on paper prior to even cutting your first clone. You have to consider the length of time this large ass plant will be taking up your bloom space, indoors or out.
Hope this helps. No need to get in arguments boys! One love Tex! IbTheMan what's good bro? I know you both know your shite! I think we are just wording things improperly, and it gets confused in type. It's all love man! Not saying I know everything just saying in my experience node spacing IS important, but it doesn't necessarily correlate to stretch, and the maximization of the stretch for higher/max. potential yields. I think you are trying to say one thing and peeps are hearing another. Am I on the right track Hugo? Pretty ripped though. PS the strains Chemdog #4, Aliendawg etc are bad ass plants that are popular everywhere. As long as they are legit cuts/crosses.
Cheers,
Crom
Do you guys try and attempt to keep the stretch to a minimum during veg to keep nodes tight?
IMO/E, No, I use a trellis to keep the canopy in line and the stretch only helps me fill in the canopy.
IF the strain is a stretcher you fill the screen/canopy less, prior to flip.
IF the strain doesn't stretch much veg it longer till the screen is fuller, and leave enough space to fill in the remainder of the screen/canopy during the stretch.
Stretch is in the eye of the beholder. What you do with a plants stress is up to you. Some train, some lst, some trellis, some hit plants with light from all angles, which I would see having a slight effect on plants stretch since there isn't an "up" to the plant as far as light is concerned. Now all of this is speculation from experience and common sense. I don't go ape shit on a 100% sativa, and expect 10% stretch, know your genetics, and what the characteristics of the strain/genotype are. Sativa dominant plants will have a stretch in one way or another, as well as a greater distance between nodes, naturally. Same with indica, just MIGHT not be as much of a stretch; due to the environment they came from. It's all relative to the genetics.
Now, why do Farmers seem to have more space between nodes then YOU, prior to flip? This is the real question being asked, or so it seems to me.
Will this maximize the yield(I always believed so)?
I believe that you know what your talking about, and you are on the right page, we are just talking the wrong language, some how. If you keep your nodes as tight as possible, no matter what your technique, I believe that you can maximize the most vertical space, an make beautiful heavy colas, that are sexy indeed. Like 2 oz colas! It is all up to the Farmer and what type of finished product you are looking to achieve, IMO. IF you are making hash oil ,for instance, and bag appeal isn't a priority what so ever then you might just grow huge pillar buds that you can break down for production. If bag appeal is your plan then you might want to scrog or sog to get those nice "small-medium" sized colas that you can actually move without separating the cola much. Say 4g buds. IMO I like the SCROG buds due to the size and the shapes that you get afterwards. Though outdoors I want HUGE long colas that are like 3' x 6" lol Again all in the eye of the beholder.
I understand that through that 2 week window after flip that some plants may double in size, and other breeds naturally tend to triple in size,
But,
Through super cropping/topping/fim etc along with, and in my eyes most effective.,...Negetaive differential(nighttime temps a few degrees warmer than daytime temps)....
Do u guys try and manipulate the stretch so that it's not extreme?
I think you can tame the plant during the stretch, or SHOULD train the plant to best support the future weight of the colas in question. There are tricks to minimizing the stretch, IE light spectrum, temps, carcinogens lol.
Do u try and keep the nodes tight on those stretchy breeds?
Or,
Do u find the big spaces will join up anyhow to form a long solid cola..?
Please advise.
Yes, I try to keep all my nodes in check prior to flipping to bloom. You are building the foundation for the structure of your colas/buds. Some plants, like Thai, have a decent distance between nodes, but the cola comes together by the time flowering has completed, should you have all your ducks in order that run. As we who grow sativas know, you don't just grow a sativa, you have to think that shit out, sometimes on paper prior to even cutting your first clone. You have to consider the length of time this large ass plant will be taking up your bloom space, indoors or out.
Hope this helps. No need to get in arguments boys! One love Tex! IbTheMan what's good bro? I know you both know your shite! I think we are just wording things improperly, and it gets confused in type. It's all love man! Not saying I know everything just saying in my experience node spacing IS important, but it doesn't necessarily correlate to stretch, and the maximization of the stretch for higher/max. potential yields. I think you are trying to say one thing and peeps are hearing another. Am I on the right track Hugo? Pretty ripped though. PS the strains Chemdog #4, Aliendawg etc are bad ass plants that are popular everywhere. As long as they are legit cuts/crosses.
Cheers,
Crom
I think that a 12" clone just takes less time to hit the "magic height" to be flipped. A 4" clone will have 8" to grow to catch up to the height of a 12" cut. That is what your partner is saying. If you cut 4" clones, in his theory, it will take you more veg time to get to your magic height that you flip at. So if you flip at 15", let's say, a 12" clone only has 3" to grow and get trained prior to the flip. This just gets your bloom cycle STARTED earlier then a shorter clone would allot. Your boy hears "4" clones" and things 2 weeks veg to hit the "15" bloom height". It's all in the training and pruning really. If you want a clone that has nice node spacing out the gate, but is 12" tall, just cut the best 12" cuts with the best node spacing already established. This way you both are happy. You get a node heavy clone to start from, and your boy doesn't stress on time "wasted" vegging YOUR cuts to HIS preferred height. Make sense?
Cheers,
Crom
Alot of the Kushes with spotch out with long internodals and typically do not fill in during flower but rather leave many, many spread out golfball nugs but no real solid main colas, you still get the yield but not the dense full bud structure
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