Dudded, Stunted, and Runted plants...

[SpiderK]

Nematodes as Plant Parasites Menu

 

[EveryOneSmokes]

Sorry man, no ph issues here. It gets checked daily at 5.8. I have been dealing with TMV for a Long time and have lab results to show that's what it is. Been doing this for a lot of years and never had the twisting or other issues like now. The mosaic pattern leaves have only shown on a couple strains. It dosn't happen to all. This I why there is so much mis information, out there people think they know what causes every issue when they haven't even dealt with some things. The virus also makes plants look like they have mag def nute burn and many other symptoms, but all comes back to the virus.

I'm sure u know what ur talking about but the tmv symptoms are different from what I've seen in dud's.. I ran a cut of Chemdog D that displayed the traditional tmv symptoms and produce good meds, Ur pics also show this... Some of ur plants may have been just
Weaker cuts but still produced, duds complete don't develop..

I by no means consider my self an expert but I didn't start growing yesterday...lol..
I hope it's something that can be eliminated with ease.. Best of luck to all, I wouldn't wish this on no one... Real talk.. :cool:

 

[caregiverken]

Yeah you guys,
Dont be posting pics of some larfy,leafy, airy, foxtailed crap and trying to say you had a dud! :rolleyes:


:p

 

[grower4life]

The leaf twisting thing in the pics from farmer 186183 posted,,,, I have some cookie monsters that I just started growing and they twist a lot during veg and into the first few weeks of flowering, goes away pretty much for te most part. Ive seen tis before on other strains but never this bad. I am new to growing cookies is this just part of there traits, im one of the peeps that know hes infected with the virus but I don't really ever see tis on the ogs, fire og and wifi.
?

 

[grower4life]

MakinGoo ive seen some of ur pics of sc do u have the leaf twisting issue

 

[true grit]

I do not believe it is viral.

some notes........

• Was using clonex brand clone gel
• Could be infection via inconsistent/unclean cloning practices
• Plants seem to be able to grow out of it
• Seems like its a coco related/induced problem or plants are at least more susceptible in coco medium
• Duds first showed on dubtech, o dub a dub etc in socal and prob has since spread

I've had veg duds with other clone gels. Agreed with all the rest but the Dubtech thing. Im telling ya we've discussed it on other forums and the problem has been around before Dub related strains. Has been evident on OG's etc for years. So to me that means some of the genetics are just more susceptible.

Could be cloning practices for sure, but I would think with my not very sterile lazy cloning methods i would see it as much as others are saying they do...and i really don't. Once in a blue moon and i don't take as much effort when cloning. And the ones i see in veg are almost always from cuts from someone else, or off a cut from someone else.

Well the smaller compared to the bigger are def dud plants as far as I'm concerned. Did you see the difference in thc between the first bud shot and the second? No smell to the small ones, and very slow weird growth. Also look at the difference in the hair color between the two, the small ones are all red looking. Once they get that way they never come back. Does anyone have some pics of what you are talking about?

They may be what you are considering duds, but not what we are talking about. You definitely shown stunted growth but there is trich production and not at all what we are talking about the "dud" look. You'll see Delae's pix and prob be like wtf!? And thats what we are talking about lol. If those are freakin ya out- these duds def would!

sounds to be we have some consistency
The gel, infection through cleanliness of tools, coco may be more prone to the issue although I clone in rockwool and have seen all theses duds in rockwool cubes first, another thing to note is how saturated or excessive watering...
This round I got really lazy with the cloning stage and honestly could say I had less desirable results with a few duds this run..

Ya seems its usually the OGs that take forever to root for me and end up sitting in damp plugs.

 

[toquer]

Sorry to post this here but it seems to be fitting to ask and show this photo. Have dealt with this leaf coloration issue on one strain and it hadn't done it in the past and it doesn't do it outside and will recover partially. If in veg the leaf will regain its color. It's flowers fine but doesn't finish how it used to. Could it be a pathogen?

 

[Capulator]

Sorry but in my experience the "dud" was actually more vigorous than the original strain.

Here you can see two branches from the same white hash plant (the only plant I have ever had to "dud"). Again, this plant is from seeds I ordered myself, grew myself, and grew actually for 2 years or so before this happened. I took a whole bedful of clones and only one flowered out fucked up. It had an OG structure, very little smell, but it was hella vigorous compared to all the rest. in the above pic the dud is on the bottom. Different serration, glossy, smaller leaves with tighter nodes. One branch just straight mutated.

I kept a healthy cut and tossed the mom.. mom is a couple months old and looks perfect. Haven't seen a dud since ... >>>knocks on wood<<<

I think its a trip that the dud branches all look pretty much the same, regardless of strain. I really think it is some kind of mutation.

 

[Capulator]

The duds on cannabis are the straight up "witches broom" of the deciduous tree world.

http://www.missouribotanicalgarden....ests-and-problems/diseases/witches-broom.aspx

 

[Capulator]

and then:

http://apsjournals.apsnet.org/doi/abs/10.1094/PDIS-91-2-0227C

 

[Capulator]

Curious:

Have you guys sprayed forbid or other miticides on your plants before they dudded?

Sorry for all the posts in a row.

 

[Capulator]

OK one more:

http://www.finegardening.com/french-tarragon

pay attention to the russian mutant part halfway through./

 

[Capulator]

OK OK

just one more guys and I am done. We should try breeding with one of the duds to see what happens with offspring.

http://books.google.com/books?id=rX...epage&q=spontaneous mutation or sport&f=false

 

[MakinGoo]

4sho 100% duds were in coco & were seed plants White Bubba, & White Fire,even FPOG .
.

In this post I was talkin bout I got duds in clones that were found in recent seed pops (within a few yrs) >>most duds were found in clone only og kush cuts.. I was saying I had some dud action from recent pheno hunts..

then I went on 2 say this>>>>

Its possible the yeti juss sucked balls it wasnt my pheno <<<<< maybe theres yeti phenos with no crystals? LoL prolly not but who knows?

Some people could take that the wrong way so let me clear this up .. what I was saying is the Yeti I ran was a "dud" >>>but 2 b funny I said its possible the Yeti juss sucked balls!! I said that bcuz it was not my pheno selection & I had no clue if it was killer or not.. ive never ran any Yeti beans so I said>>> again trying 2 be funny I said maybe there r no crystal phenos in Yeti<<< it was a 100% joke thats why I ended it with >>>>>LOL

That yeti I ran was juss 1 of these freak DUDs..... I WAS NOT talkin shit bout the Strain Yeti or Loompa Farms in any way..

 

[MakinGoo]

Curious:

Have you guys sprayed forbid or other miticides on your plants before they dudded?

Sorry for all the posts in a row.

Mine juss happen 2 b new strains I was running & I would of 4sho sprayed them with everything I had when I received them as new cuts...& when I mix up a batch of anything I give it 2 every1 well im at it...

 

[delae632]

DUD LIFE Bout to get that shit tattooed on my stomach if I don't get this figured out quickly. lol

All of mine have been grown in soil. Saw my first ones on my first run in this room about 3.5 years ago or so. I didn't know what happened and thought I just fucked up like some of the rest of you, then it happened again and again randomly with no patten that I could see. I've switched my room up every which way, changed soils, pots, beds, changed cloning gels, changed cloning practices, glass, no glass, high heat, low heat, organics, synthetics, slammed with nutes, light nutes, different cuts, different seeds, high temps, low temps, sealed, passive, active, etc...same ol' shit happens to at least a couple plants every time. It doesn't matter if I have any problems with a run or if everything goes perfectly...I'll still get at least a couple duds. I was positive I wasn't going to have any duds last run (except a couple cast off's in pots). Everything in the beds looked killer and even, then during week 2 of veg I started seeing a lag in about 12 of them (out of 64). Those ones all got passed up by the rest of the canopy and started to get "the look", those plants dudded and everything else came out superb. I have a feeling it's a virus or fungus but I've had this discussion with @MakinGoo before and I do have a strong feeling that it may have something to do with the roots as well. Like him, when I water, everything gets watered at the same time, no matter what. The smaller and weaker plants seem to really hate this. lmoa

The only thing I can say with 100% confidence is that I have NO idea what the hell this is. lol I just want it to go the fuck away so I can stop loosing sleep at night.

Side by side. TK cut from the same mother....same exact everything. Healthy plant on the left and a fucked off dud on the right.

TK dud vs normal

TK dud. It's like a spider plant...

White Bubba dud vs normal

Tahoe

White Fire

Pre 98 Bubba

GSC Forum cut normal vs dud

 

[drknockbootz]

Im so glad i found this thread. Ive been getting this dud shit going on my chow beds. My Chemdog #4 like 10-15% dudding. But my Snowdog has gone to 40% duds. But this gradually happened overtime and is the reason im going to start fresh with new moms.

True grit the list of signs are spot on and agree with checking for the signs at an early stage but many time it can go undetected, since the plants havent fully developed yet . Usually longer internodal spacing for my Chemdog #4 are what Im looking for in the healthier cuts. If you look the poster with pics of his Chemdog D the one on the right has shorter internode spacing, smaller leaves and has a slightly mutated look.Also the more fingers the better. My duds might show 1 to 3 blades sometimes but I want atleast 5.

And like cap said sometimes they are as vigorous as the non. My Snowdog is a bitch its hard to pinpoint. But the TMV looking leaves are indicator. On some varieties if you dont select the correct cut from the beginning theres nothing you can do(which the beds have shown me).

Another thing is its funny how people have moms for multiple years. But I just cant see a continuosly vigorous cuts coming from a rootbound plant that gets trimmed back severely, unless its a super hardy stable line. These new lines seem fragile, never saw this in my earlier days.

All what I wrote is what I think might be going on Im trying to pinpoint it myself. I thought I was the only one going through this. Also lanky OGs are the worse of the worse from my experience.

 

[drknockbootz]

@delae632 I think it has to do with the health of the moms and only selecting your most vigorous cuts no imperfections or they get tossed. I see the vigor of my moms slowly fading. This run I took 50 cuts of my Snowdog I will pick 6 of the best and use those for my moms. Another thing i notice is when i see uniformity in the roots, leaves, and overall vigor that seems to be a good indicator of a healthy mom and proper cloning conditions.

 

[DowNwithDirT]

@delae632 your pics are dead on for what we have going on over here.

some serious monsanto genetic modification esq shit going down.

Weeks ago all the talk was about fusarium. This just sucks

 

[grower4life]

Delea632,,,,, Fuk me that's the exact shit im talking about to a tee. A years ago I tought I was the only poor bastered out that completely forgot how to grow. lol. I didn't give up. I did have a revalation lastnigt though,,, I just noticed it starting on a WIFI plant that I started from bean, last cuts looked great and did great, just took cuts again and now a few of the new shoots are duds ( once uv seen it and maked it as a weird cut and then veg and flower it, u can see it a mile away) anyways
what ive been doing is I notice that my moms start to look just ok after 2 to 3 rounds of cuts come off ( so 3to4 months) ( 3 rooms running) and I would decide to just take cuts off a crop I was about to flip (cause there no visible duds or I had removed them) and would use a few to star new moms. Cuts would look great coming off moms again for a min and then the dud look would start happening. So this is y I only would have a branch hear and their. I will post pics of the WIFI that's starting to transform.

I did have major duds when I was in coco and then switched back to soil and its way better but still there.
Shit fukin irritate and scares me for the first few weeks of flowering. Thank god I can spot them as im veging them, but te WIFI on tis last round had 1 or 2 plants witt brances that didn't have the dud look at but happened to be in the front and late in flowering was smell testing flowers and noticed that they were not greasy or sticky and ad no smell on my fingers (like the duds) but look perfect. This shit is very very frustrating.

Ive moved from the ogs to cookies to (well market is changing) and ogs seem to be the worst at duding that ive seen.
The cookie monster I am growing seems to have a lot of twist on the leaves that comes and goes. not sure if tis is the norm or the virus fuk wit me.