First DWC. overwhelmed with names and chemicals and additives

[Aqua Man]

Well I can say this a friend of mine recently finished a DWC grow with just botincare pro blend with hydro guard and it’s just two jugs grow and bloom lol he told me it worked great and took a lot of question in nutes and extra shit out of it he liked it a lot and before that he used blue planet. I haven’t gotten to sample the crop yet but he did get some pretty fat buds that stank.

Yes simple is the way to go... ensure your alkalinity is good and ph is stable. Use a basic fert and thats it.

 

[User59204626117]

Whoa shot got crazy in here fast... slow down... the whole point of using potassium silicate is to buffer the PH by creating alkalinity. Yes less available but still will supply some and cannabis is not a huge accumulator of silica although it does benefit.

Read here before freaking out and doing something that is going to give you an unstable PH.

Marijuana pH Levels for Growing Weed: A Basic Explanation

OK I'm going to do my best to explain PH since its something that is for the most part greatly misunderstood and can be confusing to new growers and even experienced growers alike. This will explain why we need both ppm and PH meters to give us informed information about PH This will be a...

www.thcfarmer.com

Can you explain this more? Seems like the potassium silica I have is more focused on the ph properties and not getting as much silica as possible into the plants.

I’d rather have a silica that the plant can use a lot easier versus something that the plant “struggles” to uptake but focuses more on the ph? Hence the power.si. I can figure out/adjust ph on my own... I think. Don’t need the silica bottle to do that. Right?

the reading I did last night, on both cannabis forums and non Cannabis sites all raved that the potassium silica kinda sucks and the other stuff is worth it’s weight in gold.

 

[Aqua Man]

Can you explain this more? Seems like the potassium silica I have is more focused on the ph properties and not getting as much silica as possible into the plants.

I’d rather have a silica that the plant can use a lot easier versus something that the plant “struggles” to uptake but focuses more on the ph? Hence the power.si. I can figure out/adjust ph on my own... I think. Don’t need the silica bottle to do that. Right?

the reading I did last night, on both cannabis forums and non Cannabis sites all raved that the potassium silica kinda sucks and the other stuff is worth it’s weight in gold.

Ok there is a huge difference in the reason for use. You need to understand the properties of ph and alkalinity. Without a stable ph you will get swings and that will cause nutrient uptake issues.

I can tell you no additive is going to make or break your grow.... adding something like massive will give you far more benefit in yield etc than adding any form of silica but none of that matters if you don't have the basics of PH and proper nutrient ratios and concentrations.

Stop looking for a miracle in a bottle because there is no such thing and the thing that will make the biggest difference in your grow is a healthy plant as a result of good environment and media conditions. All of those other additives may make a slight improvement IF you already have healthy plants and a good conditions.

I can promise your going to spend more money all for not if the basics aren't there.

I have never EVER seen a silica deficiency... can anyone else say they have?

The more you add the more things need to be taken into account and compensated for and if you don't have the basics down its only going to cause more issues.

Idk what else to say, you have everything you need so once you get that working then you may want to look at improving but the biggest improvement is going to be getting you plants healthy not adding supplements to push them harder and further.

 

[tobh]

Ok there is a huge difference in the reason for use. You need to understand the properties of ph and alkalinity. Without a stable ph you will get swings and that will cause nutrient uptake issues.

I can tell you no additive is going to make or break your grow.... adding something like massive will give you far more benefit in yield etc than adding any form of silica but none of that matters if you don't have the basics of PH and proper nutrient ratios and concentrations.

Stop looking for a miracle in a bottle because there is no such thing and the thing that will make the biggest difference in your grow is a healthy plant as a result of good environment and media conditions. All of those other additives may make a slight improvement IF you already have healthy plants and a good conditions.

I can promise your going to spend more money all for not if the basics aren't there.

I have never EVER seen a silica deficiency... can anyone else say they have?

The more you add the more things need to be taken into account and compensated for and if you don't have the basics down its only going to cause more issues.

Idk what else to say, you have everything you need so once you get that working then you may want to look at improving but the biggest improvement is going to be getting you plants healthy not adding supplements to push them harder and further.

+1

For further validation of the silica def comment, I only started using silica when I started growing again last year. I did so begrudgingly even simply because I've been around long enough to have seen a thousand snake oils come and go. Silica is the only thing I've used, aside from my PK booster of choice, that seems to have had any real noticeable impact on plant health.

With all the basics, plants will do their thing just fine. Adding silica just makes em structurally more sound, and seems to have positive benefits in alleviating stress symptoms. As @Aqua Man said, get the basics in order, plants healthy, then once everything is stabilized entertain the idea of additional additives.

Digging further into the silica use topic.

In my system, I start with 12 gallons of tap water, pH ~8 and ~160ppm. I add 60ml of protekt silica solution, allow to mix for 15-20 minutes. This drives the pH up to over 10, and increases ppm's by about 20-25. I then use on average 45ml of pH down (phosphoric acid) to get the pH to 6.5, then proceed adding the rest of my components (two part salts, then hygrozyme). This puts my final pH at about 6.0-6.2. I pH down with an additional 10-15ml pH solution to hit 5.5.

The pH remains stable for the duration of the res, maybe dropping a little. When i eliminated the expired hydroguard, I eliminated massive pH fluctuations. I equate the stability 100% to the silica's alkalinity. Without it, my tap simply isn't alkaline enough to keep the pH from nose-diving throughout a res cycle.

 

[godspeed2k86]

Well looks like I was able to stir something up here lol. So from my personal experiences switching to monosalistc didn't affect my ph stability at all. Also Cyco silica is a lie it is not a true monosalistc add that shit to your water on goes up. Not an acid.. osa 28 I would not recommend. Power si I havent used. MSA stout I have ran the longest good res stability and rood result and a good price. Front row Ag So is a 10% monosalastic and its doing a great job this run but it js her first run so more testing will still be needed with that.

 

[Aqua Man]

Well looks like I was able to stir something up here lol. So from my personal experiences switching to monosalistc didn't affect my ph stability at all. Also Cyco silica is a lie it is not a true monosalistc add that shit to your water on goes up. Not an acid.. osa 28 I would not recommend. Power si I havent used. MSA stout I have ran the longest good res stability and rood result and a good price. Front row Ag So is a 10% monosalastic and its doing a great job this run but it js her first run so more testing will still be needed with that.

Thats exactly the point... you are assuming in hydro ppl use potassium silicate only for the silica... its not why its used. Its for the alkalinity to increase the buffering capacity of the water to create a stable ph... the fact monosalastic acid does not buffer the PH makes it only good for a supplement and while thats what you are after its not what its intended purpose is for this grower. So its just more confusion for the new grower who now seems to think he needs it when infact he doesn't and your telling him not to use it. I am not disputing the benefits of silica by any means but the reason for the potassium silicate is to add alkalinity to the water and like you have said the monosalistc silica does not do this so its not something that can be just unilaterally swapped in this case

 

[godspeed2k86]

Thats exactly the point... you are assuming in hydro ppl use potassium silicate only for the silica... its not why its used. Its for the alkalinity to increase the buffering capacity of the water to create a stable ph... the fact monosalastic acid does not buffer the PH makes it only good for a supplement and while thats what you are after its not what its intended purpose is for this grower. So its just more confusion for the new grower who now seems to think he needs it when infact he doesn't. I am not disputing the benefits of silica by any means but the reason for the potassium silicate is to add alkalinity to the water and like you have said the monosalistc silica does not do this so its not something that can be just unilaterally swapped in this case

I'm am not saying your wrong but if it was such a key pivotal portion on the nutrient PH stability why has General Hydroponic only recently with in the past 5 or 6 years release a potassium silica product. I have been physically mixing hydro systems and rezs for about 10 year ls now and like I said I didnt say you are wrong but I have never made a real world correlation to ph stability you are referring to be associated with said products. Any who knowledge is power and the more we have of it the more educated forward thinking we can have to progress ourselves.

 

[Aqua Man]

I'm am not saying your wrong but if it was such a key pivotal portion on the nutrient PH stability why has General Hydroponic only recently with in the past 5 or 6 years release a potassium silica product. I have been physically mixing hydro systems and rezs for about 10 year ls now and like I said I didnt say you are wrong but I have never made a real world correlation to ph stability you are referring to be associated with said products. Any who knowledge is power and the more we have of it the more educated forward thinking we can have to progress ourselves.

Because there where other products used and still can be. Potassium bicarbonate commonly sold as ph up was used before and still is. There are many many different compounds that can be used to create alkalinity. Just so happens I feel the best available for the price is potassium silicate. Carbonates, bicarbonate, hydroxide, silicate all work to add alkalinity. The base ferts and compounds in thier makeup may eliminate the need to add any of those. Like with anything there is no one answer or solution.

I explain in the thread I linked how important alkalinity is in the creation of a stable ph and why. You can simply Google how alkalinity affect ph. If you have low or none of those listed your ph is goin to change drastically in 24 hrs... whether its supplied from your tap in the form or calcium carbonate or nutrients or addition like potassium silicate, you need an alkalinity source to create a buffer. I cant say why you haven't seen any correlation in your grows maybe the nutes, maybe the water source...who knows but if its not been an issue its because in some way shape or form there has been enough alkalinity added to provide this for you or maybe you have a ph controller?

 

[Aqua Man]

Idk i just need a holiday here... its been common knowledge for decades upon decades how alkalinity affects ph... I have no idea how after 10 yrs of hydro it isn't known.

 

[Grownsince95]

Idk i just need a holiday here... its been common knowledge for decades upon decades how alkalinity affects ph... I have no idea how after 10 yrs of hydro it isn't known.

It seems very common for some folks to memorize the "when, where and how much" without ever understanding the "why". Like cooks who can only follow recipes.

 

[Aqua Man]

If you don't understand my article read this. It uses pools as an example but explains pretty well how the alkalinity is responsible for the stability of the PH and that PH is nothing more than a measure of the acid to alkaline sources ratio... ph is a result.... and has nothing to do with the stability of PH or its resistance to change.

Total Alkalinity vs. pH, and their roles in water chemistry

What is Alkalinity vs. pH? Total Alkalinity is a measure of all dissolved alkali in water. It helps buffer the change in pH by neutralizing acids.

www.google.com

 

[Aqua Man]

As simple as I can put it is each - is acid and each + is alkaline.

Let's say you water has low alkalinity. It looks like this in say absolutely pure water with small amounts of alkaline source added say 2 parts

++ ph 8

Now we add some acid to bring the PH back to neutral. Small amount of acid needed.

- -/++ ph 7

Now we add 1 part of acid say from out nutrients and the ph changes based on these ratios.

- - -/++ ph 6.5 if we are following the math here. So how much influence the additional 1 part of acid made? Pretty significant.

Now we have a water source with a good amount of alkalinity sat 10 parts.

++++++++++ ph 8 we are using potassium bicarbonate it has a ph of 8.2 but we will call it 8 for ease.

Now we need to add 10 parts of acid to bring this back to 7. Significantly more acid needed.

++++++++++/- - - - - - - - - - ph 7. But we have a much larger buffering capacity so now we add that 1 part of acid from the nutrients and what do we end up with.

++++++++++/- - - - - - - - - - - ph 6.9

NOW do you see how alkalinity provides a buffer and much more stable? Adding acidic or basic compounds influence the ph MUCH less. This is how you get stability.

I give up after this if there are any questions on it.

 

[User59204626117]

So it seems that the ph up I have is more focused on the ph and alkalinity though and not so much the benefits of the silica, which seem to be significant. not that I’m experiencing a silica deficiency. But the proper silica definitely wouldn’t hurt it seems.

can I not use something else to control my ph and alkalinity and let the silica do it’s job as a silica and not have to moonlight as a ph buffer also?

I swear the more I read about this the more confusing it gets. If I wanted to be a chemist I would of paid more attention in science, this is insane. I’m just trying to grow some dope. My god is this ever complicated. Leaves a more sour taste in my mouth and more confusion the more i read and research it. You need a god damn PhD in chemistry to grow bud it seems nowadays.

I’m a tinkerer and a gear head. I just can’t settle and leave stuff alone and stop upgrading. I’m always searching for something better, bigger, faster, more efficient. Etc. Never happy with what I got that’s for sure. Gotta love social media and being online and seeing everyone’s stuff/life being way better than yours.



those $100 ozs or $18 grams of shatter online are more and more attractive every day....

 

[Aqua Man]

I give up.

 

[User59204626117]

Me too. This isn’t fun anymore. It’s causing more stress than it’s worth.

Gonna take the 3 plants out today and chuck them out. I’ll keep the one that’s alive going for a bit but it’ll probably get tossed too.

 

[Grownsince95]

 

[Anthem]

I think this guy User59204626117 gets his kicks out of seeing how many people he can get to comment on his thread. The hydrogaurd mess and all was what started me thinking he is some sort of troll.

 

[User59204626117]

Think what ya want. I clearly can’t figure this out. I appreciate the help but I’m done. This is fucking ridiculous. Not having fun.

sorry for wasting your time aqua man.

This will be my last post. Take care everyone.

 

[Aqua Man]

Think what ya want. I clearly can’t figure this out. I appreciate the help but I’m done. This is fucking ridiculous. Not having fun.

sorry for wasting your time aqua man.

This will be my last post. Take care everyone.

Not sure why the last post plenty of ppl here to help ya. I just don't have the time to try and explain things better than I have. Maybe someone else does

 

[Anthem]

So it seems that the ph up I have is more focused on the ph and alkalinity though and not so much the benefits of the silica, which seem to be significant. not that I’m experiencing a silica deficiency. But the proper silica definitely wouldn’t hurt it seems.

can I not use something else to control my ph and alkalinity and let the silica do it’s job as a silica and not have to moonlight as a ph buffer also?

I swear the more I read about this the more confusing it gets. If I wanted to be a chemist I would of paid more attention in science, this is insane. I’m just trying to grow some dope. My god is this ever complicated. Leaves a more sour taste in my mouth and more confusion the more i read and research it. You need a god damn PhD in chemistry to grow bud it seems nowadays.

I’m a tinkerer and a gear head. I just can’t settle and leave stuff alone and stop upgrading. I’m always searching for something better, bigger, faster, more efficient. Etc. Never happy with what I got that’s for sure. Gotta love social media and being online and seeing everyone’s stuff/life being way better than yours.



those $100 ozs or $18 grams of shatter online are more and more attractive every day....

Let me put it to you in some gear head terms you might understand. You are the guy that goes out and buys a 1471 blower, slaps on a couple nitros kits to a stock 350 small block and starts asking questions why his engine does not run right. Maybe a little research before you jump head first into RDWC would have helped, but from your previous posts you always want it bigger and better. Well, just remember what Grumpy Bill Jenkins said, change one thing at a time. You went from soil to one of the most challenging growing technics without understanding. You might be frustrated like other on here are but considering you have racked up 34 pages of people trying to help you, it is just disrespectful. Have a nice day, sorry you are frustrated. It can be challenging.