DWC Plants Dying Please Help

[TheOhmOne]

It's strange seeing root rot with controlled water temps. In regards to water levels I wouldn't say that was the issue, personally I fill up my system as full as I can get it, usually the pots sit in an inch of solution and right now when I switched to an air cloner to a straight out bath I saw much better rooting in my clones. I think you should start over. Try adding silica to your feed, it acts as an anti fungal, humics and fulvics are amazing too to help buffer a lot of things and kelp extract is awesome too for plant health and defence. I've got this in photos on my current diary here if you want to see what I was talking about.

Hey Mospeada!!
Thank you for the reply. I really appreciate it.
when, what type and how do you recommend I add the silica to the res?

I was going too add silica once they were going along better, never have experienced growth this slow.
Thanx again

 

[TheOhmOne]

Raise your pots and you'll see a big difference. Some cuttings just start off rough, yours are saveable.

The water line has been lowered and I already see new root growth Growing from the toP. :)

 

[TheOhmOne]

The plants are hungry but feeding them more now is like asking someone to eat while you are choking them. With the rockwool more dry and properly oxygenated, humidity at least close to 50%, and all rot removed from the reservoir, they will eventually recover and need more food. Most of what you feed them now is just going to the bad microbes anyway.

Yes.
Water level has been lowered. And I am adding a humidifier to get RH hopefully above 40% consistently.

In your option is is better the start withfrssh clones ? Or can I make up for this much stress during veg?

here’s current res and climate conditions



Thank you for the feedback

 

[TheOhmOne]

Honestly
I grow in a humid environment I cannot say much about vpn..... the lack there of, its not a problem I experience.
I can say lower your water level, you have soaked Rw, they don't feed well with rotting roots. Once they tap into the rez u need to be much lower or you are playing with fire.
And your ppms are very low imo, I run 700+ at that point.
As for the 3 inch net pots, I would never grow any adult plant in anything less than 5, I use 6, some can do 4 inch, but I have 2 inch stalks in my dwc, 3 is way to tight for a large plant. Maybe auto flowers can roll in 3.

I was under the impression the net pot only helped support the plant. I figured with the large res, and likely all the roots becoming one large mass, coupled with the Scrog and LST, that they would have enough support. I do normally use 6” , so this is a huge jump for me. I wanted to cut veg time by doubling plant quantity.

Regarding the PPM I agree. It’s low. But it also isn’t going down. It’s rising if anything.
with The rockwool being soaked I’d assume they were just able to take up so little nutrients.?

I was hoping to fill this 5x5 space.
Do you think these 3” net pots will pose an issue later on?
Thanx for the feedback!!

 

[TheOhmOne]

Current photos

 

[Aqua Man]

Ok few questions... but first reduce the light intensity until you get things sorted. Your pushing plants that are unhealthy.

What h2o2 are you using and at what dosage how often?

I dont like the idea of rockwool for dwc. Personally I think it stays to wet and would agree with others on lowering the water because of this.

You should be pouring a few cups from the top a week not only to prevent salt buildup bit also to get the h2o2 to the rest of the root zone. The roots in the water may reap the benefits bit the ones not will be more susceptible to rot because they aren't.

Temps mean shit when it comes to root rot all lower temps do is slow the progression they dont prevent it.

You need to gently wash the roots in temp adjusted tap water daily to remove any slime.

I have never seen Personally h2o2 cure root rot once you have it... prevent it yes bit not cure. Other may have but I haven't. So I would consider switch to hydrogaurd or southern ag fungicide.

What is the ph drift in 24 hrs now? Using RO water and not adding a buffer back can make for large ph swings and very unhappy plants and roots.

300ppm is fine for them at this stage.

Remove the foil over the hydroton as others suggested.

If continuing with h2o2 consider hygrozyme or komplete enzymes to help keep healthy roots. Again at least once a week pouring from the top to ensure all roots are in contact with products and h2o2.

Just some thoughts and questions

 

[TheOhmOne]

Great! Thank you AquaMan !! I appreciate the detailed response.

I apologize , I’m not sure if I mentioned this. But the ROI720 Light was at 25% for the 1st 10 days, currently its at 50%.How do I determine how much umol or intensity to give the plants at any given time during the grow?


I do have hydroguard on hand. Do you recommend using it? If so how much per gallon? How do I add it to the Rez? Would I then stop the H202? Is there any negatives to using Hydroguard ?

I was running h202 at .5ml per gallon at the start, once I noticed the root discoloration I upped to 3ml per gallon for 3 days straight and then back to 1ml per gallon there after every other day.

I honestly just don’t like the idea behind adding h202 and I’m not well educated enough to make a sound choice behind this. When in doubt, I like to play things safe. I guess ultimately risking a run now playing it too safe? .
Can you briefly educate me on the effects h202 might have on the final product if used a X amount throughout the grow?

Do you consider this root rot as well? What would you say was the main culprit for this if so?

When your referring to top feeding the net pots, the solution that’s used, is that RO water alone?, RO ph adjusted ? Do I just scoop the nutrients from the res and pour a cup or so over each plant? Sorry I’ve never top fed.
I would stop top feeding once roofs are well established though no?

Similarly, should I be misting the plants with water if my humidity is on the low side? If so RO water? PH adjusted? Ext..

The Res PH is remaining pretty stable though this all surprisingly. At the beginning (1st 10 days or so), I was adjusting once every 24 hours with a PH swing of no more than
.8- 1PH. I was adding on average 5ml of PH down total to the 30 gallon res daily.

The last 10 days of so, the PH remains stable at 5.6-5.9 range. I haven’t added PH up or down in 10 days. I’ve only added PH up once, and that’s after the 1st Res change, the PH was too low initially. I added a total of 2.5ml of PH up.

Currently when I add nutrients and top off, the PH is climbing back up around 5.9 and then very slowly dropping again.

5.5 is the lowest I’ve seen in the last 10 days. With 6.0 being the highest.

The lowest Ph since the start is 5.4 when I would add PH down when the PH was rising.
I usually lowered to 5.5-5.6 but a few times it reached 5.4 for no more than a few hours.

PPM has pretty much maintained throughout this whole grow so far. They have climbed and fallen 10-20 points over 24hrs , and then dropped back down and bounced back up from day to day really.

I’ve always ran a few inch air gap between water line and netpot, never any issues at all. At all.
How do you recommend I combat the increased risk of rot from the air gap?



To be Frank, only Top Shelf Cannabis is of use to me. I have absolutely no issue with giving away lbs of entire crops to family and friends if it is nit suitable for me.Sounds a little crazy, but over the years, I’ve developed a very specific taste and need. I enjoy watching and actively growing all different types of stains. But I will ultimately only actual consume very few.

Moral is and Final question, Do you think the overall quality and yield will be effected by this stress if I continue to push through and fight this off potentially?
If and when starting over, what do you recommend I change exactly to reduce the risk of hindering the crops quality and yield potentials.

Thanx again AquaMan! Your time is valued .

 

[TheOhmOne]

+1 for apparent root-rot. I dealt with this on my first grow. Anti-fungal may be too late to fully rescue this grow, but it's worth a shot.

Do you have any photos of the Rot ?

Did you only change one variable from the time you had the rot, until the time the rot disappeared?

What’s the biggest risk/factor that you’ve found while growing via dwc, or just cannabis in general.
Thanx for your time Nate!

 

[TheOhmOne]

Here is an example of a 3hr fluctuation I will get.


4 degree water temp change. I actually let the water temp raise from 64-65 all the way to 68 and then lower again.

10 ppm change

.1 ph change.
This may just be the tolerance of the meter at play??

The room temperature fluctuates way more. But only .4 in these 3 hours, the RH grew by nearly 10%. Normally though the temperature is never more than 10f different in 24 hours , and never more than 30% RH. Normally around 5 degrees F, and 10% RH it remains. Sometimes there is random spikes throughout the day, likely related to the ambient room temp the tent sits in??

 

[GreatWhiteShart]

Lol
"To be Frank, only Top Shelf Cannabis is of use to me. I have absolutely no issue with giving away lbs of entire crops to family and friends if it is nit suitable for me.Sounds a little crazy, but over the years, I’ve developed a very specific taste and need. I enjoy watching and actively growing all different types of stains. But I will ultimately only actual consume very few"
Dude, I cant be blunt enough, if you want to grow top shelf herb, maybe you should have spent less money on crap, gadgets, and nonsense. You really need to do the leg work, you might be better off just buying weed. You jumped into hydro and you can't even understand that roots cant be soaked and need fresh air.....top shelf....!!!???
Comon man.... practice makes perfect..
Most of your first grows will be total shit, everybody's are....
This hobby is one of epik phailures and learning. I would take a long hard look at what you want to accomplish. I have been doing this for 15 years and I can say that it's not a quick learn hobby.
You cannot fast forward learning, and if you only want to grow top shelf, sell your stuff to a friend and buy a zip bro!

Its like sitting on the couch eating a twinky wondering why you don't have a shredded 6 pack

Rofl cheers man

 

[TheOhmOne]

Ok shoot. One last thing.

My light cycle is 24/0. Never turned off since start.
I’ve always grown this way during veg.
It’s been years though. I just though of this and I know that 18/6 was recommended by a lot of people and I believe even shown to be beneficial in studies.

any advice here? Is this an issue?

 

[Aqua Man]

Great! Thank you AquaMan !! I appreciate the detailed response.

I apologize , I’m not sure if I mentioned this. But the ROI720 Light was at 25% for the 1st 10 days, currently its at 50%.How do I determine how much umol or intensity to give the plants at any given time during the grow?


I do have hydroguard on hand. Do you recommend using it? If so how much per gallon? How do I add it to the Rez? Would I then stop the H202? Is there any negatives to using Hydroguard ?

I was running h202 at .5ml per gallon at the start, once I noticed the root discoloration I upped to 3ml per gallon for 3 days straight and then back to 1ml per gallon there after every other day.

I honestly just don’t like the idea behind adding h202 and I’m not well educated enough to make a sound choice behind this. When in doubt, I like to play things safe. I guess ultimately risking a run now playing it too safe? .
Can you briefly educate me on the effects h202 might have on the final product if used a X amount throughout the grow?

Do you consider this root rot as well? What would you say was the main culprit for this if so?

When your referring to top feeding the net pots, the solution that’s used, is that RO water alone?, RO ph adjusted ? Do I just scoop the nutrients from the res and pour a cup or so over each plant? Sorry I’ve never top fed.
I would stop top feeding once roofs are well established though no?

Similarly, should I be misting the plants with water if my humidity is on the low side? If so RO water? PH adjusted? Ext..

The Res PH is remaining pretty stable though this all surprisingly. At the beginning (1st 10 days or so), I was adjusting once every 24 hours with a PH swing of no more than
.8- 1PH. I was adding on average 5ml of PH down total to the 30 gallon res daily.

The last 10 days of so, the PH remains stable at 5.6-5.9 range. I haven’t added PH up or down in 10 days. I’ve only added PH up once, and that’s after the 1st Res change, the PH was too low initially. I added a total of 2.5ml of PH up.

Currently when I add nutrients and top off, the PH is climbing back up around 5.9 and then very slowly dropping again.

5.5 is the lowest I’ve seen in the last 10 days. With 6.0 being the highest.

The lowest Ph since the start is 5.4 when I would add PH down when the PH was rising.
I usually lowered to 5.5-5.6 but a few times it reached 5.4 for no more than a few hours.

PPM has pretty much maintained throughout this whole grow so far. They have climbed and fallen 10-20 points over 24hrs , and then dropped back down and bounced back up from day to day really.

I’ve always ran a few inch air gap between water line and netpot, never any issues at all. At all.
How do you recommend I combat the increased risk of rot from the air gap?



To be Frank, only Top Shelf Cannabis is of use to me. I have absolutely no issue with giving away lbs of entire crops to family and friends if it is nit suitable for me.Sounds a little crazy, but over the years, I’ve developed a very specific taste and need. I enjoy watching and actively growing all different types of stains. But I will ultimately only actual consume very few.

Moral is and Final question, Do you think the overall quality and yield will be effected by this stress if I continue to push through and fight this off potentially?
If and when starting over, what do you recommend I change exactly to reduce the risk of hindering the crops quality and yield potentials.

Thanx again AquaMan! Your time is valued .

I do have on hand. Do you recommend using it? If so how much per gallon? How do I add it to the Rez? Would I then stop the H202? Is there any negatives to using ?

Hydrogaurd at 2 ml a gal. Rinse the roots in temp adjusted tap water for 3-4 days one a day. Be very gentle and just use your fingers to remove any slime. Don't beat them up. And never use h2o2 with hydroguard.

I apologize , I’m not sure if I mentioned this. But the ROI720 Light was at 25% for the 1st 10 days, currently its at 50%.How do I determine how much umol or intensity to give the plants at any given time during the grow?

if you have an android you can try using light meter by my mobile tools dev. As long as its true full spectrum and not blurple it will get you close. I would say 25k lix for now till they recover.

was running h202 at .5ml per gallon at the start, once I noticed the root discoloration I upped to 3ml per gallon for 3 days straight and then back to 1ml per gallon there after every other day

what strength of h202? Thats important and it should be added every 3 days or so.

Can you briefly educate me on the effects h202 might have on the final product if used a X amount throughout the grow?

H2o2 has no negative effects directly. Its used to kill and keep and bacteria etc good and bad from populating in the system. Nothing wrong with using it.

Do you consider this root rot as well? What would you say was the main culprit for this if so?

It is an infection of something or a bacterial bloom i do see some dark spots that appear to be rot

When your referring to top feeding the net pots, the solution that’s used, is that RO water alone?, RO ph adjusted ? Do I just scoop the nutrients from the res and pour a cup or so over each plant? Sorry I’ve never top fed.
I would stop top feeding once roofs are well established though no?

top feeding is simply pouring some nutrient solution from the res once a week. Over time salts can build up and affect the roots directly in the media. They also don't get apposed to much of the h2o2 or hydrogaurd so doing this once a week is beneficial.

Similarly, should I be misting the plants with water if my humidity is on the low side? If so RO water? PH adjusted? Ext..

Imo do not miat the plants. Try to get the humidity up bit the light is going to make the issue worse if you drive them to hard in low humidity
Hydroguard

 

[TheOhmOne]

Lol
"To be Frank, only Top Shelf Cannabis is of use to me. I have absolutely no issue with giving away lbs of entire crops to family and friends if it is nit suitable for me.Sounds a little crazy, but over the years, I’ve developed a very specific taste and need. I enjoy watching and actively growing all different types of stains. But I will ultimately only actual consume very few"
Dude, I cant be blunt enough, if you want to grow top shelf herb, maybe you should have spent less money on crap, gadgets, and nonsense. You really need to do the leg work, you might be better off just buying weed. You jumped into hydro and you can't even understand that roots cant be soaked and need fresh air.....top shelf....!!!???
Comon man.... practice makes perfect..
Most of your first grows will be total shit, everybody's are....
This hobby is one of epik phailures and learning. I would take a long hard look at what you want to accomplish. I have been doing this for 15 years and I can say that it's not a quick learn hobby.
You cannot fast forward learning, and if you only want to grow top shelf, sell your stuff to a friend and buy a zip bro!

Its like sitting on the couch eating a twinky wondering why you don't have a shredded 6 pack

Rofl cheers man

Interesting .I’ve had well over 20 harvests throughout my lifetime. The first 10 or so were soil based, ever since has been DWC strictly. First a 5 gallon bucket, then 10 gallon cooler, then 60 gallon custom tote a few times.

The only difference now, I’ve never ran a 120L sized cooler, with 3” net pots. Normally 6-8”. I normally grow 1-3 monster plants. The 3” net pots were extremely hard to get fitted into the lid of the cooler. They did not fit as expected. Since the lid of the cooler is so thick, the 3” net pots barley dropped below the lid inside. This is much different conceptually than anything I’ve done before. I also normally don’t use the cooler Lid, I normally make my own out of insulation.

Clearly top feeding is a basic procedure, however I’ve never had to top feed my dwc ever. I’ve had root masses bigger than myself. It took 2 people to lift the 60 gallon tote lids when full size.

I’ve had very very good luck with all my past grows. Never a single pest, root issue, or major deficiencies. The biggest issue I’ve had in DWC is the branches begin to get hard to support on such large plants. I can never figure out how navigate around the Scrog screen enough to reach all the sites.

I normally run res temps 65-68f
Water line 3-4” below after rooting
PPM get adjusted as plant uptakes indicates
Nutrients I’ve used are Lucus Formula, and AN Sensi grow.
Cal mag supplements
PK boosters
Silica supplement
And I think I’ve tried one or two of ANs plethora of products on my 1st dwc grows.
But I really got excellent If not better results on the 4 main nutrients listed above.

Maybe I pose questions in the wrong way , but I’d prefer when asking questions on forums to really let others speak on what’s worked for them. Just to gather all the first hand information available, Also in part to help many other growers who may be in a similar situation and not sure exactly what to do.
By breaking this down, I feel like I may also help someone else in the future.
I know what I’ve done in the past, and now something isn’t working. Which is why I come onto the forums.

I may or may not have known answers to many questions I asked. But it never hurts to get confirmation when abnormal situations occur.

Additionally a large number of people learn how to grow cannabis from forums alone. But I strongly feel that having Overly clear, Detailed, all bases covered info with multiple experienced members weighing is, is nothing but beneficial for anyone who happens to take the time to read.

It is the second you get complacent and think you have everything down, that you get smacked in the face with reality. Which may have happened to me here, which is why I’m covering all bases again.

It’s not as if I didn’t know the air gap was needed.... I always run the air gap. I had the air gap when I discovered the brown roots, but after some research I decided to raise it back up. (The research i found indicated that the air gap was merely creating roots that transport nutrients, and was not needed if enough air was present throughout res. This was the first time I encountered such an issue, and it was clearly a bad decision or so appears. The key is I forgot about how much moisture the rockwool cube would hold.

To be clear the water line was never in full contact with the rockwool cube.

 

[GreatWhiteShart]

O.o
Yo,
I'm sorry you are having issues, but you really need to take your time and do alot of work with your system. You should have dialed that in with a dry run and no plants.

I never dont speak my mind but I seriously doubt you have never had a issue in 10 grows dwc besides large branches, and cant even run a dwc without basic issues being resolved.

I hope you can get your girls back on track man.

Be cool man

 

[Aqua Man]

. You jumped into hydro and you can't even understand that roots cant be soaked and need fresh air.....top shelf....!!!???

You couldn't be more wrong here. The reason I agreed about lowering the water is that with a small root system and much of it in the rockwool it won't get the air exchange it needs and act like it's overwatered. The roots then suffer and rot can set in.

If you ask me this was just a simple improper dosing of hydrogen peroxide. I still don't know the concentration he is using.

Water temps do not cause root rot and pythium as there are several different strains has no issues growing in cool water.

You can run your net pots under water once you have an established root system. Its the transition from cubes, rapid rooters etc thats why you don't soak en. If done in a aqua cloner they can go right into hydroton and fully submerged. Roots in hydo get o2 from the water you don't need them to be exposed. My waterline is kept as close to 1" as possible at all times.

Top feeding is not necessary but good practice. How many grows you see with white hydroton on top? and yea I have seen ppl have issues from it.

 

[TheOhmOne]

You couldn't be more wrong here. The reason I agreed about lowering the water is that with a small root system and much of it in the rockwool it won't get the air exchange it needs and act like it's overwatered. The roots then suffer and rot can set in.

If you ask me this was just a simple improper dosing of hydrogen peroxide. I still don't know the concentration he is using.

Water temps do not cause root rot and pythium as there are several different strains has no issues growing in cool water.

You can run your net pots under water once you have an established root system. Its the transition from cubes, rapid rooters etc thats why you don't soak en. If done in a aqua cloner they can go right into hydroton and fully submerged. Roots in hydo get o2 from the water you don't need them to be exposed. My waterline is kept as close to 1" as possible at all times.

Top feeding is not necessary but good practice. How many grows you see with white hydroton on top? and yea I have seen ppl have issues from it.

I do not normally run h202 throughout. I use it in small amount if I feel the res may be a little less than fresh.

If purchasing clones rooted in rockwool, what do you recommend I do to get the best results? Ive never grown by seed , but hope as things become more stable, that I’ll be able to maintain a setup that allows me to do so more confidently.
I always have white buildup on the clay pebbles after harvest. Normally on the entire walls of the netpot, and also most of the balls are white that are on the outside perimeter.

 

[Aqua Man]

I do not normally run h202 throughout. I use it in small amount if I feel the res may be a little less than fresh.

If purchasing clones rooted in rockwool, what do you recommend I do to get the best results? Ive never grown by seed , but hope as things become more stable, that I’ll be able to maintain a setup that allows me to do so more confidently.
I always have white buildup on the clay pebbles after harvest. Normally on the entire walls of the netpot, and also most of the balls are white that are on the outside perimeter.

The white is just salt build up from the ferts. Top feeding once a week just to keep it clear helps. Like I said not necessary but good practice.

I dont run sterile so one of those guys can hopefully help ya there. I do know you want to start with a good hydrogen peroxide like 30%.

With rockwool you just need to make sure it doesn't stay soaked. So keeping the water from being close to the cube will help.

Imo you either need a proper dose at proper time of h2o2 or hydrogaurd (etc beneficial bacteria)

Enzymes like hygrozyme and komplete also help keep rots nice and cleaned up and healthy.

Just my opinions but there are many ways to skin a cat.

 

[TheOhmOne]

Sweet deal man I appreciate the advice !

I apologize if this has been covered, but what exactly is your take on what happened here and why?

Do you run hydroguard? What nutrients and other supplements do you use ?


Thanx

 

[Nate_in_AK]

Do you have any photos of the Rot ?

Did you only change one variable from the time you had the rot, until the time the rot disappeared?

What’s the biggest risk/factor that you’ve found while growing via dwc, or just cannabis in general.
Thanx for your time Nate!

See my first grow....

Newb first time grower starting to feel like I have a black thumb...

pH was up this afternoon. I cut the nutrient strength in half again and fixed the pH; should now be about 25% of vendor recommendation. As requested - root pictures. BlackBerry Kush: Bubbagum: As previously stated, the roots don't smell odd to me, and they don't feel slimy at all, so...

www.thcfarmer.com

While high temps certainly didn't help, my root rot problem was caused by my own stupidity. My air pump somehow got turned all the way down. I'm not sure how long it was like that before I figured it out. You know I taped that sucker on MAX now!.

 

[Nate_in_AK]

What’s the biggest risk/factor that you’ve found while growing via dwc, or just cannabis in general.
Thanx for your time Nate!

This might sound sarcastic, but it's not: The biggest risk factor is ME!

Everything that has gone wrong with my plants has been my own fault.

I over-watered Blueberry this grow and she is barely making a comeback.

But.... it's a learning process. Of course I made mistakes. Hopefully I'll complete a perfect grow from start to finish before I die.