Steamrollers little hide away pt 1

PipeCarver · Feb 25, 2023

Moe.Red said:
I got you.

First, these were the early days for me and I didn’t have a clue what I was doing. It showed in my results! So don’t do what I did.

That said I would follow the feed advice based on the media. So if you are in coco feed like you are top watering.

My issue was that the water never made it up to the top and a few inches always stayed dry. I tried adding rope and stuff like that to wick it up to the top and never got it how I liked it. That’s when I started being a weedgineer and all the crazy shit I’m doing now came from those early trials.

Bottom line if I had to grow with auto pots today I would use a low ppm mix probably 300 -500 range in the feed res and try to encourage transpiring to move water up. Adjust ppm based on results.

Thanks for that, I'm not sure I like the part where you say if you had to grow with them again....like being forced to do something you don't want to do........I thought I was moving up in the world...advanced stuff ...lol...130% improvement in growth !!!....Spectacular then there's the air domes with more growth improvement.....These things are going to revolutionize the whole cannabis growing world......or so goes their advertising.

Moe.Red · Feb 25, 2023

PipeCarver said:
Thanks for that, I'm not sure I like the part where you say if you had to grow with them again....like being forced to do something you don't want to do........I thought I was moving up in the world...advanced stuff ...lol...130% improvement in growth !!!....Spectacular then there's the air domes with more growth improvement.....These things are going to revolutionize the whole cannabis growing world......or so goes their advertising.

Sorry I did not mean to pee on your parade.

With your skills you can probably outgrow anything I got going with you autopots.

SweetLeafGrow · Feb 25, 2023

Awesome bro, super excited to watch you RDWC. A couple of tips for the build-

Get your hole saws in multiple sizes if you don't already have them. Practice on something other than your buckets to make sure you have the right sizes.

Make sure you pick up one of these for cleaning up the hole. They will make your hole a bit larger so you have to be careful with them but they work great.

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steamroller · Feb 25, 2023

Moe.Red said:
I can see this as a good basis for a high pressure pump and spray nozzles. I got all those parts here I was building a system with aqua before I landed on fog if I can help you with that let me know

At some point I will be converting my rdwc to pressure aeroponics for the o2 benefit you get in a pressurized system

Tell me about a good pump for 15 buckets...
I am sure my circulation pumps won't like high pressure although I was really thinking I could make a loop with PEX and install misting nozzles I have from making my areo cloner in each bucket and adjust flow at each bucket. Probably still have circulating flow also.

How much gap/ air space can there be between net pot and water level?
I see many keep their water 1 inch below and some I have heard from saythey run water to the pot.
Is the air gap a real big deal without spray?
Sounds like I am just modifying/ mocking up an aero bucket,or fog like Moe.
I really did not think 2-4 inches from pot to water was a big deal as long as roots stayed wet?
^^ This is the stuff you guys need to tell me^^.

Anthem · Feb 25, 2023

Moe.Red said:
If there is 2” of water in the bottom and then a big air gap the roots hang out in you will get root damage or air pruning. So I’m not quite sure how these work.

If you fill the buckets with coco or something then you basically built an auto pot. There are several of those grows on the farm you can see results. I started with auto pots in my stealth days and outgrew them but they do work.

Moe,
I have about a 3" gap in my ebb and flow Green Tree System. The roots do not air prune. I get just a little bite of nasty looking roots where the bottom bucket has a drop down for the line connect. I am to do more research on the dutch bucket design. It is not all making
sense to me.

Aqua Man · Feb 25, 2023

steamroller said:
Tell me about a good pump for 15 buckets...
I am sure my circulation pumps won't like high pressure although I was really thinking I could make a loop with PEX and install misting nozzles I have from making my areo cloner in each bucket and adjust flow at each bucket. Probably still have circulating flow also.

How much gap/ air space can there be between net pot and water level?
I see many keep their water 1 inch below and some I have heard from saythey run water to the pot.
Is the air gap a real big deal without spray?
Sounds like I am just modifying/ mocking up an aero bucket,or fog like Moe.
I really did not think 2-4 inches from pot to water was a big deal as long as roots stayed wet?
^^ This is the stuff you guys need to tell me^^.

Thats the key as long as roots stay wet

steamroller · Feb 25, 2023

Anthem said:
I am to do more research on the dutch bucket design. It is not all making
sense to me.

^^ This I like^^I dig you are 'in process' with similar buckets. Yours have no reservoir at bottom though?
I am thinking now my plan is not there intended use. Seems about par for the course.

I still believe the Dutch bucket is what I want for my build.
I had no intention of running traditionally unless they run them recirculating 24/7.
I just did not notice the use of media till last night or today.
I really hope to overcome that.

Moe.Red · Feb 25, 2023

steamroller said:
Tell me about a good pump for 15 buckets...
I am sure my circulation pumps won't like high pressure although I was really thinking I could make a loop with PEX and install misting nozzles I have from making my areo cloner in each bucket and adjust flow at each bucket. Probably still have circulating flow also.

How much gap/ air space can there be between net pot and water level?
I see many keep their water 1 inch below and some I have heard from saythey run water to the pot.
Is the air gap a real big deal without spray?
Sounds like I am just modifying/ mocking up an aero bucket,or fog like Moe.
I really did not think 2-4 inches from pot to water was a big deal as long as roots stayed wet?
^^ This is the stuff you guys need to tell me^^.

Please do not let me deter you from your intended plan. I have not done this yet so have not worked out the bugs.

Moe.Red · Feb 25, 2023

The idea there is to use the expansion tank to smooth out the highs and the lows, and use the solenoids to actuate buckets or branches.

The misting heads are very low flow. I can show you what we came up with across the board if you think you want to get deeper with this.

I'd bet 30 seconds on every 5- 10 minutes is more than enough, but again I have not tested this. Fog became easier to implement so I went that way.

Moe.Red · Feb 25, 2023

Anthem said:
Moe,
I have about a 3" gap in my ebb and flow Green Tree System. The roots do not air prune. I get just a little bite of nasty looking roots where the bottom bucket has a drop down for the line connect. I am to do more research on the dutch bucket design. It is not all making
sense to me.

I do not know how you are running, but I can tell you air pruning is a thing.

In a perfect world you want to keep the roots from drying out. Your system may accomplish that, just as an RDWC with bubbles bursting at the surface keeps roots above the water line damp.

steamroller · Feb 25, 2023

I know that pump! It lives in my house before my RO system.
Easy enough if I go that route. I use BRS for my RO and stuff like that; https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/1-4-aquatec-8800-booster-pump-kit-bundle.html
^^ That kit comes with shut off for RO system. Always good to have replacement on hand!

Bubbles can do the same thing right?
My air pumps blow what you guys use away!

Alita AL-40 Linear Air Pump

Runs on 46 watts and has a air output of 40 lpm @ 2.18 psi. Output O.D 5/8"

kensfish.com

I have 2 of them or the next size up.
As mentioned I plan on air in the res. of each bucket. I think I can push a lot of air for 15 buckets one way or another.

Moe.Red · Feb 25, 2023

steamroller said:
How much gap/ air space can there be between net pot and water level?
I see many keep their water 1 inch below and some I have heard from saythey run water to the pot.
Is the air gap a real big deal without spray?

In my RDWC with fallponics and airstones in the plant sites, the netcup full of coco stays damp all the time from splashing. The water level is set to 1" below the netcup.

I could probably go more or less and it wouldn't matter.

But you know the more water a system has the more stable it is, so if you are designing it from the ground up, lean towards higher water level for stability. PH, temp, O2, nutes, everything becomes more easily managed with more water.

Moe.Red · Feb 25, 2023

steamroller said:
I know that pump! It lives in my house before my RO system.
Easy enough if I go that route. I use BRS for my RO and stuff like that; https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/1-4-aquatec-8800-booster-pump-kit-bundle.html
^^ That kit comes with shut off for RO system. Always good to have replacement on hand!

Bubbles can do the same thing right?
My air pumps blow what you guys use away!

Alita AL-40 Linear Air Pump

Runs on 46 watts and has a air output of 40 lpm @ 2.18 psi. Output O.D 5/8"

kensfish.com

I have 2 of them or the next size up.
As mentioned I plan on air in the res. of each bucket. I think I can push a lot of air for 15 buckets one way or another.

concur.

Anthem · Feb 25, 2023

steamroller said:
^^ This I like^^I dig you are 'in process' with similar buckets. Yours have no reservoir at bottom though?
I am thinking now my plan is not there intended use. Seems about par for the course.

I still believe the Dutch bucket is what I want for my build.
I had no intention of running traditionally unless they run them recirculating 24/7.
I just did not notice the use of media till last night or today.
I really hope to overcome that.

This is getting over thought. I looked up the system and it is very similar to what I have ran for years. It is ebb and flow. The only difference I see between the dutch bucket and what I run is the way the system circulates. You will need a media in the bucket. It needs to be there to support the plant and the plants roots. Further it is needed to allow the plant moisture when the pumps are not running. That is one of the advantages I see for the system I run. You can adjust the amount of time the system is feeding better than I can. I do 3 floods per day for 30 minutes each. It takes about 20 minutes for the return pump to backfill the rez. I use hydroton, which allows air to get to the roots between waterings, thus oxygen. I believe the amount of time between feedings allows plenty of air to circulate thru the media and that is where the plants get their o2 from. The bummer with this type of a system over say DWC is the hydroton. By the time you are done with a grow the hydroton is toast. The roots just wrap all around the hydroton and I am not going to try and take it all off. With 2 gallon buckets one 50 liter bag of hydroton will fill about 7 pots. Hydroton is around 33 dollar a bag, so that is the extra cost. However there is additional savings over DWC because you are not running air pumps nor are you running the water pumps 24/7. You use very low pressure pumps with the dutch bucket system IMO. I mean you could set it up with a dabs pump, net a fin emitters and even run dosatrons if you really wanted to and go drain to waste but the base system is designed to be simple stupid as most ebb and flow systems.

steamroller · Feb 25, 2023

@Anthem I agree that is how they are designed to be used.
Not my plan from beginning though.
I believe the way I intend to use the bucket will make them a RDWC.
Low tech but here is what I see.

A picture is worth a thousand , or couple hundred words.

I will be able to control and adjust the drain height so space below pot can what I choose.
The overflowing drain is the main goal in my build. Each overflow encourages off gassing and DO.
So I will have 1 overflow per bucket. Each bucket can be individually controlled for air,water in and water out. This is the easy part of the build for me and what I have been thinking about.
I can build this^ for 15 pots easy.

SweetLeafGrow · Feb 25, 2023

Are they going to all be connected in the same system or separate?

Aqua Man · Feb 25, 2023

steamroller said:
@Anthem I agree that is how they are designed to be used.
Not my plan from beginning though.
I believe the way I intend to use the bucket will make them a RDWC.
Low tech but here is what I see.
View attachment 1334794
A picture is worth a thousand , or couple hundred words.

I will be able to control and adjust the drain height so space below pot can what I choose.
The overflowing drain is the main goal in my build. Each overflow encourages off gassing and DO.
So I will have 1 overflow per bucket. Each bucket can be individually controlled for air,water in and water out. This is the easy part of the build for me and what I have been thinking about.
I can build this^ for 15 pots easy.

I actually like that idea… the syphon will also act as a skimmer and far less likely to plug imo

Anthem · Feb 25, 2023

steamroller said:
@Anthem I agree that is how they are designed to be used.
Not my plan from beginning though.
I believe the way I intend to use the bucket will make them a RDWC.
Low tech but here is what I see.
View attachment 1334794
A picture is worth a thousand , or couple hundred words.

I will be able to control and adjust the drain height so space below pot can what I choose.
The overflowing drain is the main goal in my build. Each overflow encourages off gassing and DO.
So I will have 1 overflow per bucket. Each bucket can be individually controlled for air,water in and water out. This is the easy part of the build for me and what I have been thinking about.
I can build this^ for 15 pots easy.

I see what you are attempting. I would either go with a straight DWC type system or an Ebb and Flow system. I believe you mentioned you ordered some buckets take a look at how the drain works because that is a possible point of concern. All my stuff uses grommets to hold barred fitting. Depending on the water height it could be a point of concern.

Aqua Man · Feb 25, 2023

If doing that i would suggest input be on the opposite side of output. Maybe coming in the side at a right angle down. That will allow better mixing capa

Anthem · Feb 25, 2023

steamroller said:
@Anthem I agree that is how they are designed to be used.
Not my plan from beginning though.
I believe the way I intend to use the bucket will make them a RDWC.
Low tech but here is what I see.
View attachment 1334794
A picture is worth a thousand , or couple hundred words.

I will be able to control and adjust the drain height so space below pot can what I choose.
The overflowing drain is the main goal in my build. Each overflow encourages off gassing and DO.
So I will have 1 overflow per bucket. Each bucket can be individually controlled for air,water in and water out. This is the easy part of the build for me and what I have been thinking about.
I can build this^ for 15 pots easy.

What size pots are you talking about? I am not a DWC expert but if they are like 2 gallon you might want more input from the DWC guys.

Steamrollers little hide away pt 1

Steamrollers little hide away pt 1

PipeCarver

Moe.Red

SweetLeafGrow

US Stock 1set NB1100/1000 Deburring Tool With 10 BS1010 Blades NEW | eBay

steamroller

Anthem

Aqua Man

steamroller

Moe.Red

Moe.Red

Moe.Red

steamroller

Alita AL-40 Linear Air Pump

Moe.Red

Moe.Red

Alita AL-40 Linear Air Pump

Anthem

steamroller

SweetLeafGrow

Aqua Man

Anthem

Aqua Man

Anthem

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