L.E.D. Argument Thread For Dummies:)

Aqua Man · May 20, 2021

1diesel1 said:
It has come full circle!
A shout out to all you LED Dummies:)

Reporting for duty sir.

PiffinOut · May 20, 2021

this is probably above most people heres level but.. which is better for efficiency... or better yet, which setups have been able to show the most efficiency per par... samsung strips with an aluminum rail heat sink vs hlg quantum boards using the same diodes. Which is most efficient.

Aqua Man · May 21, 2021

PiffinOut said:
this is probably above most people heres level but.. which is better for efficiency... or better yet, which setups have been able to show the most efficiency per par... samsung strips with an aluminum rail heat sink vs hlg quantum boards using the same diodes. Which is most efficient.

It's not that simple...

1. The diodes have an efficiency themselves. Like the 301h is more efficient than the 561c

2. The more diodes you put under the same wattage through them (ie 2000 diodes with 600w driven through them will be less efficient than 3000 diodes with 600w) so number of diodes is important when comparing lights.

3. Different spectrums have vastly different efficiencies so you can run all red and have very high efficiency and shit performance in practice because its beneficial to have all spectrum as the plants have different photo receptors.

4. Temperature can affect efficiency so a good heat sink or system for cooling is important. (Fan driven waste efficiency on power for fans)

5 plants use different spectrums more efficiently red being most I believe then blue and green last. But all are important each receptor can only absorb so much. Green while being the lowest also penetrates the canopy much better than red or blue so you are getting an increase to the overall photosynthesis of the plant by using leaves that would not be photosynthesizing as much otherwise.

Then add to this the photo biological and morphology effects and it further complicates things.

Granted intensity trumps all and the more photons the better up until you start to reach the saturation point of those receptors and then spectrum is the only way to increase photosynthesis further.

Now add to that spectrum for different stages of growth.

It's a very complex answer and one that is not definitive yet and likely won't be for some time... even then you have different genetics that will not all prefer the same... so yeah basically your question is splitting hairs when it comes to the higher end lighting of LED

You are starting to see in some cases much more far red added to fixtures which while has a benefit also inflates the ppfd output because they are most efficient at producing photons per watt. I can't say at what point its optimal but I can bet in some cases that's being taken advantage of for advertising purposes.

Aqua Man · May 21, 2021

For the reasons above I chose the Scorpion diablo from hlg

DazedNconfused78 · May 21, 2021

I love this for my veg. They make their own humidity partially because of the 50 gallon res in my tent. It stays 60-70% rh like yours. Temp is around 80 with lights on. Leaf temps are around 75°. I have changed my res once. My EC went down before i changed it. I only changed it to change nutrient brands. And even changing brands they took off. They get to equilibrium this way i think. Leds are keeping it about 80 °

taxle · May 23, 2021

I run both D.E hps and hlg 550rspecs, to say the least I enjoy them both. All things considered. I would have to lean towards my HLGs.
Now to compare apples to apples, build a l.e.d light with 10 Quantom boards on one heat sink and driver. Then can we compare a true 1000watt led vs a 1000watt hps and tell me witch one will out perform who.

Bbonez · Jun 14, 2021

Aqua Man said:
For the reasons above I chose the Scorpion diablo from

Aqua, does your Diablo have a Inventronics or Mean Well driver? The unit I bought in January has Inventronics, I didn't notice a difference on the one I picked up on 4/20 so I think it's the same. But today I got two more and they both have a Mean Well driver, is this better or worse? I hope they aren't lowering the quality to improve profit margins, my two Kingbright lights from Alibaba have Mean Well drivers.

Older unit:

New units:

hlg

Aqua Man · Jun 14, 2021

Bbonez said:
Aqua, does your Diablo have a Inventronics or Mean Well driver? The unit I bought in January has Inventronics, I didn't notice a difference on the one I picked up on 4/20 so I think it's the same. But today I got two more and they both have a Mean Well driver, is this better or worse? I hope they aren't lowering the quality to improve profit margins, my two Kingbright lights from Alibaba have Mean Well drivers.

Older unit:
View attachment 1135595

New units:
View attachment 1135594

I'll have e to look next time I'm down there.

ComfortablyNumb · Jun 14, 2021

Meanwell drivers are very popular. They are not fly-by-night suppliers.

Anthem · Jun 14, 2021

ComfortablyNumb said:
Meanwell drivers are very popular. They are not fly-by-night suppliers.

very easy to knock off in a factory and just place the name on the product

Anthem · Jun 14, 2021

Bbonez said:
Aqua, does your Diablo have a Inventronics or Mean Well driver? The unit I bought in January has Inventronics, I didn't notice a difference on the one I picked up on 4/20 so I think it's the same. But today I got two more and they both have a Mean Well driver, is this better or worse? I hope they aren't lowering the quality to improve profit margins, my two Kingbright lights from Alibaba have Mean Well drivers.

Older unit:
View attachment 1135595

New units:
View attachment 1135594

They might be experiencing supply chain issues with the Inventronics, that is the same brand of driver fluence uses on their spyder 2I lights

ComfortablyNumb · Jun 14, 2021

Anthem said:
very easy to knock off in a factory and just place the name on the product

Unfortunately true.

Bbonez · Jun 14, 2021

Steve the owner of HLG said it is a supply chain issue, the same chips that are holding up Ford and GM are in the drivers. He said the MW drivers are 0.05% more efficient and cost them 2% more. Also, the MW driver has a 5 year warranty independent of the 3 year HLG warranty.

I think I was just skeptical at first because they included a pair of their $60 MethodSeven glasses, I thought that might have been some kind of apology gift...

Sounds like a win win for me!

jonnynobody · Jun 18, 2021

I got my qb's from alibaba. Three 660w boards and a mismatched 450w board supplemented with 2 100w Cree COB's. I got my two 660's for $650 with shipping. I've purchased 5 boards from the same supplier. Excellent quality lights.

The room is a little naked right now. I'll be moving plants in this week. Another 2 weeks of veg until the 12/12 flip. 3 of those lights were on only for the photo. No plants in there yet ;)

Planning to add 2 more 660w boards to max out the room. Love me some alibaba!

Here's a pic from my last flower cycle with the 2 1000w hps's, 2 600w hps's, 660w qb, 450w qb, and 2 COB's. It was bananas :)

And my nursery tent 110w qb's:

HLG you need not :)

Scrogger2190 · Jun 18, 2021

What strain is that johnny?

Goblinkiller · Jun 19, 2021

Very nice. You got a nice size room and setup. And your power box must be decent. Looks like you have easy access and room to move.

jonnynobody · Jun 19, 2021

Scrogger2190 said:
What strain is that johnny?

The last flower cycle was blue dream, maui waui, ghost train, jager, and critical mass. My upcoming flower cycle is going to be bruce banger, god bud, maui waui, godfather OG, blue dream, jager, and critical mass. I really don't know what to expect out of god bud, bruce banger, or the godfather. They seem to be highly rated strains so I've got high hopes.

The blue dream so far has been the most impressive strain. The flavor is absolutely out of this world. Jager is a close second. The ghost train and maui are so strong I don't even smoke them during the day or I won't get anything done. Critical mass is just smooth as silk. Not much flavor though which is shocking. In flower it was incredibly aromatic and trimming was a nightmare because it was so sticky. Very potent, but man there is almost zero flavor. It's a great smooth smoke but it's missing character. I plan to cycle out the critical mass and maui next cycle. I'll be introducing gg#4 back into the garden which I'm very excited about.

jonnynobody · Jun 19, 2021

Goblinkiller said:
Very nice. You got a nice size room and setup. And your power box must be decent. Looks like you have easy access and room to move.

It took me about a year to put this all together as you see it in it's current form. The power box is only 100 amp service, but I have a small home with low power demands outside of the grow areas. The people I bought the home from had to install the new panel due to having a new furnace installed. And I'm very thankful they did, because I couldn't afford to do that shit :)

In the last year I've installed a 50 amp light controller, portable AC with exhaust ducting to outside, added a 50pt/day dehumidifier, painted the walls, added the floor tarp, and upgraded to LED. It's been a very long road. This all started with a single 600w HPS 3 years ago. I've had some very difficult days to make the magic happen. It took 3 weeks to take down the last harvest. Trimming 12 hours/day M-F taking weekends off. It was pretty brutal, but I'm firmly against auto trim machines. Just say no to auto trimmers :)

jonnynobody · Jun 19, 2021

This is the link to the 2 660's I just bought in 3500k chips with 660nm and 760nm reds:

660w Sunlike Spectrum 3000k 5000k 660nm 760nm Uv Ir Aquaponics Growing Systems Growing Lights - Buy Sunlike,Uv Ir,Growing Lights Product on Alibaba.com

www.alibaba.com

I've had my oldest board from this supplier for over a year now without any issues. The spider farmer SF-4000 I bought at the same time is melting the glue off the PCB creating brown ugly spots on the board. The heat sink is considerably smaller on the SF versus the alibaba light which is most likely the culprit. Too much heat paired with a heat sink that can't effectively dissipate the heat resulting in melted glue on the PCB. It appears to be cosmetic only, but I would not be inclined to purchase another SF branded unit. If you look in amazon reviews on the SF-4000 you can see pictures from other buyers showing the same damage.

karolanne · Jun 19, 2021

I don't know if it's the place to say that, but: Marshydro II Epistar 160 is a piece of shit. Just saying. The plants I have in front of my window grow much faster than those under the lights. ppppfff I was silly to buy that. Learning...

L.E.D. Argument Thread For Dummies:)

L.E.D. Argument Thread For Dummies:)

Aqua Man

PiffinOut

Aqua Man

Aqua Man

DazedNconfused78

taxle

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660w Sunlike Spectrum 3000k 5000k 660nm 760nm Uv Ir Aquaponics Growing Systems Growing Lights - Buy Sunlike,Uv Ir,Growing Lights Product on Alibaba.com

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