MYTH: more roots= better yield

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Jumpingspider

Jumpingspider

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Yeah coco 1 gal. Some older pics... I'll grab some new ones later and post in my thread. The pic of the roots is from all the way back on dec first lol

Yeah 14x feeding is the way to go if you're using 1 gal pots.

Out of curiosity, why?

Why not just use more coco?

It's not even that expensive right?

What pain are you avoiding or what benefit is derived from small ass pots that could outweigh the negative of requiring more feedings and needing to set up irrigation?
 
Aqua Man

Aqua Man

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Yeah 14x feeding is the way to go if you're using 1 gal pots.

Out of curiosity, why?

Why not just use more coco?

It's not even that expensive right?

What pain are you avoiding or what benefit is derived from small ass pots that could outweigh the negative of requiring more feedings and needing to set up irrigation?
Why pay for more media if you don't have to? Its all auto watering and drain so I just set a timer and it feeds them. If hand watering i definitely would not be doing this. There are many reasons but don't wanna derail this.
 
SaintsSamilia

SaintsSamilia

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Feeding mine at 14x a day right now. I forgot the feed timer 2 times and dam near killed em.... but before that they were fine.
Really don't have any automation experience but definitely tried to have this run and will have next run waterfalls on my dwc system being a new
Feeding mine at 14x a day right now. I forgot the feed timer 2 times and dam near killed em.... but before that they were fine.
thats the one major lesson I've learned this grow is automated feeding is the way .... Being new to dwc i never really understood that even once after the plants where in the solution you need or I needed top feed regaurdless of the dwc buckets to get them to take off on their own. The original design I did was with rdwc with waterfalls the seals I planned failed so currently waiting on them but definitely next run will be set up to top feed. Even if i decide in the end the hydro is dookie tasting compared to the soil I'll also be running at least a drip feed on soil or coco from here on out. Definitely helps I'd imagine in all mediums
 
SaintsSamilia

SaintsSamilia

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Actually thinking about it... isn't this guys end result theory basically why anyone who use airpots or fabric pots logic everyday... I litteraly switched to fabric based of the advertisement at that point of air pruning your roots to avoid root bound plants so to be fair seems he was ahead possibly of the cloth pots ...šŸ¤”šŸ˜¬šŸ¤£ but I don't know when those where mainstream grow wise so he could have also just been following the same logic as long as fed and happy it will grow
 
Jumpingspider

Jumpingspider

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Why pay for more media if you don't have to? Its all auto watering and drain so I just set a timer and it feeds them. If hand watering i definitely would not be doing this. There are many reasons but don't wanna derail this.

Less effort involved in the setup- I pay more for medium and you pay more for irrigation plus time spent on setup. It's arguable that irrigation saves time overall vs hand watering? Maybe irrigating into small containers gives you a boost in nutrient uptake efficiency too? Idk.

All i know is I am paying for the luxury of not having the labor of setting up an irrigation system, and you are paying for the luxury of not having to hand water.

I'd say it's about break even but I could be wrong. Also i hear stuff gets clogged so that's a risk of irrigating that I'm taking into consideration.
 
SaintsSamilia

SaintsSamilia

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Less effort involved in the setup- I pay more for medium and you pay more for irrigation plus time spent on setup. It's arguable that irrigation saves time overall vs hand watering? Maybe irrigating into small containers gives you a boost in nutrient uptake efficiency too? Idk.

All i know is I am paying for the luxury of not having the labor of setting up an irrigation system, and you are paying for the luxury of not having to hand water.

I'd say it's about break even but I could be wrong. Also i hear stuff gets clogged so that's a risk of irrigating that I'm taking into consideration.
The sad truth I'm already facing from one large scale mix to most likely under these situations never doing it again is the ratios of small scale feeding in actual qaulity control in the end is greater so if the end result and qaulity really really matter drip feed is gonna outproduce a large reservoir. To even consider keeping my nutes mixed in my current 12 gallon dwc if I'm not running 2 large stones I'm waisting my time if actually trying to control the qaulity of food mixture in the water when i run all soil I run small hand mixes 1/2 gallon a time all the way through flower its extremely annoying in smaller pots but its less controlled once I spread it across my larger pots. So in the end It really comes down to those type conversations beyond just different grow styles I'd say im even to the point of mixing 1 gallon of nute at a time for my dwc its annoying but I havent had any problems that I honestly expected from what I've watched many first time hydro or soil growers go through 1 gallon is easy peasy even 5 gallons but to do a full swap out was 50 to ph that for myself currently was a nightmare. But thats another reason I'm going to a single reservoir sytem on my next grow.
 
plumsmooth

plumsmooth

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Can someone tell me if it is really necessary to change out my 2.5 Gallon Power Grower Reservoir every time that plant consumes 2.5 gallons of water/nutrients. My plants when big can almost consume 2 gallons in a day! I find myself topping up my reservoir for a week even when it is drinking 1.5 gallon per day? Am I asking for problems? Are there a build up of nutrient waste materials or something I am missing?
 
Jumpingspider

Jumpingspider

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So anyways... cutting up the roots is just baller status so Cap probably was flexing. Lmao
 
Aqua Man

Aqua Man

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Can someone tell me if it is really necessary to change out my 2.5 Gallon Power Grower Reservoir every time that plant consumes 2.5 gallons of water/nutrients. My plants when big can almost consume 2 gallons in a day! I find myself topping up my reservoir for a week even when it is drinking 1.5 gallon per day? Am I asking for problems? Are there a build up of nutrient waste materials or something I am missing?
You dont have to... it just ensures your nutrient ratio stays in a good place. You can push it back and see how it works for you. That method is just to ensure you don't have issues but does not mean you may not be able to go longer.
 
Aqua Man

Aqua Man

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Less effort involved in the setup- I pay more for medium and you pay more for irrigation plus time spent on setup. It's arguable that irrigation saves time overall vs hand watering? Maybe irrigating into small containers gives you a boost in nutrient uptake efficiency too? Idk.

All i know is I am paying for the luxury of not having the labor of setting up an irrigation system, and you are paying for the luxury of not having to hand water.

I'd say it's about break even but I could be wrong. Also i hear stuff gets clogged so that's a risk of irrigating that I'm taking into consideration.
Really no effort to setup... you do it once and thats it and its not very expensive. Personally if I add up my wages and the time saved its not even close so I guess its how much you value your time. There are other benefits to smaller pots like air exchange etc. Its all preferences but no way would I want more media to lug around and hand water. Imo its a lot more work.
So anyways... cutting up the roots is just baller status so Cap probably was flexing. Lmao
Don't think it had anything to do with flexing and it wasn't to show root pruning is of any benefit... it was to try and see if there may be a correlation between root volume and fruit volume.
 
JadedMarxist

JadedMarxist

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I change my water only when it's needed. Maybe on average 3 times per grow. I'm growing in 5 gal buckets.

My rule of thumb is if it starts to smell time to change!

This is a very thought provoking idea too bad the problems that happened to cap!

I have to say I'm of the mind that excess roots will leach valuable energy to form them. On the otherside too small roots will not sustain the canopy. There must be some avarage sweet spot of root to canopy ratio.

Unfortunately as mentioned many times the variables between specimens of the same strain is something very hard if not impossible to control. Even between clones you will see a difference in growth patterns.

Good on Cap this is how serious breakthrus actually happen. From an idea. So we should all be cheering for cap. He at least tried so the rest of us don't have to diminish our own yields or risk one of our plants to discover something new.

Bro science will come to an end soon enough now that legalization is finally taking hold

This all just my own uneducated guess.

And even without conclusive results,
Thank you Cap
 
Milson

Milson

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At the point you are feeding 14x a day (or more), I would imagine the effect is pretty similar to just being in dwc. I am curious to see what those roots look like in the end lol.

I kind of think of the roots and leaves thing as kind of a give and take of economy. Like the leaves can turn light into sugar and feed the whole plant but they need some other nutrients sent up from the roots in order to do that. The roots expand their capacity based on getting enough sugar from the leaves (and being able to breathe) and the leaves expand their capacity based on what they are getting from the roots.

So long as the roots are continuing to push what is needed to the leaves, the leaves won't care. The roots are getting what they need, so they don't care. There must be an upper limit on how much you can get out of root absorption and that limit is higher with more roots I imagine (hence outdoor monsters with huge root systems), but the plant does not need the default behavior of "keep growing longer roots to find new nutrients since we are sucking up the old ones faster than the ground is likely replenishing them given most ecosystems" that genetics have given her. If she doesn't need to do that, she will figure out it's whatever and get on with it, right? At least well enough for our purposes?

I guess that is what we are finding out.
 
Jumpingspider

Jumpingspider

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Really no effort to setup... you do it once and thats it and its not very expensive. Personally if I add up my wages and the time saved its not even close so I guess its how much you value your time. There are other benefits to smaller pots like air exchange etc. Its all preferences but no way would I want more media to lug around and hand water. Imo its a lot more work.

Don't think it had anything to do with flexing and it wasn't to show root pruning is of any benefit... it was to try and see if there may be a correlation between root volume and fruit volume.

1. I appreciate your input regarding pot size! I definitely see why it would be good to not have 30 gallons of coco sitting around in pots from the 6 males that I took out. Not sure wtf to do with all of it while i wait for my clones to veg out.

2. I was totally 100% joking. Please don't take that comment that cutting up roots - just because you wanna find out something random - is freaking baller - seriously. It was meant as a compliment disguised as a jab.

Peace!
 
Hopefull Stoner

Hopefull Stoner

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Really no effort to setup... you do it once and thats it and its not very expensive. Personally if I add up my wages and the time saved its not even close so I guess its how much you value your time. There are other benefits to smaller pots like air exchange etc. Its all preferences but no way would I want more media to lug around and hand water. Imo its a lot more work.

Don't think it had anything to do with flexing and it wasn't to show root pruning is of any benefit... it was to try and see if there may be a correlation between root volume and fruit volume.

how is setting up your system easier then setting up pots to hand water, did i miss something. i'm headed to coco and hand watering. granted won't be over 16 pots for sog and maybe 9 on avg. using 2/3 gal pots max for a more regular bush style grow,
last two were done using epsoma organic potting soil and biobizz lite flowered in 2/3 gallon pots vertical style for testing...

whitish and reddish ones are different strains. warriors tonic cbd-thc cultivar = red hair and cap'n shivas crunch berries is the other regular thc plant
 
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Aqua Man

Aqua Man

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how is setting up your system easier then setting up pots to hand water, did i miss something. i'm headed to coco and hand watering. granted won't be over 16 pots for sog and maybe 9 on avg. using 2/3 gal pots max for a more regular bush style grow,
last two were done using epsoma organic potting soil and biobizz lite flowered in 2/3 gallon pots vertical style for testing...
System takes like an hr and never have to do it again. I mix my res and thats it. After mixing nutes for hand watering more frequently you still need to water and get rid of runoff for every pot of every grow. I could not use 1 gal pots if I was hand watering because I would spend all day mixing and watering. Idk how anyone can think its more work? In veg with a 20 gal res I was doing 20 plants and mixing nutes once a week that took me a while 10 min. I cant see how hand watering can take less time

So not only do I save time I save on the cost of pots and coco
 
Hopefull Stoner

Hopefull Stoner

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System takes like an hr and never have to do it again. I mix my res and thats it. After mixing nutes for hand watering more frequently you still need to water and get rid of runoff for every pot of every grow. I could not use 1 gal pots if I was hand watering because I would spend all day mixing and watering. Idk how anyone can think its more work? In veg with a 20 gal res I was doing 20 plants and mixing nutes once a week that took me a while 10 min. I cant see how hand watering can take less time

So not only do I save time I save on the cost of pots and coco
ok u caught me having a stoner moment lol. ur right hands down. which is why i want to figure out a blaumat drip system eventually. i'll just blame it on this ice cream cake lol. but seriously it's because now days i often process really slow and make mistakes in focus t be perfectl yhonest. i can't really blame weed frfr. lol
 
Aqua Man

Aqua Man

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ok u caught me having a stoner moment lol. ur right hands down. which is why i want to figure out a blaumat drip system eventually. i'll just blame it on this ice cream cake lol. but seriously it's because now days i often process really slow and make mistakes in focus t be perfectl yhonest. i can't really blame weed frfr. lol
Nothing wrong with asking or debating. Was a fair question. Especially if you have never used autofeed.
 
Hopefull Stoner

Hopefull Stoner

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how fast can u break that puppy down. and how much does it cost to run with electricity and water costs on avg. how many pants and what type of pull. how much and what type of lights ?

i was running a 600 hps digital old school no dimmer but barely used u dig. just grabbed a 500w led board i haven't even unboxed it yet. might do that tonight since some seedlings sprung up today unexpectedly. do u have a thread that show ur set up well ?
 
Jumpingspider

Jumpingspider

541
143
System takes like an hr and never have to do it again. I mix my res and thats it. After mixing nutes for hand watering more frequently you still need to water and get rid of runoff for every pot of every grow. I could not use 1 gal pots if I was hand watering because I would spend all day mixing and watering. Idk how anyone can think its more work? In veg with a 20 gal res I was doing 20 plants and mixing nutes once a week that took me a while 10 min. I cant see how hand watering can take less time

So not only do I save time I save on the cost of pots and coco

Agreeing with hopefull - you seem to have this dialed in Aqua. I would love to see your setup detailed and any tips and tricks you got! In another thread though this one is about cutting roots, not packing more roots into a tiny ass container. šŸ˜…
 

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