Just thinking out loud.....

[Classic Remix]

Was having a conversation that touched on some good points last night...

At wht point does trying to achieve 1gpw become less beneficial?? The way i see it is...

If youre spending 8 weeks on a veg before you flip to flower, thats 8 full weeks of veg power on top of flowering for that "1gpw". Where as if you flowered from a week veg you could nearly get two smaller runs in in the time of the single run.... If they were .5-.6 gpw wouldnt that be more beneficial in terms of money in profit out??

Only thin that kinks this thought, is obviously always having your vegging lights on ANYWAY, which is obvious, but all the same that extra 8 weeks severly misconstrues that whole gpw thought...

Does that make sense or am i taking crazy pills?? Would love some thought.

 

[KennyPowers]

Where as if you flowered from a week veg you could nearly get two smaller runs in in the time of the single run

assuming you veg and flower under the same lights. then yea, a 14-15w cycle could be turned into 2 9w cycles or something along those lines.

 

[Classic Remix]

Well that was another point, but my veg is all t5s, but is around 7-800 watts, 24/7

Just doin the math it dumbs out at the veg room anyways, simply because ill always have stuff under those lights, i suppose if you look at it from the angle of plant to plant, instead f the room, there is a point. However it does become irrelevant because of this.

Still cool overlooked thought i suppose...

 

[KennyPowers]

i hear ya and do get what the thought is. i think its also gonna come down to plant numbers. look at michigan sweet corn for example. they can plant as many as they want, so instead of relying on the plants to veg out wider, they plant them on top of each other and grow a breed that only produces 1-2 ears per stalk.

if i could run 30 plants on 1w veg under each 1000 then maybe i would, because imo that 1 stalk of SOG bud is nicer than most of the bud on a 5+ oz plant. we veg plants to be beasts in response to the plant limits though, right? i cant do that, so instead i spend the watts vegging bigger palnts that can fill my light footprint and keep me "safe".

 

[midwestdensies]

Hempys get you to trees faster and beds either sog or scrog rule. I only do these 2 methods (for years) besides straying when I moved here for a first hodge podge run. I always consider veg part of the deal thats why I worry about root mass, health, environment and some knowledge from all you fools, I can strait up cut 1-2 weeks off veg now.
MW

 

[midwestdensies]

I like buds on a bigger plant personally, the stalks seem to uptake more the thicker they are maybe just my crazy ass tho lol but I lollipop rather well

i hear ya and do get what the thought is. i think its also gonna come down to plant numbers.

if i could run 30 plants on 1w veg under each 1000 then maybe i would, because imo that 1 stalk of SOG bud is nicer than most of the bud on a 5+ oz plant. we veg plants to be beasts in response to the plant limits though, right? i cant do that, so instead i spend the watts vegging bigger palnts that can fill my light footprint and keep me "safe".

 

[midwestdensies]

Also as I get more into trees and vegging, its like shit we flower for 8+ weeks and keep moms and such around. What if that time was used to keep plant numbers down by growing perpetual trees and such. I know waayne uses his time wisely and has a great system for this. thanks CR for getting people thinking..

 

[Classic Remix]

That was the intention of this thread!! Hell yeah haha.

Id like to do a perpetual tree, im always afraid of something happening to the cuts, liek what happened w my godfather is a perfect example. Rooted and shit got all crazy and they died (long story but irrwlevant to my point), so now i have to worry about re-veg to save it... Guess i just have to be more on point

 

[caregiverken]

I cant get shit out a small plant :sour:
I have to veg for at least a month..or 3

 

[midwestdensies]

shit youd be surprised man that little scruff of a bud at the bottom can reveg out in a couple weeks. i used to never keep moms in the midwest. Just always take cuts and clean out to get my trays but I rocked it hard, there was no running out.

I personally like trees. If I were doing this Id have the cut rooted and already in first cup/pot by flip and just keep it rolling. Just pick more medium sized to beastly ones so the veg time can match correctly but shit if you know your strains could be 1-2 weeks give or take to provide any strain the right size before flip.

If your familiar with hempys I highly suggest one round the quality and quantity is astounding as well as the ease, my ph and ec is always so money in hempys.

 

[midwestdensies]

I cant get shit out a small plant :sour:
I have to veg for at least a month..or 3

I give them hell when young to shape them initially. tops and early training is key in smaller plants. Also knowing your plant will help so you can crush big tall fat small.

 

[Theoneandonly Z]

Nice thread CR and great input MWD. I always strive to get g/w and i have tried many methods sog, big trees, or med size with 3-4 oz on each. Ive gotten better weight growing em big but it takes 1.5 -2 months veg until im satisfied. Overall power and nutrient usage figured into my final outcome really isnt as much profit as i thought. Until recently i have started figuring a whole new method for my veg. Instead of two 400w that i dim down to 250w for smaller cuts and dial to 400 before transition. Im going to utilize my two rooms as flowering rooms on a flip box and push my veg outside in a green house supplemented by t5 44's when needed. Why not use the sun? Its free and better light than i could ever supply. Cant believe its taking me years to figure out a way to increase my over all yield! Z

 

[Theoneandonly Z]

Not to mention my savings on nutes due to enriched soils and tea brews. Ive been using nutes throughout my plants life with great success but never truly satisfied with overall quality and strains would come out very similar in aroma. Now with a good soil mix, brewing teas, and minimal nutes, my quality is so much better and i can still match my yields.

 

[Classic Remix]

But with what you said i suppose kinda the point i was making.

If you veg for 8 weeks, that gram per watt people are trying to achieve will be way less than a 2 week system that gets close to a gram per watt, or even less, because of the time spent in veg. That power consumption, time, and space have to factor for something. So total ~16-20 week plant for a gpw..... Thats a lot of electricity. Id rather have 11 weeks and .6 i suppose is what im getting at, at the sake of profit it seems more feasible.

 

[Theoneandonly Z]

Oic, thats a great aspect! Especially if using the same room to veg and flower. It would be challenging to get a g/w with a two week veg imo. Would it be better for one to do the sog method if trying to achieve that goal? Ive seen ppl pull g/w under every 1000w with 50 small girls under each light with barely a veg.

 

[orbad]

I too fall into the category who think trees are not equal to a bunch of small plants. So long as plant count is not an issue.

Another kink in the gpw battle is strain characteristics. Some plants blow up huge, while others stay small.

 

[midwestdensies]

If you have a veg area around 25% of flower area you can do great things with trees maybe a 1-2 week of extra veg in the big room. Ive done great in beds with 7 days and as much as 3 weeks which is minimal. Its about the enviro

 

[Theoneandonly Z]

But with what you said i suppose kinda the point i was making...

...Thats a lot of electricity. Id rather have 11 weeks and .6 i suppose is what im getting at, at the sake of profit it seems more feasible.

So back to your orig question: "would veggin for two weeks be worth it getting about .6g/watt or would a (lets say 5 week veg) be worth the energy expense to only get 1g/watt" (I think that is what the question comes out to be)

So i put a little equation together based on total wattage spent for both situations. The numbers i have below relate to 400W veg and a 1000W flower. I dunno if that is what you run, i just find it common. regardless, its nice to see the difference of a 2 week veg and a 5 week veg, topped off with an 8 week flower on both.
(side note: Im using Watts/Hr - to find out ur bill, see what ur cost is kw/h then find out how many watts you use and divide by 1000 to get ur kw then apply to your cost per hour.)

2 week Veg (1) 400 Watt light (18hr days):
400x18= 7200 watts/hr per day
7200x14(days) = 100.8 KiloWatts

8 week Flower (1) 1000 Watt light (12hr days):
1000x12(hours) = 12000 Watts/hr per day
12000 x 56(days) = 672 Kw

2 WEEK VEG - 100.8 (total veg kw) + 672 (total flower kw) = 772.8 kw/Cycle

Now if u rocked a 5 week veg, that would bring a total veg kw to 252 Kw

5 WEEK VEG - 252 + 672 = 924 Kw/cycle

So the difference in that scenario is 151.2 Kw.

i get charged 1$/3.89 kwh. which would put a total savings of 38.86$ in my case.

so if ur happy with .6/G for veggin for 2 weeks ur looking at 600 Grams on a 1000W light which is like a 1 1/2lbs... Now if u got ur g/w on a 1000w with a 5 week veg, u should pull 2.23 lbs.... so ur looking at a 3/4lb difference...

IMO i would rather spend the 38.86$ and wait 5 weeks for the extra 1400$ + ... if we are talking money wise.

if anyone thinks this is way off let me know and i will correct or delete, just tryna help fellow farmers!
Z

 

[Camdawg]

I love the math guys on the farm.

 

[Natural]

Personally, I like to keep it simple..I need 2 p's per light or I feel shorted on my efforts. IME it has been more about strain than plant numbers or veg time. I started out at 16 plants per 1k and eventually moved to 2-3 plants per 1K. I've gravitated to my sweet spot of 9 per 1K..all overhead lighting and all in dirt with no CO2 added.
I never expect my 2p's when pheno hunting through bean pops...that would be unrealistic. During a bean pop I hunt for my keepers..but being top-shelf smoke isn't enough..she needs to be an easy clone..easy grow and a decent yield.
I like sativa dom hybrids..for growth and smoke. I think finding the correct way to train specific phenos and more important..when exactly to flip them yields the best results. Timing when the cuts are ready to move from T-5's to the big light exactly when the room is emptied, clean, and ready. I should be able to flip to 12/12 with no more than 2-3 week veg time...getting 2 p's per light..on time...every time. Having multiple rooms eliminates the need to grow large moms..having the ability to clone what is vegging under the big lights.

...of course nothing gets the blood pumping and the smile muscles working better than growing huge trees in a warehouse..greenhouse, or good ol' outdoors.