Who Really Owns Cannabis Genetics?

[dash riprock]

I was recently banned from ICmag (familiar story I know) but the reason I was banned was because I was arguing with skunkman about ownership of genetics. Apparently he is currently soliciting the growers on ICmag forums to send him any and all seed (even the dead ones) that they have so he can send it to a lab in Oregon named Phylos Biosciences to have the DNA sequenced.

http://phylosbioscience.com/about/

I was banned and all my posts deleted when I told others that in light of skunkmans past abuses with genetics ie selling his library to GW Pharmaceuticals who then sold the patent for Sativex (made from skunkman and RCC genes out of hortapharm for a rumored 7 figures). I'm actually unsure about the financial details, but hortapharm definitely sold their strains to GW who then hooked up with Bayer (a subsidiary of the Nazi war machines I.G Farben) so I am kind of pissed. I figured the best place to have this conversation was with skunkman himself but he is (a megalomaniac?) pretty unreasonable, and I say that because instead of talking about this he just brought down the banhammer on me.

The point being are we as a community (a worldwide community of cannabis lovers) going to allow two men with one company attempt to lay claim to any drug cultivar they find and then have it sequenced and lay claim to ownership? This is a truly frightening turn of events, what if in the future you are caught growing a strain that these companies have trademarked or claimed as intellectual property? Let's remember Bayer has a monster legal team, billions of dollars at their disposal, and a known track record of highly unethical (criminal) behavior. I am still stunned that people I looked up to are selling all of us down the river to big pharma, so they can sleep on silk sheets and leave a "legacy" or some stupid shit. The owners of hortapharm no longer care about the plant or the community they have decided to sleep with the enemy to further their own selfish desires.

I hope this is the right place for this thread, but this is like an elephant in the room. I cannot confirm the intentions of hortapharm or ICmag, but from past history, it will be at the expense of smaller local growers.

 

[zeke]

Ever been in a courtroom? With enough money a certified megalomaniac such as "Sam" can supeona you and your mama daily for the rest of your life. Sad but true. The fucker may have even payed me to post this post....the same folks that own rice and corn will of course own cannabis too. That's why giving plant patent holders any money ever is bad.

 

[SeaF0ur]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plant_breeders'_rights

Under the brand name Epidiolex, GW Pharma basically owns CBD's

There is pretty consistent mention of a patented canadian pvr to a strain named "grace" but their own admissions on plant variety rights are pretty vague...

GW's SEC Filings

GW Pharmaceuticals PLC - Annual Report for Foreign Private Issuers

Strong competitive position in a highly specialized and regulated field. We believe we are uniquely positioned to benefit from the significant potential within the field of cannabinoid therapeutics in which we have developed a successful track record and expertise during our 15 years of operations. In addition, we believe the highly specialized area of research and high degree of international regulations by governmental authorities, create substantial barriers to entry. We have an intellectual property portfolio including 46 patent families with issued and/or pending claims directed to plants, plant extracts, extraction technology, pharmaceutical formulations, drug delivery and the therapeutic uses of cannabinoids. Supplementing our traditional intellectual property, we own plant variety rights and possess a significant body of know-how and trade secrets pertaining to plant breeding and growing.

GW does not believe that an oral (swallowed) or inhaled formulation is optimal in administering a cannabinoid formulation containing THC.

LOL... really?!?


Does GW support medical marijuana or the use of herbal cannabis - smoked or otherwise - as a medicine?

No. GW supports the evidence-based approach to developing new medications according to the FDA approval process. Sativex is standardized in composition, thoroughly tested and quality-assured, and administered in a controlled and defined dose in an appropriate manner. Sativex contains both THC and CBD, and both preclinical and clinical studies suggest that CBD may lessen many of the negative effects of THC, including intoxication. The Sativex clinical development program is designed to demonstrate that it is possible to develop a cannabis-derived medication in accordance with modern medical standards--such as those established by the FDA process--as is the case with all other medications prescribed for serious medical conditions. Products that have gone through the FDA process have demonstrated that they are safe and efficacious for a particular medical condition; that they have been manufactured in accordance with properly validated quality-control processes; that they are highly standardized and consistent batch-to-batch; and that they provide a fixed and reproducible dose; and that they may be reimbursed by the patient’s health care insurance program.

Details released of collaboration between GW Pharmaceuticals and Hortapharm medicinal cannabis


Watson listed as a founder of Hortipharm
.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Paul_Watson

The business [HORTIPHARM]was founded by David Paul Watson in 1990. He was soon joined by David W. Pate and eventually Robert C. Clarke. They obtained the first license issued by the Dutch government to permit a Cannabis research facility in the Netherlands. HortaPharm B.V. has a partnership with GW Pharmaceuticals to develop Cannabis varieties for the manufacture of pharmaceuticals.

Watson interview .
http://www.fastcompany.com/48172/dr-dopes-connection

When Geoffrey came over here in 1998, we were getting close to our financial limit. We're an R&D company — we didn't have a product that was making an income. The problem for Geoffrey is that all cannabis experts have backgrounds — they've built their expertise by working with an illegal material. But Hortapharm was fully licensed by the Dutch government. So Geoffrey got a legal supply of pharmaceutical grade germ-plasm. And he got me and Robert Clarke to pass along our knowledge. We gave him at least a five-year head start.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GW_Pharmaceuticals

Drs. Geoffrey Guy and Brian Whittle founded GW Pharmaceuticals in 1998. In the same year, they obtained the only cultivation license in the United Kingdom from the Home Office and the MHRA, allowing GW Pharmaceuticals to cultivate cannabis from seeds and clones to conduct scientific research concerning the medicinal uses of the plant.

In July 1998, GW Pharmaceuticals collaborated with HortaPharm B.V., a cannabis research and development business based in the Netherlands,[8] founded by two expert horticulturists from California,[9] Robert Connell Clarke[10] and David Paul Watson, also known as 'Sam the Skunkman'. [11] HortaPharm grew medicinal strains for the Dutch government.

GW is developing specialist security technology which can be applied to all of its drug delivery systems.
The aim of this anti-diversionary technology is to prevent any potential abuse of cannabis-based
medicines. In addition, this technology is being designed to enable the recording and remote monitoring of
patient usage. The technology should recognise and prevent any abnormal use that differs from expected
prescribed usage. Such data would itself have intrinsic value and would also allow for efficient monitoring
in clinical trials. The first set of prototypes for the technology as applied to the sub-lingual spray pump has
been developed and two patent applications have been filed.
This technology has potential applications for the delivery of other drugs, in particular controlled drugs
such as opiates and benzodiazapenes. GW will in due course be evaluating options for the licensing of this
technology to other pharmaceutical companies.

Following introductions from the Home Office on behalf of GW, GW has held meetings with the Food and
Drug Administration (FDA), the Drug Enforcement Agency (DEA) and the Office for National Drug Control
Policy (ONDCP). In addition, GW has met with NIDA and senior State officials in California and Maine.
Although the licensing process in the US is often protracted, GW has recently received its first US import
licence from the DEA. In August 2000, ONDCP commented publicly on medicinal cannabis as follows: “To
have medicine determined by science and not by popular will is exactly what we support.’

Hortapharm BV licence
GW has entered into an exclusive worldwide collaboration with the Dutch medicinal cannabis breeding
specialists Hortapharm BV. Further details of the agreement with Hortapharm are set out in paragraph 11
of Part VIII. Hortapharm has been researching the cannabis plant for a decade. Its staff include individuals
who have published several works on cannabis botany. Hortapharm has also developed techniques for
breeding varieties of cannabis of a pre-determined cannabinoid composition. By obtaining access to all of
Hortapharm’s relevant know-how and relevant plant varieties (present and future), the Directors believe
that GW’s cultivation programme has been accelerated by several years.

Intellectual property rights
An integral part of the research and development programme is to establish proprietary intellectual
property rights to protect techniques and technologies involved in the development programme.
Examples of the areas in which the Group is and will be seeking protection in the future are as follows:
plant variety rights
methods of extraction patents
drug delivery device patents
patents on compositions of matter for the delivery of cannabis
methods of use patents
design copyright on devices
trade marks
The Group’s aim is to develop a matrix of interlocking intellectual property rights which is difficult for
competitors to penetrate. The Group has considerable know-how which is backed by a growing number of
patent applications and it is in this intellectual property where much of the value of the Group lies. The
maintenance, strengthening and expansion of its portfolio of intellectual property is a priority for the
Group.

GW Pharmaceuticals Announces New US Patent Allowance


GW’s intellectual property portfolio includes multiple patent families with issued and/or pending claims directed to plants, plant extracts, extraction technology, pharmaceutical formulations, drug delivery and the therapeutic uses of cannabinoids, as well as plant variety rights, know-how and trade secrets.

The main tie that binds is Sativex... Sativex is made by GW but ole David Watson is all over it.

The Feasibility Study of Sativex in China
http://essay.utwente.nl/57896/1/scriptie_Pan.pdf
Principals:
David Watson
Email: [email protected]

The objective of my principals is to ‘grow cannabis, manufacture Sativex and sell it within China’

The first medicine developed straight from pot plants is poised for FDA approval.
http://www.takepart.com/feature/2014/03/05/coming-soon-to-pharmacies-marijuana

The story of Sativex begins, perhaps unsurprisingly, in Amsterdam. An expat Californian named David Paul Watson, after years of wandering the globe compiling a library of cannabis types, had settled there. In 1997, the company he cofounded, HortaPharm, received the Dutch Ministry of Health, Welfare and Sport’s first license to cultivate cannabis for medical research.

HortaPharm developed the first homozygote cannabis (a plant with two identical sets of chromosomes), enabling the company to produce strains overwhelmingly high in a single cannabinoid. It’s long been known that THC is the “active ingredient” in pot—it’s what gets a person stoned. But more recent research has found numerous other cannabinoids in the plant, which have different effects on the body. One that’s shown early promise for antiseizure and antianxiety properties is cannabidiol, or CBD. Watson could grow plants that were 98 percent THC, or 98 percent CBD, or whatever. (The hash oil treatments given to the girl on CNN are from high-CBD strains, and GW’s antiseizure medication is high-CBD.)

HortaPharm soon crossed paths with Dr. Geoffrey Guy, who in 1998 received a license from the British government to grow pot for medical R&D for his company: GW Pharmaceuticals. Guy was searching for a legal source of plant materials with varying compositions of cannabinoids. He wanted to hybridize different plant strains so he could test the effects of various combinations of cannabinoids on various maladies.

Cannabis-based medicine launched in UK
http://www.bluelight.org/vb/archive/index.php/t-509395.html

GW creates Sativex by processing cannabis plants it grows in secret facilities at an undisclosed location in the UK. Sativex cost £100m to develop and was based on selective breeding of two different types of cannabis plant that were acquired in 1998 from Dutch cannabis researchers Horta Pharm, which has a non-disclosed share in the success of Sativex.

I'm following money...

Sativex is now a Bayer product.
Bayer Buys Rights to Market GWP’s Cannabis Extract
http://www.beyondthc.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/GWP-2003.pdf

The whole subject makes me irritated at this point, so I'm gonna stop now LOL..

 

[SeaF0ur]

I also found this, although I have not checked into every piece of it.
http://pastebin.com/8t4uRNCM

 

[ShroomKing]

I was recently banned from ICmag (familiar story I know) but the reason I was banned was because I was arguing with skunkman about ownership of genetics. Apparently he is currently soliciting the growers on ICmag forums to send him any and all seed (even the dead ones) that they have so he can send it to a lab in Oregon named Phylos Biosciences to have the DNA sequenced.

http://phylosbioscience.com/about/

I was banned and all my posts deleted when I told others that in light of skunkmans past abuses with genetics ie selling his library to GW Pharmaceuticals who then sold the patent for Sativex (made from skunkman and RCC genes out of hortapharm for a rumored 7 figures). I'm actually unsure about the financial details, but hortapharm definitely sold their strains to GW who then hooked up with Bayer (a subsidiary of the Nazi war machines I.G Farben) so I am kind of pissed. I figured the best place to have this conversation was with skunkman himself but he is (a megalomaniac?) pretty unreasonable, and I say that because instead of talking about this he just brought down the banhammer on me.

The point being are we as a community (a worldwide community of cannabis lovers) going to allow two men with one company attempt to lay claim to any drug cultivar they find and then have it sequenced and lay claim to ownership? This is a truly frightening turn of events, what if in the future you are caught growing a strain that these companies have trademarked or claimed as intellectual property? Let's remember Bayer has a monster legal team, billions of dollars at their disposal, and a known track record of highly unethical (criminal) behavior. I am still stunned that people I looked up to are selling all of us down the river to big pharma, so they can sleep on silk sheets and leave a "legacy" or some stupid shit. The owners of hortapharm no longer care about the plant or the community they have decided to sleep with the enemy to further their own selfish desires.

I hope this is the right place for this thread, but this is like an elephant in the room. I cannot confirm the intentions of hortapharm or ICmag, but from past history, it will be at the expense of smaller local growers.

Can I copy and paste parts of this with my account on icmag so that it gets deleted too?

And topic related.
Big money is moving in and they want all the chemical rights to this wonder plant. Dont be suprised when we see our favorite breeders sell out to big pharma.

 

[zeke]

aaaaaaaaaahhhhh! Damn, when are these extremely greedy wierdos gonna realize who makes their food....

 

[suomynona]

Israel is patenting strains now:





Ok, well replace invalid.com with invalid.com and the link should work....

Geezus effin criminey.... marijuana dot com....will this work?

 

[SeaF0ur]

http://www.faqs.org/patents/assignee/gw-pharma-limited/

 

[B1GWYRM]

Not feeling good about any of this but this punks are delusional if they think people will accept or follow such laws...let them do what they want figure out how we can cut them out of our lives. They need us

 

[dash riprock]

Israel is patenting strains now:





Ok, well replace invalid.com with invalid.com and the link should work....

Geezus effin criminey.... marijuana dot com....will this work?

Yes, that works but I am going to repost the link anyway just for ease of access.

http://invalid.com/news/2014/12/israeli-marijuana-breeders-look-to-link-strain-to-illness/

I wonder what a patent in Israel means for an American grower?

 

[zeke]

Woah, they must have a time machine because they patented everything the cannabis community has learned for like ever. Whatever happened to "prior art". Skunkman really did invent everything, I'll be damned. Its all in black and white. I wonder if the patent attorneys that work for GW ever blush. Nah, probably just real self satisfied. Well done fellas.

 

[dash riprock]

Here is another reason why I think we need to be wary of DNA sequencing at least for the near future, maybe longer for some of us:

New marijuana DNA database declares grass warfare.

A national marijuana DNA databank has been established by a university researcher that will give law enforcement the ability to track where the drug originated when arrests are made and contraband dope seized.

The DNA mapping system, developed at the University of New Haven, allows law enforcement for the first time not only to track where marijuana came from, but also to possibly link it to drug trafficking organizations in Mexico, growers in Canada, or domestic distribution gangs, perhaps to connect the dots and make a case for conspiracy.

The system can trace the marijuana from a single bud or seed back to its source, as long as there are matching samples. Matching DNA to plants grown on public lands in California, for example, could demonstrate that the crop was planted by a specific drug operation. So, if one person has a suitcase of marijuana and another person has bags of it, police can determine that it came from the same crop.

Plant DNA is similar to human DNA in that it retains its lifelong genetic profile.

Essentially, the new marijuana database is similar to the Federal Bureau of Investigation’s CODIS (Combined DNA Index System) human DNA database. The CODIS system contains DNA profiles obtained from perpetrators and crime scene evidence, such as semen, saliva, or blood. CODIS uses computer software to automatically search across these indices for a potential match.



Casing the Joint

Lead researcher Heather Coyle, a geneticist at the Lee College of Criminal Justice and Forensic Science at the University of New Haven, said the Cannabis genetics databank is important because it provides a more effective way to classify marijuana.


“Right now, most agencies determine identity of Cannabis by the presence or absence of THC, a chemical compound unique to marijuana,” Coyle said. “However, many samples do not have THC, such as seeds, roots, and hemp.” THC, also known as delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol, is the principal psychoactive constituent of the Cannabis plant.

For samples that are part of an illegal drug operation, DNA–based identification enhances law enforcement capabilities by setting a different legal standard of identification and proof-of-identity of substance, Coyle said.

“At this time, I see this strictly as a law enforcement tool, since Cannabis sativa L. is the only species of marijuana classified as a Schedule I drug, illegal at the federal level, due to the large abuse potential and serious side effects such as psychosis and paranoia, which are observed in users of both the raw plant form and in FDA-approved Marinol tablets,” she said. THC, which the government classifies as a hallucinogenic or psychedelic substance, is one of 130 drugs on the Schedule I list. Marinol is synthetic THC prescribed for AIDS–related weight loss and chemotherapy–related nausea.

For the past 40 years there have been many attempts in the U.S. to get the federal government to remove Cannabis from Schedule I of the Controlled Substances Act, the most tightly restricted category reserved for drugs defined as having no currently accepted medical use. Those in favor of rescheduling argue that Cannabis does not meet the Controlled Substances Act's strict criteria for placement in Schedule I, and therefore the government must either permit medical use or remove the drug from federal control altogether. The government, however, still maintains that Cannabis is dangerous enough to merit Schedule I status.

Marijuana is the most popular illegal drug in the world, according to the 2012 United Nations World Drug Report, with somewhere between 119 million and 224 million users age 18 or over. It is also the most common illegal drug used in the United States. According to a 2012 government report,1 more than 30% of high school seniors surveyed admitted to using marijuana in the previous year, even though marijuana has been linked to health problems such as dependency, lung disease, and depression.



Leaves of Grass

Coyle calls her DNA typing system NMI01, after The National Marijuana Initiative, which is directed by Tommy LaNier in San Diego.


“He acts as our liaison with other drug task forces and pharmaceutical companies and has provided us with samples to test,” Coyle said.

LaNier told Forensic the DNA database was established to support law enforcement in linking wholesale and retail outlets or those in the marijuana production distribution business. The database is there to support all law enforcement, and those assigned to special drug task forces.

“We would use it in either seed or cloning operations,” LaNier said.

LaNier has already used the DNA database to prosecute marijuana cases in the San Diego area. In one case, a group of individuals were found to have multiple indoor grow houses.

“The seized marijuana was tested and we were able to determine that the houses all used a cloning operation, thus establishing connections to the houses and the growers,” LaNier said. The defendants all plead out in this case.

LaNier said using the database also helps authorities determine the seed stock being used throughout the world.

“It also gives us a better idea of the plant lineage with different growers and those that sell seed stock on the internet,” he said.

Samples are sent to Coyle on plant collection cards, similar to the way human DNA is collected for CODIS processing for human identification.

Collection cards make it easy for law enforcement to collect a marijuana genetic fingerprint. The cards work like this: Officers take a sample marijuana leaf or bud from seized evidence, rub the sample on the card, then mail the card to the lab. At the lab, a small portion of the card is punched out, inserted in the DNA sequencer, and compared against other DNA samples in the database. Coyle said it takes 5–8 days for processing and review.

“Samples are obtained from law enforcement officials via the High Intensity Drug Trafficking Areas program, a federally funded program involved in marijuana eradication and tracking efforts,” Coyle said. HIDTA, part of the Office of National Drug Control Policy, was established in 1989 by the Anti-Drug Abuse Act of 1988; its stated goal is to establish policies, priorities, and objectives to eradicate illicit drug use, manufacturing, and trafficking, drug-related crime and violence, and drug-related health consequences in the U.S.



What’s Next? Coyle said over the next few months, the Cannabis DNA database is being analyzed for statistical correlations using a variety of methods and software to establish what the optimal forensic match statistics might be for the system.


“Like other genetic typing systems, additional genetic markers can be added to increase the individualization power of the method,” she said.

Coyle said inbred lines of animals, such as cats and dogs, use DNA–based markers of upwards of 20–30 short tandem repeat loci.

“The NMI01 system is somewhat unique in the sense that the genetic barcode in Cannabis appears fairly discriminating even with 1–2 loci and is quite species-specific,” she said. Coyle said it is likely this is a result of the unique cannabinoid chemistry found in marijuana.

Current work on the databank involves match statistic calculations, which have to do with mathematical modeling to compare match statistics within a closed population versus using this technique as an open search tool.

“Having known reference genetic populations to compare some of the street, dispensary, and public land seizures against has been very informative,” Coyle said.

The development of an efficient format to archive plant evidence for DNA and chemistry–based identification from collection cards is new for law enforcement and can be easily extended to other plant material in order to preserve the DNA from crime scene samples.

References

1. Monitoring the Future survey, University of Michigan, National Institute on Drug Abuse

The nightmare never ends...

 

[symbiote420]

Almost hard to believe it but I got banned from IC before by ole Sammy too lol, dude is a f'n egotistical joke. Now no matter what I've posted in a thread over there if he joins the convo it seems like it's only to disagree with or troll my post. I think anyone that doesn't agree with his "all knowing godlike canna knowledge" walks on thin ice over there...... a speak in Layman's terms so peeps can follow me, he tries to drop all these big words that half the folks are truly lost once he opens his mouth, I know about some of these big word users lol. He got so bad at one point I had to tell him to stop living off the past and go breed something new for crying out loud. I now avoid posting in the same threads as him and if he post after me I don't reply.

The fact that I have never smoked a sample of Skunk #1 that was worthy of growing out or had any type of roadkill smell to it suggest that all he did was attach the Skunk name to it just to increase seed sales in the US...... a model that has been adopted by every bunk seed breeder since, His only canna legacy in my eyes is that he f'd up the RKS. And I'll bet the barn he started that bs statement about Sk1 being in the majority of indoor strains/crosses available....... lmao it felt good getting that off my chest it's been 2 years overdue! I've chucked better stuff with just 10 beans than he has with his "10,000 plant selection method," fool probably culled all the best plants lol, well you're part of the Farm now, you can disagree with someone as long as you're being respectful of others you shouldn't get the hammer round here!

 

[bigjay420]

"I take credit for every strain ever made (even though the shit grew for thousands of years before I came around). RKS... Northern Lights... White Widow... NYD... I created them all. So I'd better not catch one of you growing a single (MY) plant.
Not. One."

Thats pretty much how genetic ownership works, IME. It's a lot of greed and horse shit. I know soBut I guess possession is 9/10 of the law.


I've never been on IC unless a search engine led me there (rare), but they could use a new layout. Shit's dated. I prefer the farm. Less ego. More titties.

 

[SeaF0ur]

Almost hard to believe it but I got banned from IC before by ole Sammy too lol, dude is a f'n egotistical joke. Now no matter what I've posted in a thread over there if he joins the convo it seems like it's only to disagree with or troll my post. I think anyone that doesn't agree with his "all knowing godlike canna knowledge" walks on thin ice over there...... a speak in Layman's terms so peeps can follow me, he tries to drop all these big words that half the folks are truly lost once he opens his mouth, I know about some of these big word users lol. He got so bad at one point I had to tell him to stop living off the past and go breed something new for crying out loud. I now avoid posting in the same threads as him and if he post after me I don't reply.

The fact that I have never smoked a sample of Skunk #1 that was worthy of growing out or had any type of roadkill smell to it suggest that all he did was attach the Skunk name to it just to increase seed sales in the US...... a model that has been adopted by every bunk seed breeder since, His only canna legacy in my eyes is that he f'd up the RKS. And I'll bet the barn he started that bs statement about Sk1 being in the majority of indoor strains/crosses available....... lmao it felt good getting that off my chest it's been 2 years overdue! I've chucked better stuff with just 10 beans than he has with his "10,000 plant selection method," fool probably culled all the best plants lol, well you're part of the Farm now, you can disagree with someone as long as you're being respectful of others you shouldn't get the hammer round here!

 

[soserthc1]

Almost hard to believe it but I got banned from IC before by ole Sammy too lol, dude is a f'n egotistical joke. Now no matter what I've posted in a thread over there if he joins the convo it seems like it's only to disagree with or troll my post. I think anyone that doesn't agree with his "all knowing godlike canna knowledge" walks on thin ice over there...... a speak in Layman's terms so peeps can follow me, he tries to drop all these big words that half the folks are truly lost once he opens his mouth, I know about some of these big word users lol. He got so bad at one point I had to tell him to stop living off the past and go breed something new for crying out loud. I now avoid posting in the same threads as him and if he post after me I don't reply.

The fact that I have never smoked a sample of Skunk #1 that was worthy of growing out or had any type of roadkill smell to it suggest that all he did was attach the Skunk name to it just to increase seed sales in the US...... a model that has been adopted by every bunk seed breeder since, His only canna legacy in my eyes is that he f'd up the RKS. And I'll bet the barn he started that bs statement about Sk1 being in the majority of indoor strains/crosses available....... lmao it felt good getting that off my chest it's been 2 years overdue! I've chucked better stuff with just 10 beans than he has with his "10,000 plant selection method," fool probably culled all the best plants lol, well you're part of the Farm now, you can disagree with someone as long as you're being respectful of others you shouldn't get the hammer round here!

Interesting read here on the subject , can't seem to link the thread and lost it ....google ...lifetime ic member gets banned ....@mns seeds

 

[We Solidarity]

If you've got the genetics, than YOU own them. The world is only as free as you perceive it to be

 

[Medusa]

Can I copy and paste parts of this with my account on icmag so that it gets deleted too?

And topic related.
Big money is moving in and they want all the chemical rights to this wonder plant. Dont be suprised when we see our favorite breeders sell out to big pharma.

There gearing up now to sell out ....like Dominoes ...

 

[zeke]

If any Dutch food service workers are reading this, be sure to creatively contaminate any food or beverages that the Skunkman orders. Surely he eats out a lot. Any Uk food service workers please feel free to tamper with Dr.Guy's tea. These cocksuckers need to feel and taste just exactly what the rest of the inhabitants of "their world" think about them and their plans for "us". Enjoy your shit sandwiches and turdy teas amigos..

 

[Medusa]

Money talks. End of story.