Dudded, Stunted, and Runted plants...

[We Solidarity]

Due to the size of this thread, I kind of feel like this post deserves a thread of its own. That, or I can put edit the very first post to add this to it.

You may recall lilmisslone, who some years ago had an issue with root aphids that led to what she and her husband determined was barley yellow dwarf virus in their rooms. I still feel badly for telling her she had bugs in her eyes, and I did indeed learn my lesson!

For now it would be great to get it edited to the first post, there will absolutely be a separate follow-up thread once we begin studying the aphids, which will be sometime this week. Thank you @Seamaiden

 

[Seamaiden]

Ha! I'm psychic, I just edited the first post and stickied the thread. I thought it was already stickied. I made it so.

 

[We Solidarity]

You may recall lilmisslone, who some years ago had an issue with root aphids that led to what she and her husband determined was barley yellow dwarf virus in their rooms. I still feel badly for telling her she had bugs in her eyes, and I did indeed learn my lesson!

I never saw that thread, maybe it was before my time...is there a link you can dig up? Would love to see it.

 

[Seamaiden]

Hmm... it was before that big server migration, when we lost a lot of threads and such. Let me see if I can find it using Google, might still be cached. Damn, this is taking me a while. I've finally found her username at least. Now I've gotta go through the threads.



I can't find the post(s) discussing the barley streak virus. I can't seem to pull up any threads she's started, so I think they may have been lost in the changeover.

 

[Freakshow]

given the fact that some folks have said that placing their affected plants outside alleviated these symptoms, has anyone tried the new ful spectrum fluoros from Hortilux? They give off both UVa and UVb. I added a 400 watt MH set up to my veg area and the plants under that light are doing great. I'm thinking of adding the fluoros to my mom set up and my smaller veg area

 

[GrowGod]

given the fact that some folks have said that placing their affected plants outside alleviated these symptoms, has anyone tried the new ful spectrum fluoros from Hortilux? They give off both UVa and UVb. I added a 400 watt MH set up to my veg area and the plants under that light are doing great. I'm thinking of adding the fluoros to my mom set up and my smaller veg area

Does this mean we can tan while we tend? :D

 

[outwest]

Does this mean we can tan while we tend? :D

That would be TANtastic!

outwest

:);):D:(:mad::sweating::smoking::cool::p:cry::badboy::crying2::drunk::drunk2::shockedninja::ninja::fire::puke::opps::sleep::mushtache::kiss::speechless::eyepiece::puke2::party1::love2::love1:

 

[GrowGod]

That would be TANtastic!

outwest

:);):D:(:mad::sweating::smoking::cool::p:cry::badboy::crying2::drunk::drunk2::shockedninja::ninja::fire::puke::opps::sleep::mushtache::kiss::speechless::eyepiece::puke2::party1::love2::love1:

Then my wife can get dome sun with the rest of the bitches! :cry: I kid I kid

 

[zeKemyst]

From your description there you most likely have a systemic virus. I have had this before with orchids. If so then that is a real pain in the ass, you're best off dumping the line and being very careful not to contaminate other strains. Its not always possible to detect a virus (they various DNA tests) unless there is something similar already in the data base.

I and many other members on the farm have been searching for a thread on this to no avail. Hopefully this thread helps us figure out what, exactly, this dudding syndrome is.


So when I clone off of a mother plant I have a few genetics that will throw "duds". dud plants grow regular until some point in the first two months when they will suddenly stop normal growth, throw out tiny leaves with lots (7-9) of blades, lots of nodes, and usually will throw large mature pistils at the nodes. Trying to bend the branches usually will break the branch off, and over time the plant's healthy leaves will turn necrotic and begin twisting/dying.

Plants that dud out never produce a decent yield and almost always have a sub-par smell (if any) and very few trichomes. They also smoke like shit.

I'll dig through for some pictures but it's strangely difficult to photograph, even next to a comparison plant.

Any ideas as to what we're seeing? I'm looking near and far for a lab that can do testing for various viruses, the top of the list are Barley Yellow Dwarf Virus (transmitted by aphids) and Fusarium, although these syptoms don't match the syptoms of fusarium I've heard reports from commercial growers of duds testing positive.

Another possibility is a carbon drain on the plant due to an overabundance of nutrient-mobilizing fungi, @DowNwithDirT was looking into this and hopefully can swing in to shed some light (he's been busy winning cups and popping beans so we'll see)

Even still, it could be caused by some sort of change in the media when soilless media is overwatered (oxygen deprivation : overfertilization?) since this problem seems to be mostly in soilless mixes.


let's go, what you got to add?!

This post has been edited to add the following:

From your description there you most likely have a systemic virus. I know because I have had this exact problem before with orchids and it is a real pain in the ass. If thats the case you're best off dumping the line and being very careful not to contaminate other strains. Its not always possible to detect a virus (they various DNA tests) unless there is something similar already in the data base, and it is generally even harder to eliminate them

 

[darkmadder]

@We Solidarity your the man.

 

[We Solidarity]

From your description there you most likely have a systemic virus. I have had this before with orchids. If so then that is a real pain in the ass, you're best off dumping the line and being very careful not to contaminate other strains. Its not always possible to detect a virus (they various DNA tests) unless there is something similar already in the data base.

From your description there you most likely have a systemic virus. I know because I have had this exact problem before with orchids and it is a real pain in the ass. If thats the case you're best off dumping the line and being very careful not to contaminate other strains. Its not always possible to detect a virus (they various DNA tests) unless there is something similar already in the data base, and it is generally even harder to eliminate them

I'm about to sequence the DNA of root aphids along side dudded plant tissue and plant tissue that is healthy from another garden and source (both the same genetic). Hoping we will be able to find the virus in root aphids since there is lots of genetic research on the viruses transmitted by them, then be able to match it between the plant and the aphids.


If anyone with any experience with nematodes is still reading this thread, or if you know people on another forum dealing with confirmed nematodes I would love to speak with them- I could do this same test with nematodes if I found any alive.

 

[CannaTech]

I'm about to sequence the DNA of root aphids along side dudded plant tissue and plant tissue that is healthy from another garden and source (both the same genetic). Hoping we will be able to find the virus in root aphids since there is lots of genetic research on the viruses transmitted by them, then be able to match it between the plant and the aphids.


If anyone with any experience with nematodes is still reading this thread, or if you know people on another forum dealing with confirmed nematodes I would love to speak with them- I could do this same test with nematodes if I found any alive.

What abilities do you have as far as sequencing goes? Please inbox me W.S. I would like to discuss some things with you on this topic as well as others.

 

[persiankid]

I'm about to sequence the DNA of root aphids along side dudded plant tissue and plant tissue that is healthy from another garden and source (both the same genetic). Hoping we will be able to find the virus in root aphids since there is lots of genetic research on the viruses transmitted by them, then be able to match it between the plant and the aphids.


If anyone with any experience with nematodes is still reading this thread, or if you know people on another forum dealing with confirmed nematodes I would love to speak with them- I could do this same test with nematodes if I found any alive.

This is amazing.. thank you for doing this research!

 

[Seamaiden]

given the fact that some folks have said that placing their affected plants outside alleviated these symptoms, has anyone tried the new ful spectrum fluoros from Hortilux? They give off both UVa and UVb. I added a 400 watt MH set up to my veg area and the plants under that light are doing great. I'm thinking of adding the fluoros to my mom set up and my smaller veg area

Didn't work for the dud I had. She just flowered dudded out.

 

[Freakshow]

what kind of furnace and water heater do you have in your house? Propane? Natural Gas? Electric?

the reason I ask is my whole garden just dudded out. The problem happened as winter set in and the furnace use started and increased. I have a natural gas furnace and water heater.

I realize I'm grasping at straws here but last summer I was at least growing decent buds. Now the winter has come, the furnace and water heater use has increase and my all of my moms have dudded within the last month and a half. Has anyone thought about elevated Carbon Monoxide levels causing this?

 

[Freakshow]

Starting tonight, I am rebuilding part of the chimney the water heater and furnace exhaust into and adding an inline powered exhaust fan to the exhaust piping. I'm praying this helps

 

[GrowGod]

what kind of furnace and water heater do you have in your house? Propane? Natural Gas? Electric?

the reason I ask is my whole garden just dudded out. The problem happened as winter set in and the furnace use started and increased. I have a natural gas furnace and water heater.

I realize I'm grasping at straws here but last summer I was at least growing decent buds. Now the winter has come, the furnace and water heater use has increase and my all of my moms have dudded within the last month and a half. Has anyone thought about elevated Carbon Monoxide levels causing this?

Damn bro you still dealing with duds? Is this the freak show who was friends with smalltime?

 

[Freakshow]

Not sure i know smalltime. I happen to notice everything duds when the furnace starts being used more often. So I am taking measures to fix the exhaust

 

[Seamaiden]

what kind of furnace and water heater do you have in your house? Propane? Natural Gas? Electric?

the reason I ask is my whole garden just dudded out. The problem happened as winter set in and the furnace use started and increased. I have a natural gas furnace and water heater.

I realize I'm grasping at straws here but last summer I was at least growing decent buds. Now the winter has come, the furnace and water heater use has increase and my all of my moms have dudded within the last month and a half. Has anyone thought about elevated Carbon Monoxide levels causing this?

I had a dud last year. Grown 100% outdoors.

 

[xavier7995]

I am kind of happy to hear it isn't some sort of weed eel/monster. I wound up here because I have some seeds that are just not taking hold like they should and it has been driving me crazy trying to figure out what I am doing wrong. Hearing that tahoe og was one of the strains this was more prevalent in gave me some hope that I wasn't just a dumbass that couldnt get a weed to grow as that is part of the cross. I have tried a couple of mediums/methods and so far just an absolutely dismal success rate. The seeds pop, you get the nice little taproot to show up, then they just sit there and die. Most talk on here seems clone related, so I hope I am not barking up the wrong tree. I should note that some other strains popped up just fine, all are from a well respected breeder so I don't really think it is bad seeds perse and if so they just wouldn't pop. Most of teh fails were in coco, but have some in soil right now that are doing the same thing so I don't think it is from re-using the coco from my last grow and having it still be hot.

I have never washed seeds to disinfect them, never even occurred to me that it could be an issue. That is a really good practice I am going to adopt though.