Aquaman gets dirty

[Aqua Man]

Glad you got this whole soil thing out of your system. Going back to rdwc after this?

Next stop Coco... Then I will see. I have high hopes for coco. 1st is another mother grow then I will do a serious grow and try to pull min 3lbs from my hlg 600 with a 2-2.5 week veg

 

[Milson]

Next stop Coco... Then I will see. I have high hopes for coco. 1st is another mother grow then I will do a serious grow and try to pull min 3lbs from my hlg 600 with a 2-2.5 week veg

From rooted clones?

 

[MIMedGrower]

Next stop Coco... Then I will see. I have high hopes for coco. 1st is another mother grow then I will do a serious grow and try to pull min 3lbs from my hlg 600 with a 2-2.5 week veg

I have to ask. Why would a mother run not be a serious one. In my opinion it should be the most important run and requires the highest possible potential to come out for proper selection.

To further this thought. All the “breeders” growing tiny short vegged immature flowers in small pots cant possibly know which pheno is any good either.

 

[Milson]

I have to ask. Why would a mother run not be a serious one. In my opinion it should be the most important run and requires the highest possible potential to come out for proper selection.

To further this thought. All the “breeders” growing tiny short vegged immature flowers in small pots cant possibly know which pheno is any good either.

In terms of breeders, shouldn't they be weeding out diva plants anyway?

I agree they need to judge mature plants with a solid veg, but not that you would want to be perfectly dialed in while pheno hunting.

Now in terms of clone moms....I think I agree?

 

[Anthem]

Next stop Coco... Then I will see. I have high hopes for coco. 1st is another mother grow then I will do a serious grow and try to pull min 3lbs from my hlg 600 with a 2-2.5 week veg

3 units from 600 watts would be impressive provided we are talking about a maximum of 9 week for flower.

 

[Aqua Man]

From rooted clones?

Yes clones.

 

[Anthem]

I have to ask. Why would a mother run not be a serious one. In my opinion it should be the most important run and requires the highest possible potential to come out for proper selection.

To further this thought. All the “breeders” growing tiny short vegged immature flowers in small pots cant possibly know which pheno is any good either.

MIMED I do know of a few growers running the small immature plants to flower, but they are running clones not seeds.

 

[Anthem]

3 units from 600 watts would be impressive provided we are talking about a maximum of 9 week for flower.

Oh and I forgot that is dried weight, HA HA!!!!!!

 

[MIMedGrower]

In terms of breeders, shouldn't they be weeding out diva plants anyway?

I agree they need to judge mature plants with a solid veg, but not that you would want to be perfectly dialed in while pheno hunting.

Now in terms of clone moms....I think I agree?

Again. How can you tell anything about a plant to pick a pheno without growing it fully?

You need to veg to maturity just to know how much stress and how soon a plant flowers.

Its different with short or no veg time.

 

[Aqua Man]

I have to ask. Why would a mother run not be a serious one. In my opinion it should be the most important run and requires the highest possible potential to come out for proper selection.

To further this thought. All the “breeders” growing tiny short vegged immature flowers in small pots cant possibly know which pheno is any good either.

I agree buy serious I mean maximizing yield and growth rates. When looking for mother's I'm looking at many things and just let the plant do her thing. There is no guarantee of what to expect being all different phenos and not knowing the structure. When you have clones and have a decent idea how it grows you can achieve a lot more.

Basically when I run a mix of strains with different phenos I can't run them all the same and maximize each one, that's impossible. You have to basically try to appease the lot of them. I'm not looking for total yield at all and the whole grow is basically just looking for what I want in a plant and how well it smokes.

That's what I mean by not serious... I'm just hunting for mother's and I cannot push a plant to its limits because I have a room to keep happy.

 

[MIMedGrower]

MIMED I do know of a few growers running the small immature plants to flower, but they are running clones not seeds.

I dont mean for production. I ran plants 12/12 from seed for a while to get more variety.

I mean to pick phenos for cloning or breeding.

 

[Aqua Man]

Again. How can you tell anything about a plant to pick a pheno without growing it fully?

You need to veg to maturity just to know how much stress and how soon a plant flowers.

Its different with short or no veg time.

That's why I'm not doing a "serious" run next time... I doing another mother run so I can choose a mother.... Then clone and go for yield with an idea of the plant structure and temperament.

 

[MIMedGrower]

I agree buy serious I mean maximizing yield and growth rates. When looking for mother's I'm looking at many things and just let the plant do her thing. There is no guarantee of what to expect being all different phenos and not knowing the structure. When you have clones and have a decent idea how it grows you can achieve a lot more.

Basically when I run a mix of strains with different phenos I can't run them all the same and maximize each one, that's impossible. You have to basically try to appease the lot of them. I'm not looking for total yield at all and the whole grow is basically just looking for what I want in a plant and how well it smokes.

That's what I mean by not serious... I'm just hunting for mother's and I cannot push a plant to its limits because I have a room to keep happy.

Ok we have a difference of opinion here.

I care for each different seed plant individually. I water and mix what and when the plant says to. Never pushing at all. Actually trying to give only what it will use. I want the plants to achieve their potential. One of the reasons i dont want to shorten or control flowering with “signals” like too much pk or harsh techniques like massive defoliation. And yeah. My plants tend to flower longer than average. But they also get us high for hours and have deep complex highs regardless of strain. Hell ch9 says BLT is a 7-8 week flowerer. Mine all go 10-12. The breeder there gives bloom ratios. And he hates deep highs. He wants uplifting happy highs only. See where im going with this?

Only a well kept mature happy plant can reach this potential. So if we dont grow the best plant up front from seed we can't know if it was a better pick just because we can dial in and improve it after some clone runs.

 

[Aqua Man]

Ok we have a difference of opinion here.

I care for each different seed plant individually. I water and mix what and when the plant says to. Never pushing at all. Actually trying to give only what it will use. I want the plants to achieve their potential. One of the reasons i dont want to shorten or control flowering with “signals” like too much pk or harsh techniques like massive defoliation. And yeah. My plants tend to flower longer than average. But they also get us high for hours and have deep complex highs regardless of strain. Hell ch9 says BLT is a 7-8 week flowerer. Mine all go 10-12. The breeder there gives bloom ratios. And he hates deep highs. He wants uplifting happy highs only. See where im going with this?

Only a well kept mature happy plant can reach this potential. So if we dont grow the best plant up front from seed we can't know if it was a better pick just because we can dial in and improve it after some clone runs.

Yeah. Imo I can't maximize light because some are more sensitive. I can't run as warm because some are more sensitive. Some seen to like a lower RH. This things I just can adjust individually... Nutrients are a small part of it IMO. Some plants just have more vigor and can be pushed harder. I mean if you not pushing them with environment or light optimization then I can see your point

 

[MIMedGrower]

Yeah. Imo I can't maximize light because some are more sensitive. I can't run as warm because some are more sensitive. Some seen to like a lower RH. This things I just can adjust individually... Nutrients are a small part of it IMO. Some plants just have more vigor and can be pushed harder. I mean if you not pushing them with environment or light optimization then I can see your point

Pushing plants the way you are saying is not helpful as finding every plants sweet spot of happiness and keeping them there.

I always have all different strains growing. I had 3 breeders with multiple strains going before i shut down.

But i do keep temp and humidity in a static range. It is not adjusted through the cycle. But i also think the plants prefer that after doing runs while adjusting temp and humidity.

But like you said i am not running my plants at an extreme light intensity. Just mid high.

i think that high intensity with co2 is where pushing the plants with yield over quality as a result comes from.

Before that yield and quality go hand in hand. Nutrients are the big variable in my opinion. Getting them right to plant use and quality goes up.

 

[FourthCity]

Next stop Coco... Then I will see. I have high hopes for coco. 1st is another mother grow then I will do a serious grow and try to pull min 3lbs from my hlg 600 with a 2-2.5 week veg

How many plants and what footprint/sqft? Sounds ambitious but doable with enough plants (and depending on what you consider the start of veg).

I have to ask. Why would a mother run not be a serious one. In my opinion it should be the most important run and requires the highest possible potential to come out for proper selection.

To further this thought. All the “breeders” growing tiny short vegged immature flowers in small pots cant possibly know which pheno is any good either.

That's why I'm not doing a "serious" run next time... I doing another mother run so I can choose a mother.... Then clone and go for yield with an idea of the plant structure and temperament.

I would make the analogy that what @Aqua Man is saying is kinda like comparing dating someone new to being in a "serious" relationship. You cant exactly skip to the serious part before you know someone, it doesn't necessarily mean that you don't take going on a date seriously, it just means that you are still learning if you like someone, finding out what they want to be happy and whether or not you can provide it.

Its the same thing with plants, a serious grow means anticipating and providing for their needs which is hard to do before you have determined what exactly they are. For me, even though my effort is consistent its usually not until a plants third or fourth generation from clone that I feel like I can maximize their potential within the limits of my setup, up to that point its still more of a learning experience. Maybe I'm way off base so correct me if I'm wrong but that's what it seems like you are saying.

 

[Aqua Man]

Pushing plants the way you are saying is not helpful as finding every plants sweet spot of happiness and keeping them there.

I always have all different strains growing. I had 3 breeders with multiple strains going before i shut down.

But i do keep temp and humidity in a static range. It is not adjusted through the cycle. But i also think the plants prefer that after doing runs while adjusting temp and humidity.

But like you said i am not running my plants at an extreme light intensity. Just mid high.

i think that high intensity with co2 is where pushing the plants with yield over quality as a result comes from.

Before that yield and quality go hand in hand. Nutrients are the big variable in my opinion. Getting them right to plant use and quality goes up.

Yeah I don't think pushing them mean any less quality.. faster growth does not mean lesser quality and have seen no evidence. Better conditions allow for my light and more growth. Stress is stress. I mean if I put them in cool conditions and it slows growth does that mean better quality? Personally I don't think so. Pushing the plants to reach faster growth rates while keeping them from stresses imo makes for faster growth and better quality. The thing is you can't push them hard if you don't dial the environment in to where the plantnl is not stressed. It's the same with all life. Provide better environment for bacteria and they thrive and populate much fast and healthier. I don't see the correlation about growth rates equal lesser quality. Maybe it's the term pushing them hard you mean? By pushing them hard I mean maximizing the potential growth while reducing the stress.

So in essence yes that what I mean by pushing them hard... Finding the sweet spot where they can maximize the light, nutrients and reward me with vigorous, healthy and sizable growth

 

[Aqua Man]

How many plants and what footprint/sqft? Sounds ambitious but doable with enough plants (and depending on what you consider the start of veg).


I would make the analogy that what @Aqua Man is saying is kinda like comparing dating someone new to being in a "serious" relationship. You cant exactly skip to the serious part before you know someone, it doesn't necessarily mean that you don't take going on a date seriously, it just means that you are still learning if you like someone, finding out what they want to be happy and whether or not you can provide it.

Its the same thing with plants, a serious grow means anticipating and providing for their needs which is hard to do before you have determined what exactly they are. For me, even though my effort is consistent its usually not until a plants third or fourth generation from clone that I feel like I can maximize their potential within the limits of my setup, up to that point its still more of a learning experience. Maybe I'm way off base so correct me if I'm wrong but that's what it seems like you are saying.

Yup that's exactly what I'm saying.

Will be a 4x6 1 hlg 600.

 

[MIMedGrower]

How many plants and what footprint/sqft? Sounds ambitious but doable with enough plants (and depending on what you consider the start of veg).


I would make the analogy that what @Aqua Man is saying is kinda like comparing dating someone new to being in a "serious" relationship. You cant exactly skip to the serious part before you know someone, it doesn't necessarily mean that you don't take going on a date seriously, it just means that you are still learning if you like someone, finding out what they want to be happy and whether or not you can provide it.

Its the same thing with plants, a serious grow means anticipating and providing for their needs which is hard to do before you have determined what exactly they are. For me, even though my effort is consistent its usually not until a plants third or fourth generation from clone that I feel like I can maximize their potential within the limits of my setup, up to that point its still more of a learning experience. Maybe I'm way off base so correct me if I'm wrong but that's what it seems like you are saying.

I totally get it but I dont see how that gets you the best plants to clone. Maybe a mediocre plant you keep making gains with would be the best to hope for in that case. How would you know?

Most of the plants i have grown were from seed. I thought the trick to this was to watch plants and learn what they are telling us so we can continually speed up our reaction time to issues to get the most potential out of the plant as possible.

When i pick and reveg one to run again i wont likely do much better than the first time. But i will have picked a plant that i was able to already get amazing results from.

 

[Aqua Man]

I totally get it but I dont see how that gets you the best plants to clone. Maybe a mediocre plant you keep making gains with would be the best to hope for in that case. How would you know?

Most of the plants i have grown were from seed. I thought the trick to this was to watch plants and learn what they are telling us so we can continually speed up our reaction time to issues to get the most potential out of the plant as possible.

When i pick and reveg one to run again i wont likely do much better than the first time. But i will have picked a plant that i was able to already get amazing results from.

Can you explain what you think I'm doing because I think there is some confusion. What do you see that I'm doing that doesn't get me the best plant to clone?

I have clones of all of the plants I'm growing already.. I vegged them for I don't remember now 5-6 weeks. I'm flowering them now and will dry and cure... After smoking and weighing the structures of the plants, yields, quality I will chose a mother of which right now is a clone growing until I choose which on I want... The clones of the chosen plant will be the mother? Please tell me where I went wrong here