Clawing tops: please help

bunkerking · Dec 9, 2019

"Here’s some updated leaf pics which leads me to believe under fert/watered "

Your plant only eats X amount of food. If you are not daily feeding it. The left overs build and build up. Along with changing the PH.
A steady water schedule fixes that. This is why they say 20-30% run off.

HFJud · Dec 9, 2019

bunkerking said:
"Here’s some updated leaf pics which leads me to believe under fert/watered "

Bud - your plant only eats X amount of food. If you are not daily feeding it. The left overs build and build up. Along with changing the PH.
A steady water schedule fixes that. This is why they say 20-30% run off.

Yep. I always have 20% runoff. Today the ppms going in we’re the same coming out.

Going to see how this goes for a few days to a week.

HFJud · Dec 15, 2019

Update: the issue was overwatering. I let the medium dry a bit for about 3 days and the new growth is coming in just fine. The peat of the 1 gal root ball was holding too much water for too long. I’ll post update pics soon.

Aqua Man · Dec 15, 2019

HFJud said:
Update: the issue was overwatering. I let the medium dry a bit for about 3 days and the new growth is coming in just fine. The peat of the 1 gal root ball was holding too much water for too long. I’ll post update pics soon.

Your going to have issues with this grow... Part of the media will be to wet and other to dry. No idea why the mixed media but I would not do it again.

Aqua Man · Dec 15, 2019

How frequent did you try watering? I have a feeling not often enough. See coco growers say the same thing and in the end they are not watering often enough. Your plants maybperkbup now but in time letting dry out you will have nutrient build up and other issues. Good luck.

bunkerking · Dec 15, 2019

HFJud said:
Update: the issue was overwatering. I let the medium dry a bit for about 3 days and the new growth is coming in just fine. The peat of the 1 gal root ball was holding too much water for too long. I’ll post update pics soon.

eh idk about that.... its not over watering. the media is always wet. you didnt make it wetter.

bunkerking · Dec 15, 2019

High Porosity | High Porosity Soil | Growers Soil

Our high porosity soil was developed over the course of 4 years with extensive work through laboratory soil analysis for maximum yields.

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Your peat/coco mix isnt screwing you up. you not watering is. :/ Sorry to be blunt, but. Good luck. Go re-read this thread and stay on top of the watering.

ParExtracts · Dec 15, 2019

HFJud said:
Hello, View attachment 918115 View attachment 918115 View attachment 918116 View attachment 918117I recently (2 weeks ago) transplanted all my girls from 1 gal Grower’s Soil (coco/peat/perlite mix) to 3 gal Plagron Coco + 30-40% perlite mix. Here are the stats/issues:

Stats:
1.) pH 6.0
2.) nutrients: Mills
3.) 350-450ppm
4.) watering Every-other-day
5.) using Tap Water
—- with exception of last watering as I watered again the very next day this week (Tues/Wed)

Issues:
1.) Previously had nitrogen toxicity which caused the top leaves to start clawing and deforming (3.5 weeks ago)
2.) The nitrogen toxicity caused some secondary deficiencies causing some random leaves to yellow and get blotchy. (3.5 weeks ago)
—— caused by Amino additives IMO that I added from NPK industries.
—— flushed for two waterings with pH’d water
3.) after transplanting from Coco/peat to Coco perlite the growth exploded
4.) In still having some clawing or slight droop

Question:
things are looking ok but I’m not sure if this is overwatering, nute issues or the

Leaves are clawing and I’m not sure what the issue is or if I have one at all and they’re just recovering. Should I still be watering EoD or daily? A little concerned as I’m transitioning my entire grow to Coco based.

I use the medium as well as nutrients and had the same issue after transplant. You’re just over watering them. Let them relax without a feed. My advice would be skip a feed or 2 and let them droop then feed. Do that twice. Mine took about 10 days to get back to normal. Also i purchased a probe for pH/moisture/light, works great.

Aqua Man · Dec 15, 2019

ParExtracts said:
I use the medium as well as nutrients and had the same issue after transplant. You’re just over watering them. Let them relax without a feed. My advice would be skip a feed or 2 and let them droop then feed. Do that twice. Mine took about 10 days to get back to normal. Also i purchased a probe for pH/moisture/light, works great.

Your doing this in coco? Why bother growing in coco just grow in soil if your going to treat it like soil.

bunkerking · Dec 15, 2019

ParExtracts said:
I use the medium as well as nutrients and had the same issue after transplant. You’re just over watering them. Let them relax without a feed. My advice would be skip a feed or 2 and let them droop then feed. Do that twice. Mine took about 10 days to get back to normal. Also i purchased a probe for pH/moisture/light, works great.

This your company?

HFJud · Dec 15, 2019

Aqua Man said:
Your going to have issues with this grow... Part of the media will be to wet and other to dry. No idea why the mixed media but I would not do it again.

‘Twas a mistake to put the gallon of peat/coco with coco/perlite I’ll admit. My thinking was that the Growers Soil was drying out in less than a day and placing mostly in coco/perlite would be fine and thus I could treat like coco.

Aqua Man said:
How frequent did you try watering? I have a feeling not often enough. See coco growers say the same thing and in the end they are not watering often enough. Your plants maybperkbup now but in time letting dry out you will have nutrient build up and other issues. Good luck.

It not necessarily that they perked up but the growth coming in isn’t clawed like it was. I’m not letting the media “dry out” its just not heavy and wet before I watered again.

I watered 3x a day for 2 days and noticed everything kept getting perceivably worse.

bunkerking said:
eh idk about that.... its not over watering. the media is always wet. you didnt make it wetter.

It’s the 1 gal of growers soil that wasn’t drying out at all.

bunkerking said:
High Porosity | High Porosity Soil | Growers Soil

Our high porosity soil was developed over the course of 4 years with extensive work through laboratory soil analysis for maximum yields.

growerssoil.com

pH Balanced and Inert, Growers HP allows the user to maintain precise control of their feed. High Porosity works great in flood and drain systems, automated drip systems, as well as hand watered gardens. Pair with your choice of organic or synthetic nutrients.

Your peat/coco mix isnt screwing you up. you not watering is. :/ Sorry to be blunt, but. Good luck. Go re-read this thread and stay on top of the watering.

I’ve used Growers soil in 100% of my 2 previous harvests because I’ve had so much of it and it absolutely does not allow for frequent fertigation. It holds onto a lot of water as it has too much peat. Not a fan of it at all as was a primary reason I wanted to get away from any peat mixes.

HFJud · Dec 15, 2019

I will allow the roots of the plants grow bigger and deeper and then increase my fertigations as I see they’ve fully recovered.

Ph 007 · Dec 15, 2019

HFJud said:
Hello, View attachment 918115 View attachment 918115 View attachment 918116 View attachment 918117I recently (2 weeks ago) transplanted all my girls from 1 gal Grower’s Soil (coco/peat/perlite mix) to 3 gal Plagron Coco + 30-40% perlite mix. Here are the stats/issues:

Stats:
1.) pH 6.0
2.) nutrients: Mills
3.) 350-450ppm
4.) watering Every-other-day
5.) using Tap Water
—- with exception of last watering as I watered again the very next day this week (Tues/Wed)

Issues:
1.) Previously had nitrogen toxicity which caused the top leaves to start clawing and deforming (3.5 weeks ago)
2.) The nitrogen toxicity caused some secondary deficiencies causing some random leaves to yellow and get blotchy. (3.5 weeks ago)
—— caused by Amino additives IMO that I added from NPK industries.
—— flushed for two waterings with pH’d water
3.) after transplanting from Coco/peat to Coco perlite the growth exploded
4.) In still having some clawing or slight droop

Question:
things are looking ok but I’m not sure if this is overwatering, nute issues or the

Leaves are clawing and I’m not sure what the issue is or if I have one at all and they’re just recovering. Should I still be watering EoD or daily? A little concerned as I’m transitioning my entire grow to Coco based.

Iv not long gone not coco from soil,
I been trough all sorts

i pot up cuttings water once to run off and then wait few days before watering again, when pots it fully rooted I'd then water daily if the plant is a tidy size, if its still small I'll water every other day.

but when my plant is tour size I'll 100% water every day to east with no problems if I don't I get over feed and more problems eventually.

i agree with aqua man 5-700ppn be fine
I go by e.c and if was me I'd free 1.0e.c then after 2-3 feeds 1.2e.c then go slow from then on up to 1.4e.c but 1.2 should be fine till end if your not sure..

might be wrong here but over watering leaves droop
and under watering leaves and stems and plant drops

Water daily at 1.0e.c to run off to waste don't let it sit in run off .
i use to get scared over watering i still do with small plants I'm still learning with that. But when their that size I literally water the shit out of them once a day what I mean is I Chuck about 1.5/2 litres of feed through a day and it just run out to waste I could also Chuck 5/7 litres through it runs to waste I'd get non problems the coco don't get any wetter or hope any More water as it drains out instantly, its just a waste tho to use more lol, when I see run off I stop

Ph 007 · Dec 15, 2019

Ta tidally dum, she takes it up the bum

HFJud · Dec 18, 2019

The attached pictures show the deficiencies that have developed from last week to this week. Many of the plants no longer have clawed leaves and have come out of that state.

Deficiency looks like: Ca/Mg/Phosphorus

Yesterday was the 2nd watering where I had on the every-other-day, watering at 5:00pm. I also increased the ca:mg concentration.

My tap water comes out at 166ppms and I’m feeding at 650ppms now. It seems like I definitely need to increase my ppms to be roughly 960 so I can get a true 800ppm.

Thoughts?

If I don’t see progress by the end of the week I will do daily waterings 2-4x/day. I just needed to start at a testable variable and go from there.

Ph 007 · Dec 18, 2019

HFJud said:
The attached pictures show the deficiencies that have developed from last week to this week. Many of the plants no longer have clawed leaves and have come out of that state.

Deficiency looks like: Ca/Mg/Phosphorus

Yesterday was the 2nd watering where I had on the every-other-day, watering at 5:00pm. I also increased the ca:mg concentration.

My tap water comes out at 166ppms and I’m feeding at 650ppms now. It seems like I definitely need to increase my ppms to be roughly 960 so I can get a true 800ppm.

Thoughts?

If I don’t see progress by the end of the week I will do daily waterings 2-4x/day. I just needed to start at a testable variable and go from there.

View attachment 921822 View attachment 921823 View attachment 921824

Shit looks bad over feed /lock out I guess I I might be wrong tho. And inbet from the cal mag

Your first pics is how mine use to look , I stopped cal mag it give me all sorts problems I use canna aswell

I use tap wetter I'm in the UK. And my tap water ppm is just 0.75 ppm
And I they grow much better not adding calmag for me, do u feed cal every feed?

If that was me I'd flush 0.4/0.6 e.c then next watering I'd give 0.8e.d. and then 1.0e.c, it should grow OK 1.0e.c

I might be wrong but that is what is would do if I had your problem. Also the cal stopping worked for me

Ph 007 · Dec 18, 2019

Ph 007 said:
Shit looks bad over feed /lock out I guess I I might be wrong tho. And inbet from the cal mag

Your first pics is how mine use to look , I stopped cal mag it give me all sorts problems I use canna aswell

I use tap wetter I'm in the UK. And my tap water ppm is just 0.75 ppm
And I they grow much better not adding calmag for me, do u feed cal every feed?

If that was me I'd flush 0.4/0.6 e.c then next watering I'd give 0.8e.d. and then 1.0e.c, it should grow OK 1.0e.c

I might be wrong but that is what is would do if I had your problem. Also the cal stopping worked for me

If your did though my posts u see the problems iv had lol and a lot yellwowing and all.sorts
,,
I think I was getting lock out from cal as the cal used most of my ppm up so plants actually had not a lot of feed. And they didn't use the cal mag and got build up , since not using it got more feed as the ppm not being wasted and snake oil they call it I think lol that cal mag I mean snake oil
Also i think i had under free as the low feed ppm as the cal mag used it up so lock out and under free I had if that makes sece lol

Ph 007 · Dec 18, 2019

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Ph 007 · Dec 18, 2019

You want to doubt tour tap water ppm
So your tap is 166

So just add feed till it says 500ppm
Not add 500 to the 166 , that's then 666 that hight

I go to 700ppm about 3rd week flower
And start of flower 600 that including my 0.75ppm tap water.

I'd flush with 300ppm so just 150ppm if feed, the work up to 500ppm again that's including your tap wetter ppm
And 600 should be enough shouldn't need higher maybe when you get better at it experiment and go to 900ppm max

I don't follow the feed chart my my canna nutrients their feeding ppm / e.c are way to high in find,

Measure your run ppm see if its hell of a lot higher then that's going in

HFJud · Dec 24, 2019

Update: I’ve stated course of watering Every other day (2-3x per day) and here’s the result:

Nearly everyone has darkened up and normalized to a great color of green and is flourishing. A few plants are still a bit off but they’re on their way out of the woods. I’ve changed my ppm input to 800-900ppm as well (150-160ppm is tap water).

Clawing tops: please help

Clawing tops: please help

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