UCMENOW said:

Sub-Primeform, I'll spare you the schooling I'm tempted to unleash on you.....as I'm officially a reformed lash master.

Anyway......Pretty clueless of you to assume the previous posts are based off of senseless regurgitation. You must post more than you read here on the Farm.

Good news though, you're more than welcome to be clueless bro, this is an open forum after all.

I realize Current Culture has no experience in RDWC either, but they too generally recommend avoiding zymes. Apparently they've gotten repeated reports of bio-slime, red/ brown algae, reduced DO levels (from biofilms on air stones) and pH fluctuations for a high percentage of UC growers using zymes.

Though they probably just read that in a post on some random thread I'd imagine ;)

Click to expand...

I said it seemed like regurgitation because every post saying that hygrozyme is bad had 0 information to back its claim including yours. Why not simply say that there have been reports of bio slime and red/brown algae from using zymes. This is a TOTALLY different subject then treating root rot, and does belong in the conversation since it is a unique problem to DWC. Im actually very glad you brought this up because it proves why beneficial bacteria like great white DO belong in RDWC. If your having a problem with algae, using hygrozyme is not recomended because it can feed it just like the bad bacteria. Its important to understand that hygrozyme doesnt CAUSE the algae it simply feeds it. If running a sterile environment like DM zone doesnt fix the algae problem then the only solution is beneficial bacteria. In this case where you have an algae problem I would not recommend using hygrozyme at all until there are no more signs of the algae. But once again your problem isnt hygrozyme, its not having a sterile or beneficially colonized grow environment.

I would also like to know how basing your opinion on Current Cultures recommendation because of repeated reports is not from senseless regurgitation. Sounds like the definition of it to me.

I do however agree with your signature.

so these roots did they just pull off, or did you cut them off? there looks like some good roots(covered in stuff) and some bad roots? did the roots just pull away with no resistance?

recommending hygrozyme its sketch business, IMO it seems like I see just as many people have had problems with it as have liked it when it comes to water culture.

Great white is another product, some people like it, hear a lot of folks saying it causes problems..



Does that mean using hygrozyme is going to give you the slime, not nesicarlly, but its more prone to causing problems in a RDWC system than other products, so why not just recommend a product with a better track record..
for instance aquashield, how many folks do you see having problems with this and only this added to their res, compared to people having problems with the hygrozyme..

back when it was hydroguard, people loved it too, its been around forever and generally people have good results with it/

I don't think the hygrozyme itself creates the slime(~opinion~) just that it reacts with something in the environment to make the slime(algae spores, etc...), cause some folks use it with no problems, if it was actually the hygrozyme seems it would happen to every single person who used it..

I personally don't care much for zyme products cause if you are using beneficial bacteria they are already producing zymes for you. Regardless hygrozyme sucks IMO, and if I felt I had to use zymes, cnnazyme over hygrozyme any day of the week...

PhatNuggz said:

RDWC is a recipe for disaster. It vegges OK, but the roots never compare to deep cycle high pressure aero roots. It's usually when you are in the third week of flower nutes that the rez craps out heavily imbalanced pH and high ppms + warm temps are usually more than enough. Toss into that most growers over fertilize and KABOOM

There are so many potential problems waiting to happen, beginning with it is a bad idea to soak your roots 24/7.

Click to expand...

You sir are an idiot. You are unintelligent and ill-informed. And that's all I'll say about that.

Primeform, seriously dude, why won't you just admit it, you were wrong. Jeeze, man up already. Originally I had no problem with it, we all make mistakes. But you're wrong, and yet you continue to stick to your guns, even though you've already admitted to having limited first hand experience. A lot of these guys telling you that you are wrong in fact are "hydro guys". So please dude, please stop feeding misinformation to people, there is more than enough of that on the internet without your help.

primeform said:

Why not simply say that there have been reports of bio slime and red/brown algae from using zymes. This is a TOTALLY different subject then treating root rot, and does belong in the conversation since it is a unique problem to DWC. Im actually very glad you brought this up because it proves why beneficial bacteria like great white DO belong in RDWC. .

Click to expand...

I don't follow at all. So the OP is using a RDWC, so how does it not belong in the conversation? That would be like getting medication from the doctor, and when you ask about the side effect the doc replies, "That doesn't belong in this conversation." How dumb. The fact that zyme creates slime and algae proves your point that zyme belongs in an RDWC? Again I don't follow. I don't know how things go down over there, but here in The Mitten we try to not grow slime. But hey I don't know maybe your a slime/algae farmer, but me personally I grow meds.

Far from Prime Time Info

Subprime....please feel free to continue entertaining yourself with comments that make you feel knowledgable on the subject of RDWC...though it's clear your not.

As for referencing the recommendations of the makers of the most successful water culture system on the market, read closer and you'll see....

"I realize Current Culture has no experience in RDWC either, but they too generally recommend avoiding zymes. Apparently they've gotten repeated reports of bio-slime, red/ brown algae, reduced DO levels (from biofilms on air stones) and pH fluctuations for a high percentage of UC growers using zymes."

Quoting a commercially successful hydro companies advice is far from senseless regurgitation IMO

So.....Kudos on your ability to feel comfortable giving wack advice in a thread you have little to no experience on the subject.

"I'm not a hydro guy".....previous quote from Primeform

By the way....if you have beneficial bacteria in your system they will produce enzymes, no need to introduce over priced slime food.

Also, Algae is a plant, not a bacteria....please go read and learn more before you attempt to teach bro.

Primeform, you seem to contradict yourself. Why is repeating CC regurgitation from others, but you repeating what your "friends" have seen in RDWC not? I keep trying to figure out why you are so angrily defensive of hygrozyme. I thought the comment you made about how it was invented for a sterile environment interesting. I glanced at their website and didn't see that info. Do you work for a nute manufacturer or a hydro shop or something? Your posts seem off if you don't have another motivation. Maybe I'm wrong about what the motivation is, but why are you so angrily debating people who actually have experience in this?

tons of new, annoying retards on farm, prime example

what did you end up doing gettogrow? whatever you do, dont wait, you want to nip it in the bud

sorry to say but you are all close minded people that would rather NOT know how your systems work. You have no idea how DM Zone, beneficial bacteria, or hygrozyme work at all let alone how they affect each other. My information has been backed up by scientific analysis. I explained how hygrozyme feeds good bacteria, bad bacteria, and algae alike. You guys have "reports" from people to a UC designer? Im sure NONE of them took the time to figure out HOW there systems work either. Ill say it one more time. If you dump hygrozyme into a non sterile and non benefical bacteria colonized rez your in for disaster.


Mary > aquashield is beneficial bacterias. if your going that route Great White is a much better option. Actually Mycogrow is from the SAME company and much cheaper. about 80 dollars a pound. www.fungi.com

hygrozyme can feed the slime if you dont have beneficial bacteria. the ONLY thing that can TREAT the slime is BENEFICIAL bacteria. If you have algae that is not treated by using DM zone or other sterile environment your ONLY chance to fight the algae is benes. Hygrozyme doesnt CREATE algae it simply FEEDS it.

SToner smurf > read my post again i said it DOES belong in the conversation

UCENOW > just give up dude you have no idea what your talking about. Go ahead and follow the advice of the UC system support team. i gave you quotes of UC people that use hygrozyme and love it. because they know HOW to use it. And yes microbes create enzymes. And hygrozyme can feed these microbes allowing them to multiple quickly. once you have an established colonie of microbes you dont need to keep adding hygrozyme. Also I never said algae was a bacteria. I said that hygrozyme feeds algae just like bad bacteria. lol what a joker.

amstercal > no i dont work for a nute company and have NO motivation to support hygrozyme. im giving you actual scientific information about how enzymes and bacteria interact with each other. you guys are giving 3rd hand observations from people that know as little about whats happening in there system as you do. They dump hygrozyme in without knowing wtf is going on then they say hygrozyme killed my plants or gave me algae! No your just an idiot that doesnt know what your putting in your rez. And the reason I am defending hygrozyme is because people with 0 knowledge on the subject are trying to pass bad information and it has turned into a regurgitation effect. Prime example was medimarys comment that hygrozyme = igrowslime

mrdizzle > blow me loser, youve added nothing to this thread but name calling. see i can do it too.

In conclusion: I dont give a fuck if you guys use hygrozyme. At this point i would definitely tell all of you to NOT use it because you have no idea how the bacteria, enzymes, and algae interact in your systems. Not only that but instead of trying to understand how these products work youd rather just regurgitate bad information about enzymes. Also the safest bet is to just brew beneficial bacteria for 48 hours and add it to your rez at 1-3 cups per gallon.

The only reason Im on this thread was to help ghetto grow fix his problems unlike most people here.

Prime

primeform said:

Im not a hydro guy but from what i gather here are your solutions:
1> set chiller to 62 degrees as the root rot cant live below 67.
2> DM zone if you want to run sterile(meaning no benes or root excel)
3> hygrozyme to eat up the dead roots

Click to expand...

primeform said:

It is not a cure all solution and can aggrivate the problem if you already have an established colony of bad bacteria.

Click to expand...

Ok, so you're so adamantly defending hygrozyme not because you have some relationship to hygrozyme, but just because you're helping ghetto? So do these two posts of yours not contradict each other? If he's already got rot and most likely the bad bacteria that goes with it, wouldn't it be bad for him to use hygrozyme at this point?

You're right, let's make this about helping ghetto, who obviously should not use hygrozyme at this point, not about defending using hygrozyme in RDWC. Sorry, seems like you want to contribute here and that's cool, but I don't see that you're helping the OP.

So back to trying to fix my problem. The roots didnt just fall off I had to give them a tug, but some look good some look bad, I think I cought it in time.

Here is what I did so far.

Ran 29% h2o2 8 hours
change water
ran29%h2o2 24 hours
change water
Added Physan20 10ml 100 gallon 10 hours
Magic green foilar feed

This morning:
Change water
Added 150ml DM Zone
base nutes 400ppm
40 ml drip clean
ph 5.8
water temp 64

Plants still look awesome

Im going to let this ride for a couple days see what happens

Thanks for all help and the additional pissing contest, very amusing

I was not recommending hygrozyme to solve the root rot problem. I was recommending it to EAT THE DEAD ORGANIC MATERIAL after he fixes his problem by lowering the rez temp and sterilizing with dm zone.

Once you have root rot you have dead roots. That is dead organic material in your rez. Enzymes eat dead organic material. Thats how all your brown dead roots turn white again. This can also be accomplished by using benefial bacteria. DM zone can also eat up dead organic material but has proven unaffective against algae. Therefor if you have an algae problem that is not cured by sterilization, beneficial bacteria is the only way to fight it. If you go the beneficial bacteria route you should run your rez in the low 70s instead of the low 60s like a sterile environment tho. Its been proven that the low temps retard the bene bacteria more then the root rot.

do you have any problems with slime? or just brown roots? is there a mucus on the roots? what nutrients have you been using?

thats pretty much the right dose of physan, I spoke with the company a while back and they said 1ML per 15gal of water.

see how things look, if they get any worse at all, you can leave the physan in the system, which is what had worked best for me when I had some real bad algae( that I made 20times worse with hydrozyme ie realworld experience)

I left the physan in for 3days and it cleaned house,and it breaks down into N and is totally harmless at these doses

quick question on phsyan.

there's another chem i've heard about that's used similarly but i dont know the name.

it's common to use phsyan to treat algae ...i thought that was a fungicide?

is the 150 ml/g into 100gallons of water?
i think dm says to run it harder once you have probs, but have never taken it above 2ml/g myself

also whats the diff between dm zone and psycan 20? price? bene killer?

masta

excellent question.

i'm under the impression physcan does kill bennies.

i roll sterile rez ebb & flow for flower & NO root rot issues.

dwc whole other story.

if i knew about bennie microbes when i was running buckets i'd NEVER have gotten root rot.

problems that persist can be easily abated with dips. run one problem solver in your buckets.

and make a dip in an extra (single) bucket of something else.

i've utilized that tactic with success.

its not any combo of nutes that brings the rot, unless your running sugars in general, it's lazy gardening (imo).

and, from tons of real world grow experience, i'll add hygrozyme + dwc = a total mistake.

why feed microbes an enzyme if u know for sure there's no established "good ones" ?

dwc is for masochists.

i love ebb & flow so much i want to live out in my lab :-)

however if i ever switch to a lower plant count method, rdwc is up my alley.

good info gudkarma. could you explain why you think hygro is always a bad idea in dwc? just because it can feed algae or because there is better options like benes?

do you use DM zone or how do you sterilize? thanks for your experiences.

after re-reading this thread, i definitely side in the mr goodcat camp.

he's right. it's really that simple.

in this case, you can only know if you grow.

gudkarma only talks about shit he knows & tried (THREE times minumum) in his garden, before ever shooting off at the hip on the internet.

i know hygrozyme is not useful in dwc. how? i ran buckets (10) for 6 months.

i repeatedly tried hygrozyme (note language) & it's a product that :

1) doesn't live up to the internet hype & claims
2) most people are very very misinformed about
3) can't be depended on to perform in certain situations

the above said, i cant recommend a product to another farmer that works 50, 60, or 70% of the time.

i just cant do it.

hygrozyme is useful on fresh bucket changes. maybe.

hygrozyme is NOT useful to solve a single issue.

why?

once you've tipped the balance in favor of "nasty" microbes, fucking forget that enzyme bullshit.

you need heavy artillery not a bomb set off behind YOUR lines.

if you've taken the time to establish a "good" bennie colony in your buckets, hygrozyme has a place to nourish microbes.. but will be totally unnecessary & a waste of $ with which you could have bought more nutes.

the microbes will protect & crowd out all nasties. you can re-seed them if necessary with a fresh cup of myco tea.

what i stated above is fact.

i stake my rep on it.

confident?

*

having grown for many years, i've definitely come to the point where using several methods to get the job done serves me well.

i have vast experience in all areas of hydro.

i have excellent experience with dirt too (but hate it).

i clone & cut & grow moms with microbe assistance. rock hempy with perlite for moms but microbes serve me well there too.

plants are lush & give up the cuts like my girl dishes off the vajayjay.
nice!

and my shit has never looked more bumpin!

*

in flower i roll sterile rezzies... for ease, simplicity, and peace of mind.

gudkarma pays bills with his hard work and gardening skills, i leave nothing to chance in flower. everything is fried & fried again with h2o2.

*

i've said this over & over.

had i known about bennies when i ran buckets, my life would have been so much easier.

you dont even need h202, physan, or anything like that for use inside the buckets.

i already noted this week, i've been running an experiment with a bubble cloner on a (now) 6 week old solution of grow nutes, myco tea, and ph down.

how old? you read that right.

i'm on the east coast, in this cloner i have an irreplaceable cut (romulan federation ...from an awesome farmer!) thriving & growing like mad.

proof is in experience ...not internet talky threads.

ever watch squidbillies?

so i'd definitely have to go with "there's better options like bennies".

*

to clean, nigz, i roll old fucking school.

the playstation generation forgets about elbow grease... that's why you clowns are always hunting for a cure all, a fast fix, and a quick trick.

i break down, clean & soak in h202, and clean again with bleach and water.

i clean everything 2x minimum.

i clean hydroton 3x.

my rez change outs are every three weeks, hit the link in my sig and check post #49 (ish)

tell me what you see?

clean + hydro = success

like mr. goodcat said : KISS

This thread has become entertaining and very informative at the same time. I never intended to stir up a shit storm. I was just looking to help ghettogrow with the problem in the OP. Something tells me the last thing he is going to do is put hygrozyme in his rez, and thats good. Thats what I set out to do was stop an epic failure. Although I had to be a dick to do it I am glad because in the long run it helped him out and now he stands a much better chance of fixing his problem.

100% agreed

you're the herbal equiv of "jesus"

another fish and loaf of bread from the basket sir?

maybe a little wine from ur sweat?