F1 autoflower early flowering stage - what issue do you think i have?

[Waffleman]

Hi there!

So initially everything was going well, the plant was growing well however I started seeing some discoloration on the leaves. (I will attach some pictures)

- The soil is a mix of regular soil, perlite, coco

- humidity now during flower 40-50%

- temp between 22-26 Celsius

- Currently, middle of week 2 flower

Just to paint you a picture, this is what I can say for the potential problems:

1. I'm thinking its nutrient lockout? + overwatering potentially. -> This is my second grow, first grow was photoperiod outdoor. On my first grow I think I was more on the side of underwatering but the outside rain took care of that a bit. I never watered until run off, so this time I wanted to water until run off but I might've pushed it too far. When the plant got strong enough I would start watering until runoff. The run off would be about 15-20% of what I gave the plant. I recently upped it and I did notice afterwards that the leaves were drooping a bit and the tips of some leaves were slightly twisting. (but keep in mind that point 2 below happened around the same time as the upping of the amount of water. So not sure if one issue is masking the other or vice versa.)

2. Light stress. It could of course be a combination. However when the plant hit flower, according to my light directions I could lower it to a distance of 12-18 inches. I went for 12 because in my mind, more light = better but of course too much of a good thing can be a bad thing. I now (since yesterday) set the light up to 18 inches.

My next steps would be:

1. See if moving the light up makes a difference
2. if it is nutrient lockout (which I have a feeling it might be), I will let the soil dry out of a bit more and then flush the medium. After wards let it dry out again and then start giving it nutrients but I will probably start give it less than I did before and build up the amount, rather than just going by the amount that is on the bottle.

What do you all think the issue might be (based on the information and photos) + what would you all suggest for next steps? I can tell I still have lots to learn in understanding my plants language.

Any advice is much appreciated!

Regards,

Waffleman

 

[GNick55]

stop flushing and watering with run off,..
your light at 18 inches, mmm not sure about that seems still a bit close though i use hid lights, but someone else will know about led light distance,.
what kind of nutrients and how much do you feed?
looks like your around 4 weeks flowering,.

 

[Waffleman]

stop flushing and watering with run off,..
your light at 18 inches, mmm not sure about that seems still a bit close though i use hid lights, but someone else will know about led light distance,.
what kind of nutrients and how much do you feed?
looks like your around 4 weeks flowering,.

Thanks for the reply!

Yea the F1 is basically an even faster autoflower. Which might not have been a good thing to try for my second grow, lol. It started showing tiny pistils on january 18 (pistils weren't showing everywhere, just a couple really light ones, so I counted this as day 1 of flower). So today would be 2 weeks of flower. (but this is in F1 speed so might be week 4 by normal standards)

So to reset the soil would you recommend I still flush it one more time with clean water (no nutrients)? Or just keep giving it nutrient water but dont water until runoff?

I'm currently giving it the bio booster from RQS. (https://www.royalqueenseeds.com/growing/579-bio-flowering-booster.html)

As far as the lights are concerned I have the spider farm SF1000, according to the manual they recommend 12-18 inches from the canopy during flower. So I just went with the lowest number first because I thought hurdur more light intensity = better. Which was a mistake but not sure if the source of the issue.

 

[GNick55]

i would raise the light to 25 inches,.. manufacture recommendations are only if plants are 100% completely healthy,.
stop flushing and watering with run off,.
f1 auto means nothing to me and faster compared to what?
it’s all bullshit,.
your plant is around 4 weeks flowering,..
are you feeding with all three bottles with every watering?
following manufactures amount recommendations also?..

 

[GNick55]

show me if you can what discolouration you seen to cause you to flush etc etc,..
plant got worse since you been trying to fix it?

 

[Waffleman]

i would raise the light to 25 inches,.. manufacture recommendations are only if plants are 100% completely healthy,.
stop flushing and watering with run off,.
f1 auto means nothing to me and faster compared to what?
it’s all bullshit,.
your plant is around 4 weeks flowering,..
are you feeding with all three bottles with every watering?
following manufactures amount recommendations also?..

Okay I will give that a try!

In regards to the feeding, I started giving one of the bottles once the first true leaves appeared. Afterwards kept giving the 1 bottle, then according to the instruction around week 2 of flower you start introducing the second bottle. And then later into flower you add the third bottle. Initially I was feeding it less than the recommended amount on the bottle. However once it started (from my count) week 2 of flower I gave i the full amount they recommend of bottle 1 & 2. And again basically flushed it with it (again I thought watering until run off was what you were supposed to do)

 

[Waffleman]

show me if you can what discolouration you seen to cause you to flush etc etc,..
plant got worse since you been trying to fix it?

Hmm so I might have been flushing it unintentionally? Reading up online about watering cannabis indoors, I found information stating that you should (when the plant is grown enough, not during seedling phase) water until you get about 15-20% run off. Since I started doing it I didn't immediately notice an issue. However over time as the plant got bigger, more water was needed to get to the same % of run off. It's a 5L pot and when the plan got pretty big I started with giving it 3L in one sitting. Which gave a decent amount of runoff but not quite that percentage and overtime it went up to 5L of water in one watering session.

I would do this each time the top 3cm of the soil felt dry. (about every 3 days)

Maybe about 2 weeks ago I noticed some leaves showcasing some discoloration and wilting of the tips of the leaves. But since I was leaf tucking I thought maybe its because it was tucked away from the sunlight etc.. and therefore wasn't having a good time. Then over time noticed it a bit more and more until about 3 days ago where I then started doing more research into it. I didn't want to just start throwing solutions at it because I could make it worse that way. So from my research I think nutrient lockout due to overwatering. Some of the newer top leaves would be kind of droopy + then the discoloration etc.. But then light stress also seemed possible due to the tips of the leaves twisting slightly.

Of course could be a combination of the two..

Also you ask to show you, the pictures attached it basically what I started noticing here and there. It wasn't super obvious then, more obvious now.

 

[GNick55]

Okay I will give that a try!

In regards to the feeding, I started giving one of the bottles once the first true leaves appeared. Afterwards kept giving the 1 bottle, then according to the instruction around week 2 of flower you start introducing the second bottle. And then later into flower you add the third bottle. Initially I was feeding it less than the recommended amount on the bottle. However once it started (from my count) week 2 of flower I gave i the full amount they recommend of bottle 1 & 2. And again basically flushed it with it (again I thought watering until run off was what you were supposed to do)

yes some do water with just a bit of run off to makesure all the medium gets wet but no reason for you to have that much,. i can see how your starting your flower weeks but your more like 3-4 weeks flowering,..
any pictures of what caused you to react to the plant like that?

 

[GNick55]

try loading just the pictures again

 

[Waffleman]

yes some do water with just a bit of run off to makesure all the medium gets wet but no reason for you to have that much,. i can see how your starting your flower weeks but your more like 3-4 weeks flowering,..
any pictures of what caused you to react to the plant like that?

When you say react to the plant, I'm not sure what you mean? The watering with 15-20% run off is something I did because I believed it was right from what I read online. So not something I did to fix an issue I saw with the plant. So i did this ever since I thought the root structure was strong enough to handle it. Which was probably a couple weeks into veg.

The plant was doing really well and nothing really changed besides going into flowering, lowering the lights really close + watering even more water to get the same % of run off.

 

[GNick55]

When you say react to the plant, I'm not sure what you mean? The watering with 15-20% run off is something I did because I believed it was right from what I read online. So not something I did to fix an issue I saw with the plant.

The plant was doing really well and nothing really changed besides going into flowering, lowering the lights really close + watering even more water to get the same % of run off.

i think what you saw was the beginning of light stress though you treated the plant with flushing thinking lockout,. the brown dry spots on your leaves showed up after flushing as i can see the effects from flushing or watering too frequently,.
just raise your light and continue on but careful not to water them to soon, its ok for a plant to miss a day or two for watering but water a day or two to early and issues can ruin your grow,..
start following your feed schedule at 3-4 weeks,.
you say growing in a 5 litre bag you sure? if so 2000-2500ml give or take would be enough water,..

 

[Waffleman]

i think what you saw was the beginning of light stress though you treated the plant with flushing thinking lockout,. the brown dry spots on your leaves showed up after flushing as i can see the effects from flushing or watering too frequently,.
just raise your light and continue on but careful not to water them to soon, its ok for a plant to miss a day or two for watering but water a day or two to early and issues can ruin your grow,..
start following your feed schedule at 3-4 weeks,.
you say growing in a 5 litre bag you sure? if so 2000-2500ml give or take would be enough water,..

Thank you!

Just to be clear, I haven't flushed my plant INTENTIONALLY yet. But I believe now I have been flushing my plant (unintentionally) every time i watered it... which is pretty bad. But a good learning experience

I will still apply all advices, I already heightened the light and I'm letting my soil dry out (been about 3 days since last watering but I will probably leave it at least another day) + I will use the 3-4 week feeding schedule. Thanks again!

 

[GNick55]

and stop using the internet for marijuana research, trust me i see soooo many that have no real clue about growing, especially lots of you tube videos with huge grows acting like a know it all when in fact just clueless,..
lots of experienced growers/breeders who are willing to help out here on the farm with posts of their own grows as proof for you to see and decide for yourself,..
everyone is really cool here other than me haha
we’re all welcoming so join in on threads,..

 

[GNick55]

Thank you!

Just to be clear, I haven't flushed my plant INTENTIONALLY yet. But I believe now I have been flushing my plant (unintentionally) every time i watered it... which is pretty bad. But a good learning experience

I will still apply all advices, I already heightened the light and I'm letting my soil dry out (been about 3 days since last watering but I will probably leave it at least another day) + I will use the 3-4 week feeding schedule. Thanks again!

post picture updates here daily if you want and if your questioning anything just ask, nothing is stupid,.
you’ll get replies

 

[Captspaulding]

Here’s a reference shot of my veg room light height for veg, and the output never goes over 40% all through veg. I hang them 30-36 inches above my canopy.
In flower light height is also subjective to strain tolerance. I have quite the space between my canopy and the light bars in my flower space as well. Anywhere from 2 to 3 ft with the lights output% adjusted up to what the plant wants. Never crank them all the way up, harder to fix a burned up plant than it is to simply turn up your output a few percent a day to what the plants ask for. @GNick55 has your back homie! Best of luck!

 

[Waffleman]

and stop using the internet for marijuana research, trust me i see soooo many that have no real clue about growing, especially lots of you tube videos with huge grows acting like a know it all when in fact just clueless,..
lots of experienced growers/breeders who are willing to help out here on the farm with posts of their own grows as proof for you to see and decide for yourself,..
everyone is really cool here other than me haha
we’re all welcoming so join in on threads,..

Thank you will do! Yea I will definitely take a look around, seems like a lot of good information.

 

[Waffleman]

Here’s a reference shot of my veg room light height for veg, and the output never goes over 40% all through veg. I hang them 30-36 inches above my canopy.
In flower light height is also subjective to strain tolerance. I have quite the space between my canopy and the light bars in my flower space as well. Anywhere from 2 to 3 ft with the lights output% adjusted up to what the plant wants. Never crank them all the way up, harder to fix a burned up plant than it is to simply turn up your output a few percent a day to what the plants ask for. @GNick55 has your back homie! Best of luck!

Thanks for the references that definitely helps! Also made me realize how insanely close my light was xD But I shit you not its what it says in the spider farm manual but in any case the approach you mention is correct. Better to ease into the intensity of the light rather than just blast the plant like I did.

 

[Waffleman]

Here’s a reference shot of my veg room light height for veg, and the output never goes over 40% all through veg. I hang them 30-36 inches above my canopy.
In flower light height is also subjective to strain tolerance. I have quite the space between my canopy and the light bars in my flower space as well. Anywhere from 2 to 3 ft with the lights output% adjusted up to what the plant wants. Never crank them all the way up, harder to fix a burned up plant than it is to simply turn up your output a few percent a day to what the plants ask for. @GNick55 has your back homie! Best of luck!

Great looking plants btw

 

[Captspaulding]

Thanks for the references that definitely helps! Also made me realize how insanely close my light was xD But I shit you not its what it says in the spider farm manual but in any case the approach you mention is correct. Better to ease into the intensity of the light rather than just blast the plant like I did.

Yeah, exactly. Less stress equals happy life.
So the light maps that manufacturers put out, need to looked at as a broad spectrum application. No strain is created equal so the supplied info may be applicable to some strains/setups, but generally the height instructions for the different stages of growth as well as the suggested output is a general guideline, that in my experience can be woefully incorrect by 300-400 ppfd in either direction homie. so as long as you have that little nugget of info in your tool box, you’ll have giant nuggets later. Maybe. And thank you for the kind words!

 

[Waffleman]

Yeah, exactly. Less stress equals happy life.
So the light maps that manufacturers put out, need to looked at as a broad spectrum application. No strain is created equal so the supplied info may be applicable to some strains/setups, but generally the height instructions for the different stages of growth as well as the suggested output is a general guideline, that in my experience can be woefully incorrect by 300-400 ppfd in either direction homie. so as long as you have that little nugget of info in your tool box, you’ll have giant nuggets later. Maybe. And thank you for the kind words!

Haha great thanks! Yea this is opening a whole other world of nuance when it comes to growing. As this is only my second grow its awesome to already be exposed to it.