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Mitt Romney Marijuana Views Echo Long Progressive History Of U.S. Drug War

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Mitt Romney Marijuana Views Echo Long Progressive History Of U.S. Drug War

liketosmoke 221 Replies 17,598 Views
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The problem with the jobs obama wants to make or did make, they are all goverment jobs, which only cost everyone more money. Or goverment contract jobs that cost everyone more money and wont be there after the job is done, Or goverment subsidized companys, we all now how that went. LOL
If they want to make real jobs for us, they need to stop sending them over seas and put tariffs on products made in china, just like they do to us. Give tax breaks for companys who use us made products, ect. What ever it takes to save american made products. Its ureal how many companys are going over seas, Or go out of business because of imports. This is one of the biggest problems right now, and Obama is going to make it alot worse if we give him 4 more. Romeny will most likey get the private sector going alot better. Doesnt mean i wannt Romney to win, Ill admit i voted for obama, This time i im writing in Ron paul.

I'll make this very succint:

1st: You're wrong, well over 3 million jobs (old number, I believe its at above 4 now) have been created in the private sector in the past 29 months.

2nd: Not voting for Obama is THE SAME THING as voting for Romney--if Romney wins. Just as not voting for Romney (if that was your leaning) would be akin to voting for Obama--if Obama wins. Not doing anything is STILL doing something--you are still a part of the result. Any non-vote is a vote for the victor.

3rd: Jobs overseas. This is literally the crux of Obama's economic plan--we must stop doing this. The ONLY WAY THAT WILL HAPPEN is if Obama is re-elected and the democrats win a supermajority in congress. Republicans will not allow bills which address this to pass because the corporations they hold so dear are the ones DOING the job shipping. They believe this is all a part of the free-market system. If you actually care about this shit, you'd vote for Obama twice.

4th: Its an absolute joke to say that Romney will get the private sector going better. First of all, the "general" republican plan for doing this (cut taxes on rich, reduce tax deductions for middle class, slash education spending/grants/medicaid/welfare) is a totally shit plan. THEY HAVE PROVEN IT WAS A SHIT PLAN FOR 20 YEARS IN RECENT MEMORY NOW (12 before clinton--deficit quadrupled--and 8 after him--deficit doubled) Beyond that, there is no way to PROPERLY AND FAIRLY judge who's plan is better in this respect--because Romney has not released nor discussed a plan (as every presidential candidate in the history of our country has done). This is a best a wild guess--being president is markedly different from being a CEO, his experience in that respect is not going to help him balance a budget in the trillions of dollars, especially not when he must go through 400 people and 2 houses of congress to do it.


My opinion: It doesn't matter who wins if no one takes a supermajority--the other side will just fillibuster the one in power into oblivion. If this wasn't the case before Obama's presidency--you can fucking believe it is now.

I really hope republicans are in for a taste of their own medicine in that respect if Romney is elected. You're going to have one impotent leader on your hands--and everyone is going to blame the failure on him, despite the fact that its been congress the whole time.
 
Socal,I support warren buffets plan wholeheartedly!A simple solution that would work and is easy to understand.
Squig,I havent been seeing your posts but every once in a while i cant resist hitting the "show ignored content"lol,I want to read them but they are just flat wrong and that superior attitude is rediculous but ill answer your post by the numbers you used;
1)Really?I dont know one person in my circle that has gotten a new job so maybe your just beleiving the bullshit they are spoon feeding you,i know a shitload of people unemployed though who have great skillsets and educations that cannot find a job,some out of work now for going on 3 years even though they try their ass off to find decent work.How many people(honestly)do you know in your family or circle of friends are calling you stoked saying "Bro,guess what?i got a new job and its a good one,fuck yeah!
2)Voting for ANYONE who you do not support is fucking stupid,be true to yourself and vote for who you beleive in not someone you dont support but its better than the alternative,what kinda shit is that?
3)If you dont think obama is suckin off the same corporate tit as romney your not that bright,see socals george carlin post,As it stands corporations own both of the candidates and have for many years,its just a FACT,we all know it except you i guess.You dont think lobbyists care which party you are from do you?they just want their way and they could give a damn about donkeys and elephants.
4)This one is particularly laughable,Obama has never ran anything,he was always a community organizer/civil servant,never built or saved or had to run a bussiness in his life,just suckin off the govt tit,thats all he knows,now romney we all know has been very succesful doing just that,tons of experience,damn successful too whether you like it or not,hes not my boy but you cant argue with his success AND being president is EXACTLY the same as being a CEO only the citizens are the stockholders.Obama loses on experience all the way around to romney,christ the only jobs hes had are in the public service sector,we might as well get a mailman to do it.
My opinion?We need to change the whole damn system,did you look at socals warren buffet post?Here is a smart self made individual who knows how it works,these are the kind of leaders we need more of even if we just take advantage of their one field of expertise.Our system is broken and we need to fix it or were screwed.
People like you have the same problem as congress,You are so fucking far to the left that you hear NOTHING else and the republicans are so far to the right its the same deal while all the rest of us are in the middle,I personally like some ideas from both sides but i do not trust the current selection of candidates at all and as far as congress if they cant work together to get the job done asta la vista baby we'll hire someone else!
And for both candidates,Get us the fuck OUT of the middle east and for that matter other countries business,Bring our troops home where they belong,It fucking breaks my heart every time i hear of another one dying for no gain and for people that hate us for doing it,Fuck you rich and powerful sheiks take care of your own problems and by the way if the price of a barell of crude doesnt skyrocket down you can eat sand because we wont export shit to you unless its at a 10,000% increase just like you do to us,RECIPROCITY you get what you give.Oh and i apologize to all for the 1/2 page squiggly rant,lol.
 
http://reason.com/blog/2012/09/07/romney-vows-to-fight-marijuana-legalizat

546416_10151393591313032_1311507703_n.jpg


About all you need to know about the Obama vs. Romney legalization debate, the article also has some interesting info about Dem vs. Repub support of MJ.
 
Shit do be we all know by now they both are against it,romney by his own admission and obama by his actions,Go further back in this thread and see what the Americans for safe access have to say for obamas stance on weed.Oh and by the way weed is the LEAST of our worries,the way some people talk they would elect adolf hitler as long as he was pro weed.It really doesnt matter what they think if the people vote to legalize one state at a time it will happen and i beleive the numbers are there for it or damn close.
 
4)This one is particularly laughable,Obama has never ran anything,he was always a community organizer/civil servant,never built or saved or had to run a bussiness in his life,just suckin off the govt tit,thats all he knows,now romney we all know has been very succesful doing just that,tons of experience,damn successful too whether you like it or not,hes not my boy but you cant argue with his success AND being president is EXACTLY the same as being a CEO only the citizens are the stockholders.Obama loses on experience all the way around to romney,christ the only jobs hes had are in the public service sector,we might as well get a mailman to do it.
My opinion?We need to change the whole damn system,did you look at socals warren buffet post?Here is a smart self made individual who knows how it works,these are the kind of leaders we need more of even if we just take advantage of their one field of expertise.

First I don't want to get into a heated debate, just want to put that you are wrong here and I will elaborate. On this point in particular, that Obama was only a community organizer and "suckin off the govt tit", he was a practicing attorney for over ten years, as well as a law professor for a number of years. Not to mention the nobility that President Obama had in his work as a community organizer, what I mean by this is the year prior Obama had just finished 1st in his class at Harvard Law and was being offered all sorts of 6 figure salaries, he chose to abstain in order to due a service that he must of for some reason been called to because their was no seemingly ulterior motive for it, it was in the early 80's long before any real apparent political ambition. Now you can read this and be "all just another Obama supporter", or you can admit that you are just wrong on this point and that President Obama has a lot of experience in working. I have owned a few businesses myself, all ones I started on my own and a couple of them surely became successful, that said I have also been educated and can say like most things in life one is not better than the other, it seems to me equally difficult to exceed in both worlds. While President Obama did not go into some form of corporate law, which he surely could be close to a 7 figure attorney by now, it shows to me his personality and that there are more motives driving him than just.......well what do you think drives him? I wonder this when people speak so bad of the man. Lastly, you mention Buffett as someone who should be a leader in government, and while I agree to a degree that great businessman are needed in our type of government being a great president requires far more than being just a great businessman.........well guess who is one of Obama closest confidants........Warren Buffett
 
You HAVE owned a few businesses? Does this mean you do not anymore and if so may i ask why that is?


First I don't want to get into a heated debate, just want to put that you are wrong here and I will elaborate. On this point in particular, that Obama was only a community organizer and "suckin off the govt tit", he was a practicing attorney for over ten years, as well as a law professor for a number of years. Not to mention the nobility that President Obama had in his work as a community organizer, what I mean by this is the year prior Obama had just finished 1st in his class at Harvard Law and was being offered all sorts of 6 figure salaries, he chose to abstain in order to due a service that he must of for some reason been called to because their was no seemingly ulterior motive for it, it was in the early 80's long before any real apparent political ambition. Now you can read this and be "all just another Obama supporter", or you can admit that you are just wrong on this point and that President Obama has a lot of experience in working. I have owned a few businesses myself, all ones I started on my own and a couple of them surely became successful, that said I have also been educated and can say like most things in life one is not better than the other, it seems to me equally difficult to exceed in both worlds. While President Obama did not go into some form of corporate law, which he surely could be close to a 7 figure attorney by now, it shows to me his personality and that there are more motives driving him than just.......well what do you think drives him? I wonder this when people speak so bad of the man. Lastly, you mention Buffett as someone who should be a leader in government, and while I agree to a degree that great businessman are needed in our type of government being a great president requires far more than being just a great businessman.........well guess who is one of Obama closest confidants........Warren Buffett
 
Yeah for sure. I started my first one when back in 00. It was a small store that grew quite a bit in 3 years, but I was young and felt that it was not something I wanted to do for the rest of my life so I decided to sell it.....you see there were some bad times for business back then too....shit my numbers when down so hard the months after 9-11....., but I was very lucky and made great money in that business and it surely was not because of any small business tax breaks or bullshit like that, after that I went to work for a few years in the private sector and went to college and earned a couple degrees, after I opened another small company and it kept itself stable all the way up until last year when other things in life have taken precedence and I have moved on to something else. I did have one other business that President Obama did kind of shut down, I owned a dispensary and although we were not closed directly the political atmosphere became so hostile that we essentially had no other choice than to shut down.....I decided to move my partners stayed and they are still going today, just not as a dispensary anymore.
 
Sanvana,Thanks for being diplomatic,i could use to learn a little of that.I did learn something i did not know and that is that he practiced law at the SAME time as he taught in chicago,i was unaware of that fact but from what i can find his practice was limited to civil rights,a very noble thing indeed.The one landmark court case that i can find that he tried and won had to do with minorities being able to qualify to purchase homes and he took on Citibank and won,lets take a look at this lawsuit a little closer;

Plaintiffs in Obama class-action housing lawsuit got … coupons

posted at 11:01 am on September 3, 2012 by Ed Morrissey

The Daily Caller has a multi-installment scoop about the business practices of a little-known presidential candidate as its Labor Day story. This hard-nosed professional raised hopes of working-class people, made a million dollars off of them, and left almost all of them holding nothing more than worthless paper at the end of the relationship. Are we seeing another episode of How the Heartless Vampire Capitalist Turns, starring Mitt Romney? No, this one’s titled Fun With Community Organizers, starring Barack Obama.
The subject of the scoop is a class-action lawsuit filed in 1995 by Barack Obama on behalf of three lead plaintiffs and 180 subsidiary plaintiffs against Citibank for alleged discrimination in lending practices. It lead to a settlement in 1998 in which Citibank agreed to increase sub-prime lending to African-American borrowers. How did that work out for Obama’s clients? Not particularly well:
President Barack Obama was a pioneering contributor to the national subprime real estate bubble, and roughly half of the 186 African-American clients in his landmark 1995 mortgage discrimination lawsuit against Citibank have since gone bankrupt or received foreclosure notices.​
As few as 19 of those 186 clients still own homes with clean credit ratings, following a decade in which Obama and other progressives pushed banks to provide mortgages to poor African Americans.​
The startling failure rate among Obama’s private sector clients was discovered during The Daily Caller’s review of previously unpublished court information from the lawsuit that a young Obama helmed as the lead plaintiff’s attorney.​
Since the mortgage bubble burst, some of his former clients are calling for a policy reversal.​
“If you see some people don’t make enough money to afford the mortgage, why would you give them a loan?” asked Obama client John Buchanan. “There should be some type of regulation against giving people loans they can’t afford.”​
Still, the Citibank settlement was in the high six-figure range. That should have helped Obama’s clients get started on new mortgages, right? Well … it did help the lawyers:
Plaintiffs’ attorneys took home nearly $1 million in Barack Obama’s 1995 class-action discrimination lawsuit against Citibank, but 183 of the 186 plaintiffs did not get a dime.​
Three named plaintiffs in the lawsuit — Selma Buycks-Roberson, Calvin Roberson and Renee Brooks –- each collected $20,000. But none of the [183] ordinary, or non-named, plaintiffs that The Daily Caller was able to reach for comment reported receiving any money. This is despite a claim to TheDC by the lawsuit’s initiator, attorney Fay Clayton, that the settlement paid the 186 non-named clients between $770 and $3,250 each. …​
“We should have gotten some type of monetary reward from the lawsuit, which we didn’t,” said John Buchanan, one of the clients. “I don’t remember any money being offered since we were discriminated against,” Buchanan said. The bank “should have had to pay.”​
Elwood Flowers said, “the attorneys got the fatter part.” All he remembered getting was “a 1.4 inch thick package of legal gibberish.”​
Most clients said they didn’t see anything from the lawsuit.​
Fellow plaintiff Juanita Malone told TheDC she did not get a payment or a loan from Citibank after the settlement.​
Another, Patricia Dixon, said she “didn’t get anything” from the settlement.​
Cary Cotten, wife of plaintiff Edward Cotton, said the couple “got nothing” from the lawsuit.​
Of the nearly million-dollar settlement, three clients got a grand total of $60,000, while the rest of the clients got coupons. What happened to the rest of the money? Looks like the attorneys, starting with Obama, got the redistributed wealth, while the clients got the shaft. It’s a great example of how broken the class-action tort system is, and how it can force businesses to adopt bad economic policy while benefiting no one except the lawyers. It’s also a great example of the media’s utter failure in the 2008 election to take a serious look at Obama’s track record. Why didn’t this come out? Even John Edwards’ law practice got some scrutiny in 2004 and 2007, before Edwards’ candidacy imploded in scandal.
I daresay that Mitt Romney the Heartless Vampire Capitalist treated his clients a lot better than this, and that they actually profited by their association with him. There is a lesson in this comparison for voters.

Ill let you all judge this for yourself.
 
Bravo fishwhistle... Way to back your point. Just give it A few and the Blue Man Group as I call them will throw out A bunch of micellaneous numbers and and supposed facts that they heard or read somewhere and tell you why you are absolutely wrong and what they see or read is the truth. See it time and time again. They are always right, Period. Completely unable to resist telling you how wrong you are and the problem with A view that dosen't conform to their beliefs.
 
Does anybody think Warren Buffett advised Obama to pass on job creation and tax reform as the priority and make health care and massive gov. spending the dominating issue of the first term of his presidency? Your health care plan isn't going to matter for squat if you have no roof over your head because of the lack jobs available. Here we go again, back to unemployment checks, disability checks and welfare that has become the norm. I think working people would be more able to manage their health than people that are not.

Attorney for president??? Red flags should have been droping left and right. Last time I checked they don't exactly rate that high from the average persons point of view when it comes to truth, Fairness, right vs. wrong or just helping people in need. How much is it going to cost for you to represent me? If you have to ask you can't afford it, get A public pretender and bend over. I just love the way Obama helps us so.
 
Interesting Fishwhistle, I like this and I will surely look into it. Please for some reason in these debates people tend to think that I am arguing for an infallible person which I am not. I am sure Obama fucked up in practicing law as most lawyers do at least once in their life and I am equally sure he has fucked up in his presidency, but if it comes between him and Mitt, and while I can see what some are saying on here that there is no difference between the two, I can see far too many differences and truly believe that this second term will be much in our favor......talk all the shit you want about him but we are doing far better in this country than when Bush left office.......don't get me wrong the economy is in the shitter highly because of W's attempt to finance 2 wars and at the same time cut taxes, so that said the economy is getting fixed but I am talking about everything else. We are out of Iraq, Osama is dead, we have absolutely changed our global political stance for the better, we are seeing great progress for immigrants and the lgbt community, freedom of speech is alive and well.......All of these things make me want to vote for Obama.........

And to address socal (even though I am well aware we will most likely never agree on anything outside of herb) I am sorry but the healthcare system is fucked up .......there really is no arguing for the system the way that it what it was and at the very least this affordable care act stops insurance companies from denying coverage for a preexisting condition or a condition that becomes too costly.

Who are you 2 voting for?

Also fish if you are one hell of an attorney and motivated you can teach and practice at the same time, I have a buddy doing it right now.
 
Ya dont worry we all have great health care with the 2500 page health care law. LOL Doctors are already getting to ready to retire early. All the smart kids wont go into medical. The quaility of care will go to crap, There will be waiting lists for anything. Theyll find out you have cancer and book you a operation 6 months later if you live long enough. The best care will go to people with cash to slip under the table to doctors, Or who pay for good insurance. Not saying everyone shouldnt have medical care, but I dont want the goverment to micro manage it. 2500 pages is just stupid.
Really your madd at insurance company for denying preexisting condtions. Thats like going to get car insurance after you wreck your car and exspect them to pay for it after you write them a check for 1 month coverage. LOL Why would i even get insurance if i could just wait til i need it. Once they start making them pay for everything rates will go up for everyone. Insurance companys work off a very small profit margin <%5
 
Ya dont worry we all have great health care with the 2500 page health care law. LOL Doctors are already getting to ready to retire early. All the smart kids wont go into medical. The quaility of care will go to crap, There will be waiting lists for anything. Theyll find out you have cancer and book you a operation 6 months later if you live long enough. The best care will go to people with cash to slip under the table to doctors, Or who pay for good insurance. Not saying everyone shouldnt have medical care, but I dont want the goverment to micro manage it. 2500 pages is just stupid.
Really your madd at insurance company for denying preexisting condtions. Thats like going to get car insurance after you wreck your car and exspect them to pay for it after you write them a check for 1 month coverage. LOL Why would i even get insurance if i could just wait til i need it. Once they start making them pay for everything rates will go up for everyone. Insurance companys work off a very small profit margin <%5

The "lines for every procedure" argument doesn't hold water.

Shortage of doctors hasn't really been our problem (and isn't predicted to become one)--except for the ALWAYS difficult to fill general practitioner role (it generally pays less and always has).

The REASON why there are huge waits on procedures in other countries is due to lack of INFRASTRUCTURE. They do not HAVE that many CT scanners, MRIs, X-ray machines, EKGs, EEGs, etc.

They also have far fewer hospitals in places where this is an issue.

You know something else they have in those countries? Privatized healthcare, and even insurance.

For example: In britain, there is the NHS. If you don't want to wait for the NHS, you can carry insurance--and you can go see a private physician. This is common.

What this does is see to it that people get the standard of care they want, while still being able to give care to those who cannot afford it by no fault of their own (and yes, some people who are to blame for their own situation).

What countries like this understand is that it has never worked out well for a country to ignore their sick, poor, and needy. This practice has bitten every country on the ass since before we started writing down the names of them and drawing maps/borders around the names.

The good news:

We ALREADY HAVE the necessary infrastructure in place. MRI machines across the country will not melt as soon as the tax penalty for not holding insurance kicks in--contrary to popular belief. Hospitals will not topple over.

As for the quality of doctors or "the smart kids" not trying to be doctors--I'm sorry that I have a bit more bad news. Our country has not been producing the top medical field talent for some time now.

Republican resistance to education improvements and changes (and policies to curb the increasing cost of tuition) over the last 20 years have absolutely ensured that for at least the next 10 years we will be producing mediocre graduates in NEARLY ALL fields when compared with their respective counterparts in other countries--and that's if we act to change it RIGHT NOW.

We still educate the masses fairly well (we don't even do this the best anymore)--but our best and brightest are not quite so bright as they used to be.

End of the day, educating the masses and doing it WELL is what gave this country its power. We have lost sight of that and we are, in kind, slowly losing that power. This is a much bigger issue than, "the smart kids don't wanna be doctors."

That's just not true, but even if it were--let's worry about the fact that the smart kids ain't so fuckin' smart anymore FIRST. Or we could worry that perhaps people don't want to become doctors because it can cost 250K to become a doctor.

I'm almost at 100k now and I'm just a chemistry dude (at a state school)--these guys would go on to do AT LEAST 4 more years from this point and spend waaaaay more money in general along the way.
 
sanvanalona... I vote for None of the Above... Navada has had this option for over 30yrs. Part 2 of the ultimate plan is to give None of the Above "Teath" If none of the above is the majority vote then the current candidates are kicked to the curb and alternate candidates such as the cream of the crop from the primaries fill the void and voting continues until A clear leader emerges. End electoral vote majority rules and replace it with percentage of vote for each party determines electoral vote. End taxation witout representation in states such as Ca. where I live because so may Dems. live hear that it don't even matter if I vote because the state is blue and my vote has "Zero" impact wether I am Indie or Rep. under the current majority rules scam. Let every vote be truly counted. This Can happen... 49 states to go but Navada proves it can happen. Ammend the constitution as Warren Buffet explained in the link I provided to fix A brohen congress could very likely be the key to it all.

AP) CARSON CITY, Nev. - Nevada's "none of the above" voting option will be on the November ballot following an emergency stay sought by the secretary of state's office and granted by a federal appeals court.

A three-judge panel of the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in San Francisco blocked the injunction Tuesday and had strong words for U.S. District Judge Robert Jones, who last month declared the voting option unconstitutional and struck it from the ballot.
 
Ya dont worry we all have great health care with the 2500 page health care law. LOL Doctors are already getting to ready to retire early. All the smart kids wont go into medical. The quaility of care will go to crap, There will be waiting lists for anything. Theyll find out you have cancer and book you a operation 6 months later if you live long enough. The best care will go to people with cash to slip under the table to doctors, Or who pay for good insurance. Not saying everyone shouldnt have medical care, but I dont want the goverment to micro manage it. 2500 pages is just stupid.
Really your madd at insurance company for denying preexisting condtions. Thats like going to get car insurance after you wreck your car and exspect them to pay for it after you write them a check for 1 month coverage. LOL Why would i even get insurance if i could just wait til i need it. Once they start making them pay for everything rates will go up for everyone. Insurance companys work off a very small profit margin <%5
Liked your post, nice and simple, and to the point. 2500 pages, you aint seen nothing yet bro...

It’s a lawyer’s dream!
Officials have already drafted 13,000 pages of new regulations for the new ObamaTax law.
FOX News reported:
With the Supreme Court giving President Obama’s new health care law a green light, federal and state officials are turning to implementation of the law — a lengthy and massive undertaking still in its early stages, but already costing money and expanding the government.
The Health and Human Services Department “was given a billion dollars implementation money,” Republican Rep. Denny Rehberg of Montana said. “That money is gone already on additional bureaucrats and IT programs, computerization for the implementation.”
“Oh boy,” Stan Dorn of the Urban Institute said. “HHS has a huge amount of work to do and the states do, too. There will be new health insurance marketplaces in every state in the country, places you can go online, compare health plans.”
The IRS, Health and Human Services and many other agencies will now write thousands of pages of regulations — an effort well under way:
“There’s already 13,000 pages of regulations, and they’re not even done yet,” Rehberg said.
“It’s a delegation of extensive authority from Congress to the Department of Health and Human Services and a lot of boards and commissions and bureaus throughout the bureaucracy,” Matt Spalding of the Heritage Foundation said. “We counted about 180 or so.”
There has been much focus on the mandate that all Americans obtain health insurance, but analysts say that’s just a small part of the law — covering only a few pages out of the law’s 2700.
“The fact of the matter is the mandate is about two percent of the whole piece of the legislation,” Spalding said. “It’s a minor part.”
Much bigger than the mandate itself are the insurance exchanges that will administer $681 billion in subsidies over 10 years, which will require a lot of new federal workers at the IRS and health department.
“They are asking for several hundred new employees,” Dorn said. “You have rules you need to write and you need lawyers, so there are lots of things you need to do when you are standing up a new enterprise.”
For some, though, the bottom line is clear and troubling: The federal government is about to assume massive new powers.

Obamatax
 
Then there is this monster politicians keep putting off and the only reason that the "Rich" Republican gets those tax breaks someone here keeps moaning about. It's not because their rich, it's because of this...

Peter Suderman, Reason
Peter Suderman | April 18, 2011​
How many pages does it take to lay out the insanely complicated rules and requirements of our tax code? According to tax publisher CCH, the total number of pages devoted to federal tax code rules, IRS rulings, and regulations has grown to 72,536:

It's no wonder that even the government's own experts and officials can't figure it out. Any system of rules that requires in excess 72,000 pages to explain and understand borders on useless. At this point it might as well be Calvinball. (A game invented by Calvin in which one makes the rules up as one goes along)
 
Thats the problem, Gov is over complicated just like some of these posts. LOL I think Socal is covering it pretty good. i just like to throw in 2 cents.
Obama care creates 159 new federal agencies. Plus the now 13,000 pages of regs. Are they joking, You know how many of those agencies you will have to contact to get anything done.
Yes the tax code is so stupid and needs to be reworked and simplified. The whole goverment should be put on the KISS plan. Make taxes so simple that you dont even need CPAs Dang id love ron paul to be president. LOL
 
Thats the problem, Gov is over complicated just like some of these posts. LOL I think Socal is covering it pretty good. i just like to throw in 2 cents.
Obama care creates 159 new federal agencies. Plus the now 13,000 pages of regs. Are they joking, You know how many of those agencies you will have to contact to get anything done.
Yes the tax code is so stupid and needs to be reworked and simplified. The whole goverment should be put on the KISS plan. Make taxes so simple that you dont even need CPAs Dang id love ron paul to be president. LOL

As for the agencies, I'll just copy/paste from politifact (which is a really great website you should look into--and I mean that non-sarcastically):

"For example, the law creates 159 new agencies, boards and committees to control how physicians do their jobs," Rep. Trey Gowdy, R-South Carolina, said.

FactCheck: That's not accurate. The 159 number comes from an organization founded by Newt Gingrich. The Congressional Research Service says the actual number of agencies is yet to be determined as the law goes into effect.

Also worth mentioning is that some of the final number are not in fact "agencies" they are by and large committees and boards. You're looking a probably 1, 2 tops, true "agencies".

As for the regulations, this is a result of what healthcare has become in this country. A hotbed of not only wild misuse, waste, and exploitation--but also fraud, malpractice, and other such nasty things.

In a nation of 300million, if only 1% of us are shitty, that's 1 million people.

Even 13,000 pages of rules will not be enough to keep such a number of people from duping the system.

That's the world we live in.

While I agree that the KISS plan is ideal for many situations (tax code as it concerns rates--for instance) I do not agree that regulating industry is one place where this holds true.

In certain cases, when the "invisible hand" of the market is operating as we expect it to--things should be left as they are.

What republicans fail to mention about laissez-faire economy is that it's a perfect system set in an imperfect world (much the same problem that communism has, but biased towards the other extreme).

The problems which arise from this are two-fold:

1. In some cases, the "invisible hand" malfunctions--and can bias the market to those who play markets--rather than according to the value of a good or service balanced against the supply of it/demand for it. It is well known in economics that there are things for which the invisible hand simply does not work--ESPECIALLY for those things with a high degree of complexity.

2. THIS IS THE ONE REPUBLICANS PURPOSEFULLY FAIL TO MENTION Through various manipulations of the market (almost innumerable and infinitely variable in the forms they can take)--at times the "invisible hand" can be kicked out of the market, and replaced altogether by--well, a hand. Some guy's hand. Or a hand representing a group of people. This is essentially the ONLY failing of laisse-faire (that and the dickish-ness of it). The problems which arise from #1 can often be corrected without a huge amount of meddling. However, the problems which arise from this removal of the invisible hand--are not easily detected or combated. When such manipulations are detected (often) it is generally the policy of those on the left to try and close the loophole--while it is the policy of those on the right (speaking politicians here) to do their very best to pretend that it's not happening at all. Newsflash--it is. You LITERALLY don't need to go beyond an economics 101 class to learn this (covering macroeconomics)--however if you do, you're likely to be much more disgusted by it as you learn more. Market manipulation is the imperfection that the perfect system that is the "free market economy" does not account or correct for. Unfortunately rules and regulations are the only way around this. It is important to remember, above all else, that regardless of how many regulations we have now--we would need millions more to TRULY level the playing field such that the market was absolutely "free", i.e. the best services and products produced at the lowest cost (and perceived to represent the lowest opportunity cost for purchase comparatively) will be the products and services to succeed in the economy. It just does not work that way currently. The republican's idea of a free market, is one where the person who knows how to fuck people over the best and screw the system the worst wins.
 
Seriously arguing on behalf of insurance companies only goes to show how asinine this conversation has become. If that is the case keep eating that American exceptionalism mixed with some sort of conspiracy theories that lead to no critical/constructive thought. Yeah keep talking shit on healthcare systems that you have no 1st hand experience with. I skateboard, have been injured in these big evil social empires known as Canada and Spain and I also know the difference in care between there and here........ready for the difference....in both Canada and Spain the nurses were much more helpful and the doctors very friendly all without having to wait in some stupid line or getting inadequate care. Extensive traveling will put a whole new out look on things like this.
 
Extensive traveling will put a whole new out look on things like this.

Nothing rings truer than this.

Every time I'm listening to an Obamacare hater--I know I'm not speaking with someone who's been out of the country for any length of time.
 
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