cch2o UC-RDWC: 20x1000w

[desertsquirrel]

BTW why are you paying all that money for RE? IBA is dirt cheap and 10X better.

 

[BCboys]

Sorry, it was algae. It was starting to grow in the rez when I noticed it. Shortly after the Ph started swinging, and found it on the roots.
I was trying to run a sterile system at the time. It's much easier running with tea.

was your pH swinging up or down?

Im pretty sure all the brown in the system is from the RE and wouldnt be surprised if thats on the roots as well. For the most part the roots look healthy besides the brown shit on em.
I would take each individual plant out one at a time and gently rinse them with tap water in a 5 gal bucket changing the water after each plant. Gently massage the roots while holding the net pot over the bucket. This will clean your roots and they will bounce back fast. I would also dump all the water and start fresh in the systems.
Try aquashield shit stays clean in the rez and fights off nastys

Ive been there and this is what Ive done and they will bounce back fast the roots still look healthy and not rotted
Do not keep throwing different shit in the system its not gonna help sit back and wait a few days after this next flush and refill and everything will work out

Thanks BG, ill definitely take that into consideration. I'm fully behind the less is more approach and have been trying ardently to introduce one thing at a time to try and fix it. Today I went to the shop and just checked them out, there seems to be a very marginal change in the slime on the inside of the buckets, and the roots look the same. Waiting one more day before I do anything else. Just trying to figure out the next steps. So you figure the RE is causing the build up of that floating algae-like residue on the seals and what not as well? It seems like so much gunk for 1ml/g of RE, but then again I have no idea what the stuff actually does. Also, i've flushed and refilled twice now since the introduction of the RE and the slime in the buckets and on the seals still remains. It seems as though it isn't going anywhere with more flushes, so what would you reccomend to kill/rid the stuff from the buckets themselves. Thanks for the reply.

Its defiantly rot. I assume when they started to blow up you overdid it with the application rates in conjunction with the warm water... Bring down your solution strength - do not switch your entire program from sterile to living.

Listen to who ever you want, but they only thing (and im pretty sure there isnt anything we haven't tried) that has fixed rot for us is UC roots.

Hey dude, thanks for the response. So, since they were transplanted I have been running the solution strength at 2ml/g canna A, and 2ml/g canna B, also 1ml/g botnaicare calmag. I also put in 1ml/g rhizotonic about 10 days ago. Other than that nothing has been changed or increased whatsoever apart from putting in that RE. My total ppms in the systems read at 200pm, and the water I use is filtered but not RO (although it comes out of the filter between 0-10 ppm). This was the solution strength when the fan broke and the temps increased. Is 2ml/g overdoing it on application rates, in your opinion? Also, there was initially no sterile product, h202 or otherwise, being run with these three products. The introduction of sterilizers came recently, after the rot/algae began and so far has amounted to 6ml/g of 29% h202, introduced two consecutive days after fresh drain/refills.

Thanks so much to all of you for the help.

 

[BCboys]

BTW why are you paying all that money for RE? IBA is dirt cheap and 10X better.

The main reason that I ordered the RE was because I was concerned out about the high temps, and was at a loss of what I should do in the meantime. Since RE apparently contains bene's, and so many have great success with it in the UC, I figured it couldn't hurt to have it in there to battle any pythium that might try to manifest. In retrospect I obviously wish I had held off putting it in at all, since it would be one less thing to eliminate as a cause of this...but what can you do except move on right.

 

[hogan400]

Desert Sq is correct, this is rot. Same I went thru. I use a superb R.O system and tried every product you can order or buy to repair roots. The Uc roots did slow it, but it still went bad. It started as brown algae, exactly like diatoms and Im sure they were. You can contact cch2o and send in a water sample to have tested. Even once you know the pathogen you can create a plan of action, but its already in every nook & cranny in your system. My first run I also changed water almost everyday, bout 200 gallons. Was a nightmare!! For me roots exc and hygrozyme were a horrible mistake, like most here say...

Do what d.s. says and go living immediately, do not wait, hesitate, or delay. Buy these things

good worm castings any kind but try to get em form a indoor supplier
ancient forest
some quality bene's caps are great but till then, just use what you can
aquashield a must, feeds on pythium, nuff said
molasses food source to feed the tea

I use 2 cups wormcasts, 1 cup ancient forest, in a old sock, add a teaspoon of benes, 20ml aquasield, 20ml molasses per 2 gallons of purified water. I'd make like 20 gallons or so for ur size get up and add it directly to the epi. It only takes a day to make it. Ready in 12hrs! Once a week add another 5 gallons or so. This will salvage ur entire crop. If you cant find ancient forest, dont sweat, add it next batch. The worm casts and aquashield are the true repair. Pythium exists no matter what or who or where... The warm water helped create the right conditions. CAP, and ghetto are well versed and helped me with the tea. Get a rubbermaid a cheap airston and air pump. I just tapped the alita line and it made bad ass tea for me.

good luck man, you will be perfectly fine if you do this asap. Dont waste any money on products or labels and go straight to tea. None of the other shit will work and you will waste a shit ton of valuable time waiting for some over the counter wonder product with a beautiful label to do mother fuckin nothing! Maybe even make it worse.
P.m me since Im busy w multiple projects if you have any questions. Ill get a email if you do and I will hit you right back. I hated waiting and stressing for help... look for any rot on the stem byt the base where ur cuts meet the media. I had stem rot as well on a few. If so Ill tell you a sure fire method to control it as well.

 

[BCboys]

Desert Sq is correct, this is rot. Same I went thru. I use a superb R.O system and tried every product you can order or buy to repair roots. The Uc roots did slow it, but it still went bad. It started as brown algae, exactly like diatoms and Im sure they were. You can contact cch2o and send in a water sample to have tested. Even once you know the pathogen you can create a plan of action, but its already in every nook & cranny in your system. My first run I also changed water almost everyday, bout 200 gallons. Was a nightmare!! For me roots exc and hygrozyme were a horrible mistake, like most here say...

Do what d.s. says and go living immediately, do not wait, hesitate, or delay. Buy these things

good worm castings any kind but try to get em form a indoor supplier
ancient forest
some quality bene's caps are great but till then, just use what you can
aquashield a must, feeds on pythium, nuff said
molasses food source to feed the tea

I use 2 cups wormcasts, 1 cup ancient forest, in a old sock, add a teaspoon of benes, 20ml aquasield, 20ml molasses per 2 gallons of purified water. I'd make like 20 gallons or so for ur size get up and add it directly to the epi. It only takes a day to make it. Ready in 12hrs! Once a week add another 5 gallons or so. This will salvage ur entire crop. If you cant find ancient forest, dont sweat, add it next batch. The worm casts and aquashield are the true repair. Pythium exists no matter what or who or where... The warm water helped create the right conditions. CAP, and ghetto are well versed and helped me with the tea. Get a rubbermaid a cheap airston and air pump. I just tapped the alita line and it made bad ass tea for me.

good luck man, you will be perfectly fine if you do this asap. Dont waste any money on products or labels and go straight to tea. None of the other shit will work and you will waste a shit ton of valuable time waiting for some over the counter wonder product with a beautiful label to do mother fuckin nothing! Maybe even make it worse.
P.m me since Im busy w multiple projects if you have any questions. Ill get a email if you do and I will hit you right back. I hated waiting and stressing for help... look for any rot on the stem byt the base where ur cuts meet the media. I had stem rot as well on a few. If so Ill tell you a sure fire method to control it as well.

You're the man hogan, thanks a lot for the diagnoses and recipe. I'm going to pm you right now.

Been playing a waiting game with the plants the last few days trying to let them recover from all the stresses of the peroxide and hoping to see some improvement with the temps back in check. I cannot believe its only been a matter of days...it feels like weeks since the slime took over. But the plants blinked first and one of the systems is pumping out some sick new roots and for the first time in days is showing foliage growth. The other two are slower on the rebound and doing not much of anything. I have five 5g buckets bubbling with airstones right now, and going to pick up all the ingredients in the morning and get some stew bubbling. I'll keep you all updated on the outcome. Thanks to everyone for the help.

 

[Shady]

Hmmm... I think DS said Not to switch... I'm hoping for the best BCboys...

 

[Camnibus]

Ph swung low with the algae/impending rot, 4.6 or so. I limped through, finished 2weeks/2#'s early. Tried a live res midway through the next run and the tea ate that shit in a day. Ph was/is so stable I have to make it swing.

 

[babyhughie586]

when i had the slime in my UC i took each plant dipped it in a 5 gal bucket of 3%h2o2 and then dipped in regular water I repeated this process a few times with each plant changing out the water each time.. it worked for me.. i dont agree that this is rot yet i agree with budgoggles it looks to me like algae on the roots and the best thing would be to do what both him and i said... IF it IS rot your best option would be to kill the plants off and start fresh and cut your losses... your plants arent that big yet and you would only lose about a months time... imho starting new would be better than trying to fight rot during the next 3 months and hoping praying that you can beat it... Fighting ROT is a losing battle in the UC, fighting algae is not...

 

[hogan400]

Yep shady, ur right, d.s said the opposite. I read him wrong.

I used ucroots that were sent free to me, along with a full batch of the new nute line up and I had excellent results with the nutes! Ucroots, not so much. If you guys look at my original and 2nd journal PHOTOS you will see the exact issues, from the onset of algae, stifling of nute uptake, slow of growth, ending in rot. I even noted in my journals what products I used ,how long, negative results. Day after I added tea....positive results.

Im glad I spent the time to troubleshoot this with every product currently available. With algae or rot, there is no need to kill off plants. 2 weeks rooting cuts and 2-3 weeks of veg, along with issues like lumen shock and getting the ladies to feed. For a new Uc grower this restart time will be offset by the tea. After one week you will be on ur way with the tea. Be sure to flush out any sterilizers, and refill with light nutes and tea. You will also see I kept my plants alive for over 2 months with rot while I troubleshooted with the products to help others. I had maybe a 10% diminished harvest. Mostly because of all the damage I did with each new product...
Just be sure to rinse out the nasties inside the net pot with the tea by top feeding once a week as well.

Also let me make note I have several Uc's in action, only the ONE at my house has this issue. The other units I use Zone. Works perfect. Once you start tea, dont stop. Dont switch. stick with it til ur done because the algae will come right back causing root stress ending in rot.

 

[BCboys]

Thanks again Hogan, I'm also glad you spent the time troubleshooting! It's people like you, who post your journals and offer help for the rest of us, that make our battles so much easier.

So far the plants have responded beautifully to the tea. They had started to turn around in one of the systems, seemingly from only the cooler temperatures in the water, as nothing else was changed after the H2O2 bath. However, today (~24 hrs after first tea dosage) the one system that was unreponsive is about 80% clean of any sign of the algae/rot and there are new springy white roots popping out of both the netpots, as well as the middle of the previously slime covered roots. The system that was first to respond continues to pump out new roots and drink water. Meanwhile my XL16 with the afghani is slower to turn around and still has a white mucus looking snot covering the roots. However, new roots do seem to be coming out of the sides of the netpots within the last couple of days. Both XL32's have growth tremendously over the last day...maybe 2" everywhere. This is optimistic since they had been almost completely stunted since the onset of the algae and maybe grew an inch total in the last week.

I'll quickly give a step by step of what I have done so far in case anyone out there is wondering and battling the same thing. **Note** The chiller had been fixed at this point so temps were back in check at 68 deg.

Sept. 30: Noticed what appeared to be algae/rot infesting the roots system of all of my plants. This was found to be caused by the high water temperatures (75+) after 3 days of the fan being broken, and was compounded by the introduction of organic stimulants (RE) the evening before I noticed the slime.

Oct 1: Full flush/water exchange of all 600gallons and increased water levels to nearly the top of the netpots. Added 29% H2O2 at a dosage of 6ml/g. Let circulate 24hrs.

Oct 2: Full flush/water exchange of all 600gallons and set water level to ~1" above the base of the netpots. Added 29% H2O2 at a dosage of 6ml/g. Added base nutes at 2ml/g and calmag at 1ml/g. PH'd to 5.9. Total ppm's 200. Let circulate 48hrs.

Oct 3: waited

Oct 4: Added 29% H2O2 at a dosage of 2ml/g.

Oct 5-8: Waited and watched. Let the plants recover from the stresses while figuring out the next step. By the 8th there seemed to be new roots forming in one XL32 system.

Oct 9: Gathered neccesary products to brew an EWC tea and started the brew. Much thanks to Hogan400, Gettogrow, Capulator, Heisenberg and others for advice on critical components. Still trying to get my hands on Ancient Forest, but it doesnt seem they will ship it to Canada...Anyone in BC using Ancient Forest and know where I can get some? Botanicare Zho is also arriving tomorrow and will be added to the next batch.

Tea Ingredients (per 4gallons water):
-100% organic Earthworm Castings (4 small handfulls inserted into nylon)
-Aquashield (40ml)
-Molasses (40ml)
-5x 5gallon pails
-5x nylons
-5x airstones

Oct 10: Added 2 pails (8g) of the brewed tea to each of the XL32 (230g), and 1 pail (4g) to the XL16 (120g). Rebrewed the same mix as above.

Oct 11: Added second brew at the same rate as above. This totals for 16g/230g and 8g/120. Rebrewed a new batch. Zho will be in tomorrow and I will add this to the tea that is currently brewing. Will add in this last batch on Saturday Oct. 13 which wil total 24g/230g and 12g/120. This constitutes the initial hard dosing and will step down the dose of tea to maintain after Saturday.

I will keep you all updated on my thoughts and results of this process as they come. It's still a little early to tell of the efficacy, but i'm hopeful that this is working.

 

[fuzzy]

I think the aquashield and cooler water will help out a bunch!Ive only had that once and added just a tad more ashield and it stopped it.It didnt clear it up all the way but you could tell it helped a bunch.I just let it ride because it was towards the end.just my 2 sense,peace,fuzzy

 

[hogan400]

Fuzzy +1, cooler temps have more oxygen and slows the spread of pythium and algae.

ZHO is ok, but do order CAPS pack. Also BG used aquashield in earlier threads and I pm'd him, he explained why he liked it...Add it to the tea, I feel it made the "quick" difference for me too, because on my second batch of tea, the worst roots began to heal.

Keep paying attention to daily actions ur doing, and adjustments you make. Do you keep notes? Create a daily or weekly log to monitor this shit, and food, and temps, and whatever. I posted mine some where, feel free to copy. For me its a also aid in nute and ph adjustments for performance on follow up runs.

Keep flushing the tea thru the root crown and get out all the slime and rot you cant see. (I even looked up into the bottom of the roots letting all that shit get all over me, took slides for the microscope and blew up photos to help identify the issue)
Note if you see a ph change immediately after adding tea, the brew will have a high ph, a few hrs later you may adjust the ph in the system, but it should stabilize. Also Im only talking about .25 up, and thats nothing to worry about. Watch to see if ppms drop even if ph is still dropping, this means ur plants are still feeding even though they are struggling. This is a good sign.

Is ph still dropping daily?
whats ur ppm/ec/tds at now vs yesterday/last week?
whats the ph of ur finished brew?
Take a photo of the foam after the brew and post it.

Remeber you can even use the system water to flush that shit outta the root crown because it has the tea in it now. Just dont get it on the main stalk too much, you dont want stalk rot too. lol

Good work.

 

[BCboys]

Yeah, thanks guys the cooler temps I think are the most important part of staving off the algae and rot. One of my systems eventually started to turn around without any tea or additives at all, just getting the temps back in check with a bit of H2o2. I don't think the cool temperatures can be underscored enough based on what I've seen. That said, it was reaaaally slow to start seeing anything turn around. Since adding the tea, results have been coming in quite quickly. The roots systems in all three systems are finally back to producing springy fresh roots. There is still some cloudiness in the water and slime on the old roots in one system, but im hoping with the addition of zho and a little bit more time for the benes to do their work, that it will clear up a bit and mostly go away.

I mentioned in my previous post that I would be doing the last of the hard dosing today, since the addition of the zho yesterday to the tea. However I ended up dumping this batch of tea and starting another. The reason for this was because I overlooked the fact that cleaning out the buckets/airstones/nylons, is really important in between brews. Apparently the anaerobic bacteria buildup of slime in the buckets will cause your bennies to have to fight them off while simultaneously trying to populate, rather than starting with a clean slate and being able to multiply unchecked. I noticed lots of gooey bio-slime floating in the water, on the walls of the bucket, and in the base of the bucket. The nylons were coated in it and smelled of something close to vomit... So I cleaned everything really well and started a new batch. Will be adding it tomorrow afternoon.

Anyways, here's some pics of the progress so far.

 

[BCboys]

Fuzzy +1, cooler temps have more oxygen and slows the spread of pythium and algae.

ZHO is ok, but do order CAPS pack. Also BG used aquashield in earlier threads and I pm'd him, he explained why he liked it...Add it to the tea, I feel it made the "quick" difference for me too, because on my second batch of tea, the worst roots began to heal.

Keep paying attention to daily actions ur doing, and adjustments you make. Do you keep notes? Create a daily or weekly log to monitor this shit, and food, and temps, and whatever. I posted mine some where, feel free to copy. For me its a also aid in nute and ph adjustments for performance on follow up runs.

Keep flushing the tea thru the root crown and get out all the slime and rot you cant see. (I even looked up into the bottom of the roots letting all that shit get all over me, took slides for the microscope and blew up photos to help identify the issue)
Note if you see a ph change immediately after adding tea, the brew will have a high ph, a few hrs later you may adjust the ph in the system, but it should stabilize. Also Im only talking about .25 up, and thats nothing to worry about. Watch to see if ppms drop even if ph is still dropping, this means ur plants are still feeding even though they are struggling. This is a good sign.

Is ph still dropping daily?
whats ur ppm/ec/tds at now vs yesterday/last week?
whats the ph of ur finished brew?
Take a photo of the foam after the brew and post it.

Remeber you can even use the system water to flush that shit outta the root crown because it has the tea in it now. Just dont get it on the main stalk too much, you dont want stalk rot too. lol

Good work.

Hogan, pH has actually been rising a lot...up into the mid to high 6's. Meanwhile the ppm's are dropping consistently. The total pH of the finished brew is 7.1 and the pics i posted of the brew are about 10min after adding all the ingredients, so not a post brew shot unfortunately.

 

[hogan400]

The same results I had and looks similar. I never have cleaned my buckets and I just use old funky socks. haha
I have noticed the cloudiness and After a week and a couple days it went away as well. Looks nice and the plants are in much better shape than mine were. Should be a nice solid grow.

 

[BCrocker]

Why do you say that?

I'll PM ya

 

[bigdaftones]

Watching this shit grow is like waiting for christmas to come... beautiful

 

[BCboys]

Thanks dude. Today is flip, I'll post some pics today or tomorrow.

 

[swisscheese]

Flip day is always the best day! Best of luck on your maiden voyage I'm coming along for the ride?

 

[Shady]

Keep up the hard work BCboys! I hope everything runs smooth during bloom...