Fogponics. As good or better than Hydro?

[Aqua Man]

Why don't you hydro guys just use real O2[ not medical grade$$] and control the level in the res with controller?
Adding excess O2 to your water supply will raise the pH and thus a simple pH controller like fish heads use for CO2 will do?
I own both O2 and CO2 bottles and they are not a huge investment.
Then just make simple reactor to infuse it to the res?
The controller would note the changing pH[ O2 being used] and turn the tank on.
You need a regulator with solenoid also.
Sorry for asking stupid questions if that's what these are.
I have no clue if ferts would mess up such a controller?

Because tanks of o2 are super super dangerous and a reactor to dissolve o2 is not really feasible as it’s extremely hard to dissolve in water unlike co2 whichbis very easily dissolved in a simple homemade rex griggs reactor. Thats all i can say publicly at this point. There is a difference between aeration and o2 in terms of PH. Ok now i gotta pull a zipper mouth but yeah there are reasons bro

 

[Moe.Red]

Why don't you hydro guys just use real O2[ not medical grade$$] and control the level in the res with controller?
Adding excess O2 to your water supply will raise the pH and thus a simple pH controller like fish heads use for CO2 will do?
I own both O2 and CO2 bottles and they are not a huge investment.
Then just make simple reactor to infuse it to the res?
The controller would note the changing pH[ O2 being used] and turn the tank on.
You need a regulator with solenoid also.
Sorry for asking stupid questions if that's what these are.
I have no clue if ferts would mess up such a controller?

You inject O2 from a bottle into your aquariums? I've got O2 in bottles as well for welding but AM talked me out of using it for safety sake. All this equipment is feet away from my 2 gas furnaces and gas H2O heater.

Maybe I need to recheck and re-read, but I do not believe DO levels in water change PH. CO2 does, but have not seen that with O2. Just thinking out loud.

What GPH pump would you use to gently keep the res water moving? So 2" in the bottom of a 2' x 4' res. It's got to have enough ass to get it all stirred including the corners with roots dangling in the way, but not too much that it adds heat or turbulence. I still need float valves to work, and a designated height for ultrasonics, not looking to make waves.

I'm totally guessing at the size.

 

[Aqua Man]

Just to clear up the o2 concern on PH. its a long standing misguided assumption in short. Its the co2 that affects PH and just like the atmosphere both gases are independent but only co2 effects PH.… or should i say carbonic acid as thats it’s dissolved form.

Now this is all in large part affected by atmospheric co2 levels (henry law), surface area exposure, water column mixing and water surface tension. In short if you have a higher concentration or build up of co2 dissolved in water (carbonic acid) and aerate the water it as always trys to reach equalibrium and carbonic acid will be released in the form of co2 gas into the atmosphere. This causes the PH to rise but only to the point of equalibrium.

So if you aerate your water and see a ph rise you can bet your water is not at equilibrium with the atmosphere and would benefit from more water column mixing and surface agitation which is a lot more common than most realize.

o2 itself has no bearing on PH

 

[Aqua Man]

You inject O2 from a bottle into your aquariums? I've got O2 in bottles as well for welding but AM talked me out of using it for safety sake. All this equipment is feet away from my 2 gas furnaces and gas H2O heater.

Maybe I need to recheck and re-read, but I do not believe DO levels in water change PH. CO2 does, but have not seen that with O2. Just thinking out loud.

What GPH pump would you use to gently keep the res water moving? So 2" in the bottom of a 2' x 4' res. It's got to have enough ass to get it all stirred including the corners with roots dangling in the way, but not too much that it adds heat or turbulence. I still need float valves to work, and a designated height for ultrasonics, not looking to make waves.

I'm totally guessing at the size.

Calculate volume and to be safe go double to 4x for mixing

 

[Moe.Red]

Calculate volume and to be safe go double to 4x for mixing

Volume is approx. 10 gals at 2" deep.

They don't make pumps that small, I assume you mean 4x per hour? That would be 40GPH.

The tiny powerheads I have are 130 GPH, and I don't think they would be enough just by staring at the water moving with no obstructions. They are very gentle.

 

[Aqua Man]

Volume is approx. 10 gals at 2" deep.

They don't make pumps that small, I assume you mean 4x per hour? That would be 40GPH.

The tiny powerheads I have are 130 GPH, and I don't think they would be enough just by staring at the water moving with no obstructions. They are very gentle.

well i kinda think of it this way… to keep particles suspended doesn’t matter as they are not dissolved anyhow. To keep dissolved nutrients in water evenly mixed is the goal for me. I feel that should be easily accomplished with what you have. But thats just my opinion

 

[Moe.Red]

I feel that should be easily accomplished with what you have.

meaning the 130gph?

 

[Aqua Man]

meaning the 130gph?

I think its more than enough. I used a 190gph for my 50 gal res when i used my old system

 

[Moe.Red]

I think its more than enough

OK I'll try with that thx.

Such a PITA to reconfigure mid grow, just want to get this right the first time if possible.

 

[Aqua Man]

OK I'll try with that thx.

Such a PITA to reconfigure mid grow, just want to get this right the first time if possible.

Yeah sorry bro i feel ya… that seems to never end lol. Always one more thing you think of to make things better. Thats the life of an overthinker lol

 

[steamroller]

Thanks for clearing all that up!
@Moe.Red I do have O2 from shipping live fish. You would fill the bags with it after the water and fish. Old school..
It is dangerous? So has been most of my 58 year life I am told.
My thoughts are equilibrium is saturation and without injecting a known volume you can only hope to replace what is taken naturally?
Surface movement is key.
The gyre would be great for you moe. My only concern is if it is too strong to not effect the float valve.
They dial down real slow.
The video I linked was in wave mode [ which is pulsing] in a 4x4x2 aquarium not filled.

 

[Aqua Man]

Thanks for clearing all that up!
@Moe.Red I do have O2 from shipping live fish. You would fill the bags with it after the water and fish. Old school..
It is dangerous? So has been most of my 58 year life I am told.
My thoughts are equilibrium is saturation and without injecting a known volume you can only hope to replace what is taken naturally?
Surface movement is key.
The gyre would be great for you moe. My only concern is if it is too strong to not effect the float valve.
The dial down real slow.
The video I linked was in wave mode [ which is pulsing] in a 4x4x2 aquarium not filled.

Yeah over 24% o2 is explosive. leaking tanks or a stuck solenoid, end of tank regulator dump if not using 2 stage can all liquidate your house faster than a divorce preceding.

i wish i could get into why the way we do it is safe but I can’t yet. All i can say is it does not have a risk of building up

 

[Aqua Man]

My thoughts are equilibrium is saturation and without injecting a known volume you can only hope to replace what is taken naturally?

Equilibrium and saturation can be argued several ways. The difference is equilibrium in this context means equal to atmospheric ratios. Saturation is the point at which no more can be dissolved.

this is again something marketing has misused the context for monetary gains. Because the saturation point can change with equilibrium, temp and pressure. So saturation is kinda subjective in a sense

 

[N1ghtL1ght]

I just hit 26 on Jan. 27th.

Hey - I'm 20 years + a single day older ;)
and last year problems with my back reappeared and worsened, so now I feel already "old", literally :(

 

[Observationist]

Hey - I'm 20 years + a single day older ;)
and last year problems with my back reappeared and worsened, so now I feel already "old", literally :(

Yeah I can relate, fucked my shit up jumping out of a car lol.
Little peak, my R-leg/knee took most of the impact, happened about two years ago now,

my legs still hurt to this day, my physical therapy at the time was pool, spa/jacuzzi/drugs lol.

Didn't have time to go to doctor, had to work/on leg.

That was just the backside of my knee.

 

[Observationist]

Used to be the way to build a nest egg was to be smart and hard working and have a little luck.

Now it seems mostly about luck.

Things have changed since I was 26. A lot. I got lucky in so many respects. Best advice I can give ya is when you fall into some luck, grab it with both hands and run. And be fearless and willing to take a risk when it makes sense. Lack of follow thru with good ideas is the number one reason people are not successful doing things / business ideas in real life. Everybody has ideas, how many people actually turn those ideas into reality? It's a grind, it ain't all pretty.

Thanks for the encouragement, moe.

Appreciate you guys.

I'm committed.

 

[Observationist]

Dont have to disclose anything else BUT PLEASE

tell you how much o2 a plant can consume possibly at different concentrations giving you a pretty close idea as to what the ideal levels would be.

prob said a bit to much publicly but thats my thoughts

Moe.Please

I really would love to know this data.

Haha.

 

[Observationist]

Just to clear up the o2 concern on PH. its a long standing misguided assumption in short. Its the co2 that affects PH and just like the atmosphere both gases are independent but only co2 effects PH.… or should i say carbonic acid as thats it’s dissolved form.

Now this is all in large part affected by atmospheric co2 levels (henry law), surface area exposure, water column mixing and water surface tension. In short if you have a higher concentration or build up of co2 dissolved in water (carbonic acid) and aerate the water it as always trys to reach equalibrium and carbonic acid will be released in the form of co2 gas into the atmosphere. This causes the PH to rise but only to the point of equalibrium.

So if you aerate your water and see a ph rise you can bet your water is not at equilibrium with the atmosphere and would benefit from more water column mixing and surface agitation which is a lot more common than most realize.

o2 itself has no bearing on PH

Well this is getting deep.

 

[Observationist]

Don't mean to jack such a valuable insightful thread, carry on lol.

 

[Goodshit97]

Oh I bet man, I really do like all the stuff you got goin on, something I can see/would love to have for my self

Dope little house, fkin laboratory in the basement...lol.

I just hit 26 on Jan. 27th.

Life has hit me hard a few times.

I feel so behind.

Dont feel like you're behind brother. Ill be 26 in June, and still can't figure out life. Just when i think i got a grip on shit, it all flops apart. Just gotta keep chuggin bro, nothing we want in life is ever easy.