Phenotype Hunt - The search for the next, new and best!

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als_weed

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To the Cloner We Go!

Moms by strain -

Starting with WAGZ:

PH029


Next is LVCZ:

PH030


Here's PRMZ:

PH031


And finally GDPZ:

PH032


Time to snip. We are going to take the top and the largest 2 side shoots.

Here's a before:

PH033


And after:

PH034


We immediately put the shoots into a labeled cup. Positive Identification and Traceability are required in this work. If I find something without a label, I throw it away. If you don't REALLY know what something is, it is worthless.

Notice the mom plant is now a perfect cone of shoots ready to grow. And with the top gone, the plant can now concentrate completely on those shoots. This is a good time to transplant to a medium small pot, but I think we will keep them in cups for a while longer.

Clean up the cuttings until just the top shoot and a small set of leaves remain. I like to leave 5 - 7 inches of stem, and cut with a box cutter at a 45 degree angle. If you leave strings or fibers hanging, the cutting is more likely to get infected. Make sure your cuts are clean and leave no leaf buds or leaf petiole tissue on the bottom of the stem.

Here's a before:

PH035


And after:

PH036


And finally everyone in the cloner!

PH037


I have added Pure Michigan, Lava Cake and White Angel to the run as backups in case anyone refuses to root.

This is the trickiest bit, trying to get 21 individuals to root in a reasonable window, so that we can get useful information on everyone.

Hold onto your butts! Here we go!

Your questions and comments are always welcome.

-al


 
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als_weed

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-al's Mail Bag

Occasionally I will repost questions asked in other forums or mail that seem relevant.

Cloner Questions

do you use a cover/dome on the clones in the clone machine? also what do you consider a reasonable root window? -m

Great Question!

I actually do the opposite of domes and gently blow them with oscillating air. Because the aerocloner maintains the rootzone with fully saturated air, both in terms of water and the dissolved oxygen in it, domes become a hindrance to transpiration.

This is why aerocloners work so efficiently. Plants are really straws, so blowing across them helps. Don't do this with peat pellets!

As for timing, my hope is that we can get a representative from every individual rooted by around day 21. This should get us on target for 40 to 50 days veg.

Here's the cloner 24 hours later:

PH038


What is your biggest worry about the cloner? I hate aerocloners. So undependable. -b

It's August. I use biotics, some wild type. We face searing heat waves, rolling blackouts, and getting above 84 degrees in the res means start over.

The tea helps a lot. I haven't ran an aero device without it for a decade. The old 'flapper' style of sprayer will stick and kill everything, but those are relics.

The big problem with new cloners is that the reservoir is too small. Makes it too easy to heat up, and when the plants transpire, can concentrate the nutes to the point of burning. My old 64s hold 8 to 10 gallons, while the 'new and improved' low profile ones hold only 4 gallons.

You don't cut your tips? -m

No. I just make sure the center of the shoot gets light. The fan helps keep them gently swaying, reducing shadow spots while increasing transpiration.

What's the obsession with days and the calandar? -p

The art of crafting plants requires both accuracy and precision. Not only do we have to hit the target, but be able to do it repeatedly. A deeper understanding of the timing in each stage of the process is critical to success. They built Stonehenge for the same reason.

Sorry that sounded pretty high n mighty, but I am passionate about the subject!

In this experiment, the biggest trick beyond rooting, is getting all these different strains to perform together. Timing, pruning and other methods will be required to manage the bucking bronco that is aeroponics.

Here's a sneak peak at 12 days of growth, where the plants doubled in size:

PH039


Thank you for your interest.

-al

 
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als_weed

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1 Week in the Cloner

We got a couple roots, but more significantly, everyone is still with us. No slime or snot balls on the stems. The res is still foamy and I have only added fresh tea so far.

Here's a shot of our cuttings:

PH040


Here's our moms in waiting:

PH041


They will continue to sip tea while the cuttings become clones. This next week is when the action should speed up, as rooting begins in earnest.

As always, your questions and comments are welcome.

-al
 
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als_weed

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2 Weeks in the Cloner

We have 15 of 18 represented individuals with some significant root development. I took backup clones of the 3 that have failed to root so far.

Here's a shot of the tops:

PH042


And the roots:

PH043


Some are a bit bedraggled, while others are taking off already. You can see how a lot of rooting triggers off the tendencies of individuals.

Another reason is the hormones in the growth tips that we started with. Here's a shot showing the side shoot cuttings fully rooted, while the top cutting from the same plant is just starting to bump.

PH044


This is a common result that proves spending time to develop mom plants is worth the effort.

I am topping off the nutes and tea for another week, letting the cuttings grow. Soon it will be time to figure out who will make it to the veg cloner.

As always, your comments and questions are welcome.

-al



 
SchwiftyGrower

SchwiftyGrower

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What an amazing and informative read this has been! Excited to see the rest and wish you the best in your growing adventure!
 
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als_weed

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A Time to Veg

We are setting up the cloner in the Veg Room.

This is What We Need:

PH045


Disclaimer First: This is what I use. Your mileage may vary. You can harm your plants if made, used, or dosed incorrectly.

als Go Go Veg o Matic Recipe

In 8 gallons RO water:

60 ml A (heavy Nitrogen)

30 ml B (heavy Phosphorus)

2 Tblspn Aero Tea / 4 after plants established

For me, this results in 425 ppm and a pH of 6.3. They need to be topped off with RO water daily, as allowing them to concentrate the nutes can result in burning all the new growth tips and leaves. This happens when you get above 500 ppm for these nutes.

I replace all veg reservoirs weekly and double the Aero Tea dosage once the plants start to take off.

You can use about any nute line out there, just make sure the mix is Nitrogen heavy for this stage. I prefer a 2:1 ratio for the healthiest results.

Here's a pic of our girls out of the nursery and into the veg room:

PH046


This is Veg Cloner Row:

PH047


We will have to start picking winners and losers soon. I would estimate that we are about 3 weeks out from the bloom room. The contest for the 18 grow show spots begins now.

As always, your questions and comments are welcome.

-al

 
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als_weed

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There Can Be Only One!

We have 4 individuals that are seriously behind or failed to root. I took backup clones of these and a couple have started to root. We will go to the bloom room with whomever is rooted, no matter the size. Pheno hunting requires some compromises to create the largest net and snare those elusive keepers.

I selected the best representative of each individual and discarded the rest. With extra space and go-go juice, the plants have gone into explosive growth. At this rate, we will head to the bloom room in about a week!

1 Week Veg Cloner:

PH048


I decided to uppot our moms to 2 quart containers. They were getting raggedy to the point that recovery time to be a mom would be a problem. I could have drug them over the finish line, but giving them the extra space ensures that they all live, and gives me some extra time to rerun anyone that doesn't make the show on the first try.

Here's Our Moms:

PH049


Just a couple days after the uppot, you can see the fresh green aggressive growth. We are still a couple months from selecting winners and it will be a struggle to keep them small, yet ready to sprout fresh shoots.

As always, your questions and comments are welcome.

-al
 
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als_weed

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2 Weeks and Done!

The Go-go juice has done its job. The main players all look fabulous, and the stragglers are at least 6 inches tall. PRMZ1,GDPZ1,GDPZ4, and GDPZ5 are not making it to the show. I will rerun them in a future round up run. If they fail to root a third time, it's just not meant to be for my garden.

Here's our girls at 2 weeks veg:

PH050


Show us your Roots!

PH051


Our Moms:

PH052


They are loving twice the root volume right now. I will let them coast for a while before we mess with them more.

Meanwhile, it's time for the clones to go to the bloom room!

-al
 
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als_weed

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The Bloom Room

Tools & Methods


My weapon of choice for rapid phenotyping is the General Hydroponics Aeoflo 36. It's an antique, but is unmatched in performance for this kind of work. We can look at up to 18 individuals in a 6x6 footprint, while cutting weeks out of the process of getting to finished bud compared to any other method. At the same time, it uses a quarter of the nutes and the only waste products are root masses and stalks.

There are several problems with these machines, and I keep meaning to replace them with shiny new bespoke engineered pieces, but they keep running with only minor mods.

Nutrition for aero is very different compared to any other method. This was the largest leap in my progression from soils, NFT, and DWC to aero.

When I first went to water, the Lucas formula(developed on Cannabis World) was the best rule of thumb for starting nutes in bubbling buckets. 0-8-16 made some pretty plants and is still used to this day. This formulation results in a base of 1350 ppm. Aero burns at 400, and proportional reduction does not provide adequate nutrition.

At the time, Dutch Master had a line of compatible products that could be tweaked into usability. After they went belly up, the weed world changed, and the focus had shifted more towards drain to waste and other less complicated growing methods.

I however, was hooked on all the benefits of aero. I did many heads up competitions with several lines of nutes to end up with Heavy 16 as the synthetic base of my recipe. At the same time, I started developing AeroTea, taking aeroponics out of the sterile world and adding a biotic touch, combining the best of both worlds.

Syntho/Biotic Aeroponics - You can't get any further from KISS than this. The pitfalls are numerous, and all have the same result - Start Over. But there isn't a faster, more efficient, and cost effective way to produce spectacular results.

Enough with ancient history. Let's get to work!

Main Products Needed:

PH053


Secondary Products:

PH054


Disclaimer First: This is what I use. Your mileage may vary. You can harm your plants if made, used, or dosed incorrectly.

-als Syntho/Biotic Bloomtastic Brew

In 40 gallons RO water

80 ml Heavy 16 Bloom A

80 ml Heavy 16 Bloom B

40ml Heavy 16 Fire

40 ml Heavy 16 Prime

2 Tblspn Epson Salts

2 Cups Aero Tea

For me, this results in 360 ppm, with a pH of 6.3. We will have 2 full res changes over the course of the bloom cycle. All adjustments are logged daily.

Let's roll on to the plant.

-al
 
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als_weed

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Bloom Day 0

A Time to Plant

This is our layout for the participants in this run:

PH055


The order by size of mom is: Black Rock Lava Cake, Pure Michigan, White Angel, and Gran Dawgy Purps. I tried to group them by strain and size as much as possible.

In addition to our experimental girls, I have included White Angel, Black Rock Lava Cake, Pure Michigan, and Black Truffle for comparison. Black Truffle is Pure Michigan x White Truffle, and the current hotness in these parts.

One of the few good looking GDPZs broke right off in my hand. Hadn't had that happen in years. I needed a moment. What a tragedy!

PH056


Day 0 Bloom:

PH057


The light is set to the lowest setting. The droopy girls will be looking better tomorrow.

Can't wait to see these girls take off!

As always, your comments and questions are welcome.

-al
 
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als_weed

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Day 3 Bloom Update

Group Shot:

PH058


Data:

PH059


Everyone survived and perked. They have that super lush look and happy leaves.

I have shoot pruned everyone to 4, and removed any damaged leaves. This practice makes it easier to spot problems and reduces opportunities for pests and disease. As a rule, I never remove leaves unless there is a good reason.

Today was a big day for the plants. They started eating and got their first adjustment. On the data sheet, you can see the ppm got below my trigger of 345. My response was to add 20 ml of both A and B, while continuing to reduce the pH to below 6.4. This should put us right around 390-400 with this growth rate and age.

The circled s on the chart means they got a shot of foliar spray. This is the same als Super Feed N Kill Foliar Spray from earlier in this thread.

Along with all that, the lights got cranked up to 60%.

As always, your comments and questions are welcome.

-al

 
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als_weed

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-al's Mail Bag

Occasionally I will repost questions asked in other forums or mail that seem relevant.

Wow, under 400ppm. Never knew it needs to be so low in aero. -g

Yeah things start to burn around 420. Like everyone else! Seriously tho, one of the great advantages of aero is that it uses a quarter of normal hydro nutes.

So what's the short version of how aero works and why you do it? -m

Aero is all about delivering nutrients and dissolved oxygen in water droplets directly to the roots.

This acts like a supercharger, and maxes out the plants metabolism, resulting in crazy growth.

-Advantages:

Fastest Growth - Highest growth rates possible results in faster development, maximum gland and terp production, while finishing faster than other methods. Adding Aero Tea to the mix brings all the advantages of biotics and organics.

Low Nute Load - A quarter of the nutes means a quarter of the cost.

Low Waste - Only root balls and stalks are waste products. Saw a pile of used rockwool cubes on the side of the road the other day and it pissed me off.

Best Product - Aero stacks trichs like nothing else.

-Disadvantages:

High Failure Risk - Exposed roots are dangerous and there is no room for error. Most problems result in start over.

Like Having Cows - The plants require your attention every 12 hours. This is as far from KISS as you can get.

Lack of Commercial Support - Nutes and machines for medium scale aero are scarce. The machines I use are not optimized for weed and required mods.

Sorry, that got long and I still haven't answered your question of why aero? Well the answer is the same quest everyone here is on - To make the very best.

My greatest hope is that readers of this thread will find something useful for their own growing journey.

Thank you for your interest.

-al











 
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als_weed

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Day 7 Bloom Update

Unit Shot:

PH060


Data:

PH061


We had another adjustment as the plants begin to ramp up their growth. I've pumped up the lights and aggressively shoot pruned the shortest plants. while leaving the larger plants with up to 5 side branches. This directs all the energy of the short plants into height, while forcing the taller plants to lollygag on side branches that unfortunately will be cut off later.

Happy Plants:

PH062


You can see the plants have put on a set of leaves and are looking very happy.

Show us your roots!

PH063


Herringbone roots have encircled the netpot on this small plant. Smaller hair-like aero roots will develop next. Once that starts, the roots need to be left undisturbed.

As always, your comments and questions are welcome.

-al


 
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als_weed

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Looking great. How often do you foliar and how far into flower?
I try to foliar spray every third day. On the data sheet, a circled s shows when it was done.

Because I shoot prune, we will have large fan leaves beneath the bud layer that will get sprayed until a week before the chop.

This method 'force feeds' the plants in late bloom, maximizing their expressions.

Thank you for your interest.

-al
 
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als_weed

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Mom Update

PH064


At 3 months old, the moms are already screaming for root space and Nitrogen. I removed damaged leaves and pruned where needed.

They have 2 months to go, and the challenge will be to keep them small, but healthy enough to be a clone mother.

So for now, I'm adding 4 Tablespoons of worm castings and RO water. This will let us coast for a while longer on tea.

As always, your questions and comments are welcome.

-al

 
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als_weed

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Day 11 Bloom Update

Trellis Time!

We are in the explosive growth phase, when plants can put on inches every day.

Lush Plants:

PH065


Before:

PH066


A few plants are falling over and it's time to put up the trellis. I stole the tech from pepper growers that use an adjustable trellis in commercial hydro grows.

It's just dowels lashed together, but it allows us ultimate control of every plant in the unit.

Now is the time to move anyone, before they all get locked in.

Here's our swaps:

PH067


One last look at the roots:

PH068


Trellis in Place:

PH069


I've started pinching the tops of the tallest plants while leaving the side branches. Shorter plants are being aggressively shoot pruned. Just trying to keep the tall ones out of the light, while still getting viable results from the smallest participants.

As always, your comments and questions are welcome.

-al
 
Rebeccalovato777

Rebeccalovato777

353
93

Day 11 Bloom Update


Trellis Time!

We are in the explosive growth phase, when plants can put on inches every day.

Lush Plants:

View attachment 1284913

Before:

View attachment 1284914

A few plants are falling over and it's time to put up the trellis. I stole the tech from pepper growers that use an adjustable trellis in commercial hydro grows.

It's just dowels lashed together, but it allows us ultimate control of every plant in the unit.

Now is the time to move anyone, before they all get locked in.

Here's our swaps:

View attachment 1284916

One last look at the roots:

View attachment 1284919

Trellis in Place:

View attachment 1284920

I've started pinching the tops of the tallest plants while leaving the side branches. Shorter plants are being aggressively shoot pruned. Just trying to keep the tall ones out of the light, while still getting viable results from the smallest participants.

As always, your comments and questions are welcome.

-al
Looking good so do you keep it pure dark for 12 hours I would love to do this during veggitation so I could have more harvest coming I have a small house huge yard 😂 but seriously I want to do this was thinking about doing it and putting up something just in case my teens turn on a light would that affect flowering?

Ps lmao you stole it 🤦‍♀️ 😂 that made me laugh love the honesty!!!!!
 
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