HOW TO WATER COCO FOR BEST RESULTS.

[Observationist]

I can't rememeber if it was Dirtbag or Aquaman who suggested using as much PVC as possible for plumbing but that was great advice. It's dead simple to work with and cheap.

definitely, ty.

 

[SouP_N]

Temperature adjust the water? It's not abnormal to see a little droop after watering

Water should be the same as ambient ideally?

 

[SouP_N]

So for more stretch keep a 10f day night difference in temps. You could add something like massive that contains triacontanol and that will definitely make them stretch. But I think you will find they do quite well.

I would lollipop before flip. After stretch I would remove the oldest biggest fan leaves to the point that no leaves are resting on eachother, but your not letting light go through without hitting leaves. The reason you always remove the biggest and oldest leaves are new growth photosynthesises more efficiently. And also to make sure that the plants have good airflow throught them.

When lowering night temps by 10 would you maintain the VPD or drop humidity by a fixed %?

 

[Observationist]

When lowering night temps by 10 would you maintain the VPD or drop humidity by a fixed %?

maintain vpd.

 

[justice8965]

Hey guys. I'm thinking of changing up my auto watering system. I can't seem to get even flow from all 6 hydro halos. I need some help designing a PVC system. I'm thinking something like my crude drawing below.

Would this work well with a loop like this? Also, what kind of connectors do I need to connect the PVC to the hosing? I'll put the PVC on wooden blocks to keep it level with the top of the pots. Thanks for any help

 

[jguit]

I would nix the 1/2 vinyl tubing. Then use a x6 port rainbird manifold on each side of the loop so that you have x2 1/4" tubes going to each plant for redundancy?

 

[justice8965]

I would nix the 1/2 vinyl tubing. Then use a x6 port rainbird manifold on each side of the loop so that you have x2 1/4" tubes going to each plant for redundancy?

The only issue is I'm using hydro halos, not drip emitters. so i need 1/2in vinyl to connect the halos to the watering system

 

[jguit]

The only issue is I'm using hydro halos, not drip emitters. so i need 1/2in vinyl to connect the halos to the watering system

Gotcha, i missed that minor detail! LOL

 

[justice8965]

Put it together in about 30 mins. Works great, nice even rain like drip from each halo.

 

[TryingToGrow]

When using salt and organic attempts now also, I water coco same as soil.

When the pots lighten up, 5.7pH water and everything grows well. Keeping the pH of the medium correct is most important from what I have seen.

 

[justice8965]

Figure I should post some pics. 6 Nova Gas fems from Beleaf genetics on day 13 of 12/12

 

[BudhaSticks]

Ok writing this cause i see this issue often and rather have a thread to link than explain this each time. This is not my work but a collection of info from many members here and I have put into practice myself.

So first off COCO is NOT soil. For best results we want to keep it saturated between 90-100% that does not mean you can't go below this but you may see slower growth or nutrient issues over time if your consistently letting COCO get to dry.

Coco has an amazing gas exchange and air holding capacity when compared to soil. For this reason it is next to impossible to over water. Over watering is NOT to much water... its lack of o2. You will see this in soil with less drainage but because of coco's high drainage, air holding capacity and gas exchange its highly unlikely to see this in coco.

I do suggest if growing in more than 1 gal pots to add perlite if you are seeking faster grow rates. However if you want to water less often then you can eliminate the perlite as this will lower the drainage. As a rule of thumb:

1gal no perlite
2gal 20% perlite
3gal 30% perlite
4gal 40% perlite
5+gal 50% perlite

You can do more or less but it will affect the frequency of watering required. More perlite the more frequent you will have to feed. Personally I feel the better the drainage the faster the growth but its a balancing act and the above ratios i would say are a great place to start.

Coco has a low CEC (cation exchange capacity) so it does not hold onto nutrients as well as something like soil so we feed with every watering to keep a balanced nutrient ratio, ph and ppm in the coco. To do so we also need to flush out some of the last feed with each feeding to prevent a nutrient buildup which can affect all of these. THINK OF COCO AS SOILESS... much closer to hydro and very similar to rockwool.

I won't get into ppm in detail as thing will change quite a bit from grow to grow depending on many factors. But generally speaking start at around 300-400ppm and work up to around 800ppm. Now some may need to alter that as it will depend on your specific grow conditions.

HOW OFTEN DO WE FEED!!!

Ah the always debated subject.. 2 times a day, 1 time every 2 days, 10 times a day????

Forget that nonsense... like I say each grow is different so we need to use a better method. Let the plants tell you!!!!

Ok here is how we calculate it simply to your specific grow conditions, stage of growth, pot size and every other variable. You will never need to wonder am I feeding to much or to little again.

The formula:

1.Feed 5% of the pot size as your nutrient solution.
2. Of that we want 10-20% to come out as run off.
3. If you get more you can lower the frequency.
4. If we get less we need to increase the frequency and for that feed we need to add more to get our run off.

So I will do the calculations up to 5gal below to save you all some time. Feed the amount listed and check to make sure you get runoff of the amount listed from there adjust to dial in the feedings as they will change as the plants grow.

REMEMBER THIS IS A GUIDLINE AND NOT A HARD RULE. Our goal is to get as close as reasonably possible. It's not gonna kill your plants if its not exact.


I'm gonna round up.

1gal. Feed 250ml get 25-50ml of runoff

2gal. Feed 500ml get 50-100ml of runoff.

3gal. Feed 750ml get 75-150ml of runoff.

5 gal Feed 1litre get 100-200ml of runoff.

By doing this your plant will tell you how often you should be watering for best results.

Plant transpiration happens during photosynthesis so we only need to water during the lights on period. But in smaller containers you may find that you need to fertigate once in the middle of lights out if fertigation events are higher. Its unlikely but if your coco is dry before the first feed its not a bad idea to toss one in. Generally feed a couple hrs before lights out for the last time but you want to split the events evenly throughout lights on.

It may sound like you will be watering way to much but when you calculate how much you are feeding and then the frequency its not much more than most already do, just supplied in a manner that provides much greater stability. You will be using much smaller amounts of nutrient solution and by feeding much more frequently it doesn't take much to get your runoff while keeping the rootzone ph, ppm and moisture content ideal.

Are Fungus Gnats ever an issue with fert frequecy?

 

[justice8965]

Are Fungus Gnats ever an issue with fert frequecy?

I've had them in all 4 grows now, though only bad in the first where I didn't know what I was doing. Now if I see one I immediately add some gnatrol to my res and put yellow sticky tape on the media. Problem solved.

I've noticed they come about when I don't clean all the organic matter that falls on the media (leaves, stems, loose stuff when defoliating). I've read the gnats like decaying organic matter, so that's probably the main cause. Keeping your space and pots clean will help

 

[justice8965]

Question for the thread/Aqua Man since I know you are (or were) using a similar setup.

I'm going to switch from 6 plants on hydro halos to 12 using jain octobubblers for next grow. I'm a bit confused as to how pressure works, not all that knowledgeable about liquid dynamics.

I was going to buy 2 of these:

Store Locator – AvidWater

jainsusa.com

And these, greengene uses them, I like the design to make sure the whole media is watered and also to retain moisture in the pots for longer:

HydroLock S6

HydroLock Standard 6 inch fits great in 1-3 gallon containers. HydroLock S6 offers optimal water distribution and uniformity for all potted plants. HydroLock S6 comes standard with: 1 6GPH Tornado Mist Sprayer per HydroLock Available in Slate Grey or Bright White Actual diameter is 6.5 inches

shop.hydrolocksystems.com

And this pump from them:

Hydrolock™ In-Line Water Pump

4 Year Warranty The Hydrolock™ In-Line Water Pump is a true workhorse providing HydroLock Covered Irrigation systems with appropriate flow and pressure specifications. This pump applies constant pressure to the Tornado Mist Sprayer for maximum root zone coverage. This 3-chamber diaphragm...

shop.hydrolocksystems.com

Two questions. One, the hydrolocks come with a 6gph emitter in them. The bubblers can be bought in different flow rates. If I buy the 6gph bubbler, and use the 6gph emitters, I should get a flow of 6gph correct? I just don't know if one interferes with the other.

Two, do I need a pressure regulator? I'm assuming because the pump is 45psi it should handle that for me and I don't need a regulator. Oh, and do I need an air bleed valve somewhere along the line?

Thanks for any help!

 

[mikeross]

Question for the thread/Aqua Man since I know you are (or were) using a similar setup.

I'm going to switch from 6 plants on hydro halos to 12 using jain octobubblers for next grow. I'm a bit confused as to how pressure works, not all that knowledgeable about liquid dynamics.

I was going to buy 2 of these:

Store Locator – AvidWater

jainsusa.com

And these, greengene uses them, I like the design to make sure the whole media is watered and also to retain moisture in the pots for longer:

HydroLock S6

HydroLock Standard 6 inch fits great in 1-3 gallon containers. HydroLock S6 offers optimal water distribution and uniformity for all potted plants. HydroLock S6 comes standard with: 1 6GPH Tornado Mist Sprayer per HydroLock Available in Slate Grey or Bright White Actual diameter is 6.5 inches

shop.hydrolocksystems.com

And this pump from them:

Hydrolock™ In-Line Water Pump

4 Year Warranty The Hydrolock™ In-Line Water Pump is a true workhorse providing HydroLock Covered Irrigation systems with appropriate flow and pressure specifications. This pump applies constant pressure to the Tornado Mist Sprayer for maximum root zone coverage. This 3-chamber diaphragm...

shop.hydrolocksystems.com

Two questions. One, the hydrolocks come with a 6gph emitter in them. The bubblers can be bought in different flow rates. If I buy the 6gph bubbler, and use the 6gph emitters, I should get a flow of 6gph correct? I just don't know if one interferes with the other.

Two, do I need a pressure regulator? I'm assuming because the pump is 45psi it should handle that for me and I don't need a regulator. Oh, and do I need an air bleed valve somewhere along the line?

Thanks for any help!

I don't know much about "pressure" but I know what works for me.

Since its just a few pots, if it was me, I'd spring for the hydrolocks or something similar. you could also install inline PC emitters and still run your hydro halo, not exactly sure what you don't like about them. My current setup I run netafim pressure compensating emitters because I run a higher plant count and its the cheapest and IMO best bang for your buck setup.

Regarding pressure, that's going to be determined by what emitters you go with and what the manufacturers recommended PSI range. You need a min pressure to make them operate properly but theres also a max range. Finalize you emitter size and brand and follow what the manufacturer recommends for psi. I run (2) 0.5 GPH PC emitters with a 25psi regulator myself. 45psi is usually at the top/max psi range for most PC emitters. If it were me I'd plumb in a 15-25 pressure regulator somewhere in the system... your pump selection is fine.

Not a big fan of those bubbler setups. They work well but IMO there are better options.

 

[justice8965]

I don't know much about "pressure" but I know what works for me.

Since its just a few pots, if it was me, I'd spring for the hydrolocks or something similar. you could also install inline PC emitters and still run your hydro halo, not exactly sure what you don't like about them. My current setup I run netafim pressure compensating emitters because I run a higher plant count and its the cheapest and IMO best bang for your buck setup.

Regarding pressure, that's going to be determined by what emitters you go with and what the manufacturers recommended PSI range. You need a min pressure to make them operate properly but theres also a max range. Finalize you emitter size and brand and follow what the manufacturer recommends for psi. I run (2) 0.5 GPH PC emitters with a 25psi regulator myself. 45psi is usually at the top/max psi range for most PC emitters. If it were me I'd plumb in a 15-25 pressure regulator somewhere in the system... your pump selection is fine.

Not a big fan of those bubbler setups. They work well but IMO there are better options.

Thanks for the response!

The halos get clogged often in my experience. I'm mostly trying to use water more efficiently by measuring input and output. I think it would be easier to do with an emitter system of any sort.

I'm definitely getting the hydrolock, such a great way to water evenly and keep the pots more moist, reducing water even more. So the bubbler says 20-60psi and the pump is max 45psi, so I assume it would be fine with or without the regulator?

I'm guessing a 6gph on the bubbler and the 6gph on the hydrolock will work fine together. If my math is right 6gph=22710ml/hr=around 6ml per sec. So i could water for around 35 seconds each event to hit 190ml, which is 5% of the 1 gallon pot size. Then make sure I'm getting around 40ml out.

 

[jguit]

The pump looks like like it'll be fine. I'd consider putting an additional check valve and filter in your plumbing. Mine has been working flawlessly after getting it dialed in.

Use PVC where you can and liberally use PVC unions so that you can dismantle and clean when needed. That was the best advice I got when setting up something similar.

Also, make sure you add plumbing that will allow you to drain your reservoir if the need arises

 

[justice8965]

The pump looks like like it'll be fine. I'd consider putting an additional check valve and filter in your plumbing. Mine has been working flawlessly after getting it dialed in.

Use PVC where you can and liberally use PVC unions so that you can dismantle and clean when needed. That was the best advice I got when setting up something similar.

Also, make sure you add plumbing that will allow you to drain your reservoir if the need arises

I was definitely going to add a filter right after the pump. Is there any specific place a check valve should be placed?

 

[jguit]

I was definitely going to add a filter right after the pump. Is there any specific place a check valve should be placed?

I put mine right after the filter for no reason in particular. I wouldn't think it really matters. I just wanted to put it someplace to prevent potential siphoning of the res.

 

[tixg04]

Hey Aqua -
I've read through 30+ pages on this thread,
much appreciated on the high grade information
I'm new to growing my own and currently have a 4x4x6 vivosun tent running a Gavita 1930e
I have my plants in 1gal short fat smart pots (looking for some tall skinny for next run) and am running 70/30 coco/perlite mix
my plants started to peak above the coco earlier this week about 3 days in the media which I pre-rinsed and have been feeding 8x daily to runoff of 10% (200ml each feeding)
Just trying to get an idea if this water schedule is proper for them at this age or if I should be adjusting down until they're larger