Weird growth in flower? How far along do they look? *pix*

[greenergrowing4]

haha yes you are confused. Lucas is a forumla for GH 3 part that uses only the micro and bloom. The grow is cut out because micro has enough N to do the job. I did not include the ratio to the 3 part base nutes because its something I assume people are familiar with.

I do have a very complete nutrient line and all of the additives have their own specific reason for being there.

I understand your reasoning behind not adding anything at all to your base nutrients but I would also like to point out that science has come a long way and although your dogs will never die... my dog will kick your dogs ass. This is why companies like AN are able to charge people so much, not because their nutrients are superior but because there line used completely and correctly will always give you higher yields with higher THC content. And no thats not hearsay, that has been tested by many people including a nice long article by high times about testing 4 different nutrient lines and their results. I will post this if anyone is curious.

So all in all after many years of research I have picked out certain additives that I know to make a difference. If you can show me the same yields and quality without them then of course I would drop it.

I might not need to but I like including enzymes, humic, folic acids, B1, silica, beneficial bacterias, sugars to feed the microbes and my line of crazy blooming additives that help me accomplish

And to end my rant I would like to clarify that I come to THC farmer knowing I will get educated guesses for all my questions. I am not here because I am a first time grower, I have been growing for almost 10 years now so please keep that in mind. And not 10 years of closet growing.

Awww man...now I'm confused again. In your original (first) post you mentioned a couple of nutes you were feeding...both had 0 as their middle number. I think you also mentioned the CalMag at 5 per gal but that you had stopped it the week before. In your second (?) post you list everything and the list starts with GH 3-part.

So...you've been using GH 3 part base nutes as directed as WELL AS the 2 Lucas nutes with the zeros in the middle?

If you were using the GH base nutes and using the flowering recipe you should have been golden. So it musta been a bunch of N from somewhere else and or a bit to do with the Ph. HOWEVER, I DID just go back and look at your original pics. They really didn't look "bad" or anything. I'd much prefer to see my plants nice and green to yellow, rusty, purple...

GH has been around a LONG time. Growing methods have evolved and grown. I'm sure that GH nutes have also followed suit. I don't even know if they still make their original line but when they did, no one was growing in coco or dwc or uc really. RO water wasn't happening yet either so to use those same old nutes in todays systems and water, additives might be completely necessary.

It's kinda like dogfood.I have healthy dogs. I feed them cheap but vetrenary aproved food. I don't gie them vitamins, carb suppliments, hormons shots, antibiotics just in case...and these things never die. My last dog was 15. We had to put him down cause he had arthritis and was blind and shit but otherwise still as healthy and horny as ever.

Point is...a GOOD complete nutrient line designed for the use you employ should make your plants thrive.

 

[greenergrowing4]

On another note does anyone have a guess at what my yield might be?
3 weeks away from chop time!

 

[Seamaiden]

First question; Is it broke? Answer; To my POV based on the last set of pix I've seen is; No. Thusly, second question is begged; Why fix it, then, if it ain't broke?

Let them be, watch them grow while you just get more comfortable with the regimen now. And remember, if it ain't broke don't fix it!

 

[greenergrowing4]

Not at all, after the removal of the calmag they are very much not broke.
:)

Come on seasmaiden make a yield guess PRETTY PLEASE!

First question; Is it broke? Answer; To my POV based on the last set of pix I've seen is; No. Thusly, second question is begged; Why fix it, then, if it ain't broke?

Let them be, watch them grow while you just get more comfortable with the regimen now. And remember, if it ain't broke don't fix it!

 

[lazarus718]

Sorry I didn't get back earlier about the phosphorous thing bro...anything over a "5" for your P ratio will work to get you out of a deficiency. Depending on how bad you think your condition is you will either go higher or lower from there. You don't have to buy that $$$$ stuff either, just make yourself a tea out of a good bat guano or worm castings. You can also take bone meal and mix that into a tea....glad you cut out the Cal/Mag dude!!!

 

[smokestack23]

Hmm..yeah I'd like to read that article. I'd also like to know what additives are best but I guess that would depend on the base nutes line. I have NO problem with switching to AN or any other brand if they are better. Shit...I don't WANT less yield lol.

You're absolutely right. the industry has come a long way and I'm lost a bit. There are SO many lines and so many additives. I'm gonna stick with these Hollands Secret nutes for this run and I'll check what they have for additives. Anything I should look out for that works? I mean as in..carb loaders, flavor enhancers, flushing additives?

I'm stoked to see that article and to be reformed. I'm already looking forward to using AN and getting bigger yields.

Hopefully everyone doesnt jump in and say what their favorites are because everyone has a different favorite. This isn't gonna turn into a pissing match I hope. I just want to be convinced by some actual evidence...not someone's preference.

See? I'm learning TONS everytime I come here.

Thanks everyone.

 

[Seamaiden]

Not at all, after the removal of the calmag they are very much not broke.
:)

Come on seasmaiden make a yield guess PRETTY PLEASE!

VERY much not broke, they look marvelous. No guess, can't remember the numbers (plants, pot sizes, lights) right now. Besides, you're going for quality over quantity, right? ;)

 

[vonwolfen]

I have foxtailing starting..I just came out of my grow room, and noticed it. What was the final reason for the the original thread starter getting foxtails?, and what was done to alleviate the problem? and did it ruin the crop or did it turn out ok?(please say it came out ok!!)..

 

[greenergrowing4]

My problem was somewhere in between lumen overdose from lights being too close and too much Nitrogen from overdoing calmag. I have since cut out the calmag all together, if I notice a CA/MG problem I will use espon salt instead. This all came right around my last 2 weeks of nutes so when I added the bloom booster that helped in getting out of the nitrogen issue. I also heard that beneficial bacterias are known to suck on the N as well so I reuped on the microbes and went heavy on the molasses for a week. Recently they have been looking wonderful, some are still a bit *GREEN* but most of them have moved on to rocking the good hard nugs :) When I harvest I might need to leave some nugs behind to continue to ripen as some of them with the serious foxtailing are noticeably behind.

So sweet

I have foxtailing starting..I just came out of my grow room, and noticed it. What was the final reason for the the original thread starter getting foxtails?, and what was done to alleviate the problem? and did it ruin the crop or did it turn out ok?(please say it came out ok!!)..

 

[vonwolfen]

My fox tailing was at first glace was very noticeable on one plant, and a good possibility on several others, but I had someone look at all but the original one that showed foxtailing, and was told they are fine. The first one has some foxtailing just starting, but will be coming down in 4 to 5 days. It in flush now.
I made several changes from reading multiple thread, and getting PMs answered.. I raised my lights about 6inches(so they are between 1-1 3/4 feet away from the tops, I am more precise at keeping temps, and humidity stable and in the best ranges possible. The main thing I no longer do(although for some reason I always find a reason to do this) I don't go into the grow room after lights out to adjust minor problems....
Thanks for the help...Green, and those who PMed me back...

My problem was somewhere in between lumen overdose from lights being too close and too much Nitrogen from overdoing calmag. I have since cut out the calmag all together, if I notice a CA/MG problem I will use espon salt instead. This all came right around my last 2 weeks of nutes so when I added the bloom booster that helped in getting out of the nitrogen issue. I also heard that beneficial bacterias are known to suck on the N as well so I reuped on the microbes and went heavy on the molasses for a week. Recently they have been looking wonderful, some are still a bit *GREEN* but most of them have moved on to rocking the good hard nugs :) When I harvest I might need to leave some nugs behind to continue to ripen as some of them with the serious foxtailing are noticeably behind.

So sweet

 

[greenergrowing4]

You don't have to buy that $$$$ stuff either, just make yourself a tea out of a good bat guano or worm castings. You can also take bone meal and mix that into a tea....glad you cut out the Cal/Mag dude!!!

Thanks Laz, thats a really good suggestion. My big thing I wanted to add for next harvest is the teas. I used to do all organic and I miss my witches brew. Nothing like waking up to a but smelly foamy res LOL. Since I just went back to the chemical way of life, is there anything I should know about adding teas to a chemical regimen? It just seems a little backwards to me, I really wish I could go back to all organic but it was a bit costly and sadly the patients didnt notice. They are actually quit fond of the giant mutated looking colas HAHA

Hmm..yeah I'd like to read that article. I'd also like to know what additives are best but I guess that would depend on the base nutes line. I have NO problem with switching to AN or any other brand if they are better. Shit...I don't WANT less yield lol.

You're absolutely right. the industry has come a long way and I'm lost a bit. There are SO many lines and so many additives. I'm gonna stick with these Hollands Secret nutes for this run and I'll check what they have for additives. Anything I should look out for that works? I mean as in..carb loaders, flavor enhancers, flushing additives?

I'm stoked to see that article and to be reformed. I'm already looking forward to using AN and getting bigger yields.

Hopefully everyone doesnt jump in and say what their favorites are because everyone has a different favorite. This isn't gonna turn into a pissing match I hope. I just want to be convinced by some actual evidence...not someone's preference.

See? I'm learning TONS everytime I come here.

Thanks everyone.

I have looked EVERYWHERE for the right article I read about this and I cant find it. This one is just as good but its missing the chart that lays out each nutrient line and what made them each better or worse. What I loved about the chart was that it said specifically that AN tested might higher in THC and yields, while Grotek was the lowest in yields but produced buds with the highest CDBs. That could be very important in getting the most of out of the true medicinal strains.

The Nurtient Challenge - Cannabis Culture magazine

So I have to point out I am not a big fan of AN, their products are so over priced its crazy. But with proof like this you cant say they arent doing something right. What I think personally is that while most nutrient lines such as GHs Expert line have 8 bottles, ANs expert line has YES... 16 products!
Ok so while most of you this is bullshit and its just them trying to get your money, you are half wrong and half right. Everything in their line is overpriced... but everything is there. Break apart their line and find out what each product does and find a normal priced replacement.

here are some addtives in some kind of order of importance, so if I didnt have the money to buy everything I would start here.
Liquid Karma- humic/fulvic acids... there are cheaper things than LK I just really like the way it smells LOL. Diamond nectar or just buy the fulvic acid as a powder online. I have read many a grow logs that credit LK for higher yields and a better overall quality from veg to flower.
Hygrozyme(growth)/Cannazyme(breakdown)- There are 2 kinds I care about, the growth enzyme and the breaking down old matter enzyme. Hygrozyme I have also read is credited in many grows as something that helped increase yields.
Beneficial Bacterias- There is nothing better then great white, and I have tried many versions. But there is also the fact there are myco and endo bacterias which Great white is only big on the myco. Hence why AN has both tarantula and piranha. Great white also comes in the form of granuals that you can mix into your dirt, I always start with this its called "Plant success" its actually been around a long long time and is sold in most nurseries. The factory is here in socal so if you live close by you can go there and buy huge amounts for super cheap. :) Happy roots are happy plants, using this while vegging will make a HUGE difference in root mas. I have never seen such beautiful roots. If you want to take it a step further Roots Excelerator is another super pricey indulgence of mine. But if you dont want to spend the cash on that the bacterias are great on their own.
Bloom boosters- Everyone has their favorites, I was big on Monster Bloom by grotek for a very long time. This round I am trying out Monster of all Blooms (MOAB) because I have seem some impressive results in yields.
There is also the line of semi experimental products by Humboldts own, bush master, snow storm, gravity and purple maxxx. I am a bit weird about using them so I started out very slow but I am liking the results so far.

If you use nothing else use these and if you have some money left over I would say invest in brewing your own teas. There are so many benefits to this down to spraying the leaves with the teas protects against mold forming. Haha smokestack I think I finally wrote a post longer than yours

VERY much not broke, they look marvelous. No guess, can't remember the numbers (plants, pot sizes, lights) right now. Besides, you're going for quality over quantity, right? ;)

Funnnniiiesss ... I still want a great yield tho and wow in the last few days these girls have packed on the weight. I just spent 2 days restringing everything to hold them up. One bud was so heavy it broke its own stem, and not some sissy stem either. haha

There are 3 tables all with 2000watts over each.
I have 38 (1 gallons) on one table, I am crazy impressed with how big they have gotten in such a small pot

The other 2 tables have 27 (3 gallons) on each one. I still think my small table will win on the yield it seems so much more likely that Ill get at least an ounce off those and reach or surpass 2lbs a light where the bigs ones would have to produce 2.6 ounces each just to get to 2 lbs.

 

[greenergrowing4]

I made several changes from reading multiple thread, and getting PMs answered.. I raised my lights about 6inches(so they are between 1-1 3/4 feet away from the tops, I am more precise at keeping temps, and humidity stable and in the best ranges possible. The main thing I no longer do(although for some reason I always find a reason to do this) I don't go into the grow room after lights out to adjust minor problems....
Thanks for the help...Green, and those who PMed me back...

Well if you are going in your room make sure you have a green LED, I know a lot of people use party bulbs but I know that the LED are made differently so there is no chance at the wrong spectrum getting out and waking them up.
Do you have any pictures? Sometimes I was starting to think maybe this strain just has the weird fingers like some do, maybe that is your case. Raising my lights I think helped a lot. Did the tops mature enough when you cut them? I notice that some of my tops are still behind, yet the buds under them are ahead. Very weird... will make for an interesting harvest.

 

[smokestack23]

OK well..I was more talking about all the boosters and shit to make more yield, more trichomes, better flavor...all stuff that sounds like hocus pocus to me because ..again, I would THINK that the best nutes already satisfy the plant's requirements to make the biggest stickiest, stinkiest buds.

Now...I have a jug of Humic Acid...Black as all get out. I don't know if i want it in my RDWC system. to me hydroponic organic is an oxymoron. I don't want or need anything breaking anything down to make it more available to the plant. UNLESS...Humic acid is safe and good for hydro use. to me though, hydro should be "clinical" or sterile.

Hygrozyme and Cannazyme..again..living enzymes. I don't want them.

I DO have a jar of Great White. I just have it on standby IN CASE I get some brown algae or something that products like SM90 or Zone won't deal with. I use the SM and Zone all the time. Not together though.

So yeah...while I use and know about conditioners and "sterilizers"..I don't know about all the boosters and shit. In fact, yesterday I was in the city at the groshop getting supplies and dude said...you should buy this stuff..it's only $25 for a gallon and if you don't notice a big difference, bring the rest back and I'll refund you. He went on to say some stuff about...if your body doesnt have B vitamins you won't be healthy..same with the plants.
I turned down his generous offer. I don't want anything in my roots that might invite ANY nasties and, my plants arent telling me they need B vitamins..or ANYTHING. If anything, they could use a day off cause they're growing like maniacs.

I have to reiterate ..I'm not an IDIOT. If there's something out there that will give me better results (higher yield, better quality) with no downside (root problems)...I WANT it!!

Thanks so much for looking for that info. If you ever stumble upon it, please PM me it.

 

[greenergrowing4]

Well I meant what I said that if I didnt want to spend the money on all the extras I would buy those products in that order. I have used them all for coco and ebb and flow. If you are only going after flowering additives you should really try the humboldts own products. Those sound the most like hocus pocus but after trying them and listening to stories from others I can really say they do what they say but at what price? Some of these chemicals arent really well known so who knows.
Bush master will stop growth and speeds up flowering whether at the start or end. I had a friend say he cuts 7 days off his flowering time when using it. Gravity will harden them about as much as you want them too, like at the biggest point when they have all the water weight, with 5ml of this once a harvest you can keep all the water weight. (still dont know if thats ok?) Snowstorm packs on the crystals and very early on, big fat crystals that look almost abnormal. Purple maxx I have no idea if that really works but ill try it out on half the plants and take some pictures. I might not use these products ever again but ive seen such crazy results from them that I though I would personally give them a try. If you want a really high yield I think MOAB will acomplish that but also at a price, I dont think they are the best looking in quality vs other boosters. I was much happier with monster bloom or kool bloom. Someone here on the farm yielded 3.2 lbs a light using MOAB... hmmmm so I wonder how it will go for me.

OK well..I was more talking about all the boosters and shit to make more yield, more trichomes, better flavor...all stuff that sounds like hocus pocus to me because ..again, I would THINK that the best nutes already satisfy the plant's requirements to make the biggest stickiest, stinkiest buds.

Now...I have a jug of Humic Acid...Black as all get out. I don't know if i want it in my RDWC system. to me hydroponic organic is an oxymoron. I don't want or need anything breaking anything down to make it more available to the plant. UNLESS...Humic acid is safe and good for hydro use. to me though, hydro should be "clinical" or sterile.

Hygrozyme and Cannazyme..again..living enzymes. I don't want them.

I DO have a jar of Great White. I just have it on standby IN CASE I get some brown algae or something that products like SM90 or Zone won't deal with. I use the SM and Zone all the time. Not together though.

So yeah...while I use and know about conditioners and "sterilizers"..I don't know about all the boosters and shit. In fact, yesterday I was in the city at the groshop getting supplies and dude said...you should buy this stuff..it's only $25 for a gallon and if you don't notice a big difference, bring the rest back and I'll refund you. He went on to say some stuff about...if your body doesnt have B vitamins you won't be healthy..same with the plants.
I turned down his generous offer. I don't want anything in my roots that might invite ANY nasties and, my plants arent telling me they need B vitamins..or ANYTHING. If anything, they could use a day off cause they're growing like maniacs.

I have to reiterate ..I'm not an IDIOT. If there's something out there that will give me better results (higher yield, better quality) with no downside (root problems)...I WANT it!!

Thanks so much for looking for that info. If you ever stumble upon it, please PM me it.

 

[smokestack23]

Wow...so you really noticed a difference eh?

It's nice to hear that from someone who has tried the stuff..and also who has not..I mean the same person...I mean..frick...
I'm glad that you aren't someone who says...I grew some plants and used x,y, and z additives and my buds were WICKED. I'm glad that you said you saw a DIFFERENCE. You're the first person I've spoken to that I believe.

You didn't say..well I used this and that and nothing bad happened...or I used this and that because they said THIS on the bottle.

So now I have some names of stuff that DO work and what it is that they DO. Thank you. All I have to do now is research all of them and see which fits my budget and which haven't caused people's water or roots to go "funky" when they applied them to DWC or RDWC or UC.

I think you get my drift..so yeah...thank you for convincing me.

 

[greenergrowing4]

Hey I wasnt always so sure I wanted to try anything new but In the last few years I have met a lot of growers and a friend that owns a hydro store. Anything new that makes enough buzz and I know someone who is trying it first.

Of all the "products" ive tried and seen tested Ive seen the most difference in the humboldts own products but they also seem the most evil. If I had to pick the lesser evil I would say try snowstorm because it does make the buds frostier and doesnt seem to hurt anything. The most evil is gravity, I have seen someone use it wrong and FRY their plants. But they both work ;)

If you read the The Nurtient Challenge - Cannabis Culture magazine it makes you wonder whats in the kewl aid. If I find the chart I will send it to you but this article still has all the information the other one did.

Wow...so you really noticed a difference eh?

It's nice to hear that from someone who has tried the stuff..and also who has not..I mean the same person...I mean..frick...
I'm glad that you aren't someone who says...I grew some plants and used x,y, and z additives and my buds were WICKED. I'm glad that you said you saw a DIFFERENCE. You're the first person I've spoken to that I believe.

You didn't say..well I used this and that and nothing bad happened...or I used this and that because they said THIS on the bottle.

So now I have some names of stuff that DO work and what it is that they DO. Thank you. All I have to do now is research all of them and see which fits my budget and which haven't caused people's water or roots to go "funky" when they applied them to DWC or RDWC or UC.

I think you get my drift..so yeah...thank you for convincing me.

 

[smokestack23]

Thanks so much. I appreciate you taking the time to explain this to me and thanks for finding and sending that link.
I'm off to read it now.

And..everyone...PLEASE read my thread called WARNING!! Some VERY important and spooky info there. Nothing to do with additives but..yeah.

 

[greenergrowing4]

OMG That is sooo scary. I do have geo tagging disabled on my phone but I have no idea if it still collects the info. You never know. You should put the link in your signature if you want more people to read it.

WARNING! please read
[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zl4Dr-RvNZo[/YOUTUBE]

Thanks so much. I appreciate you taking the time to explain this to me and thanks for finding and sending that link.
I'm off to read it now.

And..everyone...PLEASE read my thread called WARNING!! Some VERY important and spooky info there. Nothing to do with additives but..yeah.

 

[greenergrowing4]

You know what I also forgot to mention about snow storm. I had visible crystals in the start of my second week which in my experience is a week or 2 early. This picture is from day 18, I would have taken some sooner but I was still finishing up the room.

again Im not trying to sell anyone on any of this, just noting that I do think it makes a difference.

 

[-hydrofarmer-]

Snow storm is supposed to be crystaly as hell!