using solar panels in grow rooms

[blue-dreamer]

Im wondering if you can recycle electricity by having solar panels in your grow room. Like if the panels were under 1000w lights they could power a 400w veg room???

 

[ttystikk]

LOL- boy, if this worked, we wouldn't need pesky things like power plants or high tension powerlines!

First, wouldn't you want something under the bulb besides solar panels, or what would be the point? Having plants in the way would wreck your solar gain profile!

Even the very best solar panels only capture and utilize some 25-30% of available energy.

Even if the solar panel you used for this was 100% efficient, you'd still have losses because not all the emitted light would land on a solar panel.

The bulb isn't 100% efficient at converting electricity INTO light, either. No bulb is, not even LED.

Nevermind how cost prohibitive this would be.

...and those are just the reasons I can think of off the top of my head...

 

[GanjaAL]

From the research I have done... the best you can do is get a system for the house you live in in order to offset some of the cost of other equipement that is running. But as far as it offsetting the cost of lights... don't we all wish we could do that.

If you are looking to go off grid... diesel genny's would be your best bet. You will need two of those as you would have to use one or the other while you do routine maintainance on the other.

Wish you the best brother.

 

[ttystikk]

I read your post and thought you were asking about putting solar panels INSIDE your growroom, where the only light falling on them would be light you've already generated with your bulbs. If this is the case, my comments above stand. If not, then;

First, any and all alternative energy you can tap into will reduce your usage profile. Second, any and all electrical conservation strategies you can employ will also return benefits, especially if conservation drops you into a lower tier for usage charges. I had a thread around here for power outage tips, many of those are power saving tips too.

Now- where you are will make a big difference as to which alternative energy sources make sense for you to install. Not much point in solar panels in coastal WA, for example! Investigate what people are doing in your area for alternative power, and follow suit. Here in Colorado, we're blessed by over 300 days of sunshine, plenty of wind and for those sited to take advantage, plenty of height for waterpower.

Yes, installing alternative energy sources are currently expensive- look into govt. credits, and keep in mind that part of what you save will be the difference in usage tiers your system will (or won't) allow you to stay in. Look at the long term numbers, the 5, 10 or even 20 year usage and you'll see that your investment will eventually pay off, faster if they help you stay under usage tier thresholds.

Finally, don't be afraid to think unconventionally; I run a big 2 ton chiller that cools all the hydro systems and rooms that I run. I hauled the thing inside and put it in a spare office last fall, and the heat it puts out actually heated my whole house all winter, saving me anywhere up to a couple hundred a month just in gas bills! It didn't directly reduce my electrical consumption, but money saved is still money saved.

 

[BirdDog1]

A typical residential solar panel will produce approx. 150 watts of AC power. These panels are around 3 foot by 5 foot and need to be in direct sunlight to produce 150w. I have 30 of em on my roof and they will offset 3.5 1000w lights on a 12/12. I just saw a new fan that mounts inside the grow room that has a small solar panel that runs off of the lights.....great idea, i think we will see more in-room solar powered equipment in the future.

So ya, you can recycle the energy from your grow lights!

 

[BirdDog1]

Edit: More specifically, for example if a solar panel is producing 200 watts, 5 panels will produce 1 kilowatt (1000 watts). If these 5 panels run at 1000 watts for 1 hour, its a kilowatt hour. "Kwh" is the abbreviation you will see on your power bill. This system will run a 1000 watt lamp as long as you have optimal sun.

 

[skywalkerOG]

A typical residential solar panel will produce approx. 150 watts of AC power. These panels are around 3 foot by 5 foot and need to be in direct sunlight to produce 150w. I have 30 of em on my roof and they will offset 3.5 1000w lights on a 12/12. I just saw a new fan that mounts inside the grow room that has a small solar panel that runs off of the lights.....great idea, i think we will see more in-room solar powered equipment in the future.

Going to try to do this in the summer, any tips?

 

[BirdDog1]

Going to try to do this in the summer, any tips?

Yep, i'm in the business. I don't want to jack this thread but i'm happy to help, if you have specific questions shoot me a pm.
1. Don't lease
2. Only put enough solar to suppliment the energy you buy in the higher tiers. This depends on your utility company, and how many "baseline" Kwh they give you. Typically, you want to produce 60% of your power with solar and buy the baseline from your utility because it is cheap.
3. Hire a solar contractor, and negociate $5.5o per watt installed. This will ensure a payoff in around 5-6 years....then it's all gravy. The rebate paperwork is a beeotch (federal & state), let them do it.
4. If you choose to install it yourself know that the inverters will fail, not the panels....be ready to replace.
5. Use the power grid to store your access energy. The contractor will do the paperwork and the utility will switch your meter to a "net" meter that will spin backwards when you are producing more power than you are using. If you need to be off grid completly you will need batteries to store the access. They are expensive, will need to be replaced 5-10 times compared to the panels, and need to be maintained monthly.

Cheers
BirdDog

 

[ttystikk]

Welllll... that wasn't a thread jack, that was right on point! Countries like the Netherlands, Denmark and the like are experimenting with large numbers of wind turbines and in some cases, solar. The grid sends the power to where it's requested- and the excess is stored in, of all places, the batteries of citizens' electric cars. Food for thought considering we see battery powered cars on the roads here even now.

So how big is a 200W panel, and how well can it be integrated into a home designed around them?

 

[BirdDog1]

Welllll... that wasn't a thread jack, that was right on point! Countries like the Netherlands, Denmark and the like are experimenting with large numbers of wind turbines and in some cases, solar. The grid sends the power to where it's requested- and the excess is stored in, of all places, the batteries of citizens' electric cars. Food for thought considering we see battery powered cars on the roads here even now.

So how big is a 200W panel, and how well can it be integrated into a home designed around them?

I also work with residential wind generation products but they only work between 9-35 mhp winds so they are usually not ideal when compared to solar. A 300w wind turbine is around $5-7k while 300 watts of solar PV (photo-voltaic, or electric) is around $1,500.

One company makes a 230 watt residential panel and it measures approx. 3.5' x 5'. Integration is a problem retrofitting traditional panels on a structure in terms of ascetics. The panels need a couple inches of airflow under them to keep them cool. Heat = less production for solar PV. If you have roof space that faces S/SW in your back or side yard, it's not a big problem, people typically just don't want to see them on the front of their homes.

You can buy "integrated" solar panels that blend into your roof and look like shiny tiles. These are the most ascetically pleasing, but least efficient and most expensive.

The bottom line is; How fast can I pay off my solar system with the money I will save from producing power with solar? The answer; Chinese panels, *traditional inverters, and only supplementing the high tier energy you purchase with solar. With this suggestion you can payoff your solar system with energy utility savings in around 5 years. Most inverters are waranteed for 10-15 years, and panels for 25 years. A typical return on investment on a solar PV system is as high as 20%+. In my area we pay on average 30 cents per kilowatt hour (all tiers averaged). I produce one kilowatt hour with solar for around 11 cents.

* Inverters convert the direct current electricity coming from the panels to AC. You will have an approx. 20% loss in the conversion from DC to AC. A traditional inverter will allow several panels to be wired into it in series. IE; 10 panels wired into 1 inverter. Micro inverters are newer technology. They mount under each panel, IE; 10 panels 10 small inverters. Micro inverters have their strengths but are more expensive.

I can further break down utlitly rates and tiers if anyone is interested.

Cheers
BirdDog

 

[ttystikk]

Fascinating stuff and very interesting how quickly a solar array can pay for itself in a tiered usage environment- this was recently implemented in my area, so anything I can do to shave off a few kWH is to the good!

So you have done a great job introducing panels and inverters, many thanks. There's one piece of kit left to the puzzle and that is a power controller, correct? How do the systems you're referring to above handle that? How might the setup differ based on whether you can tie into the grid or not?

Thanks again for all the great info!

 

[fishwhistle]

BD,Do you have any experience with the burgey wind generators?they are 10kw i beleive and about 35-40k to install,they are all the rage in alot of windy rural areas.

 

[BirdDog1]

ttystikk:

Good question, and this dives into the electrical wiring aspect.

With a grid tied system the panels are wired in series in which the voltage will increase with every panel added (8, 16, 24, 32 etc). This will be correct to 120/240 at the inverter. Power travels from the panels to the inverter then to the home. The power will be used in the home first, and if there is acces, flow back to the grid and spinning the meter backwards. You will receive Kwh credits for this extra power. I do believe that the utility is required as of this year to buy any remaing power surplus at the end of the annual cycle (at wholesale price of course, not what they charge us). In the past, if you produced more electricity than you used they just sold it to your neighbor and zeroed you out. No $$ for the power. Even though now they will buy the additional power, it is not a good investment. Do not oversize your grid tied system.

With an off grid system the panels are wired in parrallel so the voltage stayes the same. Off grid deals with lower voltage, usually 12, 24, or 48 volts. The DC power comes from the panels and charges the batteries first, then the power is ran through an off grid inverter and correct to 120/240 volts for use in the home. A charge controller is also needed for off grid to ensure the batteries are not over charged.

Fishwhistle:

No, we had mechicanical problems with the wind turbines in the residential market and have since focused on solar. Perhaps they are no longer blowing to pieces at 40+ mph winds, but check them out thouroughly before purchasing. I will admit that my knowledge of wind generated power is limited.

Hope that answeres your questions.

BirdDog

 

[ttystikk]

Different states vary wildly in their treatment of excess power generated by private customers- in many cases, Colorado included, the utility is required to buy the power and pay for it immediately (credit your bill), and at the same rate they sell it to you for. How this squares with tiered usage programs I'm not sure.

 

[ttystikk]

Bird dog, I gotta give you a lil grief, cuz I'm the proud son of english professors;

'Ascetics' are people who eschew modern conveniences and live very simply, one can think of a traditional Amish lifestyle as a mild form of asceticism.

'Aesthetics' is the word I think you were looking for, it refers to how attractive or pretty something is.

Walking thesaurus, at your service...

 

[BirdDog1]

Bird dog, I gotta give you a lil grief, cuz I'm the proud son of english professors;

'Ascetics' are people who eschew modern conveniences and live very simply, one can think of a traditional Amish lifestyle as a mild form of asceticism.

'Aesthetics' is the word I think you were looking for, it refers to how attractive or pretty something is.

Walking thesaurus, at your service...

You learn something every day! You are correct, I meant "Aesthetics". In all fairness, it was the spellchecker!! Haha, jk

 

[ttystikk]

I plan to do this on my dreamhouse... the one I'm saving for right now! I can't wait to put solar panels on everything from the garage to the doghouse, lol.

 

[WalterWhiteFire]

You are a genius!

 

[mastergreen]

Why though you get more power from sunlight then a bulb. I am a solar installer for advance panel systems and I can tell you that will never work, unless u get a panel or panels from a consumer dealer.. Best buy, solar depot exc. anything from a half kilowatt to a 20 watt system requires inspection, city permits if u get it done from installer. It will be highly inefient indoors for the price and effort, also you won't get enough lumens to store energy at night for air conditioner, humidifier, controllers , fans and all that fun stuff

 

[mastergreen]

Also u need a inverter to change the power from DC to AC witch all 120 and 240 sockets run off